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Moving America's Infrastructure Forward (House Small Business subcommittee hearing, February 27, 2020)

Summary

Transcript of the February 27, 2020 hearing Moving America's Infrastructure Forward before the Subcommittee on Contracting and Infrastructure of the House Committee on Small Business, Small Business Committee Document Number 116–074. Jared Golden and Pete Stauber gave opening statements. Witnesses were Lynn Frazier of the James W. Sewall Company for the American Society of Civil Engineers, Lisa Jacobson of the Business Council for Sustainable Energy, Michael Saperstein of USTelecom—The Broadband Association, and Todd Rothe of J.R. Jensen Construction Company. The appendix carries their prepared statements and a letter from Associated Builders and Contractors.

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“Moving America's Infrastructure Forward (House Small Business subcommittee hearing, February 27, 2020).” Original at www.govinfo.gov. Archived at Pandemic Darlings, https://pandemicdarlings.com/source-documents/moving-america-s-infrastructure-forward-house-small-business-subcommit-2f7f9eb0bf/, SHA-256 35891c0d6e1a92a298cb0d71e949288fcd7526497c99860d0fc693f16c6fc218.

Full text

                                                                   MOVING AMERICA’S INFRASTRUCTURE FORWARD


                                                                                                  HEARING
                                                                                                         BEFORE THE


                                                                   SUBCOMMITTEE ON CONTRACTING AND
                                                                           INFRASTRUCTURE
                                                                                                            OF THE


                                                                        COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
                                                                               UNITED STATES
                                                                         HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
                                                                                ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS
                                                                                                       SECOND SESSION


                                                                                                    HEARING HELD
                                                                                                   FEBRUARY 27, 2020




                                                                                Small Business Committee Document Number 116–074
                                                                                  Available via the GPO Website: www.govinfo.gov




                                                                                           U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
                                                                    39–801                             WASHINGTON : 2020




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                                                                                       HOUSE COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
                                                                                NYDIA VELÁZQUEZ, New York, Chairwoman
                                                                                        ABBY FINKENAUER, Iowa
                                                                                         JARED GOLDEN, Maine
                                                                                         ANDY KIM, New Jersey
                                                                                         JASON CROW, Colorado
                                                                                        SHARICE DAVIDS, Kansas
                                                                                          JUDY CHU, California
                                                                                          MARC VEASEY, Texas
                                                                                      DWIGHT EVANS, Pennsylvania
                                                                                       BRAD SCHNEIDER, Illinois
                                                                                     ADRIANO ESPAILLAT, New York
                                                                                     ANTONIO DELGADO, New York
                                                                                   CHRISSY HOULAHAN, Pennsylvania
                                                                                        ANGIE CRAIG, Minnesota
                                                                                  STEVE CHABOT, Ohio, Ranking Member
                                                                   AUMUA AMATA COLEMAN RADEWAGEN, American Samoa, Vice Ranking Member
                                                                                        TROY BALDERSON, Ohio
                                                                                         KEVIN HERN, Oklahoma
                                                                                       JIM HAGEDORN, Minnesota
                                                                                       PETE STAUBER, Minnesota
                                                                                       TIM BURCHETT, Tennessee
                                                                                          ROSS SPANO, Florida
                                                                                       JOHN JOYCE, Pennsylvania
                                                                                      DAN BISHOP, North Carolina

                                                                                              MELISSA JUNG, Majority Staff Director
                                                                                JUSTIN PELLETIER, Majority Deputy Staff Director and Chief Counsel
                                                                                                KEVIN FITZPATRICK, Staff Director




                                                                                                                   (II)




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                                                                                                              CONTENTS
                                                                                                            OPENING STATEMENTS
                                                                                                                                                                                               Page
                                                              Hon. Jared Golden ...................................................................................................              1
                                                              Hon. Pete Stauber ...................................................................................................              2

                                                                                                                       WITNESSES
                                                              Ms. Lynn Frazier, Director and Senior Transportation Engineer, James W.
                                                               Sewall Company, Old Town, ME, testifying on behalf of the American
                                                               Society of Civil Engineers ....................................................................................                   5
                                                              Ms. Lisa Jacobson, President, Business Council for Sustainable Energy,
                                                               Washington, DC ...................................................................................................                6
                                                              Mr. Michael Saperstein, Vice President of Strategic Initiatives and Partner-
                                                               ships, USTelecom—The Broadband Association, Washington, DC ..................                                                     8
                                                              Mr. Todd Rothe, President, J.R. Jensen Construction Company, Superior,
                                                               WI ..........................................................................................................................    10

                                                                                                                        APPENDIX
                                                              Prepared Statements:
                                                                  Ms. Lynn Frazier, Director and Senior Transportation Engineer, James
                                                                    W. Sewall Company, Old Town, ME, testifying on behalf of the Amer-
                                                                    ican Society of Civil Engineers ....................................................................                        21
                                                                  Ms. Lisa Jacobson, President, Business Council for Sustainable Energy,
                                                                    Washington, DC ............................................................................................                 27
                                                                  Mr. Michael Saperstein, Vice President of Strategic Initiatives and Part-
                                                                    nerships, USTelecom—The Broadband Association, Washington, DC .....                                                         33
                                                                  Mr. Todd Rothe, President, J.R. Jensen Construction Company, Superior,
                                                                    WI ...................................................................................................................      39
                                                              Questions for the Record:
                                                                  None.
                                                              Answers for the Record:
                                                                  None.
                                                              Additional Material for the Record:
                                                                  Letter from Associated Builders and Contractors .........................................                                     44




                                                                                                                              (III)




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                                                                       MOVING AMERICA’S INFRASTRUCTURE
                                                                                  FORWARD

                                                                                       THURSDAY, FEBRUARY 27, 2020

                                                                                       HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,
                                                                                   COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS,
                                                                SUBCOMMITTEE ON CONTRACTING AND INFRASTRUCTURE
                                                                                                                 Washington, DC.
                                                                 The Subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 1:07 p.m., in Room
                                                              2360, Rayburn House Office Building. Hon. Jared Golden [chair-
                                                              man of the Subcommittee] presiding.
                                                                 Present: Representatives Golden, Stauber, and Balderson.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Good afternoon, and sorry for the delay.
                                                              Just coming from some testimony with the Secretary of the Navy.
                                                              So, it kept me a little bit long. But my good colleague and friend,
                                                              Congressman Pete Stauber, I thought he was going to say that I
                                                              owed him dinner or drinks or something for being late when he
                                                              told me I had a text message waiting for me just now. But anyway,
                                                              I appreciate your patience.
                                                                 Good friend. Congressman Stauber actually came to Maine, and
                                                              I have been to his district as well. And I just point that out because
                                                              the first person testifying, I will introduce today, Ms. Frazier is ac-
                                                              tually from Maine, so you can tell her you have been to the district.
                                                                 Well, thank you all for your patience for coming to testify today.
                                                                 Whether it is the roads, rails, bridges that we use to transport
                                                              our goods, the utility systems that power our factories, or the tele-
                                                              communications networks that connect consumers to businesses,
                                                              maintaining America’s infrastructure is fundamental to a robust
                                                              economy and to the Nation’s competitiveness. Historically, Amer-
                                                              ica’s infrastructure network has fostered strong economies and al-
                                                              lowed us to be both competitive and efficient. However, by many
                                                              measures, we are failing to keep up with the growing demands of
                                                              our modern society.
                                                                 Across the U.S., years of underinvestment in our infrastructure
                                                              has resulted in crumbling roads, bridges in need of repair, rolling
                                                              blackouts, and communities that lack access to high-speed Internet.
                                                              Failure to invest in our infrastructure has serious economic con-
                                                              sequences, including lower GDP growth, lost business sales, and
                                                              fewer American jobs, especially for small businesses. Which is why
                                                              we have a plan that has been brought forward by House Democrats
                                                              in the House, a 5-year, $760 billion proposed investment in infra-
                                                              structure, the ‘‘Moving Forward Framework’’, and it merits atten-
                                                              tion today.
                                                                 We know that investments in infrastructure contribute both di-
                                                              rectly and indirectly to economic growth. Infrastructure investment
                                                                                                                  (1)




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                                                              reduces business costs, it increases consumer spending, and it lays
                                                              the foundation for a clean energy economy. It is also a critical com-
                                                              ponent to the success of small businesses and the communities they
                                                              serve.
                                                                 This is especially true in the energy sector. In 2018, clean energy
                                                              jobs totaled more than 3.26 million and nearly every state in the
                                                              U.S. has seen an increase in the clean energy economy. America’s
                                                              small businesses have been driving this growth, with nearly 70
                                                              percent of clean energy employees working for small businesses. A
                                                              commitment to investing in renewable energy sources, such as
                                                              wind, solar, biomass, is an investment in our Nation’s small busi-
                                                              nesses and their employees.
                                                                 Similarly, a robust and well-planned investment in our infra-
                                                              structure benefits small businesses, both as end-users of these net-
                                                              works and by creating business opportunities for them. Let’s take
                                                              access to rural broadband, an issue I have been working on with
                                                              my friend, the Ranking Member, Mr. Stauber, and a key compo-
                                                              nent of the Moving Forward Framework. 2.5 million Americans, in-
                                                              cluding 37,000 individuals in my home district in Maine, do not
                                                              have access to a high-speed Internet connection. In fact, only 5.5
                                                              percent of households in Maine are connected to a fiberoptic net-
                                                              work.
                                                                 We know that economic growth is tied to access to broadband—
                                                              especially for small businesses. Small firms that have access to
                                                              high-speed Internet earn twice as much revenue per employee,
                                                              guarantee four times the revenue growth year-over-year, and are
                                                              three times more likely to create jobs.
                                                                 Finally, I think we all agree that we need to enact policies that
                                                              create jobs right here at home, and we know that small firms domi-
                                                              nate sectors of the economy, such as construction, manufacturing,
                                                              and engineering. These small businesses play in integral role in up-
                                                              grading our roads, ports, bridges, airports, and electrical grids. In
                                                              fact, 61 percent of the jobs directly created by infrastructure spend-
                                                              ing would be in the construction sector, and 12 percent in the man-
                                                              ufacturing sector. These would be high-paying jobs on Main Street
                                                              that cannot outsourced.
                                                                 While there are many details to discuss, it is my hope that to-
                                                              day’s hearing can help identify how investments in infrastructure,
                                                              especially in surface transportation, clean energy, and rural
                                                              broadband, will benefit small businesses and the economy overall.
                                                                 And with that I thank each of the witnesses for joining us today.
                                                              I look forward to your testimony.
                                                                 And I will now yield to the Ranking Member, Mr. Stauber, for
                                                              an opening statement.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair, for holding
                                                              this timely hearing on an important issue which is our Nation’s in-
                                                              frastructure.
                                                                 Businesses and families across America rely on increasingly com-
                                                              plex transportation systems, electric grids, and Internet networks
                                                              to stay connected and competitive. As a member of this Committee
                                                              and the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee, I am
                                                              keenly aware of the significant impacts of even the smallest disrup-
                                                              tion to these systems.




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                                                                 Communities across the country look to us as their elected rep-
                                                              resentatives to advocate for local projects. Earlier this month, the
                                                              United States Department of Transportation approved a $10.5 mil-
                                                              lion grant to the Duluth Seaway Port Authority to help fund the
                                                              Duluth Port Logistics Hub 2020 Revitalization and Expansion
                                                              Project, which will repair terminal components and enhance capac-
                                                              ity for both domestic and international shipping. These improve-
                                                              ments will bring significant savings and market opportunities for
                                                              local small businesses, especially those in manufacturing and agri-
                                                              cultural industries.
                                                                 In addition to repair projects, many communities across the
                                                              country are waiting for the installment of broadband networks.
                                                              Once considered a luxury, broadband is now a critical component
                                                              of modern infrastructure. Last year, you and I, Mr. Chair, held a
                                                              hearing in Scandia, Minnesota, to hear from rural small business
                                                              owners challenged by unreliable access to broadband. You and I re-
                                                              alize that rural people living in Maine and rural folks in Minnesota
                                                              share the same burdens and have since worked together to explore
                                                              Federal strategies to bridge that digital divide.
                                                                 The health of our Nation’s infrastructure impacts us all regard-
                                                              less of geography or political affiliation. Our shared experience has
                                                              inspired bipartisan sentiments, but it is time for us to take action
                                                              and make desperately needed repairs and reforms.
                                                                 I appreciate all the witnesses being here today, especially Mr.
                                                              Rothe, who hails from the great 8th District of Minnesota. And I
                                                              look forward to hearing your remarks. You are all an integral part
                                                              in helping us ensure the government is helping, and not harming,
                                                              our small business community.
                                                                 Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I yield back.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Thank you. The Ranking Member and I
                                                              both agree that this is a very bipartisan issue. Everyone knows
                                                              that this is something that needs to be done. Even people who are
                                                              not even the slightest bit political at all.
                                                                 With that, I want to take just a quick minute for everyone who
                                                              is testifying to explain timing rules. Each of you will get 5 minutes
                                                              to testify. The members will then get 5 minutes for questions.
                                                              There is a lighting system to assist you. I am sure someone has
                                                              gone over this with you, but sometimes we forget. So, if you see
                                                              someone waving at you, you have probably failed to turn on the
                                                              button in front of you so that your microphone is on. The green
                                                              light will be on when you begin. A yellow light comes on when you
                                                              have 1 minute remaining, and the red light comes on when you are
                                                              out of time, and we ask that you do the best that you can to stay
                                                              within this timeframe.
                                                                 And now I would like to introduce witnesses.
                                                                 Our first witness is Ms. Lynn Frazier. She serves as the director
                                                              and senior transportation engineer for the James Sewall Company,
                                                              a 138-year-old integrated multidiscipline consulting firm providing
                                                              services to government, energy, and utilities and the forest prod-
                                                              ucts industry in Old Town, Maine. Ms. Frazier currently sits on the
                                                              board of the Maine Chamber of Commerce and is a past-president
                                                              of the American Society of City Engineers in Maine. She holds her
                                                              undergraduate degree from the University of Maine.
                                                                 Welcome, Ms. Frazier.




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                                                                 Our second witness is Ms. Lisa Jacobson. She is the president of
                                                              the Business Council for Sustainable Energy, a trade association
                                                              representing energy efficiency, renewable energy, and natural gas
                                                              industries. In this capacity, she advises states and Federal policy
                                                              makers on energy, tax, air quality, and climate change issues. She
                                                              is also a member of the Department of Energy’s State Energy Effi-
                                                              cient Steering Committee and the United States Trade Representa-
                                                              tives Trade and Environment Policy Advisory Committee. She
                                                              holds an undergraduate degree from the University of Vermont,
                                                              and a master’s degree from the London School of Economics.
                                                                 Welcome, Ms. Jacobson.
                                                                 Our third witness today is Mr. Mike Saperstein.
                                                                 Did I get this correct? Very good.
                                                                 He is the vice president of Strategic Initiatives and Partnerships
                                                              at U.S. Telecomm, a trade association representing telecommuni-
                                                              cations-related businesses in the U.S. In his role he focuses on new
                                                              and emerging technologies amid a shifting regulatory landscape. In
                                                              his previous role as vice president of Policy and Advocacy, he
                                                              worked to promote broadband infrastructure projects, such as the
                                                              Rural Digital Opportunity Fund. He received his undergraduate de-
                                                              gree from the University of Notre Dame and his J.D. from the
                                                              Catholic University of America, Columbus school of Law. Welcome,
                                                              sir. Thank you for joining us.
                                                                 And I will yield to Mr. Stauber to introduce our final witness.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
                                                                 Our final witness today is Mr. Todd Rothe. He is the president
                                                              of J.R. Jensen Construction Company. Todd has led the company
                                                              since 2004 and has nearly 30 years of construction experience. And
                                                              under his leadership, J.R. Jensen has grown from less than $5 mil-
                                                              lion in annual revenue to more than $25 million, ranking it among
                                                              the largest and most successful contractors in our region. Todd has
                                                              helped foster improvements at J.R. Jensen’s culture that have led
                                                              to excellence in safety, performance, and customer satisfaction.
                                                              Todd earned a bachelor’s degree in Business Administration from
                                                              the University of Minnesota-Duluth, the best college hockey team
                                                              in the Nation. It is a privilege to have a constituent on the panel
                                                              today, and I appreciate you for making the journey from Northern
                                                              Minnesota.
                                                                 Mr. Chair, I yield back.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Thank you very much.
                                                                 Ms. Frazier, you are now recognized for 5 minutes.

                                                              STATEMENTS OF LYNN FRAZIER, DIRECTOR AND SENIOR
                                                               TRANSPORTATION ENGINEER, JAMES W. SEWALL COMPANY;
                                                               LISA JACOBSON, PRESIDENT, BUSINESS COUNCIL FOR SUS-
                                                               TAINABLE ENERGY; MICHAEL SAPERSTEIN, VICE PRESI-
                                                               DENT OF STRATEGIC INITIATIVES AND PARTNERSHIPS,
                                                               USTELECOM, THE BROADBAND ASSOCIATION; TODD ROTHE,
                                                               PRESIDENT, J.R. JENSEN CONSTRUCTION COMPANY

                                                                                           STATEMENT OF LYNN FRAZIER
                                                               Ms. FRAZIER. Chairman Golden, Ranking Member Stauber, and
                                                              members of the Subcommittee, thank you for inviting me today for




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                                                              this important discussion on the Nation’s infrastructure and how it
                                                              impacts small business.
                                                                 My name is Lynn Frazier, and I am a civil engineer based in En-
                                                              field, Maine, the past-president of the American Society of Civil
                                                              Engineers’ Maine Section, a member of the Board of the Maine
                                                              Chamber of Commerce, and director of business development at
                                                              James W. Sewall Company.
                                                                 Today, I am appearing on behalf of the more than 150,000 mem-
                                                              bers of the American Society of Civil Engineers (ASCE). I appre-
                                                              ciate the opportunity to share our position on the importance of
                                                              long-term, strategic investment in our Nation’s infrastructure.
                                                                 Every 4 years, ASCE publishes the Infrastructure Report Card
                                                              to raise public awareness. Unfortunately, the most recent report
                                                              rated the overall condition of the Nation’s infrastructure as a D+
                                                              and found an investment gap of $2 trillion. As our infrastructure
                                                              continues to age, and investments fail to keep pace, this national
                                                              gap is only widening every year.
                                                                 At the state level, Maine’s latest report card found that our infra-
                                                              structure fares only slightly better than the national average, with
                                                              the state receiving a cumulative grade of C-.
                                                                 Ranking Member Stauber, your state of Minnesota fares slightly
                                                              better yet with their most recent report card grading the state’s in-
                                                              frastructure with a C.
                                                                 Several years ago, ASCE embarked on an effort to examine how
                                                              this persistent D average is impacting America’s economic future.
                                                              The resulting report, our Failure to Act series, found that failing
                                                              to close our Nation’s $2 trillion investment gap creates devasting
                                                              economic impacts for families, small businesses, and the Nation’s
                                                              overall GDP.
                                                                 Simply put, this analysis confirmed what we already know intu-
                                                              itively. Water main breaks, bridge closures, road postings, and the
                                                              occasional blackout are not just inconvenient, they are a drag on
                                                              economic growth.
                                                                 More specifically, our economic analysis found that by 2025, in-
                                                              frastructure will continue to degrade, resulting in a loss of 2.5 mil-
                                                              lion jobs, $3.9 trillion in GDP, and $7 trillion in lost business sales.
                                                              Additionally, our poor infrastructure cost American families $3,400
                                                              a year. That is $9 a day. This is a hidden tax that we are all pay-
                                                              ing when we do not address our infrastructure needs.
                                                                 In Maine, under investment in infrastructure like rail has eco-
                                                              nomic consequences for previously prosperous papermill towns
                                                              where economic development is desperately needed. For example,
                                                              the region’s freight connection to New York is limited to 10 miles
                                                              an hour in the Penobscot River Valley, forcing the few businesses
                                                              in the area to ship via truck. This makes the region less desirable
                                                              for other manufacturers, increases wear and tear on our roadways,
                                                              and increases congestion.
                                                                 On a more positive note, over the past several years, Maine has
                                                              made significant, strategic investments in its ports, which is paying
                                                              dividends. Due to these investments, 6 years ago, Eimskip, Ice-
                                                              land’s oldest shipping company, made Portland its U.S. head-
                                                              quarters, a move that has grown the amount of exports going
                                                              through the port each year and created many well-paying jobs. And
                                                              there are similar stories in every district across the country.




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                                                                 So how can we raise the grades and curtail the negative eco-
                                                              nomic impacts? ASCE believes that Congress should adopt infra-
                                                              structure legislation that fixes the Highway Trust Fund, eliminates
                                                              the cap on the passenger facility charge, puts trust back in the
                                                              Harbor Maintenance Trust Fund, and addresses both resilience and
                                                              the total lifecycle cost of an asset.
                                                                 Recent proposals and legislation in the House and Senate hit on
                                                              many of those priorities and we strongly hope that they will result
                                                              in bipartisan legislation this year.
                                                                 Unfortunately, none of these proposals seriously addresses the
                                                              Highway Trust Fund. The gas tax has not been raised in nearly 30
                                                              years and its purchasing power has diminished significantly over
                                                              the intervening years. Can you imagine living off your 1993 salary?
                                                              It would not get us very far.
                                                                 As a result, the Highway Trust Fund will be exhausted in 2022,
                                                              grinding critical road and bridge projects to a halt.
                                                                 Therefore, over the next 5 years, ASCE recommends a 5 cent a
                                                              year gas tax increase indexed to inflation. This proposal is sup-
                                                              ported by a wide coalition of groups, including the U.S. Chamber.
                                                              To ensure the Highway Trust Fund remains sustainable as more
                                                              electric vehicles come online, ASCE also recommends creating an
                                                              EV tax to account for their wear and tear on highways.
                                                                 Finally, ASCE urges Congress to establish a national pilot pro-
                                                              gram to better understand how a mileage-based user fee could be
                                                              implemented in the longer term.
                                                                 In conclusion, underinvestment in our infrastructure risks our
                                                              economic future and the quality of life of all Americans. It is the
                                                              goal of everyone in this room to make sure America remains com-
                                                              petitive in a growing global economy. But we cannot do that if we
                                                              cannot commit to building and maintaining a first-class infrastruc-
                                                              ture.
                                                                 I would like once again to thank the Committee for inviting me
                                                              to participate in today’s hearings, and I look forward to taking your
                                                              questions.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Thank you, Ms. Frazier.
                                                                 Ms. Jacobson, you are now recognized.

                                                                                       STATEMENT OF LISA JACOBSON
                                                                Ms. JACOBSON. Chairman Golden, Ranking Member Stauber,
                                                              and members of the Subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity
                                                              to testify today. I would like to express the Business Council for
                                                              Sustainable Energy’s appreciation for the leadership of the Sub-
                                                              committee and its strong bipartisan support.
                                                                Investment in American infrastructure will improve the Nation’s
                                                              economic competitiveness, it will increase our national security and
                                                              resilience, and has the potential to create tens of thousands of jobs.
                                                                Small businesses comprise more than 99 percent of U.S. compa-
                                                              nies and employ over 47 percent of the American private-sector
                                                              workforce. As the clean energy economy continues to grow, so too
                                                              will the impact of small businesses in these sectors.
                                                                BCSE is a coalition of companies and trade associations rep-
                                                              resenting energy efficiency, natural gas and renewable energy. The
                                                              council is pleased to have an independent initiative under its ban-




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                                                              ner, Clean Energy Business Network (CEBN). CEBN represents
                                                              small- and medium-size businesses in these industries.
                                                                Together, BCSE and CEBN represent a broad scope of the clean
                                                              energy economy, from Fortune 100 companies to small businesses
                                                              working in all 50 states and over 350 congressional districts. On
                                                              a national basis, the energy efficiency, natural gas and renewable
                                                              energy sectors support over 3.2 million U.S. jobs, and it is esti-
                                                              mated that 70 percent of these jobs are in small businesses.
                                                                To set the context for the policy perspectives offered in my testi-
                                                              mony, I would like to present some of the findings of the 2020 Sus-
                                                              tainable Energy in America Factbook. The Factbook is a report pro-
                                                              duced each year by the Business Council for Sustainable Energy
                                                              and Bloomberg New Energy Finance. Now in its eighth year, the
                                                              report released earlier this month, details the significant trans-
                                                              formation of the Nation’s energy sector, with a special look at the
                                                              last decade.
                                                                A complementary compendium from Clean Energy Business Net-
                                                              work, entitled Faces Behind the Facts, highlights some of the
                                                              small- to medium-sized clean energy entrepreneurs who are help-
                                                              ing to drive this transformation.
                                                                The 2010s was a rapid period of change in the energy sector, and
                                                              particularly for the portfolio of energy efficiency, natural gas, and
                                                              renewable energy.
                                                                During the last decade, the U.S. economy experienced sustained
                                                              economic growth, increased energy productivity, falling greenhouse
                                                              gas emissions, and low energy costs for consumers. Further, in the
                                                              2010s, renewable energy and energy-smart technologies expanded
                                                              and attracted $390 billion in investment in the United States, with
                                                              a record-breaking $55 billion in investment in 2019 alone.
                                                                Shifting to the Moving America and the Environment Forward
                                                              framework, as well as other proposals put forward by the Trump
                                                              Administration and Republicans in Congress, BCSE appreciates all
                                                              of these initiatives’ recognition of the energy system as a critical
                                                              infrastructure asset. We also support consideration of climate
                                                              change and resilience as part of these proposals.
                                                                The framework we are looking at today includes many important
                                                              areas. Specifically, (1) Siting, permitting, and regulatory reforms.
                                                              Streamlining of siting and permitting processes for electric and
                                                              natural gas infrastructure, hydropower projects, energy storage,
                                                              and materials management is critical.
                                                                Second, Resilient Infrastructure Investments. BCSE supports
                                                              pre-disaster investment to enhance the resilience of critical infra-
                                                              structure, as well as reforms to Federal regulations that enable
                                                              projects to ‘‘build back better.’’
                                                                BCSE has also worked at the local level in Texas and Puerto
                                                              Rico as a partner in the Readiness for Resilience project. These ex-
                                                              periences confirm our view that infrastructure planning and invest-
                                                              ment should consider opportunities to enhance resilience and sup-
                                                              port public private partnerships.
                                                                Third, Clean Energy and Energy Efficiency Infrastructure Invest-
                                                              ments. The framework includes several areas to accelerate the de-
                                                              ployment of clean energy technologies and resources in the energy,
                                                              transportation of broadband and buildings sectors among others.




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                                                                Finally, Infrastructure Financing Tools. To catalyze the capital
                                                              investments needed in U.S. infrastructure, Congress should seek to
                                                              strengthen and expand existing financial tools and consider new
                                                              mechanisms. These tools should catalyze and leverage private sec-
                                                              tor investment.
                                                                Energy Savings Performance Contracts, bonding authority, and
                                                              other tax measures should be considered. Further, programs should
                                                              include municipal infrastructure assets. This spans waste, water,
                                                              transportation, lighting, and energy infrastructure.
                                                                The last decade has demonstrated that energy is critical infra-
                                                              structure. Further, the U.S. energy economy is undergoing funda-
                                                              mental transformations that are powered by a robust, affordable,
                                                              reliable, and clean portfolio of commercially available energy re-
                                                              sources.
                                                                Thank you very much.
                                                                Chairman GOLDEN. Thank you.
                                                                Mr. Saperstein?
                                                                                  STATEMENT OF MICHAEL SAPERSTEIN
                                                                 Mr. SAPERSTEIN. Chairman Golden, Ranking Member Stauber,
                                                              and other distinguished members of this Subcommittee, I appre-
                                                              ciate the opportunity to testify at this important hearing on how
                                                              Federal infrastructure investment can support small business job
                                                              creation and increase connectivity in the United States.
                                                                 My name is Mike Saperstein, and I represent USTelecom, The
                                                              Broadband Association, the Nation’s premiere trade association for
                                                              broadband providers, suppliers, and innovators bringing high-speed
                                                              Internet and future-focused connectivity to families, communities,
                                                              enterprises, and small businesses.
                                                                 USTelecom shares Congress’s goal to connect every single Amer-
                                                              ican to the Internet. A meaningful infrastructure bill will do the
                                                              following things: Support robust and targeted broadband deploy-
                                                              ment via direct funding; promote public-private partnerships; and
                                                              also make regulatory changes to remove barriers to broadband de-
                                                              ployment.
                                                                 By investing in America’s broadband infrastructure today, Con-
                                                              gress can set the foundation for generations of commercial growth.
                                                              Many members of our association are actually multi-generational
                                                              local business with a history of entrepreneurship and innovation.
                                                                 Silver Star Communications, a service provider in Wyoming and
                                                              Idaho is one such small business that traces its roots to 1948 when
                                                              they connected rural farmers via telephone wires riding on barbed
                                                              wire fence. Infrastructure and technology may have changed, but
                                                              today that small business serves nine rural counties across 17,000
                                                              square miles and was the first provider in the state to deliver gig-
                                                              abit Internet service to residential customers over a fiberoptic net-
                                                              work.
                                                                 My point is this: small companies and digital connectivity busi-
                                                              nesses are not mutually exclusive. In fact, modern economic oppor-
                                                              tunity is fundamentally dependent upon access to the greatest
                                                              American innovation of the past century, the Internet. With 50 per-
                                                              cent of small businesses based out of the home, we have an impera-
                                                              tive to enable the next generation of entrepreneurship by making
                                                              sure all Americans have access to broadband wherever they may




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                                                              live or work. Broadband is as critical to America’s global competi-
                                                              tiveness as reliable roads, bridges, waters, and energy.
                                                                 With our current limited resources, we are mindful of the trade-
                                                              offs between investing in futureproof but more costly networks and
                                                              ensuring that all Americans have a baseline level of connectivity.
                                                              The $80 billion proposed in the framework for broadband deploy-
                                                              ment would fundamentally alter this calculation and provide a fu-
                                                              ture proof network in many areas of the country where this was
                                                              previously unattainable. Choosing trusted partners that have a his-
                                                              tory of successful broadband deployment, like the framework pro-
                                                              poses, is the most effective way to bridge the digital divide and can
                                                              be accomplished on the macro and micro level. The FCC, as the ex-
                                                              pert agency, has taken on the challenge of universal broadband
                                                              service and enlisted the help of experienced service providers to do
                                                              so.
                                                                 On a local level, we have seen communities taking innovative ap-
                                                              proaches to enhance their connectivity. Last year, the town of
                                                              Brooklyn, Maine, and Consolidated Communications, developed a
                                                              public-private partnership to share costs and creatively tackle
                                                              broadband deployment to the coastal community, resulting in sig-
                                                              nificantly faster and more reliable broadband connectivity. Federal
                                                              broadband funding should be targeted first to the areas of the
                                                              country truly unserved by broadband and not used to construct du-
                                                              plicative networks that overbuild a provider’s existing infrastruc-
                                                              ture.
                                                                 We commend this Subcommittee for already holding a hearing on
                                                              broadband mapping this Congress to help identify who is served,
                                                              and more importantly, who is unserved in this country. USTelecom
                                                              also commends the framework focus on adoption, digital equity, as
                                                              well as the next generation 911 services so our emergency response
                                                              networks are as accessible, efficient, and effective as possible.
                                                                 While direct broadband funding is critical, Congress, states, lo-
                                                              calities also need to focus on modernizing existing regulations to
                                                              speed infrastructure deployment. Common sense but necessary re-
                                                              forms include better access to railroad crossings, just and reason-
                                                              able access to utility poles owned by municipalities and coopera-
                                                              tives, and a sensible approach to rights of way access.
                                                                 Emerging 5G technology will drive economic growth and job cre-
                                                              ation in the years ahead, unleashing a wave of new innovation that
                                                              we cannot yet imagine. Rural 5G connectivity cannot exist without
                                                              a ubiquitous fiber network, and the faster we can deploy the fiber,
                                                              the better. The moving forward framework would be a tremendous
                                                              boost to our Nation’s broadband infrastructure. USTelecom and its
                                                              member companies, stand ready to work with this Committee, Con-
                                                              gress, and the administration to continue making significant steps
                                                              to close the digital divide.
                                                                 Thank you for this opportunity.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Thank you very much, sir.
                                                                 And finally, Mr. Rothe.
                                                                                           STATEMENT OF TODD ROTHE
                                                                Mr. ROTHE. Mr. Chairman and honorable members of the Sub-
                                                              committee, thank you for this opportunity Mr. Chairman and Hon-
                                                              orable Members of the Subcommittee, thank you for




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                                                                 this opportunity to provide my testimony about the impact that
                                                              infrastructure spending has on my firm, J.R. Jensen Construction
                                                              Company.
                                                                 Located in Superior, Wisconsin, we live in the border community
                                                              known as the Twin Ports with Duluth, Minnesota. We employ 80
                                                              full-time, union employees. The markets we serve are industrial,
                                                              energy, and commercial construction. Our industrial markets in-
                                                              clude agriculture and grain handling, such as CHS; mining, Cleve-
                                                              land Cliffs; minerals processing, Graymont; and transportation, in-
                                                              cluding railroads such as BNSF. For the energy sector we build fa-
                                                              cilities for clients operating regional pipelines, such as Enbridge;
                                                              Superior’s oil refinery, Husky Energy; and electric power utilities,
                                                              such as Minnesota Power.
                                                                 Our valued clients often hire us as well to perform work through-
                                                              out the Midwest and the 12-state region. While most of our infra-
                                                              structure work would be considered private spending, we have re-
                                                              ceived contracts as both a prime contractor and subcontractor to
                                                              Federal agencies, including the US Army Corps of Engineers, Coast
                                                              Guard, and others. We have worked for a variety of similar state
                                                              and local governments as well. So, we have experienced first-hand
                                                              the tremendous, positive economic and social impacts that infra-
                                                              structure brings, whether it is private or public. And construction
                                                              firms like us rely upon a steady stream of projects. They are not
                                                              just temporary jobs.
                                                                 People often talk about the ‘‘ripple effect’’ of such spending, and
                                                              I can assure you it is real, and it is significant.
                                                                 So today I would like to share with you some examples that we
                                                              have personally observed in our small business in Superior, Wis-
                                                              consin. These are positive results directly connected to infrastruc-
                                                              ture spending. Additionally, we do make a point with our contracts
                                                              to buy local services and buy products made in the United States
                                                              whenever possible, which again indicates the indirect and broader
                                                              impacts as well.
                                                                 So, construction projects are being accomplished with three main
                                                              things: labor, materials, and equipment. I have organized my ex-
                                                              amples accordingly.
                                                                 1. Labor. Supporting Employees with Great Jobs. People are an
                                                              company’s greatest asset, and ours is no exception. Good wages, ac-
                                                              tually high-paying wages and benefits help people to support their
                                                              families, pay their taxes, and be able to improve their lives. We
                                                              work in a part of the country that generally has brutal winters,
                                                              and yet, we are outdoors loving people.
                                                                 So, think of the things we buy, such as pickup trucks, both pop-
                                                              ular, both necessary, and common. Most of those come from Michi-
                                                              gan. Snowmobiles and ATV’s, there is a Polaris factory and an Arc-
                                                              tic Cat factory right in Minnesota. Boats are made in Minnesota,
                                                              the Land of 10,000 Lakes. Lund, Alumacraft, Premier Pontoons, all
                                                              made in Minnesota. Ice Castle fish houses for this time of year
                                                              made in Montevideo, Minnesota. Campers, trailers, and RV’s come
                                                              from Northern Indiana.
                                                                 So, the list of things that people buy goes on and on, and each
                                                              of these I have mentioned contains steel. Mining in Northern Min-
                                                              nesota not only provides great jobs; it continues to produce the iron
                                                              ore needed to make the steel that end up in these products.




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                                                                 Proposed mines such as PolyMet and Twin Metals are on the
                                                              table now and trying to get permitted. Those are needed and im-
                                                              portant. Minnesota has one of the largest deposits of copper and
                                                              nickel needed to safely and responsibly mine and use these impor-
                                                              tant minerals. The green economy needs these minerals to make
                                                              solar panels and windmills and copper wiring, tubing, catalytic con-
                                                              verters, batteries, and more. Why should these minerals not come
                                                              from the United States?
                                                                 Spending on materials and supplies is the second component of
                                                              projects. So, for many of our projects, materials are the largest part
                                                              of the budget, and these purchases create big impacts.
                                                                 Wood and lumber, forest products industries; steel, rebar, piling,
                                                              pipes, structural beams, plates, you name it, mines. Benefitting
                                                              mines and U.S. steel mills, scrap recyclers.
                                                                 Pre-engineered metal buildings are made in Butler fabrication
                                                              plants throughout the U.S. Concrete and cement plants, all their
                                                              raw materials from places such as Alpena, Michigan. Asphalt for
                                                              roads and highways; fuel for vehicles and equipment, all produced
                                                              by local by local refineries. The list goes on including all the tem-
                                                              porary utilities and power and water and various things like that.
                                                                 The last one being spending on equipment. Companies like ours
                                                              have to invest in equipment to stay competitive and productive. So,
                                                              think of major American manufacturers, including John Deere,
                                                              Caterpillar, and even Minnesota’s Bobcat.
                                                                 Section 179 allows these attractive tax rules to better plan and
                                                              make these purchases, so we thank you for that. It is working.
                                                                 And then, finally, if we meet our budget, the project yields a
                                                              profit. And this is a bad word to some people, but anyone in busi-
                                                              ness knows that it exists and without it, we will not survive. Our
                                                              firm has been successful. That allows us to give back to the com-
                                                              munity. So, we upgrade equipment, reinvest our profits, all this to
                                                              better serve our clients, improve what we do, and make sure we
                                                              continue to offer a great environment for our people to work.
                                                                 I think you have a good example there.
                                                                 In conclusion I think, you know, let’s work together in moving
                                                              America’s infrastructure forward, and I hope I have demonstrated
                                                              it is a truly significant means toward a larger goal of moving
                                                              American forward. Thank you.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Forest products, harsh winters, snowmo-
                                                              biles and ATVs, that sounds familiar.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. Hockey.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Hockey as well. That is right. University of
                                                              Maine; right? You played hockey there.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. And we beat them. Yep.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. And you won.
                                                                 We are going to move to questions now. Thank you all very much
                                                              for your important testimony.
                                                                 I will start with 5 minutes myself.
                                                                 Ms. Frazier, I sat on the Transportation Committee in Augusta.
                                                              We had people talk about a $160 million highway budget shortfall
                                                              in the state coffers with a plan in the last administration to try
                                                              and bond our way out of it, $100 million at a time over 10 years
                                                              and that would not even fill the gap. We decoupled from inflation
                                                              adjustments years ago losing tens of millions of potential dollars to




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                                                              invest and politically people are just I think scared to have this
                                                              conversation, even though organizations like the Chamber of Com-
                                                              merce and Maine Motor Transportation Association, I am sure the
                                                              American trucks as well are talking about the need to address the
                                                              revenue side of things. I feel like as a general strategy it was lack-
                                                              ing to bond because now, we are paying interest, right, rather than
                                                              just paying for it upfront. It is actually more expensive, just kind
                                                              of kicking the can. So hopefully we can find the will to do some-
                                                              thing here.
                                                                 But I did want to ask you a little bit about freight rail, which
                                                              you brought up. Ten miles per hour, I am well aware of that in the
                                                              Penobscot River Valley. Huge problem. But freight rail all over the
                                                              state lacking in a big way.
                                                                 Do you have any idea what the dollar figure is to try and get us
                                                              competitive, or any examples of specific businesses that have been
                                                              hurt as a result of the lack of investment?
                                                                 Ms. FRAZIER. Yes. So interestingly, a lot of the freight rail por-
                                                              tions are privately owned, so it is not even as much of a funding
                                                              gap that is the problem; it is a policy discussion that needs to be
                                                              had. And letting people know where our priorities are and that we
                                                              need to work with them, and if it is providing matching funding,
                                                              to just get those rails and let them know that it is important to
                                                              us.
                                                                 As far as businesses being affected, I live in Enfield, and not so
                                                              long ago, I think April of last year a large train with a full load
                                                              of timber tipped over right near the main roadway so, you know,
                                                              the road was closed. It just disrupts everything. And it is not like
                                                              they were going more than 10 miles an hour, so.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Yeah, no, it is a big problem. I appreciate
                                                              that very much.
                                                                 And there are tax credits and things, but obviously, a conversa-
                                                              tion needs to be had.
                                                                 Ms. FRAZIER. Definitely.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Some of those people are not stepping up
                                                              and we have got to find a way to do more.
                                                                 Some people talking to me recently in Maine about the idea of
                                                              building a facility at the airport in Bangor where they could house
                                                              lobsters coming off the coast so that we could be quicker to market,
                                                              you know, those types of potential projects at airports. What do you
                                                              think?
                                                                 Ms. FRAZIER. I think that is great. Yeah. Anytime we can lever-
                                                              age private funding to help with that and really boost our economy
                                                              and export our goods, sure.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Yeah, I appreciate that feedback.
                                                                 Just moving on real quick, Ms. Jacobson, you said that Maine
                                                              ranks fourth in the country in percentage of instate energy gen-
                                                              erated from renewable energy, yet we rank almost last for total en-
                                                              ergy generation as a state. Very oil dependent. You know, we are
                                                              happy that we are doing things like solar, wind, and others. But
                                                              you talk a little bit about natural gas as well. We have a bit of an
                                                              infrastructure problem there. I just want to get your thoughts on
                                                              how we could do better in terms of energy generation without hurt-
                                                              ing that. I mean, it is very nice to be number four in producing re-
                                                              newable energy right at home. So, what can we do?




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                                                                 Ms. JACOBSON. Well, I commend you on that and, you know,
                                                              our data also shows I think over 77 percent of your generation cur-
                                                              rently coming from renewable energy. Also, do not forget, energy
                                                              efficiency, you ran very high in terms of energy efficiency, utility
                                                              spending, as well as benchmarked against the rest of the country.
                                                              And that is really where I would start my remarks. It is really
                                                              about a portfolio. BCSE focuses on a portfolio of efficiency natural
                                                              gas renewables but we have to look beyond that storage, new tech-
                                                              nologies. And then the optimization of our energy system which I
                                                              know you this Committee is a big proponent of, and you are as
                                                              well.
                                                                 In terms of what drives more instate or intra-region generation,
                                                              it comes to this confluence of policy, markets, cost. And one thing
                                                              that I would highlight that I think that Maine could continue to
                                                              build on, a trend that is happening throughout the country, is cor-
                                                              porate and city-level involvement in energy decision making be-
                                                              cause of the information technology and public awareness and a
                                                              drive for sustainability, local communities as well as the private
                                                              sector are asking for a clean portfolio of energy choices. So that is
                                                              an opportunity for local businesses to request the energy that they
                                                              would like to see provided to them. So, there is a partnership op-
                                                              portunity with utilities and state policy makers.
                                                                 But in terms of infrastructure, you are exactly right. I mean, one
                                                              of the biggest trends over the last decade has been reduced green-
                                                              house gas emissions throughout the country and that is because of
                                                              shifting to cleaner fuels like natural gas. In New York, we have an
                                                              infrastructure problem, and that is, again, a local, as well as state
                                                              and Federal challenge.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Thank you very much.
                                                                 There has been a lot of talk about that challenge, a big bottle-
                                                              neck problem we have in New England.
                                                                 So, I will hand it off to the Ranking Member. I do not want him
                                                              to miss asking questions if votes are called.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
                                                                 Mr. Rothe, I appreciate your astute observation for the need of
                                                              steel as we make investments into our critical infrastructure. And
                                                              as both you and I know, Northern Minnesota is home to the largest
                                                              iron ore mine in North America and sits on the largest nickel cop-
                                                              per reserves in North America as well.
                                                                 Mining in Northern Minnesota, we mine under some of the
                                                              strongest labor and environmental standards, and it is critical to
                                                              use U.S. steel in our repair of our infrastructure in our roads and
                                                              bridges. And to that end, how will the high potential for high-pay-
                                                              ing mining jobs benefit communities in the Twin Ports and
                                                              throughout Northern Minnesota?
                                                                 Mr. ROTHE. Well, the reality with mining is very similar to
                                                              other sorts of investments. It is just that there is a big ripple effect
                                                              of the mines themselves with the high-paying jobs of the people
                                                              they employ, the magnitude of the equipment purchases they buy.
                                                              There is even some other stuff they use. And repairs they make
                                                              also employ many union tradespeople that similarly work for com-
                                                              panies like ours to keep those plants operating. So——
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. Go ahead.




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                                                                 Mr. ROTHE. You know, in the Twin Ports more specifically, all
                                                              of the shipping of the Tacket A pellets come through the Duluth/
                                                              Superior and Two Harbors area.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. Right.
                                                                 You know, we have talked about, Ms. Jacobson, you talked about
                                                              the renewable energies and what have you. So, where Mr. Rothe
                                                              and I live, those copper nickel reserves, we want to supply the cop-
                                                              per for the windmills. And the nickel and cobalt for the electric bat-
                                                              teries. And we want to be able to mine it in Minnesota with the
                                                              strongest labor standards and the strongest environmental stand-
                                                              ards and not countries that do not have our best interest at heart.
                                                              We are fighting in Minnesota to give you and give us the oppor-
                                                              tunity to grow our renewables. I would much rather get those min-
                                                              erals from our home state of Minnesota than from other govern-
                                                              ments, such as China. The steel dumping, this administration
                                                              stopped the steel dumping which was cheap and brittle steel to the
                                                              best made steel in the world. We want the renewables made out
                                                              of those minerals that we can extract. And I want you in Maine
                                                              and Vermont and other states to understand what we are fighting
                                                              for in Minnesota. Mr. Rothe is on the cutting edge of that.
                                                                 And with that being said, I want to switch gears, Todd, to your
                                                              Federal Government procurement process for your small business.
                                                              You know, when you work with the Federal Government, what bar-
                                                              riers to the efficiency have you faced? And then what certain regu-
                                                              lations did you find really burdensome and more difficult to over-
                                                              come as a small business during the procurement process?
                                                                 Mr. ROTHE. The contracts we have had have, you know, had a
                                                              fair amount of regulatory aspects to them. You know, each one of
                                                              them creates its own little silo of a problem. So, I cannot think of
                                                              anything that specifically is a real barrier except for the fact that
                                                              the quantity. So, the magnitude becomes more of the issue and it
                                                              becomes, you know, frankly sometimes we just simply do not chase
                                                              after government contracts because of those requirements. We have
                                                              a hard time, for example, in our company, meeting various diver-
                                                              sity requirements and things like that. Some of those are more
                                                              common in some of the state contracts and even some of the uni-
                                                              versity contracts. So, it is almost like either mandated hiring or
                                                              mandated percentages or all of these sorts of thresholds like that
                                                              can sometimes be pretty difficult for a small company like ours.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. And I think that both Chairman Golden and I,
                                                              when you made the statement that sometimes you will not even
                                                              chase those contracts because of the redundancy and the duplica-
                                                              tion, for a small business that is not what we need to hear. We
                                                              have a job to do and we have heard this enough over and over. We
                                                              want our small businesses to be the engine of our economy, and to
                                                              hear you say that it is a green light for change for us, Mr. Chair.
                                                                 And with that, I will yield back.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Thank you. I appreciate it.
                                                                 Next, we are going to recognize the Ranking Member of the Sub-
                                                              committee on Innovation and Workforce Development, Representa-
                                                              tive Troy Balderson from Ohio’s 12th.
                                                                 Mr. BALDERSON. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Thank
                                                              you, panel, for being here today.




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                                                                 My first question will be directed to Mr. Rothe and Mrs. Frazier.
                                                              As a member of the Transportation and Infrastructure Committee,
                                                              one of my infrastructure priorities is streamlining the project deliv-
                                                              ery and permitting process at the Federal level to maximize limited
                                                              resources and reduce bureaucratic red tape.
                                                                 Last week, I held a Transportation and Infrastructure roundtable
                                                              in my district with local stakeholders, including the Ohio Depart-
                                                              ment of Transportation, local construction businesses, county engi-
                                                              neers, and more. One topic that came up was support for stream-
                                                              lining unnecessary or complex regulations that hinder project de-
                                                              velopment. From your own experiences, what Federal regulations
                                                              can Congress update, reform, or eliminate to yield better results for
                                                              taxpayer investment in infrastructure?
                                                                 And Ms. Frazier, you may start first.
                                                                 Ms. FRAZIER. Well, ASCE supports streamlining as long as the
                                                              environment is protected, and certainly from my personal work ex-
                                                              periences, just having a standard that is in place and followed, that
                                                              we know what to expect. I mean, if there are permits that we can
                                                              obtain and we know there is a 6-month review period and we can
                                                              plan on that, but if we are modifying a permit, there is no set re-
                                                              view period. That makes businesses really nervous to not have a
                                                              plan in place. So, I think there is a lot we can do to streamline and
                                                              really set expectations.
                                                                 Mr. BALDERSON. Mr. Rothe?
                                                                 Mr. ROTHE. I would echo those statements, as well as just say-
                                                              ing the unpredictability sometimes of the processes is as big a prob-
                                                              lem as the processes themselves. And we’ve faced some severe
                                                              issues in the State of Minnesota with getting our Line 3 pipeline
                                                              permitted. Even though that’s not a Federal project review per se,
                                                              but it’s an example of things gone amuck with the level of chal-
                                                              lenges and court challenges. And we, in Minnesota, have a state
                                                              department going after, basically suing the Public Utilities Com-
                                                              mission and challenging rules there. So, things like that create
                                                              delays, cause major problems for projects in general to get them
                                                              built.
                                                                 Mr. BALDERSON. Okay. I was just looking to see if there is
                                                              something specifically that we in Congress can address, but I ap-
                                                              preciate both your answers. And if you do think of something,
                                                              please let our office know.
                                                                 My final question, just time permitted here wise, as the Chair-
                                                              man said, as Ranking Member of the Workforce and Innovation
                                                              Subcommittee, I am dedicated to closing our workforce gap and it
                                                              is something that has been a passion of mine for 20-plus years. In
                                                              your opinion, what more can be done to ensure that the industry
                                                              has an adequate supply of trained workers?
                                                                 And anybody from the panel can answer that question.
                                                                 Mr. SAPERSTEIN. Thank you for the question.
                                                                 So certainly, in the communications industry it is enabling a
                                                              whole new generation of industries, particularly as broadband ac-
                                                              cess comes online. And I think actually access to broadband is the
                                                              thing that we need to make sure that a whole new generation of
                                                              workforce is enabled. Without the basic access to that infrastruc-
                                                              ture, you cannot do your homework these days, let alone advance
                                                              in your career. So, having the broadband access, and having the




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                                                              tools to adopt it and understand the adoption and how important
                                                              that is is critical to our future development.
                                                                 Ms. JACOBSON. I will comment briefly. From the energy sector,
                                                              understanding the change and the changing needs of our workforce
                                                              is one aspect, but we also have I think one in five current employ-
                                                              ees slated to retire in the next decade when you look at the utility
                                                              sector in particular. So, there is a huge opportunity here for family-
                                                              supporting jobs, careers, and very exciting opportunities to inter-
                                                              sect with all the infrastructure sectors of the U.S. economy. Energy
                                                              is not just energy alone. It is connected to everything around this
                                                              table. So, what we focus on is workforce training and public-private
                                                              partnerships. And the industries that I work for, making this more
                                                              of a priority, but there is clearly a role for the Federal Government,
                                                              and I know in your Committee and this Committee, as well as in
                                                              Energy and Commerce, there is a lot of focus on specific legislation
                                                              that would help foster those partnerships in a more robust way.
                                                              And I think we also have to look at the needs of those potential
                                                              employees. Making sure they have support so they can take advan-
                                                              tage of the training programs when they do exist.
                                                                 Mr. BALDERSON. Thank you very much, Ms. Jacobson.
                                                                 I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. I think we are going to do another round
                                                              of questions. I know I have got one about broadband, but I am
                                                              going to first let Mr. Stauber go. I know you might have some as
                                                              well.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
                                                                 To Mr. Rothe again. You talked about the redundancy and the
                                                              Federal regulations, the duplicative part of them. Would you like
                                                              to talk about two specific industries in Minnesota that can help
                                                              small businesses? We have a replacement pipeline project, and we
                                                              have the first permitted copper nickel project. Can you tell the
                                                              members here the length of time it took to get those permits? And
                                                              you can start with the copper nickel.
                                                                 Mr. ROTHE. Well, when I joined J.R. Jensen, which was in the
                                                              year 2004, and purchased the company since then along with a
                                                              partner I had at the time. And I remember it was ’04 or ’05 when
                                                              PolyMet was starting and anticipating within 2 or 3 years to have
                                                              their permits. So, if that explains it, that was 16 years ago.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. They are into their 16th year for permitting. Six-
                                                              teen years. And then how about the replacement of a Line 3 we call
                                                              it in the State of Minnesota. How long has that been going on for
                                                              a replacement?
                                                                 Mr. ROTHE. That has been going on at least 5 years. And inter-
                                                              esting, you know, Wisconsin has similar requirements for pipeline
                                                              projects, but the 13 mile stretch in Wisconsin was built and com-
                                                              pleted 2 years ago. And I would also point out that the entire Na-
                                                              tion of Canada from North of Edmonton and Alberta area down to
                                                              the Minnesota border is also now completed and I believe put into
                                                              service.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. Which has stopped good paying union jobs.
                                                                 Mr. ROTHE. That is correct.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. Family wage jobs. And for a commodity that we
                                                              use every day.
                                                                 I just want to switch gears, Mr. Chair, if I could.




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                                                                 Mr. Saperstein, you talked about rural broadband, and you made
                                                              a very interesting comment. You talked about the investment from
                                                              rural Minnesota into the metro. Can you give the Chair and I some
                                                              type of idea how we can convince those members of Congress?
                                                              There are more of them that represent the Metro or the areas that
                                                              are heavily populated. If you were in our shoes, how would you
                                                              convince the metro legislators on working from rural in?
                                                                 Mr. SAPERSTEIN. Sure. And thank you for the question.
                                                                 I think economic growth would be the way that I would go about
                                                              doing that. And the moving forward framework does this because
                                                              it invests in a robust fiber-fueled broadband infrastructure
                                                              throughout our Nation.
                                                                 So the more people that come online, not only do you have the
                                                              construction projects that are going to fuel the fiber development
                                                              because we are going to be stringing miles and miles of fiber as a
                                                              result of this, but you also have all of the spillover benefits. You
                                                              have a 5G economy that is going to come online as a result of this
                                                              that is going to unleash who knows what when it comes to eco-
                                                              nomic potential. But I can tell you this, that if the rural areas are
                                                              not connected, they are not going to be a part of that. And so that
                                                              is why we commend the Committee for looking at this moving for-
                                                              ward framework. And think about all of the economic opportunity.
                                                              You know, 50 percent of home businesses, over 50 percent are
                                                              women owned. So that brings another generation of potential
                                                              entrepeneurs into the workforce. So, the economics compel us to in-
                                                              vest in our broadband infrastructure today.
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. That is music to both of our ears. That is criti-
                                                              cally important.
                                                                 Both the Chair and I held broadband meetings in rural commu-
                                                              nities and that is exactly what they said, do not forget about us.
                                                              Our rural hospitals, our rural schools are just as important, and we
                                                              need to protect that.
                                                                 I am going to make a final statement, and I am going to at-
                                                              tribute this statement to Neel Kashkari. He is a member of the
                                                              Federal Reserve out of Minneapolis. He and I were talking about
                                                              this subject, about rural broadband, and he made this statement.
                                                              He said, at some point in the government’s history, they made the
                                                              decision that every mailbox mattered. Every mailbox mattered.
                                                              And I equate that to every household matters, whether you are in
                                                              Grand Marais, Baudette, Minnesota, or Willmar, Minnesota, rural
                                                              areas, they matter. And I just really appreciate, I can tell your en-
                                                              thusiasm for it because Jared and I, Mr. Chair and I are all over
                                                              this to be able to make sure that rural broadband, it is not a lux-
                                                              ury anymore. It is a necessity for people. It is a necessity for small
                                                              businesses to move out to rural America and live our quality of life.
                                                              And I appreciate your enthusiasm.
                                                                 And Mr. Chair, thank you to all the witnesses, and I appreciate
                                                              the extension of the time.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Of course. Thank you very much.
                                                                 Something you might not know about Maine, we actually passed
                                                              a law in the state legislature having to do with mining that was
                                                              widely believed to set the standard for labor and environmental
                                                              protections along with mining. So, something for you to look at in
                                                              your work in Minnesota. And I think the point is taken, 5G, these




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                                                              iPhones that everyone is dependent upon these days, solar panels
                                                              and others, all involving minerals, very important.
                                                                 I am going to probably wrap it up here with just a few more
                                                              questions starting with broadband. One of the issues that we have
                                                              talked about here in the Committee had to do with mapping. Re-
                                                              cently, the FCC approved a Rural Digital Opportunity Fund. They
                                                              would go ahead and use reverse auctions to disburse about $20 bil-
                                                              lion over 10 years for broadband. And I am glad that the FCC is
                                                              going to support this rural broadband infrastructure investment,
                                                              but I do have some concerns. And I will start with the fact that
                                                              they are looking at frontloading the bulk of the funding in the first
                                                              phase before the FCC’s planned update to its broadband maps will
                                                              be ready. We have found in the Subcommittee and in our hearings
                                                              and in our work around the country really, that the mapping data
                                                              is just very inaccurate, and it is a big problem. So, of course, I am
                                                              concerned that they are going to make the bulk of their investment
                                                              in areas that may very well already be served and leave out the
                                                              communities that are most greatly underserved. And I wanted to
                                                              ask your opinion about this. Is this something Congress should be
                                                              looking into? What can we do to make sure the investment is made
                                                              where it needs to go?
                                                                 Mr. SAPERSTEIN. Sure. And thank you, Chairman, for the
                                                              question.
                                                                 So, we commend Congress for taking a hard look at the
                                                              broadband mapping because we, too, at USTelecom have done a
                                                              deep dive into this. In fact, we sponsored a pilot project, the
                                                              Broadband Mapping Initiative to take a look at what are the hid-
                                                              den unserved pockets out there? And people who may live next to
                                                              a served house may find themselves observed and it creates a situ-
                                                              ation where it is hard to figure out exactly where the service needs
                                                              to go.
                                                                 The Rural Digital Opportunity Fund that you mentioned I think
                                                              does one thing important. You mentioned that the FCC has taken
                                                              a step to improve their broadband mapping. In the interim, the
                                                              first phase of the Rural Digital Opportunity Fund, it focuses on the
                                                              areas that are completely unserved. So, we do not have to worry
                                                              about overbuilding at that step. At USTelecom, one of the things
                                                              that we said to the FCC in particular was that the number of hid-
                                                              den unserved Americans may be very high. And so, we have asked,
                                                              and I think the FCC committed in their most recent order to re-
                                                              evaluating the budget for phase two if, indeed, the maps show that
                                                              the number of truly unserved is higher. So, we are appreciative of
                                                              that.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Thank you very much for that.
                                                                 I also wanted to ask, Ms. Frazier, high-priority infrastructure
                                                              needs in Maine. You advise a lot of different people around the
                                                              state, different businesses. What do we need most in Maine? It’s
                                                              a very open-ended question.
                                                                 Ms. FRAZIER. Yes, it is.
                                                                 I think we most need reliable funding so that we can create a
                                                              strategic plan and best decide where to put those dollars. I mean,
                                                              right now our DOT commissioner said our 3-year plan is really a
                                                              2-year plan worth of projects but that is all we can afford. So, we
                                                              need to understand what reliable source of funding is coming and




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                                                              then choose our priorities for there. Of course, roads are the most
                                                              visible and bridges. So that would be my vote.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Point well taken. Before the commissioner
                                                              of the Main DOT can make a good plan like that, he needs to know
                                                              what the feds are going to do as well.
                                                                 Ms. FRAZIER. Exactly.
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. We are all going to continue to be opti-
                                                              mistic about Infrastructure Week actually occurring. That would be
                                                              an important move. Which is why we have had the hearing.
                                                                 I will just throw out one last question for you, Ms. Jacobson. You
                                                              talked in your plan about the last 10 years of renewable energy.
                                                              What do you want to see most? What is the most important invest-
                                                              ment for the next 10 years of renewable energy?
                                                                 Ms. JACOBSON. Well, I think it really does involve public-pri-
                                                              vate partnerships. I mean, what has dominated the last 10 years
                                                              and maybe mostly in the last 5 years is what I described earlier,
                                                              is corporate procurement of renewable energy of all resources. And
                                                              I think as many companies, and certainly in Minnesota and in
                                                              Maine, you have companies that are looking to procure clean en-
                                                              ergy and more and more and more of it. But nationally, last year
                                                              in 2019, it was about 18 gigawatts of corporate PPAs signed, and
                                                              you know, that represents just about half of the demand for renew-
                                                              able energy nationally in a given year. I mean, the projects do not
                                                              happen in the same time period, but it is a forward-looking signal.
                                                              So, I think we need to have continued opportunity for research, de-
                                                              velopment, and deployment from the Federal Government. We need
                                                              to look at sensible tax policy which has really fueled renewable en-
                                                              ergy deployment and cost reductions, and we have to focus on the
                                                              private sector. What does the private sector need to get access to
                                                              clean energy?
                                                                 Chairman GOLDEN. Thank you very much.
                                                                 On that final note, we have some important tax credits that we
                                                              did not take action on to extend some of these investments in re-
                                                              newable energy, so hopefully something Congress can work to-
                                                              gether on as well in 2020.
                                                                 I want to thank you all again for your testimony and a great con-
                                                              versation. I think we do it a little bit differently on this Sub-
                                                              committee sometimes. It is an open-ended conversation between all
                                                              of us. So, thank you for joining us.
                                                                 Just as a closing statement, investments, what we have heard
                                                              today, there are obvious investments in our infrastructure. Just a
                                                              great opportunity to help small businesses grow, not just in Maine
                                                              and Minnesota but over the entire stretch of the country.
                                                                 Pete, what do you think?
                                                                 Mr. STAUBER. Thank you, Mr. Chair. And as we wrap it up, I
                                                              really appreciate your testimony. Each one of you spent some time
                                                              and money and energy to get here. While your testimony was going
                                                              on, I hope you saw us just nodding. We are all in the same boat
                                                              here. I just really appreciate what you are saying. It affirms, it re-
                                                              affirms what we are hearing in our districts and across the Nation.
                                                              Our hearing in Maine, Ms. Frazier, we heard the same thing as we
                                                              did in mid-Minnesota. The same concerns from the small business
                                                              owners, the men and women who own a small business who are the
                                                              engine of our economy; right? So, I think this is an issue that we




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                                                              can tackle and there are so many nonpartisan or bipartisan issues
                                                              that we can work on in Congress and these are certainly many of
                                                              them. So, I want to thank each and every one of you for your time.
                                                                Chairman GOLDEN. Let me go and ask unanimous consent that
                                                              members have 5 legislative days to submit statements and sup-
                                                              porting materials for the record.
                                                                And without objection, so ordered.
                                                                Thank you very much. I appreciate it.
                                                                [Whereupon, at 14:08 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]




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                                                                                                       APPENDIX




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