Court filing
NOTICE OF FILING OF OFFICIAL TRANSCRIPT of… — NOTICE OF FILING OF OFFICIAL TRANSCRIPT of Proceedings as to… (Dkt. 54)
Record facts
| Court | U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of New York |
|---|---|
| Filed | 2024-06-11 |
U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of New York · No. 1:22-cr-00020-FB · Doc. 54 · 2024-06-11 · Docket on CourtListener
Summary
A transcript of a criminal cause for trial in United States of America v. Anuli Okeke, No. 1:22-cr-00020-FB, in the U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of New York at Brooklyn, held Tuesday, June 11, 2024 at 10:00 a.m. before United States District Judge Frederic Block and a jury, filed as Doc. 54. Four Assistant United States Attorneys appear for the Government and two attorneys for the defendant, who is present. The opening records the court addressing counsel with the jury not present before the jurors are brought in, and the transcript also records direct examination of a witness about money given to bank employees and about loan rules. The closing pages carry an index listing four witnesses and a table of exhibits, including Government's Exhibits 1 through 11 at page 171 and Defense Exhibit 50. The transcript is 181 pages.
Summary drafted by a model from the document's text below and checked by script against that text before publication. It is a navigation aid, not a reading of what the document proves. Where AI is used
Full text
Court Reporter: STACY A. MACE, RMR, CRR, RPR
225 Cadman Plaza East / Brooklyn, NY 11201
smacerpr@gmail.com
Proceedings recorded by mechanical stenography; transcript produced by Computer-Aided Transcription.
134
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
EASTERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK
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UNITED STATES OF AMERICA,
-against-
ANULI OKEKE,
Defendant.
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22-CR-00020(FB)
United States Courthouse
Brooklyn, New York
Tuesday, June 11, 2024
10:00 a.m.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - X
TRANSCRIPT OF CRIMINAL CAUSE FOR TRIAL
BEFORE THE HONORABLE FREDERIC BLOCK
UNITED STATES DISTRICT JUDGE, and a Jury
A P P E A R A N C E S:
For the Government: BREON PEACE, ESQ.
United States Attorney
Eastern District of New York
271 Cadman Plaza East
Brooklyn, New York 11201
BY:
ADAM AMIR, ESQ.
JENNIFER BILINKAS, ESQ.
F. TURNER BUFORD, ESQ.
CHAND EDWARDS-BALFOUR, ESQ.
Assistant United States Attorneys
For the Defendant:
TALKIN, MUCCIGROSSO & ROBERTS, LLP
40 Exchange Place
18th Floor
New York, New York 10005
BY:SANFORD TALKIN, ESQ.
NOAM GREENSPAN, ESQ.
Case 1:22-cr-00020-FB Document 54 Filed 07/29/24 Page 1 of 181 PageID #: 427
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Proceedings
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
135
(In open court; jury not present.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: All rise.
(Judge FREDERIC BLOCK entered the courtroom.)
THE COURT: Good morning, everybody.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Criminal cause on trial, the
United States of America versus Okeke.
All counsel and Ms. Okeke are present.
THE COURT: Good morning, everybody.
So, the jurors took me seriously, they are all here,
which is terrific.
I find that it's important for the Judge to give a
little speech, and I find that it works like magic. If I
don't do that, you know, some of them may wander in five or
ten minutes late, but you've got to set the standard. So
they're terrific and they're ready to rock-n-roll.
Do we want to say anything before we bring them in?
Because I would like to use their time one hundred percent.
Mr. Edwards-Balfour, are you okay?
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: Nothing from us, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Bring your next witness in. Let him sit
up here.
Mr. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: Your Honor, the next witness
will have a certified court interpreter to assist with
English.
THE COURT: Do you need an interpreter?
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Proceedings
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MR. AMIR: Yes, they're here.
THE INTERPRETER: Good morning, Judge.
THE COURT: We have our interpreter here.
THE INTERPRETER: Yes.
THE COURT: You are interpreting what language?
THE INTERPRETER: Spanish.
(Witness enters the courtroom and takes the stand.)
THE COURT: So, we are going to bring the jurors in
now and then we are going to start with the direct
examination.
Who is going to be conducting the direct
examination?
MR. AMIR: I will, Judge.
THE COURT: Mr. Amir, okay.
And Mike is bringing them in right now.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: All rise.
(Jury enters.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: You all may be seated.
THE COURT: Good morning, everybody. We are back on
the record.
And I just want the record to reflect how proud I am
of you, everybody is on time. Keep up the good work.
We will have a full day today. And we will probably
take a little mid-morning break, perhaps, and then we'll have
a lunch break, and everything will go along smoothly, I hope.
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Proceedings
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We have a new witness for the Government here.
Mr. Amir, this is going to be your witness, correct?
MR. AMIR: Yes, Judge.
THE COURT: All right, go ahead.
MR. AMIR: I think we just need to swear in the
witness.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Sorry. Name?
MR. AMIR: Yes. This -- the Government calls
Guadalupe Ponce.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: I ask the Interpreter if you
can raise your right hand.
Will you well and truly interpret the proceedings
before this Court and this cause?
(Interpreter sworn.)
THE INTERPRETER: Yes.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Please state and spell your
name.
MR. ORRANTIA: My name is Dagoberto Orrantia,
D-A-G-O-B-E-R-T-O, O-R-R-A-N-T-I-A.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Thank you.
I ask the witness if you -- oh.
Do you swear that you will interpret the proceedings
before this Court and this cause?
MS. HONTORIA: I do.
(Interpreter sworn.)
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Proceedings
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THE COURT: I ask you to please state and spell your
name.
MS. HONTORIA: Frances Hontoria, F-R-A-N-C-E-S,
H-O-N-T-O-R-I-A.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Thank you.
I ask the witness if you can please stand and raise
your right hand.
Do you affirm the testimony you are about to give
will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
THE WITNESS: Yes, I do.
(Witness sworn.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Please have a seat.
THE COURT: All right. We have a Spanish
interpreter. So, we get many interpreters here. This is
Brooklyn and we have a wonderful multicultural world that we
live in, so here we are going to have a Spanish interpreter.
And it may well be that some of you speak Spanish,
as I would suspect. Maybe some people on the jury speak
Spanish, but listen to what the interpreter says, that is
going to be the real testimony. If there is anything that you
hear that sounds really strange, don't hesitate, just tell
Mr. Innelli because sometimes we have some of these little
issues. But, hopefully, things will go smoothly.
Your witness.
(Continued on the following page.)
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Ponce - direct - Amir
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
139
G U A D A L U P E P O N C E,
called as a witness by the Government, having been first
duly sworn/affirmed by the Courtroom Deputy, was examined
and testified as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MR. AMIR:
Q
Good morning, Mr. Ponce.
A
Good morning.
Q
Where do you work?
A
In Manhattan at 125th.
Q
And what do you do at 125th Street?
A
I sell breakfast at a food cart.
Q
And do you also sell coffee at that cart?
A
Yes.
Q
What time do you begin your workday?
A
5:00 in the morning.
Q
And when do you end your workday?
A
1:00 in the afternoon.
Q
How long have you worked at the push cart on
125th Street?
A
Four years.
Q
All right. Is that where you worked in the summer of
2020?
A
Yes.
Q
Was there a bank nearby in summer of 2020?
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Ponce - direct - Amir
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
140
A
Yes.
Q
Which bank?
A
Banco Popular.
Q
Is the bank still open today?
A
No.
Q
I'd like to go back to the summer of 2020.
Were you familiar with who worked at the bank?
A
Yes.
Q
Who worked at the bank?
A
Anuli, Anthony, Charlene.
Q
And Anuli, do you know what her position at the bank was?
A
Manager, manager of the bank.
Q
And how did you get to know them?
THE INTERPRETER: Sorry, say that again.
BY MR. AMIR:
Q
How did you learn the people or get to know the people
who worked at the bank?
A
Oh, because they bought coffee.
Q
Did Anuli have a nickname for you?
A
Primo.
Q
Did you have any discussions with Anuli in the summer of
2020 about applying for government funding?
A
Yes. She said that it was money for the pandemic that
they were giving away for free.
Q
When she said that, where were you?
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Ponce - direct - Amir
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
141
A
I was outside working.
Q
And what did she say -- what did you say in response?
A
No, that I did not want that, that I did not need it.
Q
Did Anuli bring up the topic again?
A
Yes.
Q
Approximately how many times?
A
I don't remember, but it was more than one.
Q
Did any of the bank employees ask you for documents?
A
Yes, Anthony, for the year -- I'm sorry. Anthony, the
taxes for the year '19.
Q
And do you recall who prepared your taxes for the year of
2019?
A
I don't remember, but I know that the last name is Vega.
Q
But you had your own accountant, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
After you gave your -- did you -- did you give your tax
documents to anyone at the bank?
A
I don't remember exactly if it was Anthony. I -- to one
of them I -- I gave them to them, but I don't remember very
well.
Q
After you gave your tax documents to someone at the bank,
did you learn that there was an application for you?
A
No. They just told me that I should hand over the papers
and they would notify me about the money that the Government
was going to give away for free.
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Ponce - direct - Amir
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
142
Q
Did you ever go to the bank to sign some documents?
A
Yes.
Q
And who told you to come into the bank, if anyone?
A
Anthony.
Q
I'd like to show you what is in evidence as Government
Exhibit 752, at page 24.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MR. AMIR:
Q
Mr. Ponce, is this your application form?
A
Yes.
Q
Do you see a business name in the top left?
A
Yes.
Q
And is that your name, Guadalupe Ponce Amigon?
A
Correct.
Q
Did you write that?
A
No. No.
Q
Do you know who gave you, if anyone, this form?
A
Anthony.
Q
And looking at some numbers in the middle of the screen,
do you see some numbers there?
A
Yes.
Q
Do you see a number "2250"?
A
Correct.
Q
Did you write that?
A
No.
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Ponce - direct - Amir
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
143
MR. AMIR: Let's go to the bottom of the next page,
please.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MR. AMIR:
Q
Mr. Ponce, do you see any signatures on this page?
A
Yes.
Q
Whose signature do you see?
A
Mine.
Q
Did you sign this?
A
Yes.
Q
Did anyone explain to you what you were signing?
A
No, they only told me to sign.
Q
And do you see initials on the left side of the page,
"G-P-A"?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you write that?
A
Correct.
Q
Did anyone explain to you what you were initialing?
A
No, they just told me to write down my initials.
MR. AMIR: We can take this down.
A
Anthony.
Q
Did there come a time when you learned that your
application was approved?
A
No. He only notified me that the money was already in
the bank account.
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Ponce - direct - Amir
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
144
Q
You said "he."
Who's "he"?
A
Anthony.
Q
Did there come a time where you made any withdrawals at
the bank?
A
Correct.
Q
And did you go in person to make the withdrawal?
A
Correct.
Q
Were you paid -- did you make a withdrawal in -- into
cash?
A
Yes.
Q
Did anyone ask you for any money from the cash that you
took out --
(Court reporter seeks clarification; cross talk.)
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Did anyone ask you for any of the cash you took out?
A
Oh, Anthony only said that I had to give -- give a gift,
a present, to the manager.
Q
And did you give a gift to the manager?
A
Yes.
Q
How much money did you give?
A
200.
Q
And you said "the manager."
Who is that?
A
Anuli.
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Ponce - direct - Amir
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
145
Q
Where were you when you paid $200 to Anuli?
A
At the bank.
Q
And where specifically in the bank was Anuli at that
time?
A
Where she used to work. How would you say this? In the
area where she worked.
Q
Was she at a desk?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you give money to anyone else who worked at the bank?
A
Yes, Anthony and Charlene.
Q
And how much did you give to Anthony and Charlene?
A
200.
Q
And where were they when you gave them 200?
A
At the same -- well, in each area where they worked.
Where they worked.
Q
Did you know if that was permitted under the loan rules?
A
No, I did not know.
Q
I'd like to show you now what is in evidence as
Government Exhibit 305.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MR. AMIR:
Q
And, Mr. Ponce, is this a bank statement?
A
Correct.
Q
And is that from Popular Bank?
A
Yes.
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Ponce - direct - Amir
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
146
Q
And looking at the middle left side of the page, do you
see any names?
A
I see my name.
Q
And looking above that, do you see a date next to the
words "This statement"?
A
Yes. Yes.
Q
Is this a statement from July 16th, 2020?
A
Correct.
Q
Scrolling down, do you see a transaction on July 2nd?
A
Yes.
Q
And is there a deposit into your account of $2,250?
A
Yes.
Q
Is that the government loan you received?
A
Correct.
Q
Looking at the transaction below that on July 7th, do you
see that?
A
Yes.
Q
Do you see how much was withdrawn on that day?
A
Yes, 1,600.
Q
Is -- did you write the withdrawal slip for that
withdrawal?
A
No.
Q
Did someone present you with a withdrawal slip on that
date?
A
Anthony.
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Ponce - direct - Amir
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
147
Q
And did you sign that withdrawal slip?
A
Correct.
Q
Did you receive cash that day?
A
Yes.
Q
And we discussed that you made some gift payments to bank
employees a moment ago.
Did you use the cash from that withdrawal to make
those payments?
A
Yes.
Q
And looking below the July 7th transaction, do you see
another transaction on July 15th?
A
Yes.
Q
And do you see how much that withdrawal is for?
A
650.
Q
Do you recall making that withdrawal?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you make any payments to Anuli from this money?
A
No.
MR. AMIR: Okay. We can take this down.
BY MR. AMIR:
Q
Mr. Ponce, separate from the loan and withdrawals we just
looked at, did anyone at Popular Bank help you with a
different loan application?
A
What's the question?
Q
Was there a different loan application that you filled
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Ponce - direct - Amir
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
148
out or that you had help filling out at Popular Bank?
A
Yes.
Q
And did you fill out this loan form yourself?
A
No.
Q
Who filled it out?
A
Charlene.
Q
And is that someone who worked at Popular Bank?
A
Yes.
Q
Do you know what the form said?
A
No.
Q
But did you receive money from this loan?
A
Yes.
Q
Do you recall how much you received?
A
$2,000.
Q
Into which bank account?
A
To my own personal account.
Q
And at which bank was that account?
A
TD Bank.
Q
And did Charlene or anyone at the bank explain that this
loan had to be paid back?
A
No.
MR. AMIR: One moment, please.
(Pause.)
MR. AMIR: No further questions.
THE COURT: Any cross-examination?
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Ponce - cross - Talkin
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
149
MR. TALKIN: Yes, Judge.
CROSS-EXAMINATION
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Good morning, Mr. Ponce.
A
Good morning.
Q
I just have a few questions for you.
A
Yes.
Q
You said that you had several -- or a couple
conversations with Anuli about filing for a loan?
A
Yes. She said that they were giving out money.
Q
And you had those conversations in English?
A
Yes. I did -- I did not understand very well, but yes.
Q
And you -- going back during the pandemic, your business
suffered during the pandemic, correct?
A
It suffered.
Q
Yes. And your business is a -- you're the single
employee at the business?
A
No, it's two of us. There is another one working.
Q
And that other person is your father, correct?
A
Of course.
Q
And it's your father that is called Primo, isn't that
correct?
THE INTERPRETER: I'm sorry.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
It is your father that is called Primo, correct?
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Ponce - cross - Talkin
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
150
A
Also.
Q
Now, you say that you were asked for your tax returns,
and was it your driver's license also?
A
I don't remember well. They said taxes. I don't
remember if I gave the license.
Q
And you testified a few minutes ago that it was
Mr. Castro that asked you for the taxes?
A
I said that I did not remember who, but it was somebody
from the bank who did.
Q
And those taxes, at the time you were asked for them,
they were already prepared, you had your taxes, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
And you filed those a few months ago because April was,
obviously, two months before June, correct?
A
Yes, because they told me that it had to be for the year
'19 -- the year '18, it -- the year '19.
Q
No, I understand that.
But your 2000 -- when you were having the
conversation about giving the taxes to you [sic] with the
people from the bank, you had already filed your taxes?
A
Yes, because they were already paid.
It was the year '19, right?
Q
Right.
And how long -- do you remember how long ago you had
paid your taxes?
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Ponce - cross - Talkin
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
151
A
No, I don't remember.
Q
But was it before you had these conversations about this
loan and the free money?
A
I'm sorry?
Q
Sure. I'm asking you about when you filed and paid your
taxes for 2019.
I'm asking you if that was before or after you had
the discussions with the people from the bank about filing for
this loan?
MR. AMIR: Objection, asked and answered.
THE COURT: Overruled.
A
Before. Before.
Q
And I'm not asking for an exact date, but how long
before? Was it a week? A month? Two months?
A
No, I don't remember.
Q
Was it very close in time to when you gave them over to
the bank?
A
I don't understand what the question is.
Q
Okay.
There came --
THE COURT: Repeat it.
MR. TALKIN: Thank you, Judge.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
You remember that you paid your taxes for 2019 and filed
your tax form before you were asked about -- before you were
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Ponce - cross - Talkin
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
152
asked about this loan by someone from the bank, is that
correct?
A
I don't remember. I only handed over those documents. I
don't remember.
THE COURT: The question is, if you remember, did
you pay your taxes first or did you seek the loan first?
THE WITNESS: They asked me for the taxes that I had
already paid, the taxes.
THE COURT: They asked you for that?
THE WITNESS: Yes.
MR. TALKIN: Okay.
THE COURT: I think that's the best you can do.
MR. TALKIN: Thank you.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
So, they asked you for taxes -- for your taxes that you
already had paid for 2000 --
A
For the years that I had already paid.
Q
-- for 2019, correct?
THE COURT: He's, obviously, a little confused.
Let me ask you this question, because I can ask
questions also.
If you don't understand what he's asking you, you
can ask me what your problem is. Okay?
You can explain to me why you're having a difficult
time in understanding the question and answering it, maybe you
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can ask for an explanation.
THE WITNESS: Yes, because they asked me for the
year when I had paid the taxes.
THE COURT: I think that's as best as you can do.
MR. TALKIN: I understand, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Move on.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Let me ask you this:
Sir, when you were asked for the taxes, did you just
have to go to your home and retrieve them or did you have to
go get them prepared?
A
No. What I -- no, not that.
THE COURT: You don't know where you got your tax
information from that you gave to the bank, is that your
answer?
THE WITNESS: Yes, it was my taxes, but I don't
remember if it was for '18 or '19.
THE COURT: Do you remember where you got the papers
from, whether in your home, your casa, or did you have it on
your person?
Do you know where they came from?
THE WITNESS: From my house --
THE COURT: Okay. So --
THE WITNESS: -- I got them because I had already
paid the taxes.
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THE COURT: See, this is an example of when the
Judge will ask some questions just to get clarification. It
doesn't mean I have an opinion about anything whatsoever. You
understand what I'm trying to do here.
Next question.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
And those taxes were prepared by your accountant?
A
Yes, that person has always done that.
Q
And no one recommended you to an accountant to prepare
your taxes from the bank?
A
No.
Q
And those taxes that you got from your house for 2019,
they had been there for some time before you gave them to the
bank?
A
No. No, there was a mistake. It's '18 that I sent.
THE COURT: He doesn't understand.
A
Not '19.
THE COURT: All right. You either have to go
forward or could you go on to something else?
You hear his testimony, and it's the best we can do.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
So, just so I'm sure, it's your testimony now that you
gave the 2018 taxes to the bank?
A
Yes, I think it was '18 because it was a year before the
pandemic.
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THE COURT: That's your best recollection today,
that you gave the bank your 2018 taxes, is that correct?
THE WITNESS: Yes, I think that's it. I didn't
remember very well.
THE COURT: Next question.
MR. TALKIN: Your Honor, I'll ask that the -- I'm
going to use the ELMO.
Mr. Innelli, could you show it to the witness,
please.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Sure.
Is it just for the witness?
MR. TALKIN: Yes, just for the witness.
THE COURT: What exhibit are you showing him?
MR. TALKIN: Your Honor, it's -- I'm marking it as
Defendant's 50.
THE COURT: This is the defendant's first exhibit,
right?
MR. TALKIN: And I'm only marking it for
identification at this time.
THE COURT: 5-0.
(Defense Exhibit 50 was marked for identification.)
MR. TALKIN: And, Your Honor, I'm going to -- if I
can approach him? I think --
THE COURT: Go ahead.
You want to introduce this or you're showing it to
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refresh his recollection?
MR. TALKIN: I'm showing it to him to refresh his
recollection.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
I want you to take a look at that.
Are those the taxes that you gave the bank in order
to get the loan?
THE COURT: The question is simple: Is this what
you gave the bank?
THE WITNESS: I think so, yes. I gave them my...
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Are those the 2019 taxes?
A
Yes.
THE COURT: Those are 2019 taxes.
That's what you gave the bank, is that correct?
THE WITNESS: (No response.)
THE COURT: You're looking at the document.
Does it refresh your recollection as to that's what
you gave to the bank?
Do you understand what I'm saying?
The answer is yes or no.
THE WITNESS: I handed over the tax documents, that
I had paid the taxes.
THE COURT: I'm sorry. What was the question? The
answer was yes or no.
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THE WITNESS: Yes.
THE COURT: That's what you gave the bank.
Next question.
MR. TALKIN: May I retrieve the document?
THE COURT: So, members of the jury, it is not in
evidence, but we use documents sometimes to refresh the
recollection of a witness. And you just saw that happen.
Counsel can show any document at all to see whether
or not it may jog the recollection of a witness, and you heard
that happen now.
Go ahead.
MR. TALKIN: Your Honor, may I now move Defendant's
50 into evidence?
THE COURT: You need that in evidence?
MR. TALKIN: Yes.
THE COURT: Any objection to that?
MR. AMIR: Yes, Your Honor. Yes.
THE COURT: The answer is?
MR. AMIR: There is an objection.
THE COURT: No objection?
MR. AMIR: There is an objection.
THE COURT: You don't want the tax return in
evidence?
MR. AMIR: We have not been provided with these
exhibits previously.
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THE COURT: A little louder.
MR. AMIR: We have not been provided with these
exhibits previously.
THE COURT: So I am not hearing you clearly, it's
probably my fault. A little louder.
MR. AMIR: We have not been provided with these
exhibits previously.
THE COURT: You have not looked at it before, is
that your problem?
MR. AMIR: Yes.
THE COURT: Look at it now.
MR. TALKIN: Your Honor, I received these documents
from --
THE COURT: Just one second. Let's not have any
colloquy.
Counsel, take a look at it.
This happens sometimes during the course of a trial
when we have this type of situation, and counsel is entitled
to take a look at it here.
(Pause.)
THE COURT: He identified it as his tax return.
MR. AMIR: Yes, Your Honor. We maintain our
objection for the procedural reasons we said.
THE COURT: No objection?
MR. AMIR: The Government maintains its objection
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for the procedural reason we just identified.
THE COURT: The procedural reason is overruled.
It's in evidence. Exhibit 50, defense exhibit now
in evidence.
(Defense Exhibit 50 was received in evidence.)
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Mr. Ponce, isn't it a fact that you filed your 2019 taxes
on June 10th of 2020?
A
2020.
MR. TALKIN: I want to know what his answer is.
THE COURT: Look at the document, it says when you
filed the return. You can read it to the jury.
THE WITNESS: Yes; this document, yes.
THE COURT: Okay. Next question.
Q
Doesn't this document say that your taxes were filed on
June 10th of 2020?
THE COURT: Mr. Talkin, listen to me. Okay. Here's
how we do it. Obviously, it's a challenged witness, not
everybody speaks the King's language. All right.
It's in evidence. You can read whatever you want
from the document that's in evidence to the jury. It's going
to be easier than to go back and forth because, obviously, he
is not a master of the English language like you and I are.
Okay.
MR. TALKIN: I understand, Your Honor.
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THE COURT: You can take the opportunity, if you
want, to read it to the jury.
MR. TALKIN: Is this being published to the jury as
we speak, Mike?
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: It should be.
(Exhibit published.)
THE COURT: Okay, there it is. It says "June 10th."
THE WITNESS: Yes, I'm seeing it.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
And your accountant's name is Kurt Vega?
A
Of course.
MR. TALKIN: And can we go to -- put up exhibit.
Government Exhibit 305, please.
(Exhibit published.)
MR. TALKIN: And if we could just blow up the top --
the middle portion, please. And, I'm sorry, the next portion.
THE COURT: Mr. Talkin, what do you want the jury to
know from the document?
You can tell them. I'll let you do that.
MR. TALKIN: Your Honor, I just want to know -- let
me ask the witness this.
Q
Do you remember when you -- you had to open an account at
Popular Bank in order to get the loan funded, correct?
THE COURT: He's testified, I think, to that.
Next question.
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Q
And you opened that account June 22nd of 2020?
A
Yes, because they told me that I had to open an account
in order to be able to receive the money.
THE COURT: He had to open up the account, you got
your point across. That's when he opened it, okay.
Next question.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
And it's your testimony that you did -- you reluctantly
took this loan, correct?
A
Yes, I didn't want it.
Q
And you also testified towards the end of your testimony
that you opened up a second loan.
Do you remember that?
A
Yes. She told me I was going to receive other additional
money.
Q
And that was Charlene when you say "she"?
A
Charlene.
Q
So she went ahead and opened that account for you?
Excuse me, withdrawn.
She went ahead and filled out that loan application
for you?
A
Correct.
Q
But you knew that was happening?
A
No. She told me I was going to receive more money, but
she didn't tell me what for.
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Q
Well, you -- it went into your private bank account?
A
Yes, because she requested information about my account
from me.
Q
Correct.
And when she had requested that information, she was
requesting that information to fill out an application for a
second loan?
A
Yes. She told me that I was going to get more money, but
she didn't tell me that it was a loan. She told me that it
was money as a gift.
Q
So Charlene told you that money was a gift to you?
A
No. She said, No, you're gonna receive more money. Not
that it was a gift, that I was gonna receive more money.
Q
And you didn't -- you didn't fight back about that?
In other words, you weren't reluctant to take that
extra $2,000, were you?
A
She just said to me, You're going to receive more money,
but she didn't tell me why.
Q
And you didn't give anybody from the bank any money from
that second loan, correct?
A
No.
MR. TALKIN: Nothing further.
THE COURT: Any redirect?
MR. AMIR: One moment, Your Honor.
THE COURT: I'm sorry, no redirect?
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MR. AMIR: I just said could I have one moment?
(Pause.)
THE COURT: Go ahead.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MR. AMIR:
Q
Hi, Mr. Ponce.
The defense attorney asked you questions about loans
that you submitted through the bank.
Do you remember that?
A
Yes.
Q
Did anyone explain to you how those programs worked?
A
No.
Q
And did you try to return the funds?
MR. TALKIN: Objection, Your Honor, leading. Beyond
the scope.
THE COURT: Overruled.
A
Of course.
MR. AMIR: No further questions.
THE COURT: Anything else?
MR. TALKIN: No. Thank you.
THE COURT: You may step down. Thank you very much.
(Witness steps down.)
THE COURT: Next witness.
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: Your Honor, I think it makes
sense for us to take a break here. The next witness is going
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to be quite long.
THE COURT: Let's start now.
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: Okay.
The Government calls Anthony Castro.
(Witness enters the courtroom and takes the stand.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Good morning, Mr. Castro. If
you could take the witness stand, please.
I ask if you could remain standing and raise your
right hand.
Do you affirm the testimony you are about to give
will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
THE WITNESS: Yes.
(Witness sworn.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Thank you.
Please have a seat. I ask you to please state your
name, and keep your voice up.
THE WITNESS: Anthony Castro.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Spell it.
THE WITNESS: A-N-T-H-O-N-Y, C-A-S-T-R-O.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Thank you.
THE COURT: Ms. Bilinkas, your witness.
MS. BILINKAS: Thank you, Your Honor.
(Continued on the following page.)
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A N T H O N Y C A S T R O,
called as a witness by the Government, having been first
duly sworn/affirmed by the Courtroom Deputy, was examined
and testified as follows:
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MS. BILINKAS:
Q
Good morning, Mr. Castro.
A
Good morning.
Q
Where do you live?
A
I live in Long Island.
Q
And generally, where did you grow up?
A
The Bronx.
Q
How old are you?
A
Thirty-five.
Q
How far did you go in school?
A
Associate's degree.
Q
Have you ever worked in the financial services industry?
A
Yes.
Q
Have you ever worked at a bank?
A
Yes.
Q
What bank did you work at?
A
Popular Bank.
Q
Did you work at the Popular Bank branch at 125th Street?
A
Yes.
Q
And is that in Manhattan?
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A
Yes.
Q
When did you start working at that location?
A
Approximately 2016, '17.
Q
Did you work at the 125th Street branch in 2020?
A
Yes.
Q
What was your role at Popular Bank in 2020?
A
I was a personal banker.
Q
Can you tell us what some of the roles and
responsibilities are as a personal banker?
A
I was responsible to open personal accounts, personal
loans. Also, at times, do teller transactions. So, it was
basically like a dual role.
Q
Are you familiar with the federal program known as the
Paycheck Protection Program, or PPP?
A
Yes.
Q
What was your understanding of that program?
A
That was a program that the Government, during the
pandemic, was offering to small businesses to alleviate the
losses of the pandemic.
Q
Did Popular Bank offer PPP loans in 2020 at the
125th Street branch?
A
Yes.
Q
Mr. Castro, in 2020 did you help submit fraudulent PPP
loan applications when you worked at 125th Street branch?
A
Yes.
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Q
Did the PPP applications you worked on contain false
information?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you work with others at Popular Bank to submit
fraudulent PPP loan applications?
A
Yes.
Q
Who was the Popular Bank branch manager in 2020?
A
Anuli Okeke.
Q
Would you recognize Anuli Okeke if you saw her today?
A
Yes.
Q
Mr. Castro, I am going to ask you to take a look around
the courtroom and if you see Anuli Okeke, please indicate an
article of clothing and where in the courtroom she is sitting.
A
She's wearing a black blouse. She's over here
(indicating).
MS. BILINKAS: Your Honor, let the record reflect
that the witness has identified --
THE COURT: We did this before. I respect the fact
that you're very, very sensitive about how we identify people
in the court, but the record will reflect that you have
identified the defendant.
MS. BILINKAS: Thank you.
BY MS. BILINKAS:
Q
Mr. Castro, was defendant Anuli Okeke one of the people
you worked with to submit fraudulent PPP loan applications?
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MR. TALKIN: Objection to the leading, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Overruled.
BY MS. BILINKAS:
Q
Was defendant Anuli Okeke one of the people you worked
with to submit fraudulent PPP loan applications?
A
Yes.
Q
Was she the only one you worked with?
A
No.
Q
On April 13th, 2021, did you plead guilty to a federal
crime?
A
Yes.
Q
What crime did you plead guilty to?
A
Conspiracy to commit wire and bank fraud.
Q
I want to turn your attention now to your work at Popular
Bank prior to the COVID 19 pandemic.
Have you always worked at the 125th Street branch?
A
No.
Q
What other branches have you worked with?
A
Fordham Road in the Bronx and Southern Boulevard.
Q
When did you work at the Fordham Road location?
A
2013.
Q
Who was the branch manager at the Fordham Road location?
A
Anuli Okeke.
Q
What was your role at Popular Bank when you were at the
Fordham Road location?
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A
Teller.
Q
And how did you end up working at the 125th Street
branch?
A
After moving to the branch in Southern Boulevard, a
couple of years later Anuli Okeke offered me the position
of -- that opened up at the 125th branch for personal banker.
Q
And, Mr. Castro, at Popular Bank is going from a teller
to a personal banker considered a promotion?
A
Yes.
Q
When you initially transferred to the 125th Street
branch, who was the bank branch manager?
A
Anuli Okeke.
Q
Mr. Castro, can you describe your relationship with Anuli
Okeke?
A
We had a really good relationship, more like a family at
the time, mentorship.
Q
How old were you in 2020?
A
Thirty.
Q
What, if any, training did you receive to be a personal
banker?
A
So, the bank provided policies and procedures training,
basic training to know how to open the accounts, and
government and regulations that we needed to learn.
Q
Were you paid a salary?
A
Yes.
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Q
And approximately how much were you paid?
A
30,000 a year.
Q
In your role as a personal banker, did Popular Bank have
any compensation for account or loan referrals?
A
Yes.
Q
And can you describe that?
A
So, we had a goal, depending on the branch that we
worked. In my case at 125th, we had a quarterly goal that we
had to reach, whether it was for account openings or for loans
that we had to submit.
Q
Were you compensated for how many bank accounts you
opened?
A
Once you reached your goal, you would be compensated if
you did reach the goal, yes.
Q
I want to direct your attention now to March of 2020.
Were you working at Popular Bank in March of 2020?
A
Yes.
Q
Which location?
A
125th.
Q
And during the initial months of the COVID 19 pandemic,
were you in person at the bank?
A
Yes.
Q
How many employees were working at the 125th Street
branch then?
A
Four. And then, at times, we had a teller that would
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rotate from other sites. So, in total, five.
Q
Going to the initial four you said, who were the four
people working there?
A
Myself, the branch manager Anuli Okeke, assistant manager
Charlene Wint, and personal banker Lenny Sanchez.
MS. BILINKAS: Your Honor, at this time, the
Government moves to admit Government Exhibits 1 through 11.
THE COURT: Any objection?
MR. TALKIN: No, Your Honor.
THE COURT: In evidence at this time.
(Government's Exhibits 1 through 11 were received in
evidence.)
MS. BILINKAS: Can we please pull up Government's
Exhibit 3.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MS. BILINKAS:
Q
Mr. Castro, do you recognize who's depicted here?
A
Yes.
Q
And who is this?
A
Charlene Wint.
Q
What role did Charlene Wint have at Popular Bank?
A
She was the assistant manager.
Q
Who was her supervisor?
A
Anuli Okeke.
Q
As a branch supervisor, did you work with Charlene Wint
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SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
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to submit fraudulent PPP loan applications at Popular Bank?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Thank you. You can take that down.
BY MS. BILINKAS:
Q
Did the 125th Street branch have accountants who assisted
with PPP loan applications?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: If you could please pull up
Government's Exhibit 7.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Mr. Castro, do you recognize who is depicted here?
A
Yes.
Q
And who is this?
A
Hashim Campbell.
Q
And what role, if any, did Mr. Campbell play at Popular
Bank during the COVID 19 pandemic?
A
He helped to submit fraudulent tax documents for the PPP
loan applications.
Q
Did he recruit applicants to come to the 125th Street
branch?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: If you could please pull up
Government Exhibit 8.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Mr. Castro, do you recognize who is depicted here?
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A
Yes.
Q
Who is this?
A
I only know him by the nickname of "the African."
Q
Is that a nickname that you had?
A
Yes.
Q
What role, if any, did this individual play at Popular
Bank during the COVID 19 pandemic?
A
He also submitted fraudulent tax documentations for
applicants.
Q
For PPP applicants?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Thank you. You can take that down.
BY MS. BILINKAS:
Q
Prior to the COVID 19 pandemic, how would you describe
the client base at 125th Street branch?
A
It was a low volume. Basically, community-based, local
businesses and local clients.
Q
What, if anything, changed once the 125th Street branch
started offering PPP loans?
A
So, our volume increased a lot. And the majority of the
clients that we did -- started receiving were from outside the
community, mainly from the Bronx.
Q
And in 2020, where did Anuli Okeke live?
A
In the Bronx.
Q
As a personal banker, are you familiar with the PPP loan
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application that was in place in 2020, at the 125th Street
branch?
A
Yes.
Q
How did you first find out that PPP loans were being
offered at your branch?
A
By a staff meeting with -- led by Anuli Okeke.
Q
Did you receive separate training about the PPP loans?
A
No.
Q
How did you get information about the program?
A
Through Anuli Okeke.
Q
As a personal banker, did you assist with the PPP loan
application process?
A
Yes.
Q
And how -- how did you assist?
A
Mainly to start opening the checking account. Applicants
needed to have a personal account established with Popular.
And secondly, with the form, itself, helping them
fill out the whole application.
Q
You mentioned account openings.
In order to open a bank account for a PPP loan, did
anyone else have to sign off on the bank account being opened?
A
Yes.
Q
Who?
A
The branch manager or the assistant branch manager.
Q
And who were those at the time?
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A
Anuli Okeke and Charlene Wint.
Q
And can you describe that process of the approval of an
account opening?
A
So, after we did our part as personal bankers in intaking
the information, that account, itself, and all the
documentations that were provided for that account needed to
be approved by the manager. And the manager needed to know
what was the purpose of that particular account that was being
opened.
Q
When you say "the purpose," what does that mean?
A
Meaning was it for direct deposit, what is the client
coming into this -- the branch opening that account for. In
this case, for the PPP loan, the manager needed to sign off on
the account.
Q
Did Popular Bank process sole proprietor PPP loans?
A
Yes.
Q
What does it mean for a person to be a sole proprietor?
A
It's a person that provides a service, and that service
is considered to be their source of income or business.
Q
What is the maximum amount an applicant can get as a sole
proprietor?
A
I believe a little bit over 20,000.
Q
What type of documents, if any, did Popular Bank require
to process a sole proprietor PPP loan?
A
They needed to provide their 2019 tax return.
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Q
Did Popular Bank process PPP loan applications for
businesses that had multiple employees?
A
Yes.
Q
And what, if any, supporting documents were required for
those type of applications?
A
They also needed to provide their 2019 tax returns.
Q
Did anyone from the bank have to sign off on all PPP loan
applications processed at your branch?
A
Yes.
Q
Who?
A
Anuli Okeke.
Q
And if a PPP loan application was approved at the branch
level, where did the application go next?
A
The application needed to be scanned over and sent out to
Popular Bank auditors.
Q
I want to turn your attention now to July 9th of 2020.
Did you ever have any meetings with Anuli Okeke
outside of Popular Bank to discuss PPP loans?
A
Yes.
Q
Where?
A
At a restaurant in the Bronx.
Q
Do you remember the name of the restaurant?
A
Boca.
MS. BILINKAS: If we could please pull up for the
witness what's been marked as Government's Exhibit 674.
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THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Is this just for the Witness?
MS. BILINKAS: Yes.
THE COURT: You said 74?
MS. BILINKAS: 674, Your Honor.
THE COURT: 674.
BY MS. BILINKAS:
Q
Mr. Castro, do you recognize this?
A
(No response.)
Q
Sorry. Can you see it?
A
No.
Q
Oh.
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Your Honor, I am going to move to
admit Government's Exhibit 674 with no objection from defense.
THE COURT: All right, in evidence, with no
objections at this time.
(Defense Exhibit 674 was received in evidence.)
(Exhibit published.)
(Continued on the following page.)
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EXAMINATION BY
MS. BILINKAS:
(Continuing.)
Q
Mr. Castro, is this a Chase bank account statement from
your account?
A
Yes.
Q
And is this account ending in 9927?
A
Yes.
Q
Okay. If we could please go to the bottom of the page
to the transaction detail. Second transaction from the
bottom.
Mr. Castro is this a transaction from Boca Steakhouse
in the Bronx on July 9th?
A
Yes.
Q
Had you ever gone out socially with your co-workers
before?
A
Yes.
Q
Who coordinated this lunch?
A
Anuli.
Q
You can take this down for a second.
What was the purpose of the lunch?
A
Outside from us spending time together, it was to talk
about the PPP loan applications.
Q
And who was at this lunch?
A
Myself, Lenny, Charlene and Anuli.
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Q
Can you please pull up that exhibit one more time.
Can you take a look at the transaction above the
Boca Steakhouse. Was there also a Zelle payment from
Charlene Wint on July 13th?
A
Yes.
Q
And what was that payment for?
A
As we always did, we split the bill.
Q
Thank you. You can take that down.
During the lunch, Mr. Castro, did you learn whether PPP
loans were forgivable?
A
Yes.
Q
From who?
A
From Anuli.
Q
And what, if anything, did Anuli say about loan
forgiveness at that lunch?
A
That the process of the PPP loan, the applicant didn't
have to pay the loan back eventually because she would have
to, like, she will be able to submit documentation to
forgive the loan itself.
Q
During this lunch, did you discuss whether anyone would
be compensated for processing PPP loans?
A
Yes.
Q
Who discussed that?
A
Anuli.
Q
And can you tell us that conversation?
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A
So, knowing that the workload was going to increase and
that clients were not obligated to pay the loan back, she
referred that clients were going to bless us and compensate
us.
Q
And what did you take "bless us" to mean?
A
That we were going to receive money for submitting the
application.
Q
Mr. Castro, as a bank employee, are you allowed to be
compensated for processing loans to customers?
A
No.
Q
Prior to the PPP Program, had you ever been compensated
for loans at Popular Bank from loan proceeds themselves?
A
No.
Q
At this lunch, and based on the conversations at this
lunch, did you believe you were going to be processing
legitimate PPP loan applications?
A
No.
Q
After this lunch, did you assist in preparing
fraudulent PPP loan applications?
A
Yes.
Q
Mr. Castro, did Popular Bank require tax documents for
the PPP loan applications?
A
Yes.
Q
And if an applicant didn't have taxes, what was your
understanding of how PPP applicants were to get tax
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documents?
A
For the fraudulent applications, then we would refer
the applicant to Hashim Campbell or to the African.
Q
How were you introduced to Hashim Campbell?
A
Hashim Campbell was someone who Anuli introduced early
in my career at Popular. He was someone that would
volunteer as a speaker t community events at the 125th site.
Q
And had you met Hashim Campbell prior to PPP loans
being offered at your bank?
A
Yes.
Q
Did Hashim Campbell ever in the branch in 2020 when the
bank was offering PPP loans?
A
Yes.
Q
Did he ever work at the bank?
A
Yes.
Q
Where?
A
At the conference room.
Q
And to your knowledge, what, if anything, did he do in
the conference room?
A
He was assisting his clients with the PPP loan and tax
documentations.
Q
Mr. Castro, generally, what loan amount did Hashim
Campbell's clients get at your branch?
A
The max amount, 20,000.
Q
What, if any, conversation did you have with Anuli
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Okeke about Hashim Campbell's PPP client referrals at your
branch?
A
She would give me a heads up if an applicant or a
client was to come in on the site just to be prepared so I
could be aware to open the account that Hashim was sending a
client over.
Q
What type of occupations did Hashim Campbell's clients
have?
A
They were mainly hair dresser, cab driver, mechanic.
Self-proprietorship.
Q
Were those occupations truthful?
A
No.
Q
Were they made up?
A
Yes.
Q
How do you know they were made up?
A
I was part of it and I knew that many of those clients
did not have those professions.
Q
Did you have any conversations with Anuli Okeke about
these occupations?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you describe those conversations?
A
She would tell me that if an applicant came in and
needed, and we needed to input that information, those were
the professions that we will mainly be using: Cab driver,
mechanic, hair dresser.
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Q
Mr. Castro, did you start referring customers to the
bank to apply for PPP loans?
A
Yes.
Q
And, to your knowledge, did other people outside of you
and Hashim Campbell also refer applicants to your branch to
apply for PPP loans?
A
Yes.
Q
Who?
A
Charlene.
Q
Who else?
A
Lenny; my brother.
Q
You mentioned your brother. Did you have family
members who referred applicants to apply for PPP loans?
A
Yes.
Q
Do you also have a brother name Ariel?
A
Yes.
Q
Did he refer people to the bank?
A
Yes.
Q
Did the referrals from your family members have false
information in the applications?
A
Yes.
Q
For the PPP loan applications that Hashim Campbell did
referrals, did those loan application having false
information?
A
Yes.
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Q
How do you know that?
A
Those are clients, once again, that needed to input
those tax information, like, the amount and the profession.
On many occasions, I contacted myself Hashim after
communicating with Anuli on what the steps that needed to be
made.
Q
What does that mean, "communicated with Anuli" about
the steps?
A
So if the applicant came to open the checking account,
I would ask Anuli, okay, so what is the next step? Who
should we get this client to fill out those tax forms,
either Hashim or the African.
Q
Were you paid money for loans you assisted were brought
in to the bank by Hashim Campbell?
A
Yes.
Q
Was Anuli Okeke paid money from Hashim Campbell's
client referrals to the bank?
A
Yes.
Q
How do you know that?
A
I, myself, when I did the withdrawals. On many
occasions, I would put from the proceeds of the withdrawal,
put money into the envelopes and cash envelopes and hand it
into in to Anuli.
Q
Did anyone else at the bank receive cash?
A
Yes.
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Q
Who?
A
Charlene Wint and Lenny.
Q
Were you paid money for loans you assisted brought into
the bank by other PPP loan referrals brought into your
branch?
A
Yes.
Q
Was Anuli Okeke paid money for these other loan
referrals?
A
Yes.
Q
And how do you know that?
A
Once again, I would put the money in the envelopes
myself, cash envelopes, and I would hand it in to Anuli
after the withdrawal was being made.
Q
Did people outside of the bank get paid for fraudulent
PPP loan applications processed at your branch?
A
Yes.
Q
Who?
A
The people that were referred the clients to go in as
well.
Q
What about the accountants?
A
Yes.
Q
I want to turn your attention to -- or just as an
initial matter, Mr. Castro, did your branch process
legitimate PPP loan applications?
A
Yes.
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Q
Were you compensated for those loans?
A
No.
Q
To your knowledge, was Anuli compensated for the
legitimate PPP loans?
A
No.
Q
For any PPP loan that was funded at 125th Street that
you were paid for, did you assist with the withdrawal of the
applicant's PPP funds?
A
For a good number of applicants, yes.
Q
Did Anuli Okeke make any of the withdrawals?
A
No.
Q
If you were paid after a PPP loan was successfully
funded at your branch, were you paid out by the loan
proceeds?
A
At times, yes.
Q
And in what form?
A
Cash.
Q
Was it always cash?
A
Yes.
Q
Can you tell us how the PPP money was withdrawn from
the account?
A
Once the account was funded, we would do the withdrawal
slip or a bank check, a starter check, and we would use that
to make the withdrawal. The withdrawal was either made in
cash or we would split the transaction in cash and cashier's
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checks depending on the amount that was being withdrawn.
Q
How did you know what amount to withdraw?
A
So depending again on how large the account was, and
the withdrawal was being made, both Anuli and Charlene would
tell us, the bankers or the teller, how they were going to
proceeds and make that withdrawal and split it whether in
cash or cashier's checks.
Q
And who were the checks made out to?
A
Those cashier's checks, they were made out to the
business itself.
Q
Were any checks ever made out to the bank employees?
MR. TALKIN: Objection to the leading, your Honor.
THE COURT: No. Overruled.
So, members of the jury, you may wonder what this
means because, generally, you don't ask on direct
examination what we call "leading questions." But I will
allow some of it because maybe it's connected. And
sometimes it makes good common sense to allow a brief
leading question to lead into a subject matter and that's
what's happening now. Okay?
Q
Were the checks made out to any bank employees?
A
No.
Q
Why not?
A
That would lead to a paper trail and we never wanted to
make any cashier's check payable to one of us.
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Q
After a loan was deposited into an applicant's account,
when would the checks be cashed?
A
Periodically, we would cash it on the same day and
weekly as well.
Q
And why were checks cashed on the same day or weekly
after the funds hit the account?
A
To my understanding, it was that we needed to show a
paper trail showing that the individual, the business
itself, as his -- a payroll week. That's the whole purpose
of the PPP loan, the cashier's check needed to cashed on
weekly basis to front that whole process.
Q
And, Mr. Castro, did you make these checks out for
legitimate PPP loan applicants?
A
No.
Q
Were the checks signed at the time you withdrew the
funds?
A
Yes.
Q
And who would sign the checks?
A
The cashier's checks, they were signed by myself or the
branch manager who authorized the transaction.
Q
Were there instances where checks were signed before
the loans were funded?
A
The withdrawal slips, yes.
Q
And can you explain why?
A
If it was a starter check or a withdrawal slip for
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certain applicants, we wanted to ensure that the applicant
itself, once the account was being funded, that we would be
able to make the withdrawal as soon as possible.
Q
And when you say, "we wanted to ensure," who?
A
Myself, Anuli.
Q
What type of applicants did you do this with?
A
The more on the table, we started receiving a few
applicants that were not very stable. They were like more
homeless. They looked more like not your typical 9 to 5 and
we were not too sure about this new wave of clients that we
were getting. So we started doing the withdrawal slips or
the starter checks and get them signed during the account
opening.
Q
What was your understanding of how PPP loan funds were
supposed to be used?
A
It was supposed to be used for business purposes.
Again, to maybe receive -- had any loss on your personal
business for rent or for your payroll purpose.
Q
And for PPP loans, where you in the bank received a
portion, was anything written in the memo lines for the
checks?
A
Yes.
Q
What?
A
Anuli indicated for us to have the paper trail and on
the memo to put weekly payroll or rent, basically,
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indicating that the funds being withdrawn was for that
particular purpose.
Q
Were these descriptions in the memo lines made up?
A
Yes.
Q
What is an account hold at Popular Bank?
A
That's when you place a hold on an account and no
withdrawals can be made anywhere.
Q
Were there any account holds in 2020 placed on
borrowers who received PPP loans at the 125th Street branch?
A
For some applicants, yes.
Q
Like who?
A
By management, Anuli or Charlene Wint.
Q
And, to your knowledge, why were there account holds
placed on some of the accounts?
A
Similar to getting the withdrawal slips signed, it was
just to ensure that the applicant wasn't going to any other
branch to make the withdrawals; that they were solely only
going to our site to make those withdrawals once the account
was funded.
Q
To your knowledge, Mr. Castro, did your branch place an
account hold on applicants who received legitimate PPP
loans?
A
No.
Q
Now, you mentioned other branches. Were applicants
that you received money from allowed to go to a different
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Popular Bank branch?
A
Not necessarily, no.
Q
Why not?
A
For the fraudulent applications, we wanted the
applicant to come back to us and make the withdrawals and
avoid any red flags or any questions being asked at the
other branch by a branch manager or branch teller.
Q
Who made that limitation?
A
Again, management. Anuli and Charlene.
THE COURT: Ms. Blinkas, I think I want to give
the jurors a little break. Let me know when it's a good
time to do that, all right?
MS. BILINKAS: We can take a break now, your
Honor.
THE COURT: Okay. So members of the jury we'll
take a midmorning break. Don't talk about the case and see
you back here by 11:30.
COURTROOM DEPUTY: All rise.
(Jury exits courtroom at 11:48 a.m.)
COURTROOM DEPUTY: You can step down if you like.
(Witness leaves the witness stand.)
(A recess in the proceedings was taken.)
COURTROOM DEPUTY: All rise.
(Jury enters courtroom at 11:48 a.m.)
COURTROOM DEPUTY: You can all be seated.
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(Witness takes the witness stand.)
THE COURT: The Ms. Bilinkas, you can continue
with your direct examination.
MS. BILINKAS: Thank you, your Honor.
EXAMINATION BY
MS. BILINKAS:
(Continuing.)
Q
Mr. Castro, before the break, we were discussing the
location at which borrowers could withdraw their PPP loan
proceeds.
How did borrowers know that they had to come back to
the 125th Street branch?
A
We would notify the client and the applicant that they,
if they wanted to make any withdrawals, that they would have
to come back into our location.
Q
When you say "we," who is we?
A
Myself, on some occasions. Anuli depending on who the
applicant was.
Q
And when in the process would you have this
conversation?
A
At the account opening.
Q
And, to your knowledge, did legitimate PPP loan
applicants have this limitation of coming back specifically
to the 125th branch?
A
No.
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Q
Are there other Popular Bank branches located in the
New York area?
A
Yes.
Q
Are you familiar with the term "blind spot" as it
relates to video surveillance?
A
Yes.
Q
And what does that mean?
A
That is a spot where the cameras cannot reach and the
camera can't record.
Q
Were there any blind spots in the video surveillance in
2020 at the Popular Bank branch 125th Street location?
A
Yes.
Q
Mr. Castro, were blind spots utilized during the time
PPP loans were being offered at the branch?
A
Yes.
Q
How?
A
During the withdrawals, if the cash withdrawals -- once
the account was being funded, we would go into those blind
spots to hand out the cash that was placed in the cash
envelopes.
Q
When you say "we" who is we?
A
Myself, Anuli, Charlene, Lenny.
Q
Were there secured areas at the 125th Street branch?
A
Excuse me, sorry.
Q
Were there secured employee only areas at the 125th
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Street branch?
A
Yes.
Q
Where?
A
The back area, meaning, the teller and where the safe
was. That was employees only.
Q
Who had access to the video surveillance systems at the
bank?
A
Management, Anuli and Charlene.
Q
Was there a conference room at the 125th Street branch?
A
Yes.
Q
And can you describe the physical layout of the
conference room?
A
So it was at the entrance of the building or the
branch. It was glass so you could see through the
conference room from outside. Also, the sidewalk you could
see into the conference room.
Q
Could you see into the conference room when you were
inside the branch?
A
Yes.
Q
Did Anuli Okeke ever follow-up with you about money
after a PPP loan was withdrawn?
MR. TALKIN: Your Honor, I object to the leading.
THE COURT: It is a leading question, I'll sustain
that objection. But it's already been asked and answered so
I'll let it stay right now.
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Counsel knows about leading questions. When
you're allowed some leading questions preliminary to go into
different subject matter, and so, I will allow a little bit
of it.
Go ahead, next question.
Q
Mr. Castro, what, if any, conversations did you have
with Anuli Okeke after funds were withdrawn?
A
Conversations that once the funds were withdrawn
ensured that the applicant was coming in to make the
withdrawal and what basically the blessing or compensation
was and where was her conversation after the withdrawal was
being made.
Q
Did you ever have conversations with borrowers about
getting their loans forgiven?
A
Yes.
Q
And what conversations were those?
A
We would tell the borrowers that they didn't have to
pay the loan back. That Anuli, the manager, she would be
submitting a forgiveness documentation so the applicants
didn't have to pay the loan eventually.
Q
When in the process did you have those conversations?
A
During the account opening and the initial step of the
submitting the application.
Q
How much money, Mr. Castro, in commissions did you get
from assisting with fraudulent PPP loans?
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A
As a whole, $15,000.
Q
I want to turn to Hashim Campbell.
Did you communicate with Hashim Campbell about
fraudulent PPP loans that were processed at your branch?
A
Yes.
Q
How did you communicate with him?
A
Through text messages and e-mails.
MS. BILINKAS: At this time, for the witness's
eyes only I would like to pull up Government's Exhibit 320.
(Continued on the next page.)
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Castro - direct - Ms. Bilinkas
Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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(Continuing.)
MS. BILINKAS: And if you can just scroll through.
THE COURT: So that's in evidence already, I
believe?
MS. BILINKAS: Not in evidence, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Not yet.
BY MS. BILINKAS:
Q
Mr. Castro, do you recognize Government's Exhibit 320?
A
Yes.
Q
And generally, what is it?
A
My conversation with Hashim Campbell.
Q
And is the phone number 7839, ending 7839, the phone
number you had in 2020?
A
Yes.
Q
And do these messages fairly and accurately depict
conversations you had with Hashim Campbell between June 9th
of 2020 and August 15, 2020?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Your Honor, at this time the
Government moves to admit Government's Exhibit 320.
THE COURT: Any objection?
MR. TALKIN: No, Your Honor.
THE COURT: In evidence at this time.
(Government's Exhibit 320 received in evidence.)
(Exhibit published.)
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Castro - direct - Ms. Bilinkas
Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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Q
Looking at page 1 of Government Exhibit 320,
Mr. Castro, what are we looking at?
A
We're looking at the list of applicants that I am
sending to Hashim so he could process their tax documents.
Q
Did the tax documents contain false information for
these applicants?
A
Yes.
Q
Where did you create this list?
A
This was created at the computer at Popular at the
125th branch.
Q
Why did you create this Lynch?
A
To keep track of the clients, since the volume was
increasing, it was Anuli informing me just to make sure that
I had a track of who were the clients that Hashim needed to
do the taxes for.
Q
How many lists like this on page 1 did you create
during the PPP loan program?
A
About 30 lists.
Q
Where did you get the information to create these
lists?
A
So the name, social, date of birth and address was
provided by the applicant at the moment of opening the
account. And the profession was initially conversation that
I had myself with Anuli and she would tell me what kind of
professions that we could put in for these applicants.
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Castro - direct - Ms. Bilinkas
Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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Q
And what type of PPP loan were these applicants
getting?
A
The sole proprietorship.
Q
And what is the maximum amount they could get?
A
A little bit over 20,000.
Q
Are the professions on your list here made up?
A
Yes.
Q
Is this your handwriting on these documents?
A
The lower corner, yes.
Q
On the middle and third page, is that also your
handwriting?
A
Yes.
Q
Looking at the middle page at the top, what is the date
listed there?
A
July 16th of 2020.
Q
Was that after your meeting in the Bronx at the Boca
restaurant?
A
Yes.
Q
What is the handwriting at the bottom right?
A
That's my handwriting, indicating up, like I said,
other, the old list that we had, indicating those were
already sent out to Hashim and if they had a checkmark, that
meant that we already processed the PPP loan application.
Q
And how did a borrower receive the maximum amount for a
loan?
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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A
The accountant, Hashim Campbell, he would inflate the
numbers on the tax returns. And the larger amount that he
reported on your taxes, that transpired to PPP loan
receiving the $20,000 based on the formula that the PPP loan
application had.
Q
Did these individuals on this list receive PPP loans?
A
Yes.
Q
And did you take portions of the proceeds from those
loans?
A
Yes.
Q
Did Anuli Okeke, to your knowledge, receive portions of
loan proceeds?
A
Yes.
Q
How do you know that?
A
I, myself, handed in cash envelopes to Anuli.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please go to page 2?
Q
Looking at these top messages, are you in the blue or
the white text?
A
The white.
Q
Did Hashim Campbell provide you his e-mail address?
A
Yes.
Q
And is that the e-mail address listed on this page?
A
Yes.
Q
And did you communicate with him via e-mail?
A
Yes.
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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Q
About what?
A
The taxes for the applicants.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please go to page 5?
Q
Looking at the middle section of this page,
Mr. Campbell -- I'm sorry, Mr. Castro, what is the date of
this text?
A
July 9th.
Q
Is that the same day you went to Boca restaurant in the
Bronx with Anuli, Charlene, and Lenny?
A
Not sure.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please pull up Government
Exhibit 674 already in evidence?
(Exhibit published.)
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please highlight, second
from the bottom, the right side of "card purchases."
Q
Mr. Castro, was this text the same day you went to the
Boca restaurant in the Bronx?
A
Yes.
Q
Thank you.
Just focusing back on the 320 page. What did you
tell Hashim Campbell that day?
A
I was informing him that we needed to get the maximum
for the three applicants that I was sending over.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please go to page 6?
Q
And looking at the top of this text, why are you
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Official Court Reporter
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providing Hashim Campbell Jesse Scott Rolon's information?
A
This was one of the applicants we were submitting
fraudulent information and Hashim was going to be the one
doing the taxes for this applicant.
Q
The occupation, maintenance worker, was that a made-up
profession?
A
Yes.
Q
Looking at the bottom of this page, did Hashim Campbell
send e-mails to both your personal and work e-mails?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: If you could please go to page 8.
Q
Looking at the message, July 22, 2020, what did Hashim
Campbell send you on this date?
A
So this is a screen shot of his spreadsheet showing the
applicants that he's working on and also the applicants that
were already -- that he was probably submitting on that
particular day.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please go to page 9?
Q
Mr. Castro, is the image at the top of this page the
same image we looked at on page 1 of Government's
Exhibit 320?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: You can take that down.
Can you please go to the bottom?
Q
What is Currentcarz?
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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A
That was another e-mail that Hashim would send
documentations from.
MS. BILINKAS: You could take that down.
If you could please go to page 10.
Q
Mr. Castro, we talked about your family members before.
Did your brothers also have clients that dealt with Hashim
Campbell?
A
Yes.
Q
And what are we looking at in this message?
A
So the first one is just the screen shot of the
spreadsheet showing the ones that he's working on. He
indicates that those are my brother's referrals and they
completed them at his location, in his office. And it's
just to let him know and communicate that it's all good.
Q
Okay.
A
And that the other ones are going to be completed
afterwards.
MS. BILINKAS: If you can please go to page 11.
Q
Can you please read the text message that you sent to
Hashim that's on the screen.
A
I said: Hey, good morning. Hensy, Pamela, Henry and
Rubi are my other brother's accounts. Anuli submitted those
apps already. One of them is about to get funded. Call me
if you need anything else.
Q
Can you read his response?
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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A
Yeah, I'm all mixed up now. Just trying to get
everything out to you.
MS. BILINKAS: You can pull that down. Thank you.
Q
And on July 26th of 2020, can you please read this
message that you sent to Hashim Campbell?
A
Hey. Happy Sunday. Me and Anuli were wondering if you
were going to work on that list today and have it ready by
Monday 'cuz we're really behind with our clients. If we
can't get this done, we need to know so we can look into
other options, but we have to know what the deal is
otherwise we are just stuck. And the clients are asking for
the updates. Some of these clients open accounts two.
Q
What did you mean by looking into other options?
A
As I mentioned before, there was the other accountant,
the African, that in the case that Hashim wasn't able to
provide us with those tax documents, then we will get those
tax documents with the applicant.
Q
Can you please read the text message you sent at the
top?
A
The clients are asking for the updates. Some of these
clients open accounts two weeks ago.
Q
And how did Hashim respond?
A
Working on it bro.
Q
How did you respond?
A
Thanks. Just keep me updated because I have Anuli, my
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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brother and the clients on my back with this. So I have to
kind of know what we doing.
Q
What did you mean when you said Anuli, my brother and
the clients are on your back?
A
Being the banker that was opening all these accounts,
so I had the pressure from Anuli. She wanted to make sure
that I was reaching out to Hashim and get those tax
information in so we could get the PPP loan application in.
Also, the clients were asking where the money was and
everyone that was referring those clients were asking me
when is the money going to get funded. So I was getting
pressure from different angles.
MS. BILINKAS: Thank you. You can take that down.
Q
Looking at the bottom of this page, did you send Hashim
Campbell a list of individuals?
A
Yes.
Q
And why did you send him these?
A
Similar to the other list, just to keep track of the
ones that we are working on and that are pending.
MS. BILINKAS: Thank you. You can go to the next
page.
Q
Mr. Castro, on July 30th of 2020, did you send Hashim
Campbell information for your cousin?
A
Yes.
Q
And why did you send this information?
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A
To see if my cousin could get, before the PPP loan
funds were exhausted, as it was almost to the end of the
period, to get him a loan.
Q
When you say "the end of the period," what does that
mean?
A
So at that time, towards August, the PPP loan was
almost at the end of the funds were being exhausted. So we
were getting notification, Anuli was telling us that we
might not be able to submit any more applications.
Q
And is the application for your cousin that you sent
this information over looking at fraudulent information on
the application?
A
Yes.
Q
Was this loan ultimately funded?
A
No.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please go to the next page?
Q
And did you send Hashim on August 3rd a photo of a list
of individuals?
A
Yes.
Q
And why did you send him this?
A
Once again, it's just to ensure that he knew which
applicants we are working on, the information, and to get
updates from him.
MS. BILINKAS: Thank you. You can take that down.
Q
And on August 4, 2020, can you please read these two
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messages you send Hashim?
A
Hey, good morning, bro. As you know we are close to
the deadline. I know you are going to get a lot of calls
today. Just wanted to let you know I couldn't find Genis
Castro taxes. I don't think we going to have time for the
new business account so let's just work on the ones we
already have pending. Thanks.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please go back to page 1 of
this exhibit.
Q
Mr. Castro, did there come a time when you assisted
with the PPP loan application for an individual named
Richard Pinero?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Now showing what's in evidence as
Government's Exhibit 11.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Do you recognize this person?
A
Yes.
Q
And who is this?
A
Richard Pinero.
MS. BILINKAS: You can take this down.
Q
How did you meet Richard Pinero?
A
He was referred to the branch and he came in to open up
the checking account and to submit the PPP loan application.
Q
Can you describe Mr. Pinero?
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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A
Very unstable person. One could say homeless. Very
erratic.
MS. BILINKAS: I want to pull up now what's
already in evidence as Government's Exhibit 1029, page 23.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Mr. Castro, is this the PPP loan application you worked
on at Popular Bank for Richard Pinero?
A
Yes.
Q
And how do you know that?
A
Because I helped him fill out the application.
Q
Is this your handwriting?
A
Yes.
Q
What type of PPP loan was this?
A
This is sole proprietor.
Q
So what was the maximum amount someone could get?
A
A little bit over 20,000.
Q
Was the information on this PPP loan application false?
A
Yes.
Q
How do you know that?
A
This is one of the applications that we sent, or the
applicants that we sent to Hashim to make the taxes so we
could get the max amount.
MS. BILINKAS: I'm going to show the witness now
what's already in evidence as Government Exhibit 1030.
(Exhibit published.)
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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Q
Is this the tax document that was submitted with this
PPP loan application?
A
Yes.
Q
And looking at number seven, gross income.
MS. BILINKAS: If you could highlight that, and
then also A at the top.
Q
What profession did you have on the application for
Mr. Pinero?
A
Janitor.
Q
Did Mr. Pinero make $135,000 in 2019 as a janitor?
A
No.
Q
Was this number made up?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: You can take that down. Thank you.
Q
Did Popular Bank fund this loan?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Showing you what's already in
evidence as Government's Exhibit 1046.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
What is this document?
A
That's a bank statement for Richard Pinero.
MS. BILINKAS: And if you could please go down to
the transactions, specifically, the transaction on
August 18th.
Q
Mr. Castro, how much was Mr. Pinero's PPP loan funded
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for?
A
20,590.
Q
What was the beginning balance before the PPP loan hit
his account?
A
$5.
Q
Did you get paid for processing this PPP loan?
A
Yes.
Q
Did Anuli Okeke get paid for this PPP loan application?
A
Yes.
Q
Looking at the transaction on August 27th, was there a
$9,900 withdrawal made?
A
Yes.
Q
Why was this withdrawal made?
A
That was the initial withdrawal that we made, and the
amount we made it was under the $10,000 amount to avoid any
CTRs.
Q
You said CTR. What's a CTR?
A
That's from banking, it's a Currency Transaction
Report. Any transaction over $10,000 needs to be reported
to the Government agencies. Anything under $10,000 doesn't
need to be reported.
Q
And then on September 11th, was there also a $1,000
withdraw made from this account?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please pull up what's
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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already in evidence as Government's Exhibit 1067?
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Mr. Castro, whose handwriting is on this check?
A
On on the top is my handwriting and on the memo line.
Q
Memo line states: Weekly payroll -- is that payment?
A
Yes.
Q
Why is that written there?
A
That's, again, what we did to show that the payment or
the withdrawal -- sorry, the withdrawal that we were making
was indicating that was for that purpose.
Q
When you say "we did," who is "we"?
A
So I filled out that memo line, but that was indicated
by Anuli to always put on the memo line what the purpose of
the withdrawal was.
Q
Going to page 2 of this exhibit, is this a $1,000
transaction on September 11th of 2020?
A
Yes.
Q
And does it also have a memo line for weekly payroll
and payment?
A
Yes.
Q
And whose handwriting is this?
A
Mine.
Q
Mr. Castro, on September 11th of 2020, did you pick up
Richard Pinero and bring him to the 125th Street branch?
A
Yes.
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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Q
Why?
A
Richard Pinero went to another site in Sutphin
Boulevard -- sorry, on 140 -- on Third Ave, in the Bronx.
And he was trying to make a withdrawal and he was not
allowed to make that withdrawal. Our branch received a
call, Anuli received a call and Anuli told me that Richard
Pinero was making a scene at the Third Avenue site and to
reach out to him. He was not answering his phone, so she
was like, well, try to go see if you can find him. Go over
there right now.
Q
Prior to September 11th of 2020, had you ever picked up
a bank customer before?
A
No.
Q
Can you describe Mr. Pinero's demeanor that day?
A
He was upset. He was confused. He was arguing.
Q
Did he ultimately come to the 125th Street branch that
day?
A
Yes. I picked him up and I brought him into the
branch.
Q
And who did he speak with?
A
After I brought him in, he went to speak to Anuli.
Q
After he spoke with Anuli, did you withdraw $1,000 from
his account that day and pay him?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: I'm showing the witness what's
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Official Court Reporter
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already in evidence as Government's Exhibit 508.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. BILINKAS: Would you please go to camera seven
and go to minute 15:17:28? And you can hit play. Thank
you.
(Video played; video paused.)
THE COURT: The jurors may be wondering what's
happening now. We have a lot of young people coming into
the courtroom. I will explain to them.
We are greeting a school of students who come to
court, we were advised in advance they would be paying a
visit and the courtroom is open to anybody. Periodically we
do get visitors, we get students, we get a whole range of
people coming in to see what goes on in the courtroom.
There are students and teachers, I talk to them during the
break, I welcome them and we try to extend what we call
hospitality especially to the next generation of citizens
and lawyers. So that's what's happening now.
Continue.
MS. BILINKAS: Thank you.
If you can continue playing this clip. And,
sorry, are you able to back up?
(Video played; video paused.)
Q
Mr. Castro, what are we looking at on this screen?
A
This is the 125th branch main lobby.
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Official Court Reporter
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(Video played.)
MS. BILINKAS: And if you can pause right here.
(Video paused.)
Q
Is this video from September 11th of 2020?
A
Yes.
Q
And who was in the still that we just saw?
A
That was myself walking through the lobby and Richard
Pinero with the yellow shirt.
Q
And where did you go when you walked through the lobby?
A
To my cubicle.
Q
Was Anuli there that day?
A
Yes.
Q
And who was that in the center of the screen now?
A
Richard Pinero.
MS. BILINKAS: If you could please go to camera
one, minute 15:17:33.
(Video played; video paused.)
Q
And what are we looking at here?
A
So at the front, we got Lenny at the teller area. And
in the background, you have Anuli's cubicle, Richard Pinero
on top, and then myself walking to my cubicle.
Q
And is Anuli sitting in her cubicle?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: You can press play.
(Video played; video paused.)
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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MS. BILINKAS: And you can pause.
Q
Where is Mr. Pinero now in the branch?
A
In Anuli's cubicle.
MS. BILINKAS: You can hit play.
(Video played; video paused.)
Q
And where did you go at this point?
A
To my cubicle.
MS. BILINKAS: If you could please go to camera
seven, minute 15:26:39, and hit play.
(Video played.)
Q
Mr. Castro, where were you going?
A
To the conference room, I believe.
Q
Who is in the screen now?
A
Myself and Richard Pinero.
MS. BILINKAS: If you can please go to camera one,
minute 15:49:48.
(Video played.)
MS. BILINKAS: Can you press pause?
(Video paused.)
Q
Mr. Castro, what are we looking at now?
A
So still Richard Pinero again. He is still upset. He
tried to make a withdrawal, I believe, at the ATM, and he
was not allowed to make the withdrawal so he's coming back
to speak to Anuli to complain that he was not able to
withdraw funds.
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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Q
And are you by Anuli's cubicle at this point with
Mr. Pinero?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: You can press play.
(Video played; video paused.)
Q
Mr. Castro, did Mr. Pinero get the $1,000 at the branch
that day?
A
Yes.
Q
And why did he get a thousand dollars?
A
To calm him down.
(Video played; video paused.)
MS. BILINKAS: Thank you, you can take this down.
Q
We've talked about sole proprietor loans. I want to
direct your attention to business PPP loans that you
assisted with at Popular Bank in 2020.
Who at the bank handled PPP loan applications for
businesses that had employees?
A
Anuli.
Q
Who met with those borrowers or applicants?
A
Anuli.
Q
What, if any, role did you have in any business PPP
loan application that claimed employees at your branch?
A
I had to ensure that the applicant had a business
account established with Popular.
MS. BILINKAS: If you could please pull up
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Castro - direct - Ms. Bilinkas
Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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Government Exhibit 8.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Can you remind the jury who this is?
A
That's one of the accountants. I knew him as the
African.
Q
How were you introduced to him?
A
He went in one time at the branch with one of our
business clients.
MS. BILINKAS: You can take that down.
Q
And did this individual assist with business PPP loans
at your branch in 2020?
A
Yes.
Q
How did he assist?
A
He provided tax documentation.
Q
Did the tax documentation contain false information?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please pull up Government's
Exhibit 4 already in evidence?
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Do you recognize who is depicted here?
A
Yes.
Q
Who is this?
A
Assana.
Q
And how do you know Assana?
A
She was one of the local business owners that had an
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Castro - direct - Ms. Bilinkas
Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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account with us at 125th.
MS. BILINKAS: You can take that down. Thank you.
Q
Did you assist with a PPP loan application for Assana's
businesses at Popular Bank in 2020?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please pull up what's
already in evidence Government's Exhibit 700?
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Who filled out this business application?
A
Anuli.
Q
Did this loan application contain false information?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please pull up what's
already in evidence as Government's Exhibit 701?
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Was this the tax documents that were submitted, or a
tax document submitted along with this application for
Assana?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you have a conversation with Anuli Okeke about this
loan application?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: You can take this down.
Q
And what, if anything, happened during that
conversation?
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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A
So my work was basically on that application, just to
ensure that the account that Assana had was open and that
documentations were scanned properly and she indicated that
at the end of our workload, since we had a lot of
applications, a lot of accounts, that we were going to be
compensated by Assana and that she was going to bless us.
Q
And at what point in the process did you have this
conversation with Anuli Okeke?
A
Very beginning.
Q
Other than an account opening up, what, if anything
else, did you do with this loan application?
A
Did the withdrawals, just ensure that, again, scanning
documents, and just make sure that everything was basically
done correctly for the application.
Q
Was this PPP loan funded?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please pull up what's
already in evidence as Government's Exhibit 786?
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Mr. Castro, what are we looking at here?
A
This is a bank statement for Assana's hair salon.
Q
And going down to the daily activity, the transaction
on July 9th of 2020, how much was the Assana Hair Salon PPP
loan approved for?
A
$75,000.
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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Q
Were withdraws made after this loan was funded?
A
Yes.
Q
How much?
A
The loan withdrawal was made for $19,500. And another
withdrawal was made for $49,030.70.
MS. BILINKAS: You can take this down, thank you.
Q
Did you end up getting paid for this loan?
A
Yes.
Q
And can you walk us through how that happened in this
case?
A
So after the withdrawal was made at the bank in the
teller area, Anuli and Charlene walked in after all the
checks were made and the cash was given to the applicant,
Anuli and Charlene, they walk in and gave myself and Lenny
an envelope with cash in it.
Q
And when you say the back or teller area, was that a
secure employee-only area?
A
Yes.
Q
And did Assana ever go back there?
A
Yes.
Q
Did there come a time where you assisted with the PPP
loan application for an entity called Laser Cut Barber?
A
Yes.
Q
And whose business is that?
A
That was my barber.
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Castro - direct - Ms. Bilinkas
Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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Q
And how did your barber learn about a PPP loan program
at Popular Bank?
A
I told him initially about the loan itself.
Q
And what was your barber's name?
A
Leo.
Q
Did Leo ever come to the 125th Street branch?
A
Yes.
Q
Did he meet with anyone?
A
Yes.
Q
Who?
A
After he met with me, he met with Anuli Okeke.
Q
And did Leo and Anuli Okeke have a conversation at the
bank?
A
Yes.
Q
How do you know that?
A
He went and sat down at her cubicle to have a
conversation about the process of application.
MS. BILINKAS: I would like to pull up
Government's Exhibit 760 already in evidence and go to
page 24, please.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Is this the PPP loan application for your barber's
Laser Cut Barbershop?
A
Yes.
Q
And how many employees were claimed?
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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A
Thirteen.
Q
And what was the average monthly payroll?
A
$30,370.
Q
What loan amount was requested for this application?
A
$75,920.
Q
Were tax documents required in order to submit this
loan application?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: If you could please pull up what's
already in evidence as Government's Exhibits 757 and 759,
side by side, please.
(Exhibits published.)
Q
Were these the tax documents submitted for the Laser
Cut Barber PPP loan application?
A
Yes.
Q
Did the tax documents contain false information?
A
Yes.
Q
How do you know that?
A
I was aware that he did not have 13 employees, being
myself, a customer, the barbers -- each barber that he had
was a sole proprietor. They all got paid individually.
Q
Did you have a conversation with Anuli Okeke about the
employees listed on this application?
A
Yes.
Q
And what, if anything, was said during that
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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conversation?
A
She was basically knowing that the barber, himself, was
a sole proprietorship and that he didn't actually have 13
employees. In addition, we had the conversation about how
much we were going to charge Leo for submitting his
application.
MS. BILINKAS: You can take this down, thank you.
Q
Do you remember how much you were to charge Leo for
this $75,000 loan?
A
A couple of thousands.
Q
And did you get paid after this loan was funded?
A
Yes.
Q
And how did you get paid?
A
After he made the initial withdrawal, when the account
got funded, I took a cash envelope for myself and gave a
cash envelope to Anuli.
Q
Mr. Castro, how much would you typically get paid for
for the sole proprietor loans?
A
Anything between 20 to $150.
Q
And did you have a higher amount of money paid to you
for the Laser Cut Barber application?
A
Yes.
Q
Why was that?
A
One, that was my first, you could call, business PPP
loan, and that was the largest amount at the time that I
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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assisted with.
Q
Did there come a time that you assisted with a PPP loan
application for an entity called Car Expert Auto Group?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: If you could please pull up what's
already in evidence as Government's Exhibit 737, page 23.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Do you recognize this loan application?
A
Yes.
Q
And how do you recognize it?
A
That's my handwriting.
Q
What was your role in this loan application?
A
Basically similar to Laser Cut, that it helped opening
the business account, helping the client to submit all the
documentations for the PPP loan.
Q
And when you say the client, who was the borrower here?
A
Israel Viloria.
Q
And did Israel Viloria come to the bank branch?
A
Yes.
Q
And did Israel Viloria meet with anyone?
A
Yes.
Q
Who?
A
After he met with me, he also met with Anuli.
Q
Were you ever in a meeting together with Anuli and
Israel?
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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A
Yes.
Q
Did this application contain false information?
A
Yes.
Q
What was false about it?
A
Number of employees and the amount, the average monthly
payroll amount.
MS. BILINKAS: You can take this down, thank you.
Q
Mr. Castro, did you ever visit the business address for
Car Expert Auto?
A
Yes.
Q
Why did you visit the business address?
A
So it was part of, I guess, policy for Popular Bank to
visit if we wanted to open a business account, to go and
visit the location. It was for the manager to go and visit
the physical location of the place. In this case, being
that this was a new account, we -- Anuli needed to go and
visit that location. Being that I was the one that had a
car, she asked me to take her, for us to go and take
pictures of the business.
Q
And did you go with her to this address?
A
Yes.
Q
And what did you observe when you got to this address
for Car Expert Auto?
A
That it was a business, itself, it was a dealership,
but it definitely didn't have the 13 or the number of
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Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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employees that they -- the 20 number of employees that they
had.
Q
Why do you say that?
A
It was only probably two people working there.
Q
Was the PPP loan application still processed at the
125th Street branch after this visit to the business address
with Anuli Okeke?
A
Yes.
Q
Were tax documents provided with this loan application?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: If you can please pull up what's
already in evidence as Government's Exhibit 744 through 746.
(Exhibits published.)
Q
Were these the tax documents, IRS tax documents 941 for
the tax year 2019 that were submitted with the Car Expert
Auto Group --
A
Yes.
Q
-- loan application?
And did these tax documents contain false
information?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: You can take this down.
Q
Mr. Castro, was this loan application approved by
Popular Bank with just these 941s?
A
I believe that on top of the tax documents, the account
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document and those 941s, that's how the account was
approved.
Q
Did there --
A
Sorry. And W-2 forms.
Q
Did there come a point where W-2 forms were requested?
A
Yes.
Q
By who?
A
So Anuli had direct conversations with the auditors, so
anything that was needed from back office from the auditors,
Anuli would communicate that to me to communicate then to
the client.
Q
Why were additional tax documents required for this
application?
A
So they were having issues of the auditors approving
this loan and they were asking for more documentations as
proof of -- to show evidence that these employees actually
work at that location.
Q
And were W-2s ultimately provided for this application?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: If you could please pull up what's
already in evidence as Government's Exhibit 738.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Are these --
MS. BILINKAS: If you could just scroll.
Q
Are these the W-2s that were included with the
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application?
A
Yes.
Q
Did the W-2s have false information in them?
A
Yes.
Q
Was this the only time W-2s were submitted with this
application?
A
No.
Q
What does that mean?
A
This is probably the second -- the second time that
W-2s were submitted by the applicant, himself. He initially
came with -- show us the numbers that he was going to input
on those wages and the numbers that he input in those wages
were not realistic-looking numbers.
Q
What does that mean, not realistic-looking numbers?
A
They were mainly whole numbers. Every employee was
showing 60,000, 40,000, 30,000. So it was even numbers.
And as we all know, it's just employees or workers, they
have cents, they have different numbers, because it adds up
through the whole year. So his numbers were not realistic
for us to submit to the auditors. It was going to bring red
flags.
Q
You said "us." Who is "us"?
A
Anuli and myself.
Q
Did this loan --
MS. BILINKAS: You can take that down, thank you.
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Q
Did this loan ultimately get approved?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: I am showing the witness what's
already in evidence as Government's Exhibit 789.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
What is this document, Mr. Castro?
A
It's a bank statement for Car Expert.
MS. BILINKAS: And if you could please go down to
the activity, to the August 18th.
Q
How much was this loan funded for?
A
$250,000.
Q
Now, the date is August 18th. What was the status of
PPP loan funding at that point in August of 2020?
A
It was towards the end.
Q
And what, if any, conversations did you have with Anuli
about the timing of this loan application?
A
That that was perhaps the last application because the
funds and the Government was cutting funding for PPP loans.
Q
After the PPP funds went into this bank account, were
there withdraws made from this account?
A
Yes.
Q
And sorry, before we get to that, what was the
beginning balance for this entity prior to the money hitting
the account?
A
Zero.
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Q
And then looking at the two transactions on August 19th
and August 28th, how much in withdraws were made from this
account?
A
The initial withdrawal was for $150,000. The second
withdrawal was for $50,000.
Q
Were you allowed to withdraw this amount of money in
your role as a personal banker?
A
No.
Q
How were you able to withdraw this amount?
A
In order to make a withdrawal of $150,000, I would need
what we call an override.
Q
And who was authorized to make an override?
A
Anuli or Charlene.
MS. BILINKAS: I would like to show the witness
now what's already in evidence as Government Exhibit 806.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. BILINKAS: And if you could please pull up the
checks side by side.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
Mr. Castro, are these the two checks we just looked at
from the account statement for Car Expert Auto?
A
Yes.
Q
Whose handwriting is this?
A
My handwriting.
Q
Are these checks dated August 19th and August 28th of
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2020?
A
Yes.
Q
And why did you fill out these dates this way?
A
So it was again to show and confirm that it was a
weekly period to pay out the employees and have the paper
trail to show that the person is making those weekly
withdrawals.
MS. BILINKAS: If you could please highlight the
memo lines.
Q
Did you write this these memo lines?
A
Yes.
Q
Were these memo lines made up?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: You can take that down, thank you.
Q
Did you receive a portion of these loan proceeds,
Mr. Castro?
A
Yes.
Q
Did Anuli Okeke receive a portion of these loan
proceeds?
A
Yes.
Q
How do you know that?
A
I did partial withdrawals. I handed myself a cash
envelope and I handed Anuli a cash envelope from those
withdrawals.
Q
Mr. Castro, earlier you testified that you pleaded
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guilty. Did you plead guilty pursuant to a cooperation
agreement?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you review and sign that agreement before you
entered into it?
A
Yes.
Q
What is your understanding of what your obligations are
under this cooperation agreement?
A
To tell the truth.
Q
Did you meet with law enforcement as part of this
process?
A
Yes.
Q
Have you met with the Government a number of times in
connection with this case?
A
Yes.
Q
Under your plea agreement, what is the maximum term of
imprisonment you can receive?
A
Thirty years.
Q
What do you hope to receive from the Government if you
meet all of your obligations under the cooperation
agreement?
A
Lenient sentencing.
Q
Do you know what a 5K letter is?
A
Yes.
Q
Who writes the 5K letter?
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A
The prosecutors.
Q
And generally, what is in that 5K letter?
A
It basically explains the things that I did during the
scheme. Also my cooperation with the Government.
Q
And who does Government send this letter to?
A
To the judge.
Q
And what do you hope the 5K letter will get you?
A
A lenient sentence.
Q
Does the 5K letter require the sentencing judge to give
you a specific sentence?
A
No.
Q
Can the judge still sentence you up to the maximum
amount of time that we discussed?
A
Yes.
Q
Will the Government recommend a specific sentence for
you?
A
No.
Q
Can the Government promise you a specific sentence?
A
No.
Q
Ultimately, Mr. Castro, who decides your sentence in
this case?
A
The judge.
Q
And sitting here today, do you have any idea what your
sentence is going to be?
A
No.
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Q
What happens if you don't tell the truth here today in
court?
A
I will be breaking my deal.
Q
What do you mean by breaking your deal?
A
I would be committing perjury and not telling the
truth, breaking the deal.
Q
Would the Government be obligated to write a 5K letter
for you?
A
No.
Q
Would you be stuck with your guilty plea in that
scenario?
A
Yes.
Q
Has anyone from the Government promised you anything
other than what's in your cooperation agreement?
A
No.
Q
Finally, Mr. Castro, as part of your guilty plea, did
you also plead guilty to getting an Economic Injury Disaster
Loan?
A
Yes.
Q
And how did you first find out about this loan program?
A
In a staff meeting, a group meeting with myself, Lenny,
Anuli, and Charlene.
Q
Did you have a business in 2020?
A
No.
MS. BILINKAS: At this time, Your Honor, the
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Government moves to admit Government Exhibits 368 and 369.
THE COURT: Any objection?
MR. TALKIN: No, Your Honor.
THE COURT: 368 and 369 are in evidence at this
time.
(Government's Exhibit 368, 369 received in
evidence.)
MS. BILINKAS: If you could please pull up
Government's Exhibit 368.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. BILINKAS: And go to page 13. And if you
could highlight the top quarter of the page.
Q
Mr. Castro, how much of an EIDL loan did you receive in
2020?
A
16,500.
Q
And what was the date you received this EIDL loan?
A
July 2nd, 2020.
Q
And can you tell us what happened at this staff meeting
you referred to?
A
Anuli gave us instructions on how can we submit that
application for an SBA loan.
Q
And was this loan funded approximately a week before
your meeting with Anuli, Lenny, and Charlene at the Boca
restaurant in the Bronx?
A
Yes.
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Q
Did you receive EIDL loan proceeds in your account?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: Can you please pull up Government's
Exhibit 369?
(Exhibit published.)
MS. BILINKAS: Can you go down to the bottom right
area?
Q
Mr. Castro, for an EIDL application, did you need to
list your gross revenues and cost of goods sold for the
12 months prior to the disaster?
A
Yes.
Q
Where did you get these numbers?
A
Again, that was part of the conversation in the meeting
and Anuli telling us what information -- what each question
meant and what information to put in.
THE COURT: What exhibit number is that again?
MS. BILINKAS: 369.
THE COURT: 369.
Q
To be clear, Mr. Castro, did you have cost of goods
sold at any point in 2019?
A
No.
Q
Did you have gross revenues in 2019?
A
No.
Q
Were these numbers made up on this application?
A
Yes.
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MS. BILINKAS: You can take that down.
Q
After you received $16,500, did you pay anyone the EIDL
proceeds?
A
Yes.
Q
Who?
A
I gave some of the proceeds to Anuli.
Q
Approximately how much?
A
$200.
MS. BILINKAS: One moment, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Let me know whether you think it's a
good time, because I want to talk to the students a little
bit while they are here. Are you finished with your direct
examination?
MS. BILINKAS: Yes, I'm done, Your Honor.
THE COURT: So this is a good time to finish, if
you are finished with your direct?
MS. BILINKAS: Yes.
THE COURT: Members of the jury, we are going to
take our lunch break now. Let's come back at 2 o'clock. I
am going to talk to the students a little bit. Enjoy the
weather, and we will see you at 2 o'clock. Don't talk to
anyone about the case.
(Jury exits.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: You can all be seated.
THE COURT: The jury is out of the courtroom.
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Mr. Witness, you have to come back at 2 o'clock.
Obviously, you will be subject to cross-examination. It
would be best if you didn't speak to any Government lawyers
during this time. Okay?
See you at 2 o'clock.
(Witness steps off the stand.)
(Luncheon recess taken.)
(Continued on the following page.)
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Proceedings
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
239
AFTERNOON SESSION
(In open court - jury not present.)
(Witness entered the courtroom and resumed the
stand.)
(Judge FREDERIC BLOCK entered the courtroom.)
THE COURT: Stay seated.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Great. I'll bring the jury
in?
THE COURT: Yes.
Who is going to do the cross, Mr. Talkin?
MR. TALKIN: I am.
THE COURT: All right.
(Pause.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: All rise.
(Jury enters.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: You can all be seated.
THE COURT: Folks, as I told you, after the direct
examination, you just saw a good example of what direct
examination is, then the other party can have
cross-examination, and that's what is going to be happening
right now. All right.
Okay. So I understand Mr. Talkin is going to be
directing the cross.
MR. TALKIN: Thank you, Your Honor.
(Continued on the following page.)
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Castro - cross - Talkin
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
240
ANTHONY CASTRO,
having been previously called and sworn/affirmed, was
examined and testified further as follows:
CROSS-EXAMINATION
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Good afternoon, Mr. Castro.
A
Good afternoon.
Q
Hashim Campbell is someone you identified as -- you
called him one of the accountants?
A
Yes.
Q
And you have known him for some time because he did
events at the bank, at the 125th Street bank?
A
Yes.
Q
But you weren't personal friends with him, were you?
A
No.
Q
And you didn't keep in touch with him, did you?
A
No.
Q
And your next contact with him after doing the charity
events at the 125th Street was -- would be in 2020 dealing
with PPP, right?
A
Yes.
Q
I want to talk to you about -- you described on direct
examination there was a meeting at a Boca Restaurant.
Do you remember that?
A
Yes.
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SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
241
Q
And I think we established, I know it was hard to
remember four years ago, but I think when you saw your own
records, you realized it happened on July 9th?
A
Yes.
Q
And so, we're accurate about that?
A
Yes.
Q
Now, you said -- you described for the jury what was said
during that July 9th meeting, but really the heart of it was
you left that meeting understanding now that the PPP loans
that you were going to do at the 125th Street were going to be
fraudulent loans, right?
A
Correct.
Q
And before that you didn't think that, but -- before the
meeting that really wasn't clear to you, but it was crystal
clear to you after that July 9th, 2020 meeting?
A
Yes.
Q
And as a matter of fact, at the beginning you thought the
PPP loans were legitimate?
A
For the most part, yes.
Q
And July 9th changed that for you?
A
Yes.
Q
And when you say "for the most part," are you saying that
you knew there were illegitimate loans before July 9th?
A
I was suspicious, being that the number of clients that
we were getting was increasing at the branch. We were getting
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Castro - cross - Talkin
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
242
more referrals from the branch -- from the Bronx. So, there
was conversations already being had, and that we had at the
branch level.
Q
So, you were kind of figuring it out on your own
something was up, but you didn't know what was up until after
the meeting?
A
Yes. Correct.
Q
Now, when you say people from the Bronx, I forgot, did
you say -- are you originally -- you said, I'm originally from
the Bronx?
A
Yes.
Q
Your brother Leo lives in the Bronx?
A
Um --
Q
Did -- I'm sorry.
In 2020, your brother Leo lived in the Bronx?
A
I'm not sure.
Q
Did he live with you in 2020?
A
At one point he did, yes.
Q
And when did he stop living with you?
A
He stopped living around 2021.
Q
Okay. So during COVID and during 2020, he was living
with you?
A
At some point, yes.
Q
And at some point -- in all of 2020, or in part of 2020?
A
Partially. He would be in and out. He stayed in my
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Castro - cross - Talkin
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
243
house for -- for some time. So, yes.
Q
And this was during COVID?
A
Yes.
Q
Your brother Leo submitted a PPP loan, correct?
A
Yes.
Q
And it was a fraudulent loan?
A
Yes.
Q
The taxes came from Hashim?
A
Correct.
Q
And that loan was submitted in June of 2020?
A
Don't know the exact date, but it was submitted.
Q
It was submitted prior to the meeting on July 9th of
2020?
A
I don't recall the date. Like I said, it was submitted,
yes.
MR. TALKIN: I am going to ask that the witness only
be shown Defense D-29.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
I am just going to ask you to look at that and just tell
me if you recognize what it is.
Don't read out loud to the jury, just tell me if you
recognize what it is, please.
A
Yes.
Q
And that is Leonard Castro's, your brother's, PPP
application, correct?
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SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
244
A
Correct.
MR. TALKIN: Go to page 2, Mr. Turner, please.
Thank you.
(Pause.)
MR. TALKIN: Your Honor, may I approach the
witness--
THE COURT: You may.
MR. TALKIN: -- give him a copy of the same?
This is just a hard copy of the same thing.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
If you go to page 2 of that, does that help you remember
when your brother Leo's fraudulent PPP application was filed?
A
Yes.
Q
And that was June 15th of 2020?
A
Correct.
Q
So that's well before the July 9th meeting?
A
Yes.
Q
Now, when you were -- before you testified -- on direct
examination you said you spoke to the Government before you
testified, correct?
A
Say that again. Sorry.
Q
I'll slow it down.
A
Yes, please.
Q
Prior to testifying today, on numerous occasions you've
met with the Government and talked to them about this case?
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A
Yes.
Q
And you practiced your testimony as it got closer to
trial?
A
Yes.
Q
And prior to that, you would meet with investigators from
the Government?
A
Correct.
Q
And there were a lot of meetings, right?
A
Yes.
Q
And you were asked questions, some the same, some
different, but the same ones you were asked over and over,
right?
A
Correct.
Q
And you answered them honestly?
A
Yes.
Q
And to the best of your ability, right?
A
Yes.
Q
On June 20 -- excuse me.
On August 7th of 2023, do you remember being
interviewed by a group of individuals from the United States
Attorney's Office and the Government?
A
Now that you mention it, we had meetings. The date, I
don't recall the date exactly.
Q
You don't, but do you remember sometime in the summer of
2023, meeting with them?
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A
We had several meetings.
Q
Did any of them take place in the summer of 2023?
A
I don't know.
Q
If I show you a report from an interview on that day,
would that help you remember?
A
Sure.
Q
Okay.
MR. TALKIN: I am going to ask that just for the
witness, that AC-126 be shown.
THE COURT: This is not in evidence, I take it?
MR. TALKIN: It is not, Your Honor.
(Pause.)
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Take a look at the very top of that and let me know if
that helps you remember the date --
A
Yes.
Q
-- or at least when it happened.
So, it happened sometime in August of 2023, you'll
agree with me on that?
A
Yes.
Q
And during that meeting, you -- you talked to them about
the lunch meeting that the group from the 125th Street had at
Boca Restaurant.
Do you remember that?
A
Yes.
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Q
And during that meeting, you told the investigators that
Ms. Okeke provided the details of the PPP program.
Do you remember that?
A
Yes.
Q
And she outlined how it worked?
A
Correct.
Q
And she said that she wanted the PPP at Popular Bank --
if an individual did not have a Popular Bank account, they
would have to open one?
A
Yes.
Q
And she didn't mention anything -- you didn't mention
anything during that meeting about -- talking about using
accountants, did you?
A
Say that -- about the what? Sorry.
Q
Using accountants for fraudulent documents.
A
No.
Q
So, you described the same meeting in a very different
way in August of 2023 than you did here before the jury,
correct?
A
Correct.
Q
And you also had another meeting on January 25th of this
year.
Do you remember that?
A
Again, I don't remember all the dates.
Q
If I show you a report, would that help you remember?
Case 1:22-cr-00020-FB Document 54 Filed 07/29/24 Page 114 of 181 PageID #: 540
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A
Yes.
MR. TALKIN: Can we please show the witness only
AC-128.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
If you just look at the top, does that help you
remember --
A
Yes.
Q
-- the date of the meeting?
So, the meeting happened in January of 2024, this
year.
Do you remember that?
A
Yes.
Q
And at that meeting, you also described this lunch
meeting at the Boca Restaurant, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
And during that time, you told the investigators that
that meeting took place at the midpoint of the first wave.
Do you remember that?
A
Yes.
Q
And you told them that that was when there was a slight
uptick in the customers?
A
Yes.
Q
And that you -- that Okeke told everyone she wanted the
employees to spread the word about loans that might not have
to be paid back?
Case 1:22-cr-00020-FB Document 54 Filed 07/29/24 Page 115 of 181 PageID #: 541
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A
Correct.
Q
And she wanted 125th Street to be better than the other
branches at bringing in PPP loans?
A
Yes.
Q
And also she said there that, you know what, to you all,
if you open accounts, you can get bonuses; she informed you of
that, right?
A
Yes.
Q
And that's true, by opening more accounts it helps you
get a bonus as an employee of the bank?
A
That wasn't what I was referring to.
Q
I'm asking you: At the bank, opening loans — I know it's
not a big bonus — but it's a way that you can get a bonus;
correct?
A
You could get compensated for opening accounts, yes.
Q
And, again, during this meeting in this year you didn't
mention anything about fraudulent documents, did you?
A
(No response.)
Q
Let me ask the question again.
At this meeting, at this discussion with the
Government, talking about January of 2024, when you're
explaining what happened on the July 9th, 2020 meeting, you
did not mention anything about fraudulent documents, did you?
A
I don't believe I did, but I -- not necessarily because I
did expand on everything that was transpiring.
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Q
Well, let's go --
A
I explain everything that was being transpired.
Q
Okay. So, are you saying you don't remember exactly what
you said that day?
A
Yes.
MR. TALKIN: Can we please show the witness 128,
page 2 of 6.
And then to save time, can we please highlight A,
that whole paragraph.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Take a minute and read it to yourself and see if that
helps you remember.
(Pause.)
Q
I am going to ask you the question again.
In January of 2024, when you explained this meeting,
you did not say anything about fraudulent documents, did you?
A
No.
Q
You didn't say anything about accountants creating them,
did you?
A
Not at that moment, no.
Q
You talked about how Okeke explained the program and how
she wanted 125th to have the most loans, correct?
A
Yes.
MR. TALKIN: Can we pull up 320, please,
Government's Exhibit.
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BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Looking at page 1, and including the names written down
the right-hand side -- first, the names written down the
right-hand side, is that your handwriting?
A
Yes, it is.
Q
All of those names are clients that came or were referred
to the bank by your brother Leo, correct?
A
I want to say the majority or all of them, yes.
Q
As a matter of fact, you had a pretty good feel for Leo's
clients, correct?
A
Yes.
Q
And as a matter of fact, at one point in time when you
were speaking with the agents from the Government, they gave
you a long list, and you were -- they asked you to identify
all of Leo's clients.
Do you remember that?
A
To identify, yes.
Q
And you actually made a check mark on the list to show
that?
A
Yes.
Q
And it turned out to be somewhere between 25 to 30
individuals?
A
I don't know the exact number.
MR. TALKIN: Oh, yes. I'm sorry. 320 is in
evidence.
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So, can we please show it to the jury.
Thanks, Mr. Innelli.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Let me ask the last question again. I'm sorry.
You said it's somewhere between 25 and 30 people
that Leo brought?
A
I don't know the exact number, to be honest.
Q
It's a lot, though, right?
A
I was a number, but I don't remember how many.
Q
It was a high number, right? Yes? Correct or incorrect?
A
I don't remember the number of exactly. If you show me,
but I don't know the exact number of applicants that went in.
Q
Sure. I am going to ask you to take a look, just for
identification, at Defense 30-D.
(Pause.)
Q
Do you recognize that piece of paper?
A
Yes.
Q
Does that help you remember?
A
Yes.
Q
And it's quite a few that you were able to identify?
A
Correct.
Q
And it's a large number, you'll agree with me on that?
A
Yes.
Q
And you were able to do that off the top of your head
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during that meeting, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
Because you were very involved in the loans from your
brother Leo?
A
I wasn't involved in all of it.
Q
But focusing on the loans that your brother Leo referred,
you were very involved in those?
A
I was the only banker there. I was involved in
everything.
Q
Going to page 2 of 320, if you just look at that.
The first entry is June 9th of 2020, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
And that's you getting -- I think that's Hashim sending
you his e-mail?
A
Correct.
Q
Directly from him to you?
A
Yes.
Q
And that June 9th is actually in exactly a month prior
than July 9th, we can agree on that, right?
A
Correct.
Q
And then below that, it says -- he says to you on
July 1st, also before July 9th: Hey, it's Hashim.
And you say: Hey, sir.
He says: Call you in 15.
And you say: No problem.
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Right?
A
Right.
Q
So, you're in communication with Hashim before July 9th
of --
A
Yes.
Q
-- of 2020?
And you're in touch with him about taxes, right?
A
Correct.
Q
You're in touch with him about fraudulent taxes, correct?
A
About taxes, yes.
Q
Are you telling me that this communication between you
and him is not in reference to fraudulent taxes?
A
I can't recall if this is a conversation that --
Q
Tell me what real tax that this was in -- was about.
Just one.
A
All right. Okay. This transaction -- I mean this text
message at that time, don't recall if that's exactly when
everything started between us three.
Q
"Us three" meaning you, him, and my client?
A
Yes.
Q
Okay. So, you don't know whether a month before
July 9th, when this big meeting happened, is -- you were
involved with this communication with Hashim, is that what
you're saying?
A
We already were receiving clients coming into the site
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prior to the lunch. The lunch was more of a detailed
conversation, but I already was in communication with Hashim.
Q
So, just so we're clear, your testimony now is that you
knew that Hashim was making fraudulent documents prior to
July 9th?
A
Not necessarily. Like I said, I didn't know in details
the whole operation. But I was in communication with Hashim.
Q
You knew the details of your brother's application,
didn't you?
A
I know that my brother submitted a loan prior to our
meeting, yes.
Q
And you filled out that loan application --
A
Yes.
Q
-- for him?
A
I helped him, yes.
Q
You helped him.
It's your handwriting on there, correct?
A
Yes.
Q
And you also helped him obtain taxes?
A
Yes.
Q
And you got those taxes from Hashim?
A
Yes.
Q
Those taxes from Hashim were fake?
A
At the time, that was not what was said to us.
Q
Oh. So, what you're saying is that because Hashim didn't
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tell Leo that his own taxes are false, there's no way he would
have known they were false, is that what you're telling the
jury?
A
No. It wasn't Hashim that communicated with my brother
and I.
Q
It was Hashim who created the taxes, right?
A
We were referred to Hashim.
Q
And when -- you were referred to Hashim, but Hashim gave
you the taxes?
A
Ultimately, yes, he did. He's the tax preparer person.
Q
Correct.
And the taxes he gave you, you knew they were fake?
A
That's not what the conversation was.
Q
I'm asking you not what the conversation was.
A
Yes.
Q
I'm asking you that when you looked at those taxes that
you put into the application for your brother, who was living
with you, you knew whether or not they were fake?
A
So, he was not working. So, he was reporting what was
said to him was that he was gonna have to pay those taxes
based on what he reported on those taxes.
Q
Okay.
MR. TALKIN: May I approach the witness, Your Honor,
just to get the document back?
THE COURT: You may.
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MR. TALKIN: Can we pull up D-29.
Your Honor, at this time, I'm going to offer D-29
into evidence.
MS. BILINKAS: No objection.
THE COURT: Admitted.
(Defense Exhibit D-029 was received in evidence.)
MR. TALKIN: Can we display it, please.
(Exhibit published.)
THE COURT: Let me just mark this. Will you give me
a second. This is Defendant's exhibit?
MR. TALKIN: Yes, Your Honor, D-029.
THE COURT: 029?
MR. TALKIN: Correct, Your Honor.
THE COURT: All right, in evidence.
MR. TALKIN: Can we highlight the top portion that
has the income.
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
So on D-029, that's your handwriting, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
And you filled out the portion that says "Average Monthly
Payroll"?
A
Correct.
Q
And that says "$7,912.25," correct?
A
Correct.
Q
This is the time that your brother was living with you on
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and off when he was homeless, correct?
A
Yes.
Q
So, you know that the average monthly payroll for him of
$7,912.25 is a lie?
A
Correct.
Q
So, when you just told the jury that you didn't really
know what was going on, that somebody said this, you were not
telling the truth, were you?
A
Incorrect.
Q
The fact of the matter is, when you filled out this
application, you knew that that average monthly payroll number
was incorrect?
A
We were going based on the numbers on his taxes, correct.
Q
Correct.
And those taxes, when you say "his," they're your
brother's, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
He's living with you, correct?
A
Yes.
Q
And you know that your bother wasn't making -- didn't
have a payroll of over almost $8,000 a month?
A
What my brother was doing outside my home was his
personal business. This is my brother --
Q
So, just so we're clear.
A
Yes.
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Q
What you want the jury to believe is that you didn't know
what your brother was up to, and that's the reason that you
don't know that $8,000 a month of payroll for him is
incorrect, is that what you're saying?
A
No.
Q
I didn't think so.
Your brother didn't have a business at that time,
correct?
A
No.
Q
So, he couldn't have had a payroll?
A
No.
Q
Now, early on in your meetings with the Government — and
when I say "the Government," I mean not just the Assistant
United States Attorneys, I mean many investigators — there's
many individuals you met with, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
Early on you were questioned about how your brother got
to Hashim, right?
A
Yes.
Q
And you told them the reason they got to Hashim was
because you referred him to them?
A
Yes.
Q
And the reason you referred him, you told the Government
at that time that you referred your brother was you were
trying to get his life back together, so you wanted him to
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fill out the last four years of taxes.
Do you remember telling them that?
A
Not the part of the life back together, but that he
needed to do his taxes 'cause he didn't have his taxes done
for prior years, yes.
Q
And that was all before July 9th of 2020, correct?
A
I believe.
Q
So, Leo's referrals to you, he got money from those
referrals, correct?
A
Yes.
Q
And he got a lot of money from those referrals, didn't
he?
A
I don't know what the amount -- the exact amount that he
got from it.
Q
Can we agree it was a lot?
A
I don't know the exact amount, but it was a certain
amount, yes. It could be a lot for -- yeah.
Q
And Leo brought a lot of customers in that fit the
category, I think you said on direct examination, that seemed,
like, homeless or didn't seem to be, like, credible as having
a job?
A
Yes.
Q
And that was kind of his clientele, correct?
A
For the most part.
Q
And when you said before that you wanted to have them
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sign checks before they left, that was so that you could
control the money when it got funded, correct?
A
Not for all the applicants.
Q
I'm talking about for Leo's, the ones you described as
looking as homeless.
You said that's the group that you did that for,
right?
A
And like I said, not for all of that. There was a
specific number of those applicants that we would do that for,
as directed by Anuli.
Q
And there was another group of applicants that you
actually took starter checks and you forged their signatures,
isn't that correct?
A
Correct.
Q
And you did that a lot?
A
Quite -- sometimes, yes.
Q
And you did that for your brother Leo's cases, correct?
A
For some of the applicants, yes.
Q
But the forgeries were all for Leo's applicants, right?
A
Don't recall it was for all of them -- for Leo's and only
for Leo's, but we did like that at sometimes, yes.
Q
A major portion of the forgeries were for Leo's
customers, correct?
A
Some of them, yes.
Q
And after you forged documents, you would pull out the
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cash, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
So, you would write the check, correct?
A
Yes.
Q
You would forge the signature?
A
Yes.
Q
And then you would cash the check?
A
At times I would cash the check, and other times would be
another teller, Lenny.
Q
Okay. So, either you or Lenny would cash the check?
A
Yes.
Q
And when Lenny did it, it's because you asked him to do
it?
A
Because we were the only two bankers. We were the only
two people that were able to cash the checks.
Q
Right. But he didn't do it on his own, you had the check
in your hand, you wrote it, and you gave it to him to cash?
A
Correct.
Q
And after the check was cashed, the money was given to
you?
A
Yes.
Q
And then you gave the money to Leo?
A
At times, to Leo. At times, to the client.
Q
And a lot of the times you gave it to Leo, correct?
A
At times, to Leo. At times, to the client, yes.
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Q
And when you gave it to Leo, you knew it wasn't going to
go to the client, didn't you?
A
No, I didn't know that.
Q
You didn't know that?
A
No.
Q
You believed that he was going to actually give it to the
client?
A
I wouldn't know. He was the one that referred the
client. He was the one that had the direct connection with
the client.
Q
So, Leo doesn't work at the bank?
A
No.
Q
Leo has a criminal background, right?
A
Correct.
Q
Leo is down and out as far as money, as far as you're
concerned, because he's living with you, right?
A
Not necessarily.
Q
Well, his fortunes got better once you all started
cashing checks together, right?
A
No.
Q
Okay. And you would give him the money, and your belief
was that he was going to actually go take it to the borrower?
A
Yes.
Q
You talked about Richard Pinero, correct?
A
Correct.
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Q
Richard Pinero is one of the individuals who you forged
the signature, correct?
A
No, don't recall. His signature was the one in the
withdrawal and the applications.
Q
I'm sorry. I wasn't clear to you.
You forged his signature on the check, the
withdrawal check, the first one?
A
Don't recall.
Q
Do you remember meeting with the Government on
November 3rd of 2020, and telling one of the investigators
that you forged Pinero's check?
A
Don't recall again.
MR. TALKIN: I'm going to ask that the witness be
shown -- the witness only be shown AC-005.
And if we could highlight for him H, which is on --
which is on page 10 of that document at the very bottom. And
that's Number 12 there.
THE COURT: This is not in evidence, is it?
MR. TALKIN: It's not.
Your Honor, may I approach the witness? We're just
having some technical difficulties.
THE COURT: Do you plan to offer that into evidence?
MR. TALKIN: No, I don't.
THE COURT: Okay.
(Pause.)
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THE COURT: What's your question?
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Sir, isn't it a fact that during that interview you
admitted that you forged Pinero's signature?
A
It seems like I said that at the time.
Q
Did you or did you not say that at the time?
A
Yes.
Q
Yes, you did?
A
I did.
MR. TALKIN: And I will now ask that we show --
well, Your Honor, at this time, I am going to offer into
evidence D-17, which is a subset -- I think it's already in
evidence as 1029, it's the actual -- it's just a portion of
it.
THE COURT: Just a second.
MR. TALKIN: It's Government's 1029.
THE COURT: Government's 1029.
MR. TALKIN: I am offering D-17, which is just a
subset of that, because that's a bulky document.
MS. BILINKAS: No objection.
THE COURT: Okay. Go ahead.
(Defense Exhibit D-17 was received in evidence.)
(Exhibit published.)
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
I want you to take a look at the -- D-17, the first page
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of it.
MR. TALKIN: Can we show it to the jury, please.
(Exhibit published.)
Q
That's your handwriting, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
You got those, I guess -- interesting, you dot the i
sometimes with a circle?
A
Sometimes.
Q
Not always, but sometimes?
A
Not all the time.
Q
It's pretty distinctive, though, when you do, right?
A
Yes.
MR. TALKIN: And then if we can go to page 3 of that
document.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
That's the check that you forged, correct?
A
So, yes, this is perfect. That's not my signature. I
didn't forge that.
Q
But there was two -- there was a total of two checks from
Richard Pinero, correct?
A
Yes.
Q
And the signature there is not the one you forged?
A
No.
MR. TALKIN: Can we go to the next page.
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Castro - cross - Talkin
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
267
(Exhibit published.)
Q
The signature there, is that the one you forged?
A
No.
MR. TALKIN: Can we go to the next page.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
The signature there, is that the one you forged?
A
No.
Q
So --
A
I'm looking at the same....
Q
So, neither one of those two -- you -- you're saying that
neither one of those two checks you forged?
A
Can I see the one before again?
Q
Yes, please. Take your time.
MR. TALKIN: So, if we could show him the third
page.
(Exhibit published.)
A
I'm not sure if I -- I'm not sure, to be honest.
MR. TALKIN: Let's put up the second page of the
document next to the third page -- excuse me, the fourth page
of the document, if that's possible, Mr. Turner, please.
(Pause.)
THE COURT: Do you have a question?
MR. TALKIN: I'm waiting for the document. I'm
still waiting for the document to get up.
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Castro - cross - Talkin
SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
268
Thank you, now.
On the left, can we have the second page, please.
I apologize for the technical difficulty, Your
Honor.
And now the check also next to that, which is the
third page. Can we have the third page, not the fourth page.
Okay. Thank you.
(Pause.)
MR. TALKIN: Your Honor, can we take a five-minute
recess just to sort this out, so we don't waste the jury's
time.
THE COURT: You want the jurors to stay here while
you do that or do you want to --
MR. TALKIN: I guess if they want a bathroom break,
that's fine. If not...
THE COURT: Okay, take ten minutes. Okay. Don't
talk about the case.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: All rise.
MR. TALKIN: Thank you, Your Honor.
(Jury enters.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: You can all be seated.
(Recess taken.)
(Continued on the following page.)
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COURTROOM DEPUTY: All rise.
(Jury enters courtroom at 2:50 p.m.)
COURTROOM DEPUTY: You can all be seated.
THE COURT: Mr. Talkin, are you ready to proceed?
MR. TALKIN: Yes. Thank you, your Honor.
EXAMINATION BY
MR. TALKIN:
(Continuing.)
Q
Mr. Castro, I apologize we corrected our technical
difficulties.
So now I'm going to ask you to take a look at what you
see in front of you which is from Defendant's D-17.
And if you look at the signature on the application and
the signature on the check, they appear to be the same;
correct?
A
Yes.
Q
And you had Mr. Pinero actually sign the application,
correct?
A
Correct.
Q
So it's fair to say that the thousand dollar check is
not the forged check, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
Now, let's take a look at the other page, the other
check.
Now, when we look at those together, those look very
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different; correct?
A
They look different, yes.
Q
So it's fair to say that's the forged check?
A
That's the thing, I'm not sure, but -- I'm not sure.
Q
We agree you forged one of the two checks, right?
A
Yes.
Q
And we just agreed that the $1,000 check doesn't look
forged?
A
Yes.
Q
And we know that on September 11th of 2020, Mr. Pinero
was actually in the branch?
A
Yes.
Q
So it makes sense that he actually signed the check?
A
Yes.
Q
So the thousand dollars that you said that Anuli was
able to give to Mr. Pinero was using his own signature,
correct?
A
Yes.
Q
And then here in front of you this $9,900 that's the
forged check?
A
I believe.
Q
And that's the one where you took the money and you
gave it to your brother not to Mr. Pinero?
A
Yes, correct.
MR. TALKIN: And, your Honor, I think I need to
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make a correction. I believe that I said the subset for
Mr. Pinero was D-3026. I just want to make sure the subset
is D-017.
THE COURT: I have D-17.
MR. TALKIN: Great. Thank you.
Q
So now, I'm going to ask you about someone named
Eduardo Vasquez.
Do you recognize that name?
A
No.
MR. TALKIN: I'm going to ask that the witness
only be shown D-026.
Q
Do you recognize your handwriting?
A
Yes.
Q
And that you filled out that application?
A
Yes, correct.
Q
Going to Page 2. You see the signature there?
A
Yes.
Q
And then if we go to Page 3, you see a signature that's
very different than the signature on the application;
correct?
A
Correct.
Q
So does that lead you to believe that this is one of
the forgeries you committed in relation to Leo's cases?
A
Not sure.
Q
Okay. Is it a possibility?
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A
Yes.
Q
You said that you did forge numerous checks for Leo?
A
Correct.
Q
Can we go to the next check, please.
That check is also a forgery?
A
Not sure.
Q
If we can put the page of D-6 and Page 2 next to any
one of the two checks, see if that helps you remember.
Does that help you remember if that's one of the forged
checks that was done?
A
Still, it's a different signature but I'm not sure if I
was the one that was responsible for that particular
withdrawal.
Q
So it was a forgery, you're just not sure if you're the
one; right?
A
Correct.
Q
As a matter of fact, it could have been Leo who did the
forgery?
A
It could have been anyone to be honest, yes.
Q
Let's focus, let's take anyone out of it. Let's talk
about who had access to the check.
You're saying to could have been Leo because he had
access to the check?
A
In some cases, yes.
Q
He did.
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As a matter of fact, the Government asked you
specifically about the check; do you remember that?
A
No.
Q
If we could show the witness EV-009. I'm sorry EC-009.
And if we could show him only around J.
Does looking at the second sentence there, does that
help you remember? You could highlight the second sentence?
A
Yes.
Q
Do you remember telling the investigator on that date
that it could either have been -- you wrote the check you
admitted to that, right?
A
Yes.
Q
And then they asked you who forged it and you said it
was either you or Leo?
A
Yeah, that was unsure. Like I said earlier.
Q
That was, I didn't hear what you said?
A
That was unsure. Just like I said a few minutes
earlier.
Q
I understand. Unsure, but we can narrow it down not to
anybody. It's either you or Leo?
A
Yes.
Q
Okay. You talked about your cooperation agreement that
you have with the Government.
Obviously, you're hoping for the most lenient sentence,
right?
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A
Correct.
Q
And your decision was led by testifying at this trial,
that's probably the best way for you to get the most lenient
sentence?
A
Correct.
Q
And you're hoping that you don't get any jail time,
that's your hope?
A
The most lenient sentence.
Q
Okay. No one has made you any promise as to what
sentences you would get?
A
No.
Q
By testifying, and going into a cooperation agreement,
that's your best chance in getting no jail time. We can
agree on that, right?
A
That's my hope, yes.
Q
During the meetings with the Government and the
Government officials, they often asked you if you knew Leo's
whereabouts, didn't they?
A
Yes.
Q
And you told them you didn't know?
A
At the time, I didn't.
Q
Do you know now?
A
We in communication but I don't know exactly where his
location is.
Q
Have you given the Government the information to the
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best of your ability as to where his location is?
A
When I'm asked, yes.
Q
But they haven't been able to locate him, correct?
A
I don't know.
Q
You would know if your brother got arrested, wouldn't
you?
A
Yes.
Q
And you understand that as part of your cooperation
agreement you have to give them truthful information,
correct?
A
When asked, yes.
Q
Well, you also can't lie by omission either. You know
what that means, right?
A
Correct.
Q
And you can't do that. You can't lie by omission, can
you?
A
No.
Q
And to do so would violate your cooperation agreement?
A
Correct.
MR. TALKIN: One second, your Honor, I think I'm
done.
(A brief pause in the proceedings was held.)
MR. TALKIN: Nothing further. Thank you.
THE COURT: All right.
MS. BILINKAS: Brief redirect, your Honor.
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THE COURT: Go ahead.
Ms. Ausbrooks, can pull up 1067, Page 2. I'm
sorry, maybe it's Page 1.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MS. BILINKAS:
Q
Mr. Castro, do you remember defense's questions about
this check for $9,900?
A
Yes.
Q
Okay. And you were asked whether you gave the money to
Leo for this check, do you remember that?
A
Correct, yes.
Q
Out of this $9,900, you received a portion of this,
correct?
A
Yes.
Q
And out of this $9,900, Anuli Okeke also received a
portion of this, correct?
A
Yes.
Q
And what was the date of this check?
A
August 27, 2020.
Q
And defense showed you their own exhibit, I believe it
was Defense 26.
MS. BILINKAS: Mr. Turner, is it possible to pull
that up on your end, please.
D-26. Is that the only page?
MR. TURNER: No. You want the check?
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MS. BILINKAS: Yes, please. Thank you.
Q
Defense showed you this check as well, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
Is this also dated August 27th of 2020?
A
Yes.
Q
Is this check also for $9,900?
A
Yes.
Q
Why was this check written out for $9,900?
A
To do --
MR. TALKIN: Objections beyond the scope of cross.
THE COURT: I'll allow it.
Q
Why was this check also written out for $9,900?
A
To be beyond the $10,000 ratio of the CTR.
Q
And why did you have checks written out under CTR?
A
To avoid any red flags from auditors and from Popular
itself. Popular Bank.
Q
And did you have any conversations with Anuli Okeke
about writing checks without detecting CTR?
A
Yes.
MS. BILINKAS: No further questions.
MR. TALKIN: May I?
THE COURT: You have some questions.
RECROSS-EXAMINATION
BY MR. TALKIN:
Q
Mr. Castro, the filing of a CTR for any transaction
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over $10,000 is very well known by anybody who works at a
bank, right?
A
Correct.
Q
It's obvious that to anybody whose ever worked at a
bank and probably people who haven't, if you do a
transaction for cash for over $10,000 that a CTR has to be
filed, correct?
A
Correct.
Q
And it's obvious that a CTR creates a paper trail,
correct?
A
Yes.
MR. TALKIN: Nothing further.
THE COURT: Anything further?
MR. TALKIN: No.
THE COURT: You may step down. Thank you.
(Witness leaves the witness stand.)
THE COURT: Next witness.
MR. AMIR: The Government calls Shelley Zielinski.
THE COURT: While the next witness is coming in,
I'm going to give you folks a day off on Friday. Let me
tell you what's going on. One of you folks has an important
day, I understand anyway. But we're going to be making a
lot of progress, I think, through Thursday afternoon and I
think you deserve the day off. We'll probably be wrapping
up the trial on Monday, Tuesday or Wednesday, middle of next
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week in all probability so you can plan on that type of
dynamic, okay? But Friday, take a day off and attend to
your personal affairs, you can do that.
COURTROOM DEPUTY: Good afternoon, Ms. Zielinski.
Can you take the witness stand, please.
THE WITNESS: Yes.
COURTROOM DEPUTY: Remain standing and raise your
right hand.
Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the answers
and the testimony that you are about to give to the Court
will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the
truth.
SHELLEY ZIELINSKI, called by the Government, having been
first duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows:
THE COURT: Have a seat. State your full name and
spell it for the record.
THE WITNESS: Shelley, S-h-e-l-l-e-y. Zielinski,
Z-i-e-l-i-n-s-k-i.
COURTROOM DEPUTY: Thank you.
THE COURT: Your witness.
MR. AMIR: Thank you, Judge.
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MR. AMIR:
Q
What city do you live in?
A
Chicago.
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Q
How far have you gone in school?
A
I have an associate in applied science.
Q
Where do you work?
A
Popular Bank.
Q
Is that where you worked in the summer of 2020?
A
Yes.
Q
And what is your position at Popular Bank?
A
I am a vice president, manager of branch
administration.
Q
And how long have you held that position?
A
Almost nine and a half years at this point.
Q
Can you describe your duties and responsibilities in
that position?
A
Duties and responsibilities include branch procedures,
branch communications that we do regularly to the branch
units. Anything that touches a branch sort of goes through
our team, meaning, systems, software, testing, upgrades. We
also manage the money desk which is the ordering of cash for
the vaults for our U.S. operations. Methods and procedures
for the Popular Bank unit, so not Puerto Rico just the U.S.
Forms, we have the forms repository for the U.S. bank and
then we also have consumer lending, errors and adjustments.
Q
Are you familiar with Popular Bank's operations at the
branch level?
A
Yes.
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Q
Are you also familiar with thor Paycheck Protection
Program or PPP?
A
Yes.
Q
Do you know if PPP Loans were issued at Popular Bank?
A
Yes, they were.
Q
What, if any, was the role of branches regarding
PPP Loans?
A
Branch management would have been the part of the
branch that would have been accepting loans. So it would
have been loan applications, and then once they were
approved they would do the closing or the booking of the
loans.
Q
And what were branch manager's duties vis-à-vis
accepting those loans?
A
Branch management is the only level that can take
consumer, I'm sorry, commercial loan applications. So they
would be the ones I.D.ing the customer, doing the CYC, Know
Your Customer identification; collecting any documents from
the customer to prove their identity, and then they would
input the application and then await for next steps
stipulations or closing.
Q
Who, if anyone, in the branch is responsible for
ensuring compliance with Popular Bank programs and policies
regarding the PPP Loans?
A
That would have been branch management.
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Q
Did Popular Bank maintain a branch at 125th Street in
Manhattan?
A
Yes, we did.
Q
Is that location open today?
A
It is not.
Q
Why was the 125th Street branch closed?
A
It was part of closures of multiple locations in 2021,
February 1st of 2021.
Q
Do you know why the closed locations were selected for
closure?
A
All of the locations that were selected for closure
were either up for lease renewal or closed due to
consolidations because they have branches near them or close
to them and they were not profitable.
Q
Did the 125th Street branch give out PPP Loans in the
summer of 2020?
A
Yes, they would.
Q
At a high level, do you know the policies and
procedures that apply to the branches?
A
Yes.
Q
Could you briefly describe them?
A
So we have lots of procedures for branches. But high
level, you got anything from transaction monitoring,
transaction completion, approvals, Know Your Customer, CYC,
customer identification, new account opening, new account or
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existing account maintenance all the way through loan
applications and loan bookings.
Q
Do employees receive training on these topics?
A
Yes, they do.
Q
When do they receive those trainings?
A
So all new hires get specific training related to their
roles. So a teller would go through teller training. A
banker would go through -- we have dual banker roles, so
they're a teller and a banker. So they would go through
both the teller and the banker trainings. And management
would go through those same dual, both the teller and the
banker, trainings.
Q
Apart from trainings and onboarding, are some trainings
give on a regular or recurring basis?
A
Yes. So we have online courses that are applied
throughout the year regularly to all employees.
Q
And are the ethics and anti-money laundering policies
some of those regular trainings?
A
Yes, they are.
Q
Have you taken those trainings?
A
Yes.
Q
And were branch managers required to take such
trainings?
A
Absolutely.
Q
Did those policies and trainings apply to the
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PPP Program as well?
A
Yes.
Q
So I'd like to show you one of those trainings.
Showing the witness only what's marked for
identification as Government Exhibit 1130.
Do you see that, Ms. Zielinski?
A
No, there is nothing on the screen.
Q
Do you see that now?
A
Yes.
Q
Do you recognize this?
A
These are screenshots of our money laundering,
anti-money laundering training.
MR. AMIR: Government offers Exhibit 1130 into
evidence.
MR. TALKIN: No objection.
THE COURT: No objection. 1130 in evidence.
(Government's Exhibit 1130 was marked in
evidence.)
Q
Turning to Page 4 of this document. Can we zoom into
the second paragraph from the bottom.
Could you read the second paragraph from the bottom
that's been zoomed in?
A
Money laundering involves three steps: Placement of
funds, introducing illegal funds into the financial system
by different means, structuring, dividing illegal funds into
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many financial transactions to disguise the cash source, and
integration -- legitimatizing illegal wealth by reinserting
it into the economy.
Q
Why does the bank provide trainings on money
laundering?
A
This is done to ensure that everybody's aware of what
to look for that could be a red flag or an alert that would
need to be escalated.
Q
Thank you. Can we turn to Page 15. And can we zoom
into the notes. Thank you.
Ms. Zielinski, could I ask you to read the bottom
paragraph starting with "for corporations"?
A
Yes. For corporations such as associations and trusts,
we need to identify the business's main location, the local
office or other physical locations. The minimum
requirements for these are I.D. number which could be the
employer tax I.D. number in the U.S. or its equivalent for
foreign companies, incorporation documents, ultimate
beneficiary, owner certification among others.
Q
And, Ms. Zielinski, why does the bank provide trainings
on knowing the identity and location of business
corporations?
A
So this is standard Know Your Customer. Regulatory
requirements of the PIP. It's to know who the business is,
who the people that are part of the business are, and to
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ensure we're properly I.D.ing who we're onboarding.
Q
And I'd like to now show the witness what's been marked
for identification as Government Exhibit 1132.
Do you recognize this document?
A
Yes.
Q
What is this?
A
This is our ethics training online.
MR. AMIR: Government offers Exhibit 1132 into
evidence.
THE COURT: Any objection?
MR. GREENSPAN: No objection.
THE COURT: In evidence.
(Government's Exhibit 1132 was marked in
evidence.)
Q
Can we zoom into the text on the first page.
Could I ask you to read the text beginning, "It is
important."
A
It is important that you complete the training within
the required timeframe. Otherwise, your participation will
be cancelled and you will have to take it again. Failure to
take the training within the deadline provided and in full
may result in disciplinary measures.
Q
And can we now move to Page 50 of this document.
Ms. Zielinski, could you please read the first bullet
on this page.
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A
Popular employees cannot create or allow others to
create false, inaccurate, or misleading records or conceal
anything that is improper.
Q
And why does the bank train its employees not to create
false records?
A
This is standard regulatory requirements as working in
any banking environment. You got to have real documents,
you can't create or falsify anything.
Q
And can we please turn to Page 83 of this document.
And, generally speaking, what is this slide, please,
scroll up.
What is this slide about?
A
This is basically the recap of our duty to consult and
report any ethical violations or concerns that you may have.
So we have an ethics point channel that we can submit that
through at work and that's part of all of our trainings. It
could be anonymous, we have a phone number or via website.
Q
But fair to say, employees at the bank are required to
disclose ethical violations if they see them?
A
A hundred percent.
Q
You can take this down.
I'd like to show you now what is in evidence as
Government Exhibit 719. Make that a little larger.
And can we move to Page 11.
Ms. Zielinski, do you recognize this as a Popular Bank
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document?
A
Yes.
Q
What kind of document is this?
A
This is a counter checking withdrawal form.
Q
And what is being requested, if anything, by this
document?
A
So this is a client coming in and requesting a
withdrawal from a checking account product.
Q
And scrolling up slightly. Do you see a sequence
number at the top?
A
Yes.
Q
What's the purpose of a sequence number?
A
So the sequence number is basically internal tracking
for each transaction. It goes up in sequence by ten. So it
will be 740, the next would be 750, 760 and so on.
Q
And what date is this slip dated?
A
So this is August 21st of 2020.
Q
Can we move to Page 10 of this document. Is this a
Popular Bank document?
A
Yes. So this is a virtual document, meaning, this is a
document created by the system. This particular document is
a DBA credit for the credit copy for the purchase of a
cashier's check. You will see on the top left it will tell
you the account number of the person purchasing the item,
the name of who the person purchasing it, the remitter; who
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the pay to the order of the check is. Bottom left, you'll
see the cash drawer and the user number, the date. And then
on the bottom, you'll see numbers on the very bottom and the
one that starts with triple zero, nine, four zeroes, 38
that's our cashier's checking account number.
Q
That's how you can tell that's a cashier's check?
A
Yes.
Q
Looking at the date and the sequence number of this
document, do you see those?
A
Yes.
Q
Are you able to determine if there's any relationship
with this document and the withdrawal slip we just saw?
A
So your sequences are off by ten. So the previous one
under ender ending in 740, this one ends in 730. So this
would be tied with that checking withdrawal would be used to
purchase this cashier's check and other transactions.
Q
And we see two, what look like two checks on the
screen. Is this meant to represent two different checks?
A
No. So this is a single item. So when we have a
virtual document, the front and the back, there is above
where it says "DBA credit" one says front, one says back.
It's front and the back, it's just a duplication of the same
information on the back side.
Q
Can we scroll up to Page 9, please.
Ms. Zielinski, is this another virtual cashier's check?
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A
Yes, it is.
Q
And looking at the sequence and date of this check, are
you able to tell the relationship between this and the
withdrawal slip we saw?
A
Yes, it's on the same date and the sequence is off by
ten digits so it would be the same.
Q
Was this also a cashier's check funded by the
withdrawal slip?
A
Yes.
Q
We can take this down.
I'd like to show you what's been marked for
identification as Government Exhibit 716, witness only.
Do you recognize this as a Popular Bank document?
A
Yes.
Q
What kind?
A
So this is the actual cashier's check, customer copy.
MR. AMIR: Government offers Exhibit 716 into
evidence.
THE COURT: No objection, in evidence.
MR. GREENSPAN: No objection.
(Government's Exhibit 716 was marked in evidence.)
Q
So you mentioned that this was a check, a cashier's
check?
A
Yes.
Q
And is this the cashier's check that actually would
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have been given to a customer?
A
Yes. So this is the actual copy of the check itself
that would be handed to a client when they purchase it.
Q
And how does this differ from the other cashier's
checks that we saw?
A
So the other ones were the bank copy or the credit
copies, so this is the debit copy. So what would be paid
through the account. The credit copy is the purchasers
copy, meaning, the bank's copy.
Q
How does a customer purchase a cashier's check at
Popular Bank?
A
So they can do it by doing a withdrawal from an account
with us or with purchase of cash.
Q
Thank you. We can take this down. Can you please pull
up what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 1067.
Ms. Zielinski, do you recognize this as a Popular Bank
document?
A
Yes.
Q
What kind of financial document is this?
A
So this is a check that would be from a new account
kit.
Q
And how can you tell?
A
So you can tell this because there's no name or address
on the top-left corner like a normal check would have, and
there's no check number. However, you do have the routing
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number and the account number at the bottom of the check.
Q
And how does a customer get a check from an account
starting kit?
A
So a new account or starter kit would be given to a
client at the time they were opening an account.
Q
Are these kinds of checks still issued by the bank?
A
They are not.
Q
Why not?
A
So we discontinued starter kits in April of 2021 and we
moved to what's called "Account Number Generator." So the
system actually populates the new account number in the
session for the actual bankers. So there's no longer a need
to keep new account kits.
Q
We can take this down. I'd like to show you what's in
evidence as actually, yes, Government Exhibit 1067 at
Page 2, please. One moment. Can we go to Page 2 of 1067,
please.
Do you recognize this type of check?
A
Yes.
Q
What kind of check is this?
A
So this is a counter or temporary check. So this would
be a check that would be provided at our teller line if
somebody didn't receive their official check order yet.
Q
And how does this differ from the prior starter kit
check we just looked at?
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A
So you'll see there's no account number in the maker
line at the bottom. It's just the routing number and the
check number. In the top left corner, you'll have the name
and account number that has to be manually filled in.
Q
Does the bank still provide counter checks?
A
Yes, we do.
Q
Looking at the field in the bottom left where it says
"memo." What's the purpose of that field on a check?
A
So the memo field is a place for the customer to write
the purpose of why they're writing the checks or where it's
being directed.
Q
We can take this down.
Ms. Zielinski, is it appropriate far a bank employee to
instruct a customer to pre-sign a starter check when they
apply for a loan?
A
Never.
Q
When customers open accounts at Popular Bank, are they
able to use the bank's services at all its branches?
A
Yes.
Q
And is it appropriate for an employee to instruct
customers to use only a specific branch?
A
Never.
Q
Is it appropriate for a bank employee to request
payment from a PPP applicant?
A
Absolutely not.
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Q
Are employees permitted to receive cash gifts from
customers?
A
No.
Q
Under bank policies, are employees allowed to open an
account they knew is based on false information?
A
No.
Q
I'd like to show you what's in evidence as Government
Exhibit 519. Zoom into the photo.
Do you recognize this as a layout of a Popular Bank
branch?
A
Yes.
Q
What kind of branch layout is this?
A
So this is what's considered a "Bandit Carrier" or an
enclosed teller line which has bulletproof glass around the
front and it would be sealed in with access via a door with
a key code or a card.
Q
In such a format, are customers permitted to go behind
the teller desk area?
A
Never.
Q
What about the safe or vault area, is a customer
permitted to go there?
A
No.
Q
Is it appropriate for bank employees to conduct bank
business using personal messaging apps on a personal phone?
A
No.
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MR. AMIR: Thank you. No further questions.
THE COURT: Any cross-examination?
MR. GREENSPAN: Yes, Your Honor, briefly.
CROSS-EXAMINATION
BY MR. GREENSPAN:
Q
Good afternoon, Ms. Zielinski.
A
Good afternoon.
Q
In your role as the VP of Branch Administration, did
you oversee the preservation of surveillance videos from the
bank branches?
A
No.
Q
Do you know the policy surrounding the preservation of
surveillance videos?
A
No, I do not.
Q
And who would have overseen that and who would know
about those policies?
A
That would be our security officer.
Q
You talked about account openings which I believe did
fall within your purview, right?
A
Correct.
Q
Is it fair to say any banker could open an account?
A
If you could clarify the question.
Q
Sure. Could any banker at a branch open a new account
for a customer?
A
Depends on the type of account. (Continued, next page.)
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Zielinski - cross - Mr. Greenspan
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CROSS-EXAMINATION
BY MR. GREENSPAN (ctd):
Q
Could they open a business account for a customer?
A
So generally, business accounts are opened by branch
management or a seasoned banker, but a new banker generally
would not open a new business account without management
also assisting.
Q
You say "a seasoned." Is there a policy that says
who's seasoned and who is not in terms of who can open an
account?
A
There is not.
Q
At the very end, you talked about the fact that it
would be inappropriate to use personal communication Absen
devices to communicate with customers, correct?
A
That's correct.
Q
So fair to say that communication with customers should
go through bank e-mail addresses?
A
Correct.
Q
You talked about placing holds on accounts. Who can
place a hold on an account?
A
If you can clarify? Because I did not -- I don't
remember responding about placing holds.
Q
Let me ask you this: Do you know what a hold is?
A
Yes.
MR. AMIR: Objection, scope.
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THE COURT: Overruled.
Q
What is a hold on an account?
A
A hold is a temporary placement of -- against funds in
an account that's in the system with an expiration date.
Q
And can bankers put holds on accounts?
A
Yes.
Q
Bankers in the branch?
A
Yes.
Q
And who among the branch bankers, what levels of
employees at the branch can put a hold on an account?
A
All employees will be able to place a hold because
doing a transaction will place a hold on an account.
Q
So not really branch managers or supervisors, right?
A
Correct.
Q
And is there a system that logs who puts a hold on an
account?
A
Yes.
Q
And what system is that?
A
That would be our core system, which is considered FIS.
Q
FIS?
A
Correct.
Q
Does the FIS system retain that information over a
certain period of time?
A
Yes.
Q
Would that FIS system continue to retain that
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information for any hold placed in 2020?
A
Yes, it should.
MR. GREENSPAN: No further questions.
THE COURT: Any redirect?
MR. AMIR: No, Your Honor.
THE COURT: You may step down.
(Witness excused.)
THE COURT: Let's take our afternoon break.
15 minutes. Come back at quarter to.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: All rise.
(Jury exits.)
(Recess taken.)
(Jury enters.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: You can all be seated.
THE COURT: So folks, you are getting a real live
example of how a trial unfolds. Like no commercials, right?
We don't know for sure exactly how the case is going to
happen; it depends on how long the case, the
cross-examination, you never have a crystal ball, but you
see it in real life now. We are doing fine. And sometimes
we have loopholes and things of that nature, but I think we
have been going consistently. You are doing great.
I am advised by the Government that we have a
stipulation and then one witness that may which may not take
that long, so I may let you go a little bit early again
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Stipulation - Mr. Edwards-Balfour
Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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today, but you are doing fine.
And then tomorrow, we will start at 10 o'clock and
hopefully have a full day. And I will know at the end of
tomorrow pretty much where we stand in terms of when it's
likely that the case will be sent to you folks
determination, maybe sometime next week.
Go ahead, stipulation.
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: Yes, we have two
stipulations, Your Honor. The first one is United States of
America against Anuli Okeke. It is here by stipulated and
agreed --
THE COURT: Let me interrupt you. Do you have an
exhibit number for them?
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: Yes. I am going to read the
exhibits at the end, but do you want them now?
THE COURT: Whatever you want.
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: It is hereby estimated and
agreed by and between the United States of America by
Assistant United States Attorneys Chand W. Edwards-Balfour
and Adam Amir, and Department of Justice Trial Attorney
Jennifer Bilinkas, and the Defendant Anuli Okeke, by her
attorneys Sam Talkin and Noam Greenspan that: If an
individual from Popular Bank with knowledge of Popular
Bank's funds transfer records were called to testify, this
individual would testify that:
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Stipulation - Mr. Edwards-Balfour
Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
300
The Popular Bank computer server that maintained
the money disbursed into any customer's account was located
in Brown Deer, Wisconsin;
If a customer checked their Popular Bank account
balance at an ATM, there would be an electronic
communication from the ATM to the Popular Bank server in
Brown Deer, Wisconsin, and then back to the ATM, relaying
that relevant information about the customer's Popular Bank
account;
The bank statements for Popular Bank account
ending in 6968 for R.R. Franklyn Ave Inc., admitted into
evidence as Government's Exhibit 795, reflect that on
August 18, 2020, an individual checked that account's
balance at an ATM located at 1528 Sheepshead Bay Road in
Brooklyn, New York. When this balance inquiry occurred, an
electronic communication would have been caused to be sent
from the ATM in Brooklyn, New York, and would have been
received at Popular Bank's server in Brown Deer, Wisconsin,
and then a return communication would have been sent from
Popular Bank's server in Brown Deer, Wisconsin and would
have been received in Brooklyn, New York, where the records
indicate the ATM was located.
This stipulation is admissible in evidence as
Government Exhibit 300-B. So stipulated.
THE COURT: 300 what?
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Stipulation - Mr. Edwards-Balfour
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Official Court Reporter
301
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: 300-B, as in boy. I move to
admit that into evidence, Your Honor.
THE COURT: So 300-B is in evidence pursuant to
stipulation.
(Government's Exhibit 300-B received in evidence.)
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: The next stipulation, United
States of America against Anuli Okeke. It is hereby
stipulated and agreed by and between the United States of
America, by Assistant United States Attorneys Chand W.
Edwards-Balfour and Adam Amir, and Department of Justice
Trial Attorney Jennifer Bilinkas, and the Defendant Anuli
Okeke, by her attorneys Sam Talkin and Noam Greenspan that:
Between May 1, 2020, and December 1, 2020, the
defendant's mobile telephone number was (917)607-6862.
This stipulation is admissible in evidence as
Government Exhibit 300-D. So stipulated.
The Government moves to admit Government
Exhibit 300-D into evidence, Your Honor.
THE COURT: So you have B and D, right?
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: B, as in boy. D, as in
Daniel.
THE COURT: Both in evidence at this time.
(Government's Exhibit 300-D received in evidence.)
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: There are a couple of other
exhibits that we are both going to admit that the parties
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have agreed on without objection. Are you ready for them,
Your Honor?
THE COURT: Go ahead.
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: Government Exhibits 995
through 1000. 1007 to 1008. 1010 to 1018. 1020, 1023 to
1028. 1033 to 1035. 1037 to 1038. 1040 to 1045. 1047 to
1049. 1051. 1054 to 1061. 1063, 1070 to 1073. 1077 to
1087. 1090 to 1091. 1095 to 1096. 1098. 1101. 1106 and
1121. The Government moves them all into evidence, Your
Honor.
THE COURT: These are all documents, and it's
great that we have the parties agreeing to it because there
is no question about the authenticity of these documents, by
and large, so they are all in evidence and entered into
stipulation.
(Government's Exhibits 995 through 1000. 1007 to
1008, 1010 to 1018, 1020, 1023 to 1028, 1033 to 1035, 1037
to 1038, 1040 to 1045, 1047 to 1049, 1051, 1054 to 1061,
1063, 1070 to 1073, 1077 to 1087, 1090 to 1091, 1095 to
1096, 1098, 1101, 1106 and 1121 were received in evidence.)
THE COURT: Next witness?
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: The Government calls Mark
Balsam.
(Witness takes the stand.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Good afternoon, Mr. Balsam.
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THE WITNESS: Good afternoon.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: I ask that you remain
standing and raise your right hand.
(Witness sworn.)
THE WITNESS: I do.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Please state and spell your
name and keep your voice up.
THE WITNESS: It's Mark Paul Balsam, Jr. That's
M-A-R-K, P-A-U-L, B-A-L-S-A-M, J-R.
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: Thank you.
MARK PAUL BALSAM, JR.,
called as a witness, having been first duly
sworn/affirmed, was examined and testified as
follows:
THE COURT: You sound like a Special Agent.
Anything who says "Paul" and "Junior" has got to be working
for the Government.
Your witness.
DIRECT EXAMINATION
BY MS. BILINKAS:
Q
Where do you work?
A
The Social Security Administration, Office of Inspector
General.
Q
How long have you worked at the Social Security
Administration?
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A
A little over five years.
Q
What is your position at the Social Security
Administration?
A
Special Agent.
Q
Can you describe your responsibilities as a Special
Agent for the Social Security Administration?
A
It's to investigate fraud and abuse of the Social
Security programs and the misuse of the Social Security
number.
Q
Can you describe your training as a Special Agent with
the Social Security Administration?
A
When I was hired as a Special Agent, I spent three
months at the federal law enforcement training center in
Georgia and several months of on-the-job training
afterwards.
Q
Based on your training and experience, what information
does the Social Security Administration gather from
businesses?
A
Businesses are required to submit W-2s and W-3s on an
annual basis.
Q
And why does the Social Security Administration gather
this information from businesses?
A
They use that information to properly distribute
retirement, survivors and disability benefits.
THE COURT: Sorry to interrupt. I have been doing
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Balsam - direct - Ms. Bilinkas
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this for a long time. The Government always asks why are
you called a Special Agent? So the jury hears "Special
Agent." How does that differ from a regular agent? So this
is an opportunity for you to explain why you are a special
agent. I am not a special judge; you are a special agent.
THE WITNESS: It's just a title I am given, Your
Honor.
THE COURT: Do you know where that came from?
THE WITNESS: No, I don't.
THE COURT: I think it came from Edgar Hoover way
back when, when he became the director of the FBI and he
wanted to make a statement that his agents were going to be
really special and I think that's really in the history of
it. And I may be wrong, but that's my sense. All agents
for the Government are called special agents. And so, you
know, I just have to tell you that because I have been doing
that for 28 years, right, they haven't called me a special
judge yet. Do you think I should be called a special judge?
Next question.
MS. BILINKAS: Thank you, Your Honor.
Q
What is the W-2?
A
A W-2 is a summary of wages and taxes given -- or paid
by an employer to an employee for a given year.
Q
And what is a W-3?
A
A W-3 is a summary of all wages paid out for that given
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year to the employees.
Q
Do W-2s and W-3s contain all the wage data for
businesses?
A
Yes.
Q
And in the course of your employment at the Social
Security Administration, have you become familiar with how
the Social Security Administration gathers wage information
from businesses?
A
Yes.
Q
Does the Social Security Administration have
requirements for what businesses must submit to the agency?
A
Yes. They must submit the W-2s and the W-3 is on a
daily -- on an annual basis.
Q
Are businesses that have employees required to file
W-2s and W-3s with the Social Security Administration?
A
Yes.
Q
If a business paid wages to employees in 2019, would
its W-2s and W-3s -- when would its W-2s and W-3s have need
to be submitted to the Social Security Administration?
A
If the wages were paid out in 2019, the forms would
have to be submitted by January 31st of 2020, which would be
the following year.
Q
And if a business does not file W-2s or W-3s for a
particular year, what does that tell you about whether or
not the business paid wages to employees that year?
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A
It would indicate the businesses have zero employees,
the businesses do not exist, or the business is violating
the law by not submitting those forms.
Q
Special Agent Balsam, as part of your role, did you
review Social Security Administration records and databases
that contain wage information reported for businesses?
A
Yes, I did.
Q
And in advance of coming here today, did you review
these Social Security Administration databases for certain
businesses?
A
Yes, I did.
Q
Did you review wage data for the entity called Laser
Cut Barber Shop, with an EIN number ending 7324?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you review wage data for a business called Ni
Global, with an EIN ending 8422?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you review wage data for Hot Spot Clothing, with an
EIN 2211?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you review for Assana Hair Braiding, EIN ending
4217?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you review Fatim's Hair Braiding, with an EIN
ending 9848?
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Balsam - direct - Ms. Bilinkas
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A
Yes.
Q
Did you review for Benne Hair Braiding, EIN, ending
1485?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you review for R.R. Franklyn, EIN ending 8884?
A
Yes.
Q
Did you review for AutoNext, EIN ending 8015?
A
Yes.
Q
And did you review finally for Car Expert Auto Group,
EIN ending 5657?
A
Yes.
Q
Special Agent Balsam, for the entities I just listed,
was there any W-2 submitted to the Social Security
Administration for the tax years 2019 through 2021?
A
No.
Q
And what does that tell you if these entities did not
have any wage data for those tax years with the Social
Security Administration?
A
It would tell me that the businesses did not exist or
they had no employees.
Q
I have two other entities I want to talk about. Did
you review wage data for the entity Sorayas House of Beauty,
EIN ending 5364?
A
Yes.
Q
And for the tax years of 2019 and 2020, were any W-2s
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on file at the Social Security Administration?
A
No.
Q
Did you review wage information for Mommy's African
Hair Braiding, with EIN number 5906?
A
Yes.
Q
And were W-2s submitted for the tax years 2019 and
2021?
A
Yes. For 2021.
Q
Sorry, for tax years 2019 and 2021 --
A
Oh, sorry.
Q
-- were W-2s submitted with the Social Security
Administration?
A
No, they were not.
Q
Was there a W-2 submitted for the 2020 tax year?
A
Yes, there was.
Q
How many?
A
One.
Q
And what were the wages reported for that one W-2?
A
$1,500.
Q
And for the tax years that the Social Security
Administration does not have for those two entities that we
discussed, what does that mean as to the business's
operations for those years?
A
Either the businesses weren't in business those years,
or there was zero employees for those years.
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Balsam - cross- Mr. Greenspan
Jamie Ann Stanton, RMR, CRR, RPR
Official Court Reporter
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MS. BILINKAS: I have no further questions.
THE COURT: Any cross-examination?
MR. GREENSPAN: Very briefly, Your Honor.
CROSS-EXAMINATION
BY MR. GREENSPAN:
Q
Good afternoon, Agent Balsam.
A
Good afternoon.
Q
Initially you were asked, just generally, this is on
direct examination, if a business didn't submit W-2s or W-3s
for a year, and you said they either weren't in business,
didn't have employees, and then you gave a third option,
which was they violated the law, right?
A
That is correct.
Q
And then when you were asked about specific companies
who didn't have W-2s and W-3s, you just said they didn't
have any employees, but you didn't say they could have
violated the law, right?
A
That's what I said, yes.
Q
But they could have had employees and they could have
violated the law, right?
A
Yeah, it's possible, yes.
Q
You don't know one way or the other?
A
I don't know.
Q
They could have paid their employees in cash and not
reported it to the Government the way they were supposed to?
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Balsam - cross- Mr. Greenspan
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A
I don't know.
Q
When you looked for information about these companies,
where did you check?
A
In the Social Security databases.
Q
Do civilians who don't work for the Social Security
Administration have access to that database?
A
No, they do not.
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: No further questions.
THE COURT: Any further questions?
MS. BILINKAS: No, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Thank you very much. You may step
down.
(Witness excused.)
THE COURT: I guess we can leave a little early
today. See you at 10 o'clock. Don't talk about the case.
We are making progress. See you then.
(Jury exits.)
THE COURTROOM DEPUTY: You can all be seated.
THE COURT: Okay. See you all tomorrow,
10 o'clock. Anything else today?
MR. EDWARDS-BALFOUR: Nothing further from the
Government. Thanks, Your Honor.
(Matter adjourned to Wednesday, June 12, 2024, 10 a.m.)
*
*
*
*
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SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
312
I N D E X
WITNESS
PAGE
GUADALUPE PONCE
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. AMIR
139
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. TALKIN
149
REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. AMIR
163
ANTHONY CASTRO
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MS. BILINKAS
165
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. TALKIN
240
REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY MS. BILINKAS
276
RECROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. TALKIN
277
SHELLEY ZIELINSKI
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. AMIR
279
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. GREENSPAN
295
MARK PAUL BALSAM, JR.
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MS. BILINKAS
303
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. GREENSPAN
310
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SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
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E X H I B I T S
Exhibit
Page
Defense Exhibit 50 (for identification only)
155
Defense Exhibit 50
159
Government's Exhibits 1 through 11
171
Defense Exhibit 674
177
Government's Exhibit 320
197
Government's Exhibit 368, 369
235
Defense Exhibit D-029
257
Defense Exhibit D-17
265
Government's Exhibit 1130
284
Government's Exhibit 1132
286
Government's Exhibit 716
290
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SAM OCR RMR CRR RPR
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E X H I B I T S
Exhibit
Page
Government's Exhibit 300-B
301
Government's Exhibit 300-D
301
Government's Exhibits 995 through 1000, 1007
to 1008, 1010 to 1018, 1020, 1023 to 1028,
1033 to 1035, 1037 to 1038, 1040 to 1045,
1047 to 1049, 1051, 1054 to 1061, 1063, 1070
to 1073, 1077 to 1087, 1090 to 1091, 1095 to
1096, 1098, 1101, 1106 and 1121
302
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