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Made in the USA: How Main Street Is Revitalizing Domestic Manufacturing (House Small Business Committee hearing, November 20, 2025)

Summary

Transcript of a November 20, 2025 House Small Business Committee hearing, Small Business Committee Document Number 119-023, on small manufacturers and reshoring. Chairman Roger Williams and Ranking Member Nydia Velázquez opened. Witnesses were Charles Crain of the National Association of Manufacturers, Harry Moser of the Reshoring Initiative, Kurt Voss of The AmeriLux Family of Companies in De Pere, Wisconsin and Shirley Modlin of 3D Design and Manufacturing in Powhatan. Velázquez sent written questions to Crain, and the appendix adds a NEMA letter.

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“Made in the USA: How Main Street Is Revitalizing Domestic Manufacturing (House Small Business Committee hearing, November 20, 2025).” Original at www.govinfo.gov. Archived at Pandemic Darlings, https://pandemicdarlings.com/source-documents/made-in-the-usa-how-main-street-is-revitalizing-domestic-manufacturing-2fbc77304c/, SHA-256 acce10fe31696fddf7ed6c6e6eb33ec8c2dca747aa7ac4e03f45821b81b70b12.

Full text

                                                                          MADE IN THE USA: HOW MAIN STREET IS
                                                                          REVITALIZING DOMESTIC MANUFACTURING


                                                                                                      HEARING
                                                                                                             BEFORE THE


                                                                           COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
                                                                                  UNITED STATES
                                                                            HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
                                                                                    ONE HUNDRED NINETEENTH CONGRESS
                                                                                                           FIRST SESSION


                                                                                                        HEARING HELD
                                                                                                       NOVEMBER 20, 2025




                                                                                    Small Business Committee Document Number 119–023
                                                                                      Available via the GPO Website: www.govinfo.gov




                                                                                               U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
                                                                        62–203                             WASHINGTON : 2026




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                                                                                        HOUSE COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
                                                                                             ROGER WILLIAMS, Texas, Chairman
                                                                                                  PETE STAUBER, Minnesota
                                                                                                  DAN MEUSER, Pennsylvania
                                                                                                   BETH VAN DUYNE, Texas
                                                                                                      JAKE ELLZEY, Texas
                                                                                                    MARK ALFORD, Missouri
                                                                                                    NICK LALOTA, New York
                                                                                                  BRAD FINSTAD, Minnesota
                                                                                                     TONY WIED, Wisconsin
                                                                                               ROB BRESNAHAN, Pennsylvania
                                                                                                      BRIAN JACK, Georgia
                                                                                                  TROY DOWNING, Montana
                                                                                        KIMBERLYN KING-HINDS, Northern Marina Islands
                                                                                                   DEREK SCHMIDT, Kansas
                                                                                                   JIMMY PATRONIS, Florida
                                                                                         NYDIA VELÁZQUEZ, New York, Ranking Member
                                                                                               MORGAN MCGARVEY, Kentucky
                                                                                                HILLARY SCHOLTEN, Michigan
                                                                                               LAMONICA MCIVER, New Jersey
                                                                                                   GIL CISNEROS, California
                                                                                                KELLY MORRISON, Minnesota
                                                                                                GEORGE LATIMER, New York
                                                                                                    DEREK TRAN, California
                                                                                                 LATEEFAH SIMON, California
                                                                                               JOHNNY OLSZEWSKI, Maryland
                                                                                                 HERB CONAWAY, New Jersey
                                                                                            MAGGIE GOODLANDER, New Hampshire

                                                                                               LAUREN HOLMES, Majority Staff Director
                                                                                                MELISSA JUNG, Minority Staff Director




                                                                                                                      (II)




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                                                                                                                  CONTENTS
                                                                                                                OPENING STATEMENTS
                                                                                                                                                                                                   Page
                                                                  Hon. Roger Williams ................................................................................................               1
                                                                  Hon. Nydia Velázquez .............................................................................................                3

                                                                                                                           WITNESSES
                                                                  Mr. Charles Crain, Managing Vice President, Policy, National Association
                                                                   of Manufacturers, Washington, DC ....................................................................                             6
                                                                  Mr. Harry Moser, Founder & President, Reshoring Initiative, Sarasota, FL ....                                                      7
                                                                  Mr. Kurt Voss, Owner & Chief Executive Officer, The AmeriLux Family
                                                                   of Companies, De Pere, WI ..................................................................................                      9
                                                                  Ms. Shirley Modlin, Co-Owner, 3D Design and Manufacturing, Powhatan,
                                                                   VA ..........................................................................................................................    11

                                                                                                                            APPENDIX
                                                                  Prepared Statements:
                                                                      Mr. Charles Crain, Managing Vice President, Policy, National Association
                                                                        of Manufacturers, Washington, DC .............................................................                              46
                                                                      Mr. Harry Moser, Founder & President, Reshoring Initiative, Sarasota,
                                                                        FL ...................................................................................................................      59
                                                                      Mr. Kurt Voss, Owner & Chief Executive Officer, The AmeriLux Family
                                                                        of Companies, De Pere, WI ..........................................................................                        71
                                                                      Ms. Shirley Modlin, Co-Owner, 3D Design and Manufacturing, Powhatan,
                                                                        VA ...................................................................................................................      73
                                                                  Questions and Answers for the Record:
                                                                      Questions from Hon. Nydia Velázquez to Mr. Charles Crain and Re-
                                                                        sponses from Mr. Charles Crain ..................................................................                           75
                                                                  Additional Material for the Record:
                                                                      NEMA Letter ....................................................................................................              77




                                                                                                                                  (III)




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                                                                        MADE IN THE USA: HOW MAIN STREET IS
                                                                       REVITALIZING DOMESTIC MANUFACTURING

                                                                                           THURSDAY, NOVEMBER 20, 2025

                                                                                           HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,
                                                                                       COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS,
                                                                                                                       Washington, DC.
                                                                    The Committee met, pursuant to call, at 10:01 a.m., in Room
                                                                  2360, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Roger Williams [chair-
                                                                  man of the Committee] presiding.
                                                                    Present: Representatives Williams, Stauber, Meuser, Van Duyne,
                                                                  Alford, LaLota, Finstad, Wied, Bresnahan, Jack, Downing, King-
                                                                  Hinds, Schmidt, Patronis, Velázquez, McGarvey, Scholten,
                                                                  Cisneros, Morrison, Simon, Olszewski, and Conaway.
                                                                    Chairman WILLIAMS. I would like to welcome everybody to our
                                                                  hearing today, and a couple items before we actually get started.
                                                                    I first want to make aware to all the Members here you have an
                                                                  invitation on your desk right here for a Christmas reception for the
                                                                  Committee, December 11, and I hope everybody can come and book
                                                                  that, and we will have some fun with that.
                                                                    And then the other thing is we have a birthday in the house
                                                                  today, beautiful Nicholle.
                                                                    Where is Nicholle?
                                                                    Stand up, Nicholle.
                                                                    So I promised Nicholle I would sing her happy birthday.
                                                                    [Laughter.]
                                                                    If you all want to join in, it is fine. You ready?
                                                                    [Singing] This is your birthday song. It does not last too long.
                                                                  Hey.
                                                                    Happy birthday, Nicholle.
                                                                    All right. Good morning, everyone. And before we get started, I
                                                                  would like to—I will lead us in the pledge and the prayer. If you
                                                                  would stand, please.
                                                                    Heavenly Father, God of all people, thank you for allowing us to
                                                                  meet today and discuss things that will make life better not only
                                                                  for ourself but those in the future, and thank you for being able
                                                                  to represent the greatest country in the world, the United States
                                                                  of America. We love you and we strive to follow you in your life
                                                                  and not in your shadow. In your name, we pray. Amen.
                                                                    ALL. I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of
                                                                  America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, under
                                                                  God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
                                                                    Chairman WILLIAMS. I now call the Committee on Small Busi-
                                                                  ness to order, and without objection, the Chair is authorized to de-
                                                                  clare a recess of the Committee at any time.
                                                                                                                      (1)




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                                                                                                                      2

                                                                     I recognize myself for my opening statement.
                                                                     Welcome to today’s hearing titled, ‘‘Made in the USA: How Main
                                                                  Street is Revitalizing Domestic Manufacturing.’’
                                                                     I want to begin by thanking our witnesses for being here today.
                                                                     Across the country, made-in-the-USA businesses are driving local
                                                                  economic growth, strengthening domestic policy change, and revi-
                                                                  talizing communities. They build, innovate, and create good-paying
                                                                  jobs in every corner of this country.
                                                                     Domestic manufacturing is critical to our economic strength, na-
                                                                  tional security, and job creation. In the first quarter of 2025, the
                                                                  manufacturing sector alone added $2.9 trillion in value to our econ-
                                                                  omy and employed over 13 million Americans. Small manufactur-
                                                                  ers make up nearly three-quarters of the industry and are driving
                                                                  local innovation and resilience.
                                                                     Revitalizing and expanding U.S. manufacturing isn’t just an eco-
                                                                  nomic priority. It is a national imperative. That is why President
                                                                  Trump made bringing production back home a cornerstone of his
                                                                  economic agenda.
                                                                     And, earlier this year, I introduced H.R. 3174, the Made in
                                                                  America Manufacturing Finance Act. This legislation supports
                                                                  President Trump’s onshoring and reshoring efforts by increasing
                                                                  access to capital for America’s small manufacturers.
                                                                     By helping small businesses access the capital they need, they
                                                                  can modernize, expand, and compete effectively on a global scale.
                                                                     In addition, technology will continue to help these small busi-
                                                                  nesses modernize the industry, and advanced tools, such as auto-
                                                                  mation and AI, are essential for U.S. manufacturers to remain
                                                                  competitive and attract a new generation of the workforce.
                                                                     So, yet, small firms face regulatory burdens that cost small man-
                                                                  ufacturers nearly $50,000 per employee, which is twice as much as
                                                                  large manufacturers. Washington must cut red tape so Main Street
                                                                  America and main street manufacturers can successfully innovate
                                                                  and they can grow.
                                                                     All of this depends on a strong and skilled American workforce,
                                                                  and with 437,000 manufacturing job openings today and a pro-
                                                                  jected 3.8 million new positions by 2033, we must invest in the
                                                                  next generation of American manufacturing.
                                                                     Manufacturers need robust skills training, apprenticeships, and
                                                                  public-private partnerships to meet industry demand.
                                                                     Programs like the Department of Labor’s Registered Apprentice-
                                                                  ships and the SBA’s new partnerships with trade schools and work-
                                                                  force programs are helping to prepare the next generation of skilled
                                                                  workers to invest in America’s manufacturing future.
                                                                     This Committee is committed to supporting made-in-the-USA
                                                                  manufacturing by removing barriers to growth, strengthening sup-
                                                                  ply chains, and empowering the workforce. When American manu-
                                                                  facturers succeed, America succeeds.
                                                                     So I want to thank our witnesses today for coming and joining
                                                                  us today, and I look forward to our discussion on how main street
                                                                  is revitalizing American manufacturing. The future of Main Street
                                                                  America is made in the USA.
                                                                     So I now recognize our distinguished Ranking Member and my
                                                                  friend from New York, Ms. Velázquez, for her opening remarks.




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                                                                                                                      3

                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. Good morning, and thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                  I appreciate the Committee, and I want to thank all the witnesses
                                                                  for being here today.
                                                                     I appreciate the Committee focusing this hearing today on the
                                                                  state of manufacturing, an important role that small businesses
                                                                  play both in our national economy and our local communities.
                                                                     While manufacturing is incredibly important, so is farming and
                                                                  ranching. I hope we can hold a hearing on the administration’s de-
                                                                  cisions on this because, as the Small Business Committee, we owe
                                                                  it to the ranchers in this country to elevate the harm of this deci-
                                                                  sion.
                                                                     According to the SBA’s Office of Advocacy, the U.S. is home to
                                                                  over 600,000 small manufacturing firms. These small businesses
                                                                  create good-paying jobs, contribute over $277 billion annually to
                                                                  payrolls, and supply components and products that fuel American
                                                                  industry, from aerospace to healthcare.
                                                                     I look forward to hearing from the small businesses on our panel
                                                                  about their challenges and what we can do to ensure small manu-
                                                                  facturers remain competitive and innovative despite the difficult
                                                                  environment in which they operate.
                                                                     Unfortunately, we continue to see warning signs that policy deci-
                                                                  sions from the administration are making the environment more
                                                                  difficult for all U.S. manufacturers, not less. This is especially true
                                                                  for small businesses in this sector.
                                                                     Despite the administration’s claim of a manufacturing resurgence
                                                                  and booming economy, the manufacturing sector continues to de-
                                                                  cline.
                                                                     This morning, the Bureau of Labor Statistics released job data
                                                                  showing the U.S. lost an additional 6,000 manufacturing jobs in
                                                                  September. The revised August numbers show a total loss of 92,000
                                                                  manufacturing jobs over the past year, with nearly a third coming
                                                                  in the past months. These month-over-month decreases are a cause
                                                                  for great concern.
                                                                     I would also like to talk about the elephant in the room. While
                                                                  some may call tariffs short-term pain for long-term gain, history
                                                                  shows that small manufacturers and their employees are unlikely
                                                                  to see benefits even if—and it is a big ‘‘if’’—any so-called long-term
                                                                  gains are realized.
                                                                     The Office of Advocacy further points out that when the overall
                                                                  manufacturing sector began to recover from earlier losses in 2010
                                                                  and large manufacturers began to grow again, there was no equiva-
                                                                  lent rebound for small firms.
                                                                     Once manufacturing jobs are lost, it is the small firms that are
                                                                  unlikely to recover. That is why we must take a holistic approach
                                                                  to retaining small manufacturers and their workforces rather than
                                                                  implement whack-a-mole policies that do not account for the dis-
                                                                  proportionate and negative impacts on small businesses.
                                                                     This is most prevalent right now with tariffs. Chaotic tariff poli-
                                                                  cies continue to be a major pain for small firms.
                                                                     I also share the concerns of our panelists on the ability of small
                                                                  manufacturers to attract, compete for, and train a skilled work-
                                                                  force.
                                                                     Manufacturing is a highly competitive labor market. According to
                                                                  NAM, there were 409,000 manufacturing job openings in August of




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                                                                                                                      4

                                                                  this year, and the U.S. will face a shortfall of 1.9 million manufac-
                                                                  turing workers by 2033.
                                                                     Working for small businesses, especially for family-owned firms
                                                                  like 3D, has many advantages. To be frank, most small businesses
                                                                  cannot match the pay and benefits packages that large corporations
                                                                  offer.
                                                                     This puts small firms at a disadvantage when competing for tal-
                                                                  ent as all manufacturers seek to feel the current and looming
                                                                  shortfalls of skilled workers.
                                                                     Therefore, I look forward to hearing from the panel about these
                                                                  issues and additional ways we can help to create an environment
                                                                  that provides businesses with opportunities for success.
                                                                     Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
                                                                     And I will now introduce our witnesses.
                                                                     Our first witness here with us today is Mr. Charles Crain.
                                                                     Mr. Crain is the managing vice president of policy at the Na-
                                                                  tional Association of Manufacturers here in Washington, D.C. In
                                                                  this role, he leads the Association’s best-in-class team of policy ex-
                                                                  perts and advocates working to achieve legislative and regulatory
                                                                  outcomes that support the growth and success of manufacturers in
                                                                  America. Prior to this, Mr. Crain served as the Association’s vice
                                                                  president of domestic policy.
                                                                     Mr. Crain began his career on Capitol Hill working for Members
                                                                  of the House Committee on Financial Services and Senate Com-
                                                                  mittee on Finance. Mr. Crain received a bachelor of arts in political
                                                                  science from Mercer University, and that is—Toby the Bear is at
                                                                  Mercer, isn’t he?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. That is exactly right.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. Great.
                                                                     I want to thank you for being with us today.
                                                                     Our next witness here with us today is Mr. Harry Moser. Mr.
                                                                  Moser is the founder and president of Reshoring Initiative in Sara-
                                                                  sota, Florida. Mr. Moser founded the Reshoring Initiative in 2010
                                                                  to bring back American manufacturing and strengthen the nation’s
                                                                  skilled workforce. His efforts have earned national recognition for
                                                                  him, including an induction into the Industry Week Manufacturing
                                                                  Hall of Fame and honors from Quality Magazine, The Economist,
                                                                  and the Manufacturing Leadership Council.
                                                                     Before starting the Reshoring Initiative, he served in leadership
                                                                  roles at GF Machining Solutions, joining as president in 1985 and
                                                                  retiring as Chairman Emeritus in 2010.
                                                                     Mr. Moser holds a bachelor of science in mechanical engineering
                                                                  and a master of science in engineering from the Massachusetts In-
                                                                  stitute of Technology, as well as a master of business administra-
                                                                  tion from the University of Chicago.
                                                                     I am looking forward to having your testimony and having you
                                                                  here today, Mr. Moser. Thank you.
                                                                     I now recognize my colleague, Representative Wied from the
                                                                  great State of Wisconsin, to briefly introduce his constituent who
                                                                  is appearing before us today.
                                                                     Mr. Wied?
                                                                     Mr. WIED. Good morning, and thank you, Mr. Chairman.




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                                                                                                                      5

                                                                     Today, I have the privilege of introducing my constituent and
                                                                  friend, Kurt Voss.
                                                                     Mr. Voss is the owner and chief executive officer of AmeriLux
                                                                  Family of Companies, headquartered in my hometown of De Pere,
                                                                  Wisconsin.
                                                                     Mr. Voss founded AmeriLux over 20 years ago and has guided
                                                                  its growth from a small start-up in 2004 to a multicompany entity
                                                                  that includes manufacturing services, distribution, logistics, and
                                                                  warehousing services, and employing over 350 people.
                                                                     Earlier this year, AmeriLux International announced a partner-
                                                                  ship with Brett Martin, a company based in Ireland, to form Amer-
                                                                  ican Polycarbonate Company and to reshore polycarbonate manu-
                                                                  facturing right in northeastern Wisconsin.
                                                                     Outside of his work at AmeriLux, Mr. Voss serves on the board
                                                                  of directors for the Green Bay Packers and the board of trustees
                                                                  of St. Norbert College.
                                                                     As a member of the board of trustees, he helped lead the St. Nor-
                                                                  bert Church restoration project, which is now known as the Cas-
                                                                  sandra Voss Center in memory of his daughter.
                                                                     Entrepreneurs and great leaders like Mr. Voss are what make
                                                                  northeastern Wisconsin and the United States of America the
                                                                  greatest place in the world.
                                                                     Thank you for joining us today, Mr. Voss. I am looking forward
                                                                  to our important conversation.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back. I thank you
                                                                  for that nice introduction.
                                                                     I now recognize the Ranking Member from the great State of
                                                                  New York, Ms. Velázquez, to briefly introduce our last witness ap-
                                                                  pearing before us today.
                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     It is my pleasure to introduce our witness today, Ms. Shirley
                                                                  Modlin.
                                                                     Ms. Modlin is the co-owner of 3D Design and Manufacturing, a
                                                                  family-owned business in Powhatan, Virginia. She studied manage-
                                                                  ment and accounting before launching 3D Design and Manufac-
                                                                  turing, starting the firm with her husband, David, in 2005.
                                                                     For 20 years, 3D has applied both mechanical engineering design
                                                                  services and manufacturing engineering design services. 3D Design
                                                                  employs 15 skilled engineers, mechanical technicians, and electrical
                                                                  specialists.
                                                                     They work frequently with large corporations, supplying their
                                                                  high-quality products to the beverage, pharmaceutical, automotive,
                                                                  and space technology industries.
                                                                     3D is a longtime Member of Small Business Majority and a
                                                                  strong and vocal advocate on behalf of small business manufactur-
                                                                  ers.
                                                                     Thank you for being with us this morning.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
                                                                     And before recognizing the witnesses, we will go over the ground
                                                                  rules here.
                                                                     I would like to remind them that their oral testimony is re-
                                                                  stricted to 5 minutes in length. You have got a clock in front of you,
                                                                  so watch that.




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                                                                                                                      6

                                                                    If you begin to go over, you will hear this. [Chairman Williams
                                                                  bangs gavel.] And that means to wind it down. If you see the light
                                                                  turn red in front of you, it means your 5 minutes has concluded
                                                                  and you should wrap up your testimony.
                                                                    So with that in mind, I now recognize Mr. Crain for his 5-minute
                                                                  opening remarks.
                                                                  STATEMENTS OF MR. CHARLES CRAIN, MANAGING VICE
                                                                   PRESIDENT, POLICY, NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF MANUFAC-
                                                                   TURERS; MR. HARRY MOSER, FOUNDER AND PRESIDENT,
                                                                   RESHORING INITIATIVE; MR. KURT VOSS, OWNER AND
                                                                   CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, THE AMERILUX FAMILY OF
                                                                   COMPANIES; AND MS. SHIRLEY MODLIN, CO-OWNER, 3D DE-
                                                                   SIGN AND MANUFACTURING

                                                                                          STATEMENT OF CHARLES CRAIN
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Good morning, Chairman Williams, Ranking Mem-
                                                                  ber Velázquez, and Members of the Committee. My name is
                                                                  Charles Crain, and I am the managing vice president of policy at
                                                                  the National Association of Manufacturers.
                                                                     Manufacturing is a powerhouse for American prosperity. If U.S.
                                                                  manufacturing were its own nation, it would be the eighth-largest
                                                                  economy in the entire world, and that economy would be prin-
                                                                  cipally driven by small businesses, which make up 98 percent of
                                                                  our industry.
                                                                     These are start-ups with new and innovative business models
                                                                  disrupting markets, and they are family-owned businesses passed
                                                                  down through the generations as pillars of their communities.
                                                                     The most important investment that Congress can make in these
                                                                  small businesses is smart public policy, policy that lowers the cost
                                                                  of doing business in the United States, policy that creates the cer-
                                                                  tainty that manufacturers need to invest millions of dollars in dec-
                                                                  ades-long projects, policy that puts more people to work, puts more
                                                                  shovels in the ground, and that strengthens our nation’s hand on
                                                                  the world stage.
                                                                     Congress has already taken a historic step in that direction with
                                                                  a pro-growth tax bill that incentivizes and supports manufacturing
                                                                  investment.
                                                                     By reinforcing and making permanent the 2017 tax reform that
                                                                  led to record job creation and wage growth and capital investment
                                                                  across our industry, H.R. 1 strengthened America’s leadership as a
                                                                  manufacturing superpower—and it saved 6 million American jobs.
                                                                     Now, more must be done to unlock the benefits of this historic
                                                                  and transformative achievement.
                                                                     This Committee has already approved the Made in America
                                                                  Manufacturing Finance Act to ensure that the SBA’s loan programs
                                                                  are working as well as possible for small manufacturers who need
                                                                  capital to grow here at home.
                                                                     This bill is a great example of how Congress and the administra-
                                                                  tion can pursue what we have called a comprehensive manufac-
                                                                  turing strategy.
                                                                     That means rebalancing unworkable regulations and reforming
                                                                  America’s broken permitting process; it means investing in our na-
                                                                  tion’s infrastructure and supporting American energy dominance; it




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                                                                                                                      7

                                                                  means providing trade certainty that empowers manufacturers to
                                                                  make things in America; and it means investing in the manufac-
                                                                  turing workforce of the future.
                                                                     We need all of these policies to build on the success of tax re-
                                                                  form, to unlock small manufacturing growth, and to drive a true
                                                                  manufacturing renaissance.
                                                                     Let’s start with permitting reform.
                                                                     We cannot become the best place in the world to build things if
                                                                  it takes us 80 percent longer to permit projects here in the U.S. as
                                                                  compared to other advanced economies.
                                                                     Unclear timelines, overlapping statutes, excessive litigation—
                                                                  these all raise costs for manufacturers or they halt manufacturing
                                                                  projects entirely.
                                                                     Another roadblock to getting shovels in the ground is the burden
                                                                  of federal regulation. Small manufacturers spend, on average,
                                                                  $50,000 per employee every single year just on compliance.
                                                                     This administration has already made tremendous progress in
                                                                  rightsizing the federal regulatory environment, meaning that more
                                                                  projects will get off the ground, not get stuck in quicksand.
                                                                     We also need both energy dominance and trade certainty to fur-
                                                                  ther unlock manufacturing investment. An all-of-the-above energy
                                                                  strategy that harnesses America’s abundant natural resources can
                                                                  power manufacturing into the future, while smart trade policy can
                                                                  ensure that we have the inputs and the machinery that we need
                                                                  to make things here at home as well as the export markets to sell
                                                                  things around the world.
                                                                     Finally, for these investments to take root, we need a highly
                                                                  skilled manufacturing workforce. With 400,000 jobs open across the
                                                                  sector, manufacturers are committed to upskilling and training pro-
                                                                  grams, and we need policymakers to deliver workforce and immi-
                                                                  gration policy solutions to help us fill jobs with the skilled workers
                                                                  that we need.
                                                                     This is the road to a manufacturing renaissance. It runs through
                                                                  a comprehensive manufacturing strategy, ensuring that all parts of
                                                                  the federal government are rowing in the same direction—toward
                                                                  an empowered, emboldened, exceptional manufacturing industry.
                                                                     Backed by the right policy choices, small manufacturers will de-
                                                                  liver—for our communities, for our country, and for our pre-
                                                                  eminence on the world stage—because when manufacturing wins,
                                                                  America wins.
                                                                     Thank you.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you.
                                                                     And I now recognize Mr. Moser for his 5-minute opening re-
                                                                  marks.
                                                                                           STATEMENT OF HARRY MOSER
                                                                    Mr. MOSER. Thank you, Chairman Williams, Ranking Member
                                                                  Velázquez, and the Members of the Committee. I am honored to be
                                                                  here. I am Harry Moser, the founder and president of the Re-
                                                                  shoring Initiative.
                                                                    So I would first like to summarize what has been happening.
                                                                  Manufacturing reshoring plus FDI, foreign direct investment jobs,
                                                                  we track them, and they increased from about 11,000 in 2010 to
                                                                  240,000 per year last year.




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                                                                    It is an annual rate. So compounded 25 percent per year. So it
                                                                  has been a very aggressive, successful trend.
                                                                    About 50 percent of the jobs that come back are in small busi-
                                                                  ness. So the major way through reshoring to bring jobs to small
                                                                  business is for big companies to reshore, decide to produce products
                                                                  here, source the components, the tooling, et cetera, from the small
                                                                  businesses.
                                                                    More effective industrial policy—something like what Charles
                                                                  recommended—can dramatically increase that rate of reshoring
                                                                  and FDI—perhaps double it—and if we did that, we could by, say,
                                                                  2040, increase U.S. manufacturing by about 40 percent, eliminating
                                                                  the goods trade deficit. That is our mission.
                                                                    A little background. The big companies make the reshoring deci-
                                                                  sions. There are certainly some small companies that import
                                                                  things, but it is basically the big companies that do most of the im-
                                                                  porting. They can make the reshoring decisions, and then the work
                                                                  goes to the small companies. So it is essential to convince those big
                                                                  companies to reshore and then feed the market.
                                                                    An excellent example of this—a company I know well—is GE Ap-
                                                                  pliances, headquartered in Louisville, Kentucky. They have been
                                                                  consistently reshoring and investing here, and they were the co-re-
                                                                  cipient of the 2025 National Metalworking Reshoring Award.
                                                                    They have done a great job. They have invested—their current
                                                                  announcements come to a total of about $6.5 billion dollars in in-
                                                                  vestments, primarily for reshoring, primarily coming back from
                                                                  Mexico and China.
                                                                    And as a result of that, they now have relationships with about
                                                                  6,500 U.S. suppliers—mostly small companies, the kind of compa-
                                                                  nies we are concerned about—across all States, and they buy about
                                                                  $4.6 billion in materials, components, and services each year from
                                                                  those companies.
                                                                    My perspective is feed the big—help the big companies reshore,
                                                                  the small companies will win.
                                                                    The root causes of reshoring are essential to understand. In
                                                                  2025, we surveyed the big and the small companies and asked
                                                                  them why they offshored and why they now reshore, and the big-
                                                                  gest barrier is price.
                                                                    The U.S. price, the manufacturing cost of making something
                                                                  here, is 10 to 20 percent higher than in most developed countries,
                                                                  and 50 percent higher, 60 percent higher than in countries like
                                                                  China, and unless we overcome that differential, companies will al-
                                                                  ways be attracted to source their components offshore.
                                                                    That price, that cost differential, is primarily driven by a U.S.
                                                                  dollar that is consistently 20 percent or more overvalued, making
                                                                  our cost higher expressed in common currency.
                                                                    The trend in 2025 started out well, softened a little bit in April
                                                                  with Liberation Day, recovered, and we project the total of re-
                                                                  shoring and FDI to be about 10 percent lower this year than last
                                                                  year but still about 220,000 jobs announced. So still a good year for
                                                                  the trend.
                                                                    We believe that one of the keys to reshoring is utilization of total
                                                                  cost of ownership. We have companies who are starting to recog-
                                                                  nize all the costs and risks associated with offshoring, and when




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                                                                  they do that, they find out that much of what they now import they
                                                                  can reshore without government subsidies, et cetera.
                                                                     For example, comparing 190 cases of China versus the U.S., the
                                                                  U.S. win rate goes from 8 percent based on price to 32 percent
                                                                  based on total cost to 46 percent if there is also a 15 percent tariff
                                                                  on the product.
                                                                     So getting companies to do that, to use those methodologies, is
                                                                  the simplest, least expensive way to achieve what we want.
                                                                     Some things that the U.S. Government and State and local gov-
                                                                  ernments can do.
                                                                     The Department of Labor still pushes college for all rather than
                                                                  a good career for everyone. And they have charts that talk about
                                                                  university education pays a million dollars more lifetime income
                                                                  than a high school graduate.
                                                                     And if they would change that to include the income of appren-
                                                                  tices, apprentice graduates, then the parents and the guidance
                                                                  counselors would see that that kind of career is feasible.
                                                                     Thank you.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Voss for his 5-minute opening remarks.
                                                                                               STATEMENT OF KURT VOSS
                                                                    Mr. VOSS. Hi, everyone. Thanks for inviting me to testify. I ap-
                                                                  preciate you soliciting feedback from those of us that are in the
                                                                  trenches with an eye towards finding additional ways the govern-
                                                                  ment can support, encourage, and enhance the success of small
                                                                  business.
                                                                    We all know the positive impact that a healthy small business
                                                                  community can have on our society, and part of that health in-
                                                                  cludes creating an environment that encourages all of us to chase
                                                                  our potential.
                                                                    I assume you have read my submissions, but my story involves
                                                                  a hyper-optimistic and hyper-entrepreneurial guy—me—with a
                                                                  young family, quitting a very good job and deciding to take a shot
                                                                  at starting a business in 2004.
                                                                    Twenty-one years later, our enterprise, the AmeriLux Family of
                                                                  Companies, employs over 350 people and serves markets through-
                                                                  out the United States and Canada.
                                                                    For perspective, the data tells us that, of all the businesses that
                                                                  were started in 2004, only 20 percent of them are in business
                                                                  today. We feel very blessed to be one of that 20 percent.
                                                                    So you have an idea what frames my mindset, we have 10 cul-
                                                                  ture statements which guide and inform how we run our business.
                                                                  They were part of the submission to you. We wrote them not to be
                                                                  in Harvard business speak, but we wrote them in what we call
                                                                  AmeriLux speak.
                                                                    One of them is, quote, ‘‘Is this a great country or what!?’’ The
                                                                  statement describes an intentionality around creating a culture of
                                                                  optimism and positivity, as optimistic and positive teams produce
                                                                  greater results than negative and pessimistic teams.
                                                                    If the business book said that to be successful you needed to be
                                                                  negative and pessimistic, I would probably be one that would try
                                                                  to beat the odds. But, thankfully, I don’t have to because it is good
                                                                  business to be positive and optimistic.




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                                                                     The other part of the meaning of this culture statement for us
                                                                  refers to this country that we have been fortunate enough to be
                                                                  born in. I don’t believe the AmeriLux story could have been writ-
                                                                  ten—at least in its current form—in any other country.
                                                                     This country is exceptional, meaning it is the exception. Our
                                                                  rights come from God, and our government is created to protect
                                                                  those rights.
                                                                     Our free enterprise system is an extension of those individual
                                                                  rights. In every other country in the world, rights come from the
                                                                  government, and those rights can be taken away or granted based
                                                                  on government edicts.
                                                                     So while this country is far from perfect, we have been on a con-
                                                                  tinuous improvement journey for about 250 years. We operate from
                                                                  the premise that the glass is 80 percent full, and our focus is to
                                                                  help it get to 81 percent and more. So we don’t spend our time with
                                                                  a hyper-focus on the 20 percent that is empty.
                                                                     In my submission, I articulated a few items that I feel this Com-
                                                                  mittee should focus on which could significantly improve things
                                                                  within the small business community.
                                                                     To be clear, we don’t assume a victim mentality when facing
                                                                  challenges or look to the government to solve all of our problems.
                                                                  I suggest a focus on the following, and I can certainly give you my
                                                                  two cents related to these issues.
                                                                     I mentioned the easing of banking regulations and compliance
                                                                  costs for small banks to allow them to better serve their customers.
                                                                     Obviously, capital formation is critical in the starting and the
                                                                  growing of businesses.
                                                                     The cost of healthcare continues to escalate, and the current
                                                                  structure is broken. Real reform needs to take place, enabling em-
                                                                  ployers and employees to obtain affordable care and for them to be-
                                                                  come better educated consumers of medical services. We don’t need
                                                                  more insurance reform. We need healthcare reform.
                                                                     Also, I am acutely aware of the importance that small business
                                                                  plays in providing for societal needs. The capital derived from suc-
                                                                  cessful small businesses benefits this country and its citizens in a
                                                                  variety of ways. It is literally the engine that runs this country.
                                                                     In many ways, this is underpublicized, and I encourage this
                                                                  Committee to use its influence to magnify that point.
                                                                     And, finally, in my submission, I mentioned the current situation
                                                                  with our newest, recently formed company, American
                                                                  Polycarbonate Company. It is a joint venture with a company in
                                                                  Ireland called Brett Martin.
                                                                     We literally unplug manufacturing equipment that was being
                                                                  utilized in Ireland and reshore that equipment to De Pere, Wis-
                                                                  consin, a suburb of Green Bay. This equipment cannot be procured
                                                                  in the United States.
                                                                     Now, I fully support the tariff strategy which has had other posi-
                                                                  tive effects on our businesses. I also understand that, with all sig-
                                                                  nificant positive policy changes, there will be some unintended con-
                                                                  sequences. But subjecting financial penalties like tariffs on equip-
                                                                  ment needed to reshore manufacturing to the United States obvi-
                                                                  ously doesn’t make sense and should be corrected.
                                                                     So thanks again for having me, and I look forward to your ques-
                                                                  tions.




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                                                                   Chairman WILLIAMS. I now recognize Ms. Modlin for her 5-
                                                                  minute opening remarks.

                                                                                         STATEMENT OF SHIRLEY MODLIN
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and Ranking Member
                                                                  Velázquez and the Members of the Committee. Thank you for this
                                                                  opportunity to speak today.
                                                                     I am the owner of 3D Design and Manufacturing located in Pow-
                                                                  hatan, Virginia, and I also am a Member of the Small Business
                                                                  Majority. I have been for a number of years.
                                                                     3D Design and Manufacturing provides manufacturing engineer-
                                                                  ing, design services, and, obviously, engineering design services.
                                                                  We work with large corporations in the beverage, pharmaceutical,
                                                                  automotive, and space technology industries.
                                                                     I want to emphasize the small manufacturers being a critical
                                                                  part of America’s economy. Large corporations rely on the small
                                                                  businesses like mine to solve a lot of their problems.
                                                                     For example, when an assembly line at a large business breaks
                                                                  down, they will call us, and we will go out very quickly, diagnose
                                                                  the problem, make the repairment part, and actually go back and
                                                                  repair the machinery and equipment.
                                                                     This happens very quickly to keep these lines moving in these
                                                                  large corporations in these big plants. So I appreciate the oppor-
                                                                  tunity here to bring this to your desk.
                                                                     The importance of the small business in domestic manufacturing
                                                                  is essential. I do tell you that small business is struggling under
                                                                  the current economic conditions.
                                                                     We have been—3D Design and Manufacturing has been in busi-
                                                                  ness since 2005, and we have never experienced such turmoil. This
                                                                  is largely due, unfortunately, to the tariffs.
                                                                     Our products are made in America, but we rely on aluminum,
                                                                  steel, and alloys, which are imported from Canada and Mexico.
                                                                     In addition to the bottom line hit, tariffs create this uncertainty.
                                                                  So that is that I never know what tomorrow will hold. A 25 percent
                                                                  tariff, a 50 percent tariff, no tariff, a tariff on aluminum, tariff on
                                                                  steel, uncertain. It is very difficult in this environment to set prices
                                                                  for my customers. And this hurts. This hurts the small business.
                                                                     While we are being battered about, we can’t do that to our cus-
                                                                  tomers. We quote our jobs and we hold our prices for at least 5
                                                                  days. If in that 5-day period prices rise, we are going to take that
                                                                  hit. We can’t pass that on to our customers because we are in a
                                                                  highly competitive industry as a small manufacturer, and these
                                                                  customers could take their business elsewhere.
                                                                     So tariffs are an essential challenge also in finding employees—
                                                                  after the tariffs, rather. One of our challenges is finding employees
                                                                  because small manufacturers have to rely on a skilled workforce.
                                                                  They have to hit the floor and be able to work. And there is a tre-
                                                                  mendous shortage of these workers in manufacturing.
                                                                     It takes a minimum of a month to 3 months to see that employee
                                                                  put on the floor and begin to succeed in what they are being asked
                                                                  and expected to do.
                                                                     We invest a great deal of money in training that employee, and,
                                                                  unfortunately, once the employee gets onto the floor, sometimes




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                                                                  they don’t work out. Sometimes they are not able to cut the mus-
                                                                  tard, if you will.
                                                                     So this shortage of workforce in our small manufacturing com-
                                                                  munity is essential. Our 30-year veterans are retiring, and we do
                                                                  not have that up-and-coming skilled workforce to take their place.
                                                                  This is very, very important.
                                                                     So to recruit positions for what we need, it is not easy. They have
                                                                  to have a great deal of training and experience. And unlike the
                                                                  large corporations, they have these employees more ready to go on
                                                                  the floor.
                                                                     We find ourselves challenged to hire because we are competing
                                                                  against large corporations who offer the big, robust packages and
                                                                  benefits.
                                                                     So I suggest that we have some interest here to ask Congress to
                                                                  assist by exempting small businesses, not just industries, but ex-
                                                                  empting from tariffs.
                                                                     I am going to close by suggesting that we also—if small manufac-
                                                                  turing can continue to exceed and grow in the workforce, if Con-
                                                                  gress will take a look at this small community and invest——
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady’s time is up. Thank you
                                                                  for that.
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. Thank you very much.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. You all did great. This is going to be a
                                                                  good hearing.
                                                                     I will say this. Every now and then, you will see some people
                                                                  move in and out, go out doors. You haven’t made anybody mad. It
                                                                  is just we have got a lot of people and a lot of Committee hearings
                                                                  going on today, so that will happen.
                                                                     I now recognize myself for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. Crain, your organization has highlighted how excessive fed-
                                                                  eral regulations stifle small manufacturers.
                                                                     Can you discuss how reducing red tape would directly improve
                                                                  the competitiveness of small and medium-size manufacturers na-
                                                                  tionwide?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Absolutely. Thank you for that question, Mr. Chair-
                                                                  man.
                                                                     As you mentioned in your opening remarks, small manufacturers
                                                                  bear the brunt of the federal regulatory burden that our industry
                                                                  faces. As an industry writ large, we face about $350 billion every
                                                                  year in federal regulatory cost. For small manufacturers, it is about
                                                                  $50,000 per employee per year.
                                                                     We don’t always have in-house—I am sure the small manufactur-
                                                                  ers on the panel can speak to this—in-house counsel, in-house ac-
                                                                  countants to comply with those burdens, so you have got to hire out
                                                                  expensive consultants, and those are resources that are diverted
                                                                  from more productive uses: growing your business, investing in
                                                                  R&D, hiring new people, purchasing capital equipment.
                                                                     These are the pro-growth activities that drive the industry, and
                                                                  so dollars diverted from those to regulatory burdens that don’t real-
                                                                  ly work for small manufacturers anyway is really wasted cost.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you.
                                                                     Mr. Moser, the 2025 Reshoring Survey reveals that 30 percent of
                                                                  regional equipment manufacturers have reshored or are working to
                                                                  reshore their operation in the last 10 years, and 43 percent of con-




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                                                                  tract manufacturers have reshored or are actively reshoring for
                                                                  their customers, and you touched a little bit on that.
                                                                     What are the benefits of reshoring to the United States for man-
                                                                  ufacturers and for the U.S. economy as a whole?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. Thanks for asking.
                                                                     For the country, it is very obvious. It is more jobs. It is less in-
                                                                  come inequality. It is better, a smaller budget deficit. It is defense
                                                                  preparedness. Almost everything that should be on our priority list
                                                                  is achieved by reshoring.
                                                                     For the companies, it is quicker delivery. It is the benefit of hav-
                                                                  ing engineering and manufacturing close to each other, able to
                                                                  speak in the same language, and optimize both the design of the
                                                                  product and the process for making the product.
                                                                     It is delivery. The survey showed that U.S. manufacturers were
                                                                  willing to pay 10 to—many of them were willing to pay 10 to 20
                                                                  percent more for a 1-week delivery instead of a 6-week delivery. So
                                                                  if you make it here, you bring some extra value to your customer.
                                                                     I have got a much longer list than that, but those are the pri-
                                                                  mary benefits.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you.
                                                                     Mr. Voss, what barriers do small manufacturers like AmeriLux
                                                                  face when trying to adopt automation and advanced manufacturing
                                                                  tools?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. By the way, I would add one thing to reshoring. That
                                                                  is just having control of your future. As organizations are looking
                                                                  to build sustainable companies, you want to be able to control your
                                                                  future, and reshoring certainly does that and was primary in my
                                                                  mind of doing that.
                                                                     As it relates to your question, Mr. Williams, I think it is edu-
                                                                  cation more than anything, not only for the workforce, but for us.
                                                                  I think we are all learning how we can use that automation and
                                                                  AI, et cetera. And a lot of us are taking fast-track courses through
                                                                  various sources to be able to do that and stay ahead.
                                                                     At the end of the day, we are all in a competitive world and a
                                                                  competitive environment, and it is no different than being out in
                                                                  the woods with 10 of your friends and a bear shows up. You have
                                                                  got to make sure you can run faster than a couple of your friends.
                                                                  Well, it is the same thing in business. And I hope that responds
                                                                  to your question.
                                                                     But we are going to have to do that if we are going to remain
                                                                  competitive for sure.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you.
                                                                     Last question.
                                                                     Mr. Crain, small manufacturers are key to modernizing Amer-
                                                                  ican manufacturing. So what are you hearing from NAM members
                                                                  about workforce development opportunities and to ensure that they
                                                                  can train and retain talent for the next generation of manufactur-
                                                                  ers?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Having skilled workers is absolutely an imperative
                                                                  for manufacturers, and, specifically, we need manufacturing skilled
                                                                  workers to fill the 400,000 open jobs that we have. These are ma-
                                                                  chinists, they are technicians, they are welders, they are elec-
                                                                  tricians that make our factory floors run.




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                                                                     And so the manufacturing industry has invested heavily in train-
                                                                  ing and upskilling programs to ensure that we can meet that work-
                                                                  force need.
                                                                     What we need from federal policymakers is to do their part: to
                                                                  ensure that our companies have the resources to offer those pro-
                                                                  grams, to ensure that federal agencies are supporting programs, to
                                                                  do education efforts as low as middle and high school to talk about
                                                                  the promise of a manufacturing career.
                                                                     There is so much to be done on the domestic workforce side and
                                                                  on the immigration side to ensure that we have workers and that
                                                                  we have skilled workers for the manufacturing industry of the fu-
                                                                  ture.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. All right. My time is up. And I now recog-
                                                                  nize the Ranking Member for 5 minutes of questions.
                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     Ms. Modlin, in your testimony you state that the workforce short-
                                                                  age is urgent and will only worsen in the coming years. The Na-
                                                                  tional Association of Manufacturers has also referenced this struc-
                                                                  tural workforce deficit, citing the need for almost 2 million more
                                                                  employees over the next decade.
                                                                     What could happen to small manufacturers if we do not properly
                                                                  invest in workforce development?
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. Thank you, Ranking Member Velázquez.
                                                                     If we do not have a workforce in small manufacturing—remem-
                                                                  bering that we do not have the resources to train on the floor. They
                                                                  need to come to the small manufacturer ready to hit the floor with
                                                                  a minimal amount of training to move forward.
                                                                     If we do not prepare our workforce and encourage our younger
                                                                  generation to come out of the technical and community colleges and
                                                                  come into the smaller manufacturing environment, we are going to
                                                                  be at a deficit.
                                                                     Small manufacturers support the large plants, the large corpora-
                                                                  tions. And so it is going to be a fallout if we do not have that work-
                                                                  force prepared, we are going to—the small manufacturers are going
                                                                  to suffer, which is going to fall down—flow down, if you will—to the
                                                                  large corporations that we support.
                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. Thank you.
                                                                     We hear from small businesses that the President’s tariff policies
                                                                  are harmful in and of themselves, but also that the uncertainty
                                                                  and unpredictability are causing as much harm.
                                                                     Can you please briefly speak to the impact of tariffs on your busi-
                                                                  ness?
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. Yes.
                                                                     Unfortunately, tariffs do create—especially today in this environ-
                                                                  ment—this unpredictability. So as I prepare for the next year, I am
                                                                  uncertain what I need to do, where my revenue needs to go, what
                                                                  my costs are going to be.
                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. Thank you.
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. That is the bottom line.
                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. After the tariff costs were passed on to you
                                                                  and your prices went up, have you seen any of those costs go back
                                                                  down as deals have been announced by the White House?
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. No. They do not go down. Prices do not go down.




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                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. Ms. Modlin, this Committee passed legislation
                                                                  to raise the SBA’s loan guarantee limit from 5 million to 10 million
                                                                  for small manufacturers. How would that impact your firm?
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. Unfortunately, it wouldn’t impact me. I couldn’t
                                                                  take on that level of debt, especially in this economy, especially
                                                                  with this uncertainty.
                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. Okay.
                                                                     Mr. Crain, one of the aspects that you mentioned was immigra-
                                                                  tion. What aspects of immigration were you referring to?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Thank you for that question, Madam Ranking Mem-
                                                                  ber.
                                                                     As I said earlier, manufacturers need skilled talent to fill the
                                                                  open jobs that we have that both you and the Chairman have ref-
                                                                  erenced.
                                                                     When we think about immigration, we think about
                                                                  supplementing the domestic workforce. We are invested in training
                                                                  and reskilling that workforce, but we do still have open jobs despite
                                                                  those efforts.
                                                                     And so having foreign-born workers both at the sort of what is
                                                                  called high-skilled level of scientists and engineers to design pro-
                                                                  grams and design products but also with the manufacturing skilled
                                                                  talent coming out of career and technical education systems that
                                                                  are machinists and technicians and electricians, we think there is
                                                                  a role for immigration policy to play as we continue as an industry
                                                                  to invest in the domestic workforce.
                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. Well, I guess that the administration is failing
                                                                  in that respect because they are unwilling to deal with immigration
                                                                  policy, and, of course, that will have a direct impact not only on
                                                                  manufacturers but also farming and other aspects of our economy.
                                                                     Mr. Voss, in your testimony you show that tariffs are having a
                                                                  counterproductive effect. These financial penalties are making your
                                                                  previous plan to reshore domestic manufacturing more costly and
                                                                  difficult. Seventy-four percent of manufacturing firms have fewer
                                                                  than 20 employees.
                                                                     How can smaller companies deal with such dramatic cost in-
                                                                  creases if even larger small businesses are challenged in their
                                                                  onshoring attempts?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Well, to be balanced, I said that there were also many
                                                                  positive consequences of the tariffs. We have had customers who
                                                                  have—their businesses have expanded as a result of the foreign
                                                                  competition being tariffed. Our prices actually have not gone up for
                                                                  the things that we bring in from overseas because the manufactur-
                                                                  ers overseas have largely ate those increases or the cost of the tar-
                                                                  iff.
                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. Interesting.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. All I would say is that we are all in competitive busi-
                                                                  nesses. We have to find ways to compete. Uncertainty is all around
                                                                  us. Unpredictability is all around us.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady’s time is up.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. It is called being in business.
                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. It is around us every single day.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Yes.
                                                                     Ms. VELÁZQUEZ. Yeah.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.




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                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Meuser from the great State of Pennsylvania
                                                                  for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Thank you, Chairman, very, very much.
                                                                     And thanks to our witnesses. We appreciate you making the trip
                                                                  and being here.
                                                                     It is certainly a very important subject. Most of us up here are
                                                                  former small business or large business owners, and we are here
                                                                  to support you and hear from you today what we can best do to
                                                                  accomplish that.
                                                                     We spend a lot of time talking to small businesses, so it is re-
                                                                  freshing just to hear your thoughtful remarks and truly what you
                                                                  would like to see. If you were sitting in our seats, what would you
                                                                  do to assist small business.
                                                                     So, Mr. Voss, I will start with you. Impressive company. Con-
                                                                  gratulations.
                                                                     The tax bill that recently passed—bonus depreciation, 199A, and
                                                                  such—how important was that?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Exceptionally important.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Okay.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. And, in fact, just to put it in perspective for the last
                                                                  question, the costs associated with the imperfection, I will say, in
                                                                  the tariff of actually tariffing reshoring equipment was more than
                                                                  offset by the tax implications and tax savings, which allows us to
                                                                  pour more money into our business.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Okay.
                                                                     Do you work with the SBA at all at your size company?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. I have not, no.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Okay.
                                                                     And from reshoring perspective, what are you seeing—what are
                                                                  you seeing—well, I guess this question would better go to Mr.
                                                                  Moser.
                                                                     What would you like to see us do? From the regulatory front, the
                                                                  tax end of things is largely accomplished. Workforce? Litigious na-
                                                                  ture of things? Healthcare? What is weighing on you most? What
                                                                  do you think is best——
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Are you asking me or Mr. Moser?
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. I am asking you, Mr. Voss.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Okay. Well, how much time do you have? I mean, you
                                                                  have a long list——
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. We can start with healthcare. Let’s start with
                                                                  healthcare.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. You have a long list of big questions.
                                                                     So healthcare is—in my opinion, we need to become better edu-
                                                                  cated consumers of healthcare, period. And a lot of the reforms
                                                                  have been around insurance and how that works, and we need to
                                                                  first of all as a country understand that we are all in this together.
                                                                     This isn’t only on the backs of small businesses or big businesses
                                                                  to provide healthcare for their employees. The employees have to
                                                                  participate, too, And the best way they can do that is to become
                                                                  educated consumers.
                                                                     And if we can push that, and then, frankly, put it in the hands
                                                                  of small business and big business instead of bureaucrats, I think
                                                                  we would come up with a solution.




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                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. And I think employer-based healthcare is so very
                                                                  important. At my former company, it worked out really well.
                                                                     Are you familiar with association health plans?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Uh-huh.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Okay. So that is something as well we are going
                                                                  to hope to put in our healthcare plans.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. We have gone through the whole gamut, continuing
                                                                  to try to stay ahead of the curve and come up with new ideas. And,
                                                                  currently, we are self-insured with a $100,000 deductible plan. But
                                                                  we are at the mercy of medical claims, and we constantly are edu-
                                                                  cating ourselves on how we can keep those claims down by being
                                                                  better consumers of that medical care.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Okay. Thank you.
                                                                     Mr. Crain, from your more macro perspective of National Asso-
                                                                  ciation of Manufacturers, is manufacturing growing? Are we re-
                                                                  shoring? Are we expanding? And is there a particular sector that
                                                                  seems to be more so than others?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. It is a great question, Congressman. I will go back
                                                                  to what you said in your previous question, is that the tax bill real-
                                                                  ly laid the foundation for exactly the types of onshoring, reshoring,
                                                                  and domestic growth that we want to see across the industry, and
                                                                  we have seen benefits from that tax bill from the smallest of small
                                                                  business all the way up the supply chain.
                                                                     Given the incentives that you all put in that law for research in-
                                                                  vestment, for capital equipment investment, for new factory con-
                                                                  struction, that is driving capital investment. It is driving wage
                                                                  growth. It is driving job creation. That is what we saw back in
                                                                  2017, 2018. That is what we are already seeing now early signs of.
                                                                     Shortly after the tax bill passed, our quarterly outlook survey,
                                                                  the optimism of the manufacturing industry jumped 10 points just
                                                                  immediately following the tax survey—excuse me, following the tax
                                                                  bill. And so we expect that to continue to manifest in additional in-
                                                                  vestment across the sector.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Sure. Taxes. Regulatory reform. Workforce. What
                                                                  about interest rates?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Absolutely. The cost of capital continues to be a sig-
                                                                  nificant burden for manufacturers given inflation and rising inter-
                                                                  est rates.
                                                                     So anything that the Congress can do and the administration
                                                                  writ large to reduce the cost of capital. We already talked about the
                                                                  SBA legislation that you all have already approved. That continues
                                                                  to be an issue for manufacturing.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Probably the best way of bringing down inflation
                                                                  is for supply to exceed demand, right? The consumer purchasing is
                                                                  there. We need to increase the supply side.
                                                                     Mr. Moser, unfortunately, I only have a few seconds left, but
                                                                  maybe we will get back to you on what is being reshored these
                                                                  days and how you see that impacting our economy.
                                                                     But my time has run out, and I will yield back.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. McGarvey from the great State of Kentucky
                                                                  for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. MCGARVEY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     Thank you all for being here today.




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                                                                     I am proud to come from a place where people still make things
                                                                  with their hands. I am from Louisville, Kentucky. We make every
                                                                  Ford F-250 and above right there in Louisville. We make Ford Es-
                                                                  capes, Lincoln Corsairs, Louisville Slugger baseball bats made by
                                                                  the steelworkers in Louisville, Kentucky, right there on main
                                                                  street. We have got GE. We are a manufacturing hub in Louisville,
                                                                  Kentucky.
                                                                     And so when the President actually says he has a stated goal of
                                                                  having more manufacturing jobs in the United States, I agree with
                                                                  him. That is a goal I have had for a very long time. I want more
                                                                  people. I want more steelworkers. I want a third shift at Ford. I
                                                                  want more United Auto Workers. I want more people making stuff
                                                                  with their hands, good-paying jobs where people can provide for
                                                                  their families in Louisville.
                                                                     So let’s talk about tariffs and how this impacts this. I have al-
                                                                  ways said tariffs are neither good nor bad. Tariffs are a tool. A
                                                                  hammer is neither good nor bad. A hammer is a tool. It is really
                                                                  good for building a house. It is not so good for fixing your iPhone.
                                                                  Because how you use a tool matters.
                                                                     And so when you see a President who is putting a 40 percent tar-
                                                                  iff on Brazilian coffee and bananas, things that don’t grow here in
                                                                  the United States, or a 50 percent tariff on Lesotho, or a grand
                                                                  total of tariffs on the McDonald Islands or the Heard Islands where
                                                                  the population is zero unless you count penguins, this is not com-
                                                                  mon sense from a guy who claims to be the President of common
                                                                  sense.
                                                                     So let’s talk about how this is impacting people across this coun-
                                                                  try and how this is impacting people right in my district in Louis-
                                                                  ville, Kentucky.
                                                                     Mr. Moser, if you are a company that wants to make a $500 mil-
                                                                  lion investment in U.S. manufacturing but in order to make that
                                                                  investment you need to import a German stamping press or an
                                                                  Italian six-axis robot or a Japanese injection mold line, do you have
                                                                  to wait until we start making those things in the U.S. before you
                                                                  make your investment, or are you just expected to pay an exorbi-
                                                                  tant tax on importing these machines?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. We feel very strongly that the tariffs should not
                                                                  apply to capital equipment such as you describe.
                                                                     Mr. MCGARVEY. But they do right now.
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. I agree.
                                                                     Mr. MCGARVEY. Yeah.
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. What we should do is we should have it not apply.
                                                                  The rate of U.S. manufacturing labor productivity has grown at 0
                                                                  to 1 percent per year for 15 years, but China’s productivity is grow-
                                                                  ing at 6 percent per year.
                                                                     If we expect to catch up with them in terms of cost, if we expect
                                                                  to be competitive, we need massively greater investments in our
                                                                  factories, and a tariff on the machines does not allow that to hap-
                                                                  pen.
                                                                     Mr. MCGARVEY. Got it. And there are some things right now.
                                                                  To get those businesses going, you have to get them somewhere
                                                                  else, but the jobs are here.
                                                                     I mean, I see this in Louisville all the time. We have got Bigelow
                                                                  Tea in Louisville. They make over a billion tea bags a year. Every




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                                                                  job they have is in the United States. They have got to buy the tea,
                                                                  because tea can’t grow in the United States, they have got to buy
                                                                  it from somewhere else. The tariff coming in is debilitating.
                                                                     We have got a great shower door manufacturer, 310 Tempering.
                                                                  They make glass custom shower doors. But a lot of that equipment
                                                                  that they have to use to make that glass comes from Italy. You
                                                                  can’t get it here. But every single job they have is in America.
                                                                     I have heard from so many companies they want to bring jobs
                                                                  back to Louisville—a major auto supplier who currently operates in
                                                                  Mexico, a cardboard manufacturer with operations in Northern Eu-
                                                                  rope, and even iconic American brands like GE Appliances, as Mr.
                                                                  Moser pointed out.
                                                                     But to set up a new factory or to expand a current one, you need
                                                                  machines, machines that are so specialized they are only made in
                                                                  a few places.
                                                                     So what do you do if you need a machine and it is only made
                                                                  in an ally country—an ally country like Germany or Japan or
                                                                  Italy—where you have tariffs upwards of 15 percent? Or what if it
                                                                  is only made in China or Vietnam where the tariff rates go up over
                                                                  100 percent and change every single week?
                                                                     Mr. Crain, what can we do for a company like GE Appliances or
                                                                  others such as I mentioned that want to build in the United States
                                                                  but are facing such staggering start-up costs? Is there a way to get
                                                                  them relief?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Thank you for that question, Congressman. I think
                                                                  it is the right framing as we think about tariffs as a tool in the
                                                                  President’s toolbox, as you indicated.
                                                                     The most important thing that we have heard from manufactur-
                                                                  ers is rising input costs. So if you look at our outlook survey that
                                                                  I referenced earlier, the top concern has been trade uncertainty.
                                                                  The second concern is rising input cost.
                                                                     Manufacturers want to make things here in America. We are
                                                                  committed to that vision. The tax bill incentivizes that. There is
                                                                  immediate expensing both for capital equipment purchases and for
                                                                  the factories that you are going to build or expand to put the equip-
                                                                  ment in.
                                                                     So we want policies to support and encourage further investment
                                                                  along those lines. And I think having the tariffs be less impactful
                                                                  for those pieces of equipment that you are bringing in to invest
                                                                  here in America would be a step in the right direction, as my fellow
                                                                  panelists have said.
                                                                     Mr. MCGARVEY. And so what I hear you saying is how we use
                                                                  these tariffs matters, and the way the President is using these tar-
                                                                  iffs right now, they are making things more expensive for people
                                                                  to buy, they are making it harder for businesses to expand, and
                                                                  they are making it harder for businesses to provide the things we
                                                                  need at a cost people can afford. Because how you use a tariff mat-
                                                                  ters, and the President is not using them in a way that makes
                                                                  sense for American people or American businesses.
                                                                     Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Could I respond to that? Because what you asked is
                                                                  exactly what I am going through. You said, what does a business
                                                                  do when they are tariffed on equipment coming in from overseas?
                                                                  What they do is they pay the tariff.




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                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman’s time is up.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. And maybe they get invited to Washington, D.C., to
                                                                  talk about—maybe not necessarily throwing the baby out with the
                                                                  bathwater and calling everything about tariffs bad, but instead
                                                                  making a modification of tariff policy that applies to specific things.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman’s time is up.
                                                                     Mr. MCGARVEY. Using the tool correctly. Yeah.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Right.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Ms. Van Duyne from the great State of Texas for
                                                                  5 minutes.
                                                                     Ms. VAN DUYNE. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     Thank you to the witnesses for joining us today.
                                                                     I think today’s hearing comes at a pivotal time as small business
                                                                  manufacturers are leading a resurgence in American manufac-
                                                                  turing powered by new export opportunities, strengthened supply
                                                                  chains, major new investments, and new tools from the Small Busi-
                                                                  ness Administration that are helping firms to reshore and scale
                                                                  here in the United States.
                                                                     The Trump administration is taking meaningful steps to create
                                                                  an environment where this revival can flourish, and House Repub-
                                                                  licans have complemented these efforts most notably through the
                                                                  One Big Beautiful Bill, which ensures small businesses can keep
                                                                  more of what they earn and reinvest in their operations and work-
                                                                  force.
                                                                     As part of that broader agenda, and in conjunction with today’s
                                                                  hearing, I will be introducing my Made in America Integrity Act.
                                                                     This bill strengthens penalties for companies that falsely claim
                                                                  that their goods or services are made in America to win federal
                                                                  contracts, because it is that kind of fraud that directly undermines
                                                                  the manufacturers who actually invest in American workers. This
                                                                  bill protects the integrity of that designation for those who have
                                                                  truly earned it.
                                                                     And, of course, manufacturing grows dependent on tax certainty.
                                                                  The One Big Beautiful Bill Act made permanent key provisions,
                                                                  like bonus depreciation, 20 percent small business deduction under
                                                                  Section 199A, and immediate R&D expensing.
                                                                     Manufacturers have been very clear that without these policies
                                                                  we would see fewer jobs, lower wages, and slower growth. And I
                                                                  appreciate, Mr. Crain, you and your association’s comments today.
                                                                     You and your association members will know that the tax provi-
                                                                  sions in the One Big Beautiful Act Bill—One Big Beautiful Bill,
                                                                  particularly permanent bonus depreciation in section 199A small
                                                                  business deduction and the R&D expensing, have been critical to
                                                                  manufacturers. So can you speak a little bit to what making the
                                                                  20 percent passthrough deduction permanent, what that means for
                                                                  small and midsized manufacturers?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Absolutely. Thank you for that question, Congress-
                                                                  woman.
                                                                     Taking a step back, coming into this year, the 199A deduction
                                                                  was scheduled to expire, as well as so many other provisions from
                                                                  the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act. Our analysis showed that, had those
                                                                  provisions been allowed to expire, we would have lost six million
                                                                  American jobs. Not a cost the economy could bear, and certainly




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                                                                  not one that you all were willing to let it bear, which is what lead
                                                                  to the passage of H.R. 1.
                                                                     When we think about the passthrough deduction, the 199A de-
                                                                  ductions specifically that you mentioned, 96 percent of manufactur-
                                                                  ers are organized as passthroughs. So their effective tax rate——
                                                                     Ms. VAN DUYNE. What percentage?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Ninety-six percent of manufacturers are organized
                                                                  as passthroughs. So their effective tax rate is dictated by whether
                                                                  or not the 20 percent passthrough deduction exists. Thanks to the
                                                                  One Big Beautiful Bill Act, it does exist. It is made permanent. So
                                                                  we have a lower effective tax rate on a permanent basis that allows
                                                                  manufacturers to keep more of what they have earned and invest
                                                                  those dollars in their communities across the country.
                                                                     Ms. VAN DUYNE. Thank you.
                                                                     Mr. Moser, you were—I know that Congressman Meuser had
                                                                  asked you a question, basically what reshoring trends that you
                                                                  have seen and, in your experience, what motivates some companies
                                                                  to be able reshore operations back to the U.S. Can you just expand
                                                                  on that?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. In our survey this year, we asked companies—we
                                                                  gave them five choices of policy actions that could drive them to
                                                                  bring back what percentage of what they now import. And they
                                                                  gave nice responses for lower taxes, less regulations, lower dollar,
                                                                  things like that. They gave the highest priority to skilled work-
                                                                  force, significantly higher than any of the other things that politi-
                                                                  cians typically talk about.
                                                                     And because they understand that if we are going to increase sig-
                                                                  nificantly in manufacturing, you need more people to do it, and you
                                                                  need better-trained people. Because we don’t do as good a job of
                                                                  training our workers as, say, Germany, Switzerland, Austria,
                                                                  China do, where they have good apprentice programs, excellent
                                                                  training. So the combination of more and better-trained people is
                                                                  the number one priority to make it happen.
                                                                     Ms. VAN DUYNE. I think that should be a wakeup call, by the
                                                                  way, to our universities and our high schools. And this is exactly
                                                                  what we are trying to take on in Ways and Means to make sure
                                                                  that, if you are getting federal dollars, that we are actually train-
                                                                  ing a workforce that can get jobs and be successful——
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. Exactly.
                                                                     Ms. VAN DUYNE.—and meet the needs of our growing American
                                                                  businesses.
                                                                     Mr. Voss, I appreciate you being here today. And I want to give
                                                                  you an opportunity to actually answer the question that you got
                                                                  stopped on during the last questioning about, you know, the tariff
                                                                  concerns.
                                                                     I look at this as almost like a Rubik’s Cube. It is tariffs trade
                                                                  on—and, you know, our taxes. And tariffs trade taxes being able
                                                                  to, like, be able to be flexible, knowing what is working, when it
                                                                  is working, and being able to move on a dime, as opposed to dou-
                                                                  bling down on failure is really a smart approach. What have you
                                                                  found as far as our tax policies and how it is being affected with
                                                                  other tariffs?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Well, there is many puts and takes as it relates to
                                                                  an income statement of a business. Taxes are one of the takes. Tar-




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                                                                  iffs are one of the takes. The current tax incentives made it a put
                                                                  for us. So these things—we are constantly balancing those things.
                                                                     My point is that—you know, I am not here as a political person.
                                                                  I am here as a businessperson. And no one can debate the fact that
                                                                  manufacturers in the U.S. have been at a huge disadvantage for
                                                                  decades. That has been—it started to be corrected.
                                                                     We have been competing against foreign competitors since our
                                                                  existence. It has been very tough because of the unfairness associ-
                                                                  ated with, you know, how they are treated. So it is a breath of
                                                                  fresh air. We are gaining business as a result of the tariffs.
                                                                     Ms. VAN DUYNE. Thank you.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. We——
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady’s time is up.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. The things that we buy from overseas, we have not
                                                                  paid a very small fraction of what the tariffs is. They have eaten
                                                                  most of them.
                                                                     Now, on the other hand, tariffs have been bad for me be-
                                                                  cause——
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady’s time is up.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS.—we brought in equipment that I got tariffed on that
                                                                  I probably shouldn’t have.
                                                                     Ms. VAN DUYNE. Thank you very much. I yield back.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Ms. Simon, from the great State of California,
                                                                  for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Ms. SIMON. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and Ranking Member
                                                                  Velázquez, for holding this hearing. And thank you all for coming
                                                                  out today. This has been very thoughtful and helpful.
                                                                     I am proud to represent the East Bay in California, California’s
                                                                  12th District, and it is a district where innovators are building
                                                                  technologies that will power and define both this and the next gen-
                                                                  eration. From artificial intelligence that can diagnose early-stage
                                                                  disease to clean energy, solutions that are powering the transition
                                                                  away from fossil fuels, our small businesses are proving day and
                                                                  day that they are the backbone and the lifeblood of our economy.
                                                                     This summer, I had the privilege of spending time and touring
                                                                  a remarkable small business in my district that manufactures au-
                                                                  tonomous maritime drones. I know, it is a thing. Maritime autono-
                                                                  mous drones. The incredible technology this small business has de-
                                                                  signed and manufactured, however, receives components sourced
                                                                  from 43 States across this great nation. And this small business is
                                                                  a model for how businesses can create hometown jobs, drive tech-
                                                                  nological advancement, and support local communities. Their story
                                                                  serves as a powerful reminder that when we invest in small busi-
                                                                  nesses deep in our communities we are investing, truly, in the na-
                                                                  tional supply chain.
                                                                     But even cutting-edge technologies like these in my district face
                                                                  very similar challenges, some challenges that we heard today.
                                                                  Manufacturers across the country have been speaking out to, I
                                                                  think, Members on both sides of the aisle on this Committee about
                                                                  these challenges. How can they compete with larger businesses in
                                                                  recruiting and retaining a skilled workforce when employees and
                                                                  their families require and deserve, not only fair wages, but afford-
                                                                  able comprehensive healthcare.




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                                                                     Ms. Modlin, I have a question for you—actually a couple. Do your
                                                                  employees use ACA Marketplace?
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. Yes, they do.
                                                                     Ms. SIMON. I love when you answer quickly. Thank you. Defi-
                                                                  nitely not a politician. I appreciate that.
                                                                     The Kaiser Family Foundation, Ms. Modlin, estimates that near-
                                                                  ly half of all adults enrolled in ACA, half of all adults who are en-
                                                                  rolled in the ACA Marketplace are directly tied to small businesses.
                                                                     So my second question, if the ACA’s enhanced premium tax cred-
                                                                  its expire at the end of this year, which we know they likely will,
                                                                  with no intervention from this Chamber, how will small businesses
                                                                  like yours, how will you make it? How will you absorb these costs?
                                                                  What are these costs? Walk us through.
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. Thank you for that question.
                                                                     Our employees have to be healthy. As individuals they deserve
                                                                  access to affordable healthcare. So without a healthy workforce, es-
                                                                  pecially the small manufacturer who does not have a second person
                                                                  to take the place of that machinist who has become ill and needs
                                                                  to, you know, have that time off or doesn’t have access to adequate
                                                                  healthcare to be able to come through that illness and come back
                                                                  on to the floor—so, yes, affordable healthcare—without affordable
                                                                  healthcare, you are not going to have a healthy workforce, and
                                                                  small manufacturers are going to suffer.
                                                                     Ms. SIMON. You know, I want to double back on the question.
                                                                  If, in fact—I only have a few seconds left, but if, in fact, by the end
                                                                  of this year you and your employees will directly be affected by the
                                                                  decisions made in this Chamber regarding healthcare, what does
                                                                  that cost you? Are you thinking about what January will hold for
                                                                  you in terms of providing healthcare for your employees? What are
                                                                  the costs?
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. I know that I cannot afford a group health policy.
                                                                  That is why my employees—I work on a reimbursement pro-
                                                                  gram——
                                                                     Ms. SIMON. Right.
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN.—where I pay my employees a certain amount of
                                                                  money each month to help them with their premiums for
                                                                  healthcare. Again, I can only say that if the healthcare is not avail-
                                                                  able and affordable to our employees, we cannot afford a group
                                                                  health policy.
                                                                     Ms. SIMON. Right.
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. So we are going to have people that are unin-
                                                                  sured, and you are going to have a loss in the workforce. It is going
                                                                  to be a fall-down, if you will, or a flow-down, because the employee
                                                                  without proper healthcare is not going to be able to come to work.
                                                                  We do not, in small manufacturing, have access to a second person
                                                                  to slip them into that job. So small manufacturing definitely will
                                                                  suffer.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady’s time is up.
                                                                     Ms. SIMON. I appreciate your answer.
                                                                     And, thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you for being here and ex-
                                                                  pressing this real need. Thank you.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. LaLota, from the great State of New York,
                                                                  for 5 minutes.




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                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     Mr. Moser, how are you doing this morning, sir?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. I am doing fine. Thanks for having me here.
                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. But I understand you are the president and the
                                                                  founder of a company that is in the business of onshoring and re-
                                                                  shoring?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. Correct.
                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. So your business helps bring back manufacturing
                                                                  jobs to America?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. We are nonprofit, and we help companies under-
                                                                  stand all the costs and risks of offshoring and provide them with
                                                                  tools to help them make the decision and implement it to bring the
                                                                  work back.
                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. That is noble work. How is business going?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. We don’t make any money, but we have achieved
                                                                  a lot. As I mentioned before, the total number of jobs per year re-
                                                                  shored has gone from 11,000 in 2010 to 244,000 per year last year.
                                                                  So the results are—I am pleased. I am delighted overall.
                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. Great. We appreciate that work. And I don’t mean
                                                                  to put you on the spot, but I read your biography. I see that you
                                                                  have a bachelor’s in MIT—and a bachelor’s and a master’s from
                                                                  MIT and an MBA from the University of Chicago. So I am going
                                                                  to presume you are our numbers’ guy on the panel this morning,
                                                                  if that is okay with you? I hope it is.
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. Yes.
                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. What do you understand about America’s trade
                                                                  deficit internationally?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. Current trade deficit is about $1.2 trillion; the
                                                                  goods trade deficit, 1.2 trillion. And it has been stable at about 4
                                                                  percent of GDP for the last 15 years. And that is a huge amount.
                                                                  One of the results of that is that foreign entities hold about 20 tril-
                                                                  lion more U.S. assets than we hold of foreign assets, and therefore,
                                                                  in effect, we are net paying out interest and dividends and so on
                                                                  on that 20 trillion that otherwise could be invested here in our
                                                                  economy.
                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. And on the 1.2 trillion goods trade deficit—and I
                                                                  appreciate you making that distinction—about what part of that is
                                                                  attributable to China?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. China was about $300 billion, so about 25 percent
                                                                  of the trade deficit. And now, last year I think, or this year, one
                                                                  or the other, down to about 218 billion. So it has definitely come
                                                                  down because we are not buying as much. But some of what they
                                                                  used to ship to us directly, they ship through Mexico or Canada or
                                                                  Vietnam or somewhere else. So it is not quite as big a reduction
                                                                  as I described, but they are still huge.
                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. And back to the 1.2 trillion, what would you—how
                                                                  far back does that go? How long has it been that big of trade a def-
                                                                  icit?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. It has been about 15—for about 15 years it has
                                                                  been 4 percent of GDP, which means, 15 years ago, it was maybe
                                                                  900 billion as opposed to 1.2 trillion.
                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. Should Congress care about these trade deficits?
                                                                  If they are important, why are they important?




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                                                                     Mr. MOSER. They are incredibly important. You know, one of
                                                                  the things that—one of the people I follow is Ray Dalio, ‘‘Changing
                                                                  World Order’’—some of you have probably read—and he describes
                                                                  how hegemons or empires or countries rise and they peak out and
                                                                  they fall. And one of the characteristics of being up here and start-
                                                                  ing to fall is a declining competitiveness. When a country or an em-
                                                                  pire gets into that condition, it is not competitive, it has got too
                                                                  much debt, it can’t pay its bills, et cetera, that is when you can tell
                                                                  that you are declining.
                                                                     And so by reshoring, by stabilizing, by reversing those trends, I
                                                                  am convinced we can stay up here nice and solid rather than enter-
                                                                  ing a decline.
                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. And you have explained a little the ways that,
                                                                  from a policy perspective, we can stabilize that negative trend and
                                                                  perhaps get back in the right direction. I have read some of Dalio’s
                                                                  material, and this is informative to me, and I am aware of some
                                                                  of the numbers.
                                                                     On Long Island, a district I represent, we have lost a heck of a
                                                                  lot of manufacturing jobs. We used to have about 88,000 manufac-
                                                                  turing jobs. Now, we are in the mid-sixties on that stuff. And we
                                                                  are looking for solutions towards that.
                                                                     What is the benefit, in your mind, of onshoring, reshoring jobs
                                                                  from a quality-of-life perspective, from an inflation perspective,
                                                                  from an affordability perspective? Why should Congress care to
                                                                  promote policies that onshore and reshore?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. From a national perspective, I think at the bottom
                                                                  line, the defense infrastructure, the ability to produce the missiles
                                                                  and the bullets and the tanks and everything else we need—hope-
                                                                  fully we will never need—but if we do need them, we have to be
                                                                  able to produce them, and we don’t have anywhere near the capa-
                                                                  bility to produce them.
                                                                     But also in terms of excellent jobs. It used to be a manufacturing
                                                                  job was a great job, and it is not seen as such anymore, but start-
                                                                  ing to come back. And especially as we promote the success of re-
                                                                  shoring, the success of manufacturing, more of our youth will
                                                                  choose that role and have excellent careers.
                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. Thank you. I appreciate you being here today.
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. Thanks for your question.
                                                                     Mr. LALOTA. My time has expired, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Ms. Scholten, from the great State of Michigan,
                                                                  for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Ms. SCHOLTEN. Thank you so much, Mr. Chair. And thank you
                                                                  so much to our witnesses today.
                                                                     You are getting a lot of similar questions around similar topics,
                                                                  but that is because these are the absolute most pressing issues to
                                                                  our small businesses and particularly our small manufacturers
                                                                  around the country. I know that is true in my home State of Michi-
                                                                  gan where more than 600,000 manufacturing jobs are supported by
                                                                  over 12,000 companies. Just think about that.
                                                                     The conversations we are having today is absolutely critical. How
                                                                  to ensure small manufacturers can thrive in an increasingly
                                                                  globalized economy. In west Michigan, we are home to a manufac-
                                                                  turing plant for the only domestic supplier of the specific yellow




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                                                                  pigments used for road markings. Unfortunately, an estimated 96
                                                                  percent of these pigments used for road markings are sourced from
                                                                  foreign manufacturers, including China and India, enabling our
                                                                  taxpayer dollars to leave the U.S. That is why I have introduced
                                                                  the bipartisan Paving the Way for American Industry Act, which
                                                                  would ensure our roads are paved using paint that is made in
                                                                  America.
                                                                     Ms. Modlin, my first question is for you. The current administra-
                                                                  tion’s chaotic tariff policies—my colleague and I, Mr. McGarvey, we
                                                                  talk all the time about how it is not inherently good—tariffs are
                                                                  not inherently good or bad, they are simply a tool. The way they
                                                                  have been used have left many manufacturers scrambling.
                                                                     What more can Congress do to protect businesses like yours and
                                                                  the one in my district that are critical to keeping our supply chains
                                                                  at home? Congress, specifically. We are here to hear from you.
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. Thank you for the question.
                                                                     I have to say, to begin, exemption for small manufacturers, ex-
                                                                  emptions from those tariffs, that would be the ideal position to take
                                                                  to encourage the—and support the small manufacturing environ-
                                                                  ment.
                                                                     Ms. SCHOLTEN. I have a series of questions. I am going to kind
                                                                  of go through them quickly. But sticking with you, Ms. Modlin,
                                                                  your testimony touches on the importance of having resources to
                                                                  train staff. One thing I really hear about from small business own-
                                                                  ers in my district is the need for more training, resources, in addi-
                                                                  tion for their guidance on how to utilize the latest technologies for
                                                                  their business.
                                                                     My bill, the AI-WISE Act, just passed out of this Committee on
                                                                  a bipartisan basis earlier this week, and it would ensure that small
                                                                  business—the SBA specifically—adds educational content on uti-
                                                                  lizing artificial intelligence so business owners can have the tools
                                                                  that they need to strengthen their businesses. It is critical that we
                                                                  support entrepreneurs in this way.
                                                                     Are you aware of any programs through the SBA that help small
                                                                  businesses currently embrace new technologies?
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. I have to say that I am not currently aware of any
                                                                  SBA programs that would directly assist the small manufacturing
                                                                  environment.
                                                                     Ms. SCHOLTEN. And moving on—thank you for that. We are
                                                                  hoping to change that.
                                                                     Michigan is home to a manufacturing extension partnership pro-
                                                                  gram that has been a critical resource for manufacturers in our
                                                                  State for decades. The Michigan Manufacturing Technology Center
                                                                  has been uplifting businesses that support—with the support of
                                                                  congressionally directed MEP dollars.
                                                                     In 2024 alone, MMTC helped clients increase sales by over 158
                                                                  million. Think about that revenue generation. Earlier this year, the
                                                                  Trump administration notified MMTC that it would not renew its
                                                                  MEP cooperative agreement, jeopardizing 157 manufacturers in my
                                                                  district, over 16,000 thousand workers.
                                                                     I fought back, calling on the administration to renew the MEP
                                                                  agreement. And, one, as the administration later announced that
                                                                  they renewed this agreement, it was critical.




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                                                                     Ms. Modlin, I want to ask, have you had any experience with the
                                                                  MEP programs, and do you think SBA could collaborate with MEP
                                                                  centers to better assist small manufacturers?
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. I have not had direct, you know, work—I have not
                                                                  worked with an MEP, okay, program. But I do think, I do under-
                                                                  stand it enough to suggest that it would definitely be something
                                                                  that would benefit the small manufacturer. And so the answer to
                                                                  that is, because I have not used the MEP SBA programs, I just can
                                                                  suggest that it would be beneficial in the small manufacturing en-
                                                                  vironment.
                                                                     Ms. SCHOLTEN. Okay. That is very helpful.
                                                                     My time is up, so I yield back. Thank you.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Wied, from the great State of Wisconsin, for
                                                                  5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. WIED. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you to all the great
                                                                  witnesses here today. This is a very good discussion and very im-
                                                                  portant to, you know, our priority in reindustrializing this great
                                                                  country. And I think—I just really appreciate all of your, you know,
                                                                  expertise.
                                                                     In my district, from paper to shipbuilding, plastics to heavy man-
                                                                  ufacturing, northeast Wisconsin is a manufacturing powerhouse,
                                                                  employing almost a quarter of the working population. In my dis-
                                                                  trict also, 90 percent of all manufacturers are small businesses.
                                                                     We obviously have a lot of challenges. Some of the challenges
                                                                  that we face are difficulty in finding skilled workers. And, of
                                                                  course, we see a declining interest in our trades, and so, obviously,
                                                                  that is one of the major issues that we are dealing with.
                                                                     First question I would like to go to, though, Mr. Voss, in your
                                                                  statement, you talked about the companies that you work with
                                                                  overseas, in your experience, that you said were eating the cost of
                                                                  tariffs. Can you expand on your experience in working with other
                                                                  companies in importing and the cost of tariffs?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Sure. So through the years, you know, we have im-
                                                                  ported from manufacturers abroad. We still do a much lesser per-
                                                                  centage of the goods that we distribute. It comes from foreign
                                                                  sources. But the ones that we continue to do now, we have not seen
                                                                  an increase in our costs because we have pushed back because,
                                                                  frankly, if they would have put the burden of the tariffs on us, they
                                                                  would have no longer been competitive. So in that case, the tariff
                                                                  did exactly what it was supposed to do in that they took a smaller
                                                                  slice of the pie rather than passing it on to the consumer here.
                                                                     And moving forward, we are seeing input costs, polycarbonate
                                                                  resin, for example, the cost of that is coming down. And that is
                                                                  going to be—that is reflected in our pricing to our customers and
                                                                  our customers’ pricing in the marketplace.
                                                                     Mr. WIED. What would be the cause of those prices coming
                                                                  down? What would be the reason for that?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Well, first of all, competition. Second of all, they are
                                                                  petroleum-based, and the cost of petroleum has come down over the
                                                                  last couple of years—or the last year for sure. Not couple.
                                                                     Mr. WIED. Well, and I also want to expand on your experience
                                                                  that you have right now in partnering with the Irish company to




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                                                                  reshore the polycarbonate manufacturing. How has controlling your
                                                                  supply chain benefited you? And tell us about that experience.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Well, a good example, and I tell this story. You know,
                                                                  we had—we were the master distributor for a couple of very large
                                                                  manufacturers, big companies. And we periodically get the dear
                                                                  valued customer letter that the price is going up due to various
                                                                  things that they articulate in the letter.
                                                                     Well, it was just at that time that we were having a routine re-
                                                                  view of our business model with our newfound partner, and our
                                                                  deal was that we were going to buy from—in other words, the
                                                                  polycarbonate manufacturing company sells to one of—our com-
                                                                  pany too, our sister company. And we were talking about the pric-
                                                                  ing along that. And we were pushing back because the pricing had
                                                                  come down a little bit since the last time we had reviewed this.
                                                                  And at the same time, at the same week that we got letters from
                                                                  two of the major manufacturers saying that the pricing had gone
                                                                  up, in talking to our partner who buys polycarbonate resin at one
                                                                  of the biggest polycarbonate manufacturers in the world, they said,
                                                                  well, that is not surprising because the cost of resin has actually
                                                                  come down. We wouldn’t have known that as a distributor, but as
                                                                  a manufacturer we do know that.
                                                                     So, again, having our future in the hands of either foreign com-
                                                                  panies or companies that maybe are owned by private equity are
                                                                  different than having control of your own future. And so that was
                                                                  a big driving force in our strategy.
                                                                     Mr. WIED. Well, how—in your opinion, how are manufacturers—
                                                                  you know, what is their ability to reshore, expand their operations?
                                                                  How are they hurt by overregulation?
                                                                     I hear about regulation. I was in my own business for 30 years.
                                                                  I struggled with overreaching government regulations on a daily
                                                                  basis. Very, very costly, to $50,000 per employee. Can you expand?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Well, all I can say is, you know, my experience is
                                                                  that, you know, what starts off as a good idea morphs and evolves.
                                                                  And you have people that are implementing those policies and pro-
                                                                  cedures, and they get overzealous and they want to justify their ex-
                                                                  istence. And those bureaucracies continue to increase. And many
                                                                  times the regulations expand beyond what the original scope was
                                                                  intended to be. We haven’t, frankly, encountered that to a large de-
                                                                  gree. So it is hard for me to comment specifically on that.
                                                                     Mr. WIED. All right. Thank you again to all the witnesses. With
                                                                  that, I yield back.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Olszewski, from the great State of Maryland,
                                                                  for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. OLSZEWSKI. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, to our
                                                                  Ranking Member. And to all our witnesses, I appreciate you all
                                                                  being here today and to discuss how we can advance domestic man-
                                                                  ufacturing for American workers and families.
                                                                     Mr. Moser, I believe both you and I grew up watching businesses
                                                                  support our neighbors and families. Some of those businesses, un-
                                                                  fortunately, being removed from global offshoring.
                                                                     My story involves growing up in the shadow of a steel plant in
                                                                  eastern Baltimore County. It was a Bethlehem Steel site. It was a
                                                                  site that produced steel used to build ships in world wars, parts of




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                                                                  the Empire State Building, the Golden Gate Bridge, the Chesa-
                                                                  peake Bay Bridge. We employed, roughly, 31,000 steelworkers and
                                                                  other employees at the heyday of the plant. I also watched that
                                                                  plant collapse over several decades, and the fallout from people los-
                                                                  ing their healthcare, losing their pensions after giving a lifetime of
                                                                  service to that manufacturing here in America.
                                                                     So we do need to uplift the American manufacturing industry.
                                                                  Clearly, I was shocked when we saw the tariff policies of this ad-
                                                                  ministration take place. I agree with my colleague, Mr. McGarvey,
                                                                  earlier, that this is a tool that can and should be used in important
                                                                  and critical situations. I would have loved to have seen action with
                                                                  tariffs when China was dumping steel, very cheap steel, that really
                                                                  put and pushed that plant towards its closure. And so certainly
                                                                  welcome the conversation but think that tariffs need to be thought-
                                                                  ful as we do that.
                                                                     In 2023, through both the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs
                                                                  Act and the Inflation Reduction Act, that steel site that I spoke of
                                                                  earlier received investments to become Maryland’s first permanent
                                                                  offshore wind turbine factory under a new name, Sparrows Point
                                                                  Steel. Sparrows Point Steel produces the monopile foundations and
                                                                  other steel components that is needed for Maryland offshore wind
                                                                  projects and has the capabilities to serve as the entire U.S. offshore
                                                                  wind market on the East Coast. It is a job-creating engine there
                                                                  that has the potential to put thousands of people to work, not in
                                                                  China, not in Europe, but right here in America.
                                                                     And my concern is, after we have already gone through this ex-
                                                                  perience where we have seen a steel plant shut down, we are now
                                                                  on the cusp of having a revitalization of manufacturing in my dis-
                                                                  trict. We are seeing an administration playing political games with
                                                                  arbitrary tariffs but also skyrocketing healthcare costs and even
                                                                  trying to cancel support for the very projects they profess to believe
                                                                  in—manufacturing.
                                                                     This administration pulled back a $47.4 million grant from this
                                                                  project, jeopardizing it. How is that making America great again?
                                                                     More recently, we are also dealing with the fallout from the col-
                                                                  lapse of the Francis Scott Key Bridge. It is a critical lifeline, not
                                                                  just for Maryland and the mid-Atlantic, but for moving goods
                                                                  throughout this country.
                                                                     And so I stand ready to continue advancing opportunities in leg-
                                                                  islation to encourage manufacturing and working on training that
                                                                  was mentioned earlier and, of course, look forward to those produc-
                                                                  tive dialogues. So I have a few questions on that because I am also
                                                                  concerned about the impact of tariffs on that critical infrastructure
                                                                  project.
                                                                     So, first, on the bridge, clearly, steel and other components are
                                                                  a big part of that construction. Would the panel here support ex-
                                                                  emptions for large-scale American infrastructure projects that will
                                                                  rely on tariff goods that are going to drive up costs for businesses,
                                                                  consumers, and taxpayers alike? Is that something that we think
                                                                  we could be supportive of in that work?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. Exemptions from what?
                                                                     Mr. OLSZEWSKI. Large-scale infrastructure projects, such as
                                                                  the rebuild of the Francis Scott Key Bridge in Baltimore.




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                                                                     Mr. MOSER. Well, I agree that all those components should be
                                                                  sourced in the U.S.
                                                                     Mr. OLSZEWSKI. And if not, though, should steel or other prod-
                                                                  ucts, if they are not sourced here, should they be charged a tariff?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. Yes.
                                                                     Mr. OLSZEWSKI. You think they should. Okay.
                                                                     And then, regardless of where the tariffs are coming or your posi-
                                                                  tions on tariffs, I am just curious for the panel here, going back to
                                                                  that grant for Sparrows Point Steel, do you think we could or
                                                                  should look at ways to use that tariff revenue to support those
                                                                  projects rather than pull that funding from them?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. That is a policy question. You have got a million dif-
                                                                  ferent projects and a lot of hands out. You have got to decide where
                                                                  it best goes.
                                                                     Mr. OLSZEWSKI. Well, in general, should we be—but should we
                                                                  be investing in——
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Should we be investing in——
                                                                     Mr. OLSZEWSKI.—manufacturing in the United States when we
                                                                  have these kinds of opportunities to reintegrate manufacturing in
                                                                  the United States?
                                                                     I mean, is it good policy to pull awards when we have a $500
                                                                  million manufacturing project on the books and it is moving for-
                                                                  ward to then pull that funding?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. I don’t know enough about it to respond.
                                                                     Mr. OLSZEWSKI. All right. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Ms. King-Hinds, from the Northern Mariana Is-
                                                                  lands, for 5 minutes—from the great Mariana Islands.
                                                                     Ms. KING-HINDS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you to
                                                                  all of you for making time to be with us today.
                                                                     I am from the Marianas, and, you know, we have one economy.
                                                                  We are trying to diversify to get—because we have seen a lot of in-
                                                                  terest with regards to manufacturing, right, folks, who want to
                                                                  come and set up shop there. So I am very focused on the conversa-
                                                                  tion with regards to retaining the right amount of workforce to be
                                                                  able to sustain manufacturing, because that is our biggest chal-
                                                                  lenge.
                                                                     And so we have talked about the problems, right. I think a lot
                                                                  of you have kind of alluded to different things. I am kind of more
                                                                  focused on, what is it that Congress can do to actually address the
                                                                  problem, so that, you know, however many years from now, we
                                                                  don’t have this massive amount of shortage, right, that can’t sus-
                                                                  tain your industry?
                                                                     And I will open up the floor to whoever wants to answer first.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. I can go first here. I was just going to say, we haven’t
                                                                  talked that much about healthcare, and we know about these cred-
                                                                  its that are expiring. I just don’t think we should keep subsidizing
                                                                  a broken system. The healthcare system is broken. We need a new
                                                                  strategy. So to the extent that we continue to tax ourselves to pay
                                                                  for a broken strategy—and then us employers, it costs us more to
                                                                  provide health insurance for our employees—that is what has got
                                                                  to stop.




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                                                                     So this isn’t about whether or not to extend the credit on a fail-
                                                                  ing system. Throw out the system and start over and find a system
                                                                  that works and is cost-competitive with the rest of the world.
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. Well, I can put that in perspective. It turns out
                                                                  that the average healthcare cost of a family of four in the U.S.
                                                                  equals the average wage of a Chinese worker. And the healthcare
                                                                  cost of a family in the U.S. gets built into the burden, that gets
                                                                  built into the cost, that gets built into the price. And, therefore, the
                                                                  higher healthcare costs in the U.S. is a major reason why our costs
                                                                  are too high and why we lose, based on cost or price, relevant to
                                                                  countries like China. So I agree entirely that something has to be
                                                                  done.
                                                                     Ms. KING-HINDS. Can I follow up then? So are you attributing
                                                                  that cost to the inability to retain workforce?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. It makes our costs—the cost of making a product
                                                                  too high in the U.S. relative to other countries and, therefore, U.S.
                                                                  companies choose to import low-price products from offshore in-
                                                                  stead of buying higher priced more or less equivalent products here
                                                                  in the United States.
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. So I think there is two angles here. One from the
                                                                  healthcare perspective; certainly, manufacturers view that as a
                                                                  critical tool to attract and retain talent. Across the industry, 95
                                                                  percent of manufacturing workers are eligible for a workforce
                                                                  healthcare plan through their employer. North of 80 percent actu-
                                                                  ally participate in one.
                                                                     We have certainly heard, as has been referenced from our Mem-
                                                                  bers, that the rising costs of healthcare are a significant cost driver
                                                                  for manufacturers. And so it certainly would help with the work-
                                                                  force situation to reduce those costs.
                                                                     On sort of pure workforce policy, we certainly should support
                                                                  more training programs and apprenticeships. We have talked some
                                                                  today about education about what the manufacturing industry is.
                                                                  It is not your grandfather’s manufacturing industry anymore. It is
                                                                  not dark, dirty, and dangerous. It is cutting-edge, it is innovative,
                                                                  it is well paid. These are family-sustaining careers.
                                                                     And so if we are supporting career and technical education pro-
                                                                  grams to get manufacturing workers out of the CTE programs and
                                                                  onto manufacturing shop floors, that is a huge step in the right di-
                                                                  rection of building the manufacturing workforce of the future, in
                                                                  addition to immigration policies that help us fill the jobs that we
                                                                  might not be able to fill with the domestic workforce.
                                                                     So there is a lot of pieces to that puzzle to ensure that we have
                                                                  the skilled workers that we need to drive manufacturing forward.
                                                                     Ms. KING-HINDS. Okay. I have a follow-up question for you,
                                                                  Mr. Crain. So, you know, in your testimony, you describe how large
                                                                  companies often have the resources to maintain internal training
                                                                  programs that small businesses lack, and you mention the need for
                                                                  policies that would allow small businesses to close that gap. Can
                                                                  you just be a little bit more specific so that we get an idea of what
                                                                  your thoughts are on that issue?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Absolutely. What we have heard from so many of
                                                                  our Members is that they actually partner with local community
                                                                  colleges, CTE institutions to set up training programs or to even




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                                                                  just ensure that the existing programs that that community college
                                                                  has are reflective of the skills that manufacturers need.
                                                                     And so from my perspective, continued focus on those skills spe-
                                                                  cifically, and in helping prospective students or adults who want to
                                                                  go back to school, or even adults who are employed who want to
                                                                  gain those skills, that we are really focusing from a policy appa-
                                                                  ratus on manufacturing-specific skills; so machinists, technicians,
                                                                  welders, electricians, et cetera. If you have those certifications, that
                                                                  is going to set you up for success in manufacturing and help the
                                                                  industry writ large.
                                                                     Ms. KING-HINDS. I am out of time. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Cisneros, from the great State of California,
                                                                  for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. CISNEROS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thanks to our
                                                                  witnesses for being here today.
                                                                     Ms. Modlin, I am going to start with you. My colleagues always
                                                                  like to say that whenever they ask small businesses, not one says
                                                                  we need more regulation. However, they ignore that small busi-
                                                                  nesses share their primary concern in cost and the uncertainty
                                                                  from tariffs.
                                                                     Whenever I ask small businesses, not one says they want to pay
                                                                  more for supplies or increase their costs. Do you want to pay more
                                                                  for your supplies? Have you ever heard of any small business
                                                                  owner saying they want to increase their costs?
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. Thank you for that question.
                                                                     No. We don’t want to increase our cost. And I cannot fathom an-
                                                                  other small manufacturer wanting an increasing in costs.
                                                                     Mr. CISNEROS. Yeah. So can you—what impact are the tariffs
                                                                  having, and the uncertainty?
                                                                     You know, I brought up in a markup yesterday, right, all the
                                                                  small businesses in my district, the one thing they just say that
                                                                  they want is stability, stability. But yet when the President decides
                                                                  he is going to raise tariffs 10 percent on Canada because he don’t
                                                                  like a commercial he saw during the World Series, there is no sta-
                                                                  bility there.
                                                                     What impact is the tariffs having, you know, with you and the
                                                                  other small businesses that you know of?
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. The impact of the tariff is—first, you are abso-
                                                                  lutely right, it is unpredictable what is going to happen tomorrow,
                                                                  okay, on the tariff side. We have to set prices. And we have cus-
                                                                  tomers that the price is set and they are not going to accept an in-
                                                                  crease in price. Once price increases, it is not going to really come
                                                                  down.
                                                                     So the unpredictability in this tariff situation is—is really puts
                                                                  us in—as I had said before, I am trying to predict and forecast into
                                                                  2026 at this time, and I am finding it very difficult to do because
                                                                  I don’t know what to expect. And because I use several different
                                                                  types of alloys and different types of metals, and the tariffs are
                                                                  possibly suggested to be—aluminum tariff might be 25 percent
                                                                  today, might be 45 percent a week from now.
                                                                     One of the most expensive tariffs I have is the carbide. Carbide
                                                                  is used in tooling that goes on all of the equipment that I use to




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                                                                  cut the metal. So carbide right now is under 90 percent tariff. So
                                                                  the tooling that I use is almost unattainable.
                                                                     So the bottom line is small manufacturers don’t have big mar-
                                                                  gins, we don’t have a lot of cushion. So this unpredictability in the
                                                                  tariff policies is really causing us to question sustainability.
                                                                     Mr. CISNEROS. All right. Thank you.
                                                                     Mr. Crain, in your testimony, you shared that in the National
                                                                  Association of Manufacturers Outlook Survey, trade uncertainty,
                                                                  rising raw material costs, and increasing healthcare costs topped
                                                                  the list of concerns.
                                                                     If there was a way for you to share those concerns with the SBA
                                                                  Office of Advocacy and they then advocated research and did—or
                                                                  did whatever they could to raise those concerns across the federal
                                                                  government, would you welcome it?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Absolutely. The Office of Advocacy is a critical voice
                                                                  for small manufacturers within the SBA and within the federal
                                                                  government writ large.
                                                                     Mr. CISNEROS. Well, thank you very much for that. And so, you
                                                                  know, we are in the process of putting forth a bill that will do that,
                                                                  will allow business owners to come forth, and to raise their con-
                                                                  cerns when it comes to immigration, tariffs, as well as healthcare
                                                                  concerns for businesses. And, hopefully, that will be welcomed by
                                                                  business owners there. So you can share with them, and then have
                                                                  the Office of Advocacy come out and report to us what input they
                                                                  are taking in. So that is coming in the future.
                                                                     And with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     And I now recognize Mr. Stauber, from the great State of Min-
                                                                  nesota, for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. Thank you very much, Chairman Williams and
                                                                  Ranking Member Velázquez, for holding today’s hearing. And
                                                                  thank you to all the witnesses for lending your insight into the re-
                                                                  surgence of America’s manufacturing space.
                                                                     Minnesota’s Eighth Congressional District lives and breathes
                                                                  manufacturing, from the iron ore on the iron range that feeds our
                                                                  steel mills, to the small shops and fabricators in Duluth, Hibbing,
                                                                  Brainerd, Forest Lake, and across northern Minnesota. Manufac-
                                                                  turing is our neighbors’ livelihoods.
                                                                     When production moves overseas, it is a lost paycheck, a shrink-
                                                                  ing tax base, and one more young person who decides there is no
                                                                  future for them in the trades back home.
                                                                     Nationwide we are reminded that manufacturing is overwhelm-
                                                                  ingly a small business story. As Mr. Crain notes, 93 percent of
                                                                  manufacturers have fewer than 100 employees, and 75 percent
                                                                  have fewer than 20. These are the kind of employers we are talking
                                                                  about today—family-owned shops and small firms that are innova-
                                                                  tive but are also the most sensitive to tax hikes, regulatory costs,
                                                                  and permitting delays.
                                                                     The One Big Beautiful Bill Act gave us a permanent, pro-growth
                                                                  Tax Code with tools like immediate expensing and passthrough de-
                                                                  duction and higher estate tax exemptions so family manufacturers
                                                                  can keep investing, hiring, and passing their business on to that
                                                                  next generation.




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                                                                     Mr. Crain, for these small businesses, what are the top one or
                                                                  two policy changes beyond the Tax Code that will help them turn
                                                                  that tax certainty into actual investment and new equipment and
                                                                  jobs on the ground?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Thank you for that question, Congressman.
                                                                     I would turn your attention to permitting reform. As you indi-
                                                                  cated, the tax bill has a number of incentives for manufacturing in-
                                                                  vestment. But if you can’t get the permit to get that investment off
                                                                  the ground, then the tax bill hasn’t had the maximum pro-growth
                                                                  effect that we would have wanted it to, right.
                                                                     And so with respect to programming reform, if we can reduce the
                                                                  timelines for permitting review and approval, then that gives man-
                                                                  ufacturers more certainty to invest in these long-term projects. And
                                                                  if we can reduce the uncertainty associated with never-ending liti-
                                                                  gation on the back end through judicial reform, both of those things
                                                                  would improve the permitting process here in the U.S. Those are
                                                                  both governed by the National Environmental Policy Act, NEPA.
                                                                     There is actually a bill, funnily enough, being marked up today
                                                                  at the Natural Resources Committee called the SPEED Act to do
                                                                  exactly that. So it is thrilling to see that we have momentum in
                                                                  the direction of permitting reform to build on the success of tax re-
                                                                  form.
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. Thank you, Mr. Crain, for mentioning the
                                                                  SPEED Act. I just left the National Resources——
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. There you go.
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER.—Committee in support of that. And that is going
                                                                  to pass in a bipartisan fashion. I really appreciate you bringing
                                                                  that up because permitting reform is a high priority for all indus-
                                                                  tries. Thank you.
                                                                     You know, we have talked about the conditions small manufac-
                                                                  turers are facing here at home. I want to zoom out to the decision
                                                                  point where companies choose whether to keep chasing the lowest
                                                                  offshore price or bring production back to the United States.
                                                                     Mr. Moser, your testimony shows that reshoring and foreign di-
                                                                  rect investments have grown from just a trickle to hundreds of
                                                                  thousands of announced jobs a year, with roughly half of those in
                                                                  the small supplier community.
                                                                     From your experience, what are the main reasons companies de-
                                                                  cide to move production back to the United States, and what more
                                                                  can we in Congress do to push large OEMs to deliberately bring
                                                                  more of the supply chain back to the small U.S. manufacturers in
                                                                  places like my hometown and my district, northern Minnesota?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. The main reasons they came back, they say, are,
                                                                  first, having manufacturing near engineering, so the small manu-
                                                                  facturer can work with the big company and communicate, work to-
                                                                  gether, partner. The second was duty and freight. And third was
                                                                  geopolitical risk, the risk of something happening over Taiwan and
                                                                  being cut off for 5 years or something from your supply chains. So
                                                                  we came out with a geopolitical risk map that shows the prob-
                                                                  ability of decoupling with each country so the companies can cal-
                                                                  culate the risk of not reshoring and justify somewhat higher prices
                                                                  here.
                                                                     In terms of actions that you can take, one of the things in terms
                                                                  of the tariffs is to firm up the tariffs. Especially for the big compa-




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                                                                  nies, they are thinking about investing a billion dollars and taking
                                                                  3 years to build the factory and 6 months to hire people. And if the
                                                                  tariffs could go away halfway through that process, the guy who
                                                                  decides to do it gets fired.
                                                                     We need to firm the tariffs up, make them solid, make them such
                                                                  that they are going to last at least through this administration,
                                                                  preferably the next, so the companies will believe and they will act.
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. Yeah. You know, you talk about tariffs. The 232
                                                                  steel tariffs that both President Trump in his first administration
                                                                  and then President Biden, they kept the 232 steel tariffs on be-
                                                                  cause we know the Belt and Road Initiative of the Chinese Com-
                                                                  munist Party is to destroy our steelmaking and our mining indus-
                                                                  tries here in the United States. Remember, we can’t do that. We
                                                                  need certainty we can lead the world.
                                                                     So with that, Mr. Chair, I yield back.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Dr. Morrison, from the great State of Minnesota
                                                                  also, for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. Thank you, Mr. Chair. We are having a Min-
                                                                  nesota minute here.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The queen of Minnesota here.
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. I appreciate you, Chairman Williams and
                                                                  Ranking Member Velázquez. And I am very honored to occupy her
                                                                  seat for the moment for holding this hearing. And thanks to the
                                                                  witnesses for being here today to have this important conversation.
                                                                     I have been hearing from so many small businesses—small busi-
                                                                  ness manufacturers, specifically, in my district and across Min-
                                                                  nesota about how the tariffs—the Trump administration’s tariff
                                                                  policy are making it impossible for them to plan and to grow as
                                                                  they work to navigate this level of unprecedented uncertainty.
                                                                     And I do just want to know, Mr. Crain, you mentioned that tar-
                                                                  iffs are a tool in the President’s toolbox. And I just—this adminis-
                                                                  tration is doing many unprecedented things that should not be nor-
                                                                  malized. And I just want to take the moment to remind all of us
                                                                  that tariffs should be a tool in Congress’ toolbox according to our
                                                                  Constitution.
                                                                     Mr. Crain, the National Association of Manufacturers Outlook
                                                                  Survey found that trade uncertainty is American manufacturers’
                                                                  top concern for three quarters, essentially since the start of the
                                                                  year. Yet there is limited—you didn’t talk so much about tariffs in
                                                                  your testimony or about concerns or proposed solutions around
                                                                  that.
                                                                     I just want to give you the opportunity now to speak to the Na-
                                                                  tional Association of Manufacturers recommendations to address
                                                                  the impacts of tariffs and uncertainty on its small business mem-
                                                                  bers.
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Thank you for that question, Congressman.
                                                                     I will start with the uncertainty piece, which is that manufactur-
                                                                  ers need certainty to plan for the long term. That is true with re-
                                                                  spect to tariffs. It is also true with respect to regulations. It is true
                                                                  with respect to tax. And so a lot of the policies that we have sup-
                                                                  ported as an industry are designed to provide manufacturers, espe-
                                                                  cially small manufacturers, with that certainty so they can make
                                                                  those long-term job-creating investment decisions.




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                                                                     With respect to tariffs specifically, the conversation we have had
                                                                  today I think is really instructive. With respect to how tariffs are
                                                                  a tool in policymakers’ toolbox, the dynamic that we have heard so
                                                                  often from our members is that they want to invest here in Amer-
                                                                  ica, which is a goal that we obviously share with Congress and
                                                                  share with the President to grow domestic manufacturing. But if
                                                                  you need an input from elsewhere to do that, there can be costs as-
                                                                  sociated with that under the current tariff environment. In many
                                                                  cases, that specialized equipment and machinery that comes from
                                                                  elsewhere, in some instances it is raw materials, it is energy re-
                                                                  sources, it is critical minerals.
                                                                     So what we have focused on is ensuring that manufacturers can
                                                                  bring those inputs and machinery here to make things in America,
                                                                  and, in fact, tying that to your ability to make things here in Amer-
                                                                  ica, which we think would allow the administration to maintain a
                                                                  tariff—a strong tariff environment but also allow manufacturers to
                                                                  make things here in America.
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. Thank you for that.
                                                                     Today, I am introducing the Small Business RELIEF Act, which
                                                                  would exempt small businesses from President Trump’s baseline
                                                                  global tariffs and provide refunds to small businesses that were
                                                                  forced to pay them. I am wondering if any of you have a perspec-
                                                                  tive on that idea.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Can you repeat exactly what the bill would do?
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. Sure. It would exempt small businesses from
                                                                  President Trump’s baseline tariffs, so liberation day tariffs, and
                                                                  then provide refunds to the small businesses that were forced to
                                                                  pay them.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. How do you define small business?
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. By the way the SBA defines them.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Which is how?
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. It depends on the industry, but it is usually
                                                                  less than 500 employees. I think less than 7.5 million in revenues.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. You guys have an opinion on that?
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. Something to ponder.
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. I will throw in an opinion. First, it is a nice idea,
                                                                  but my fear——
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. Thank you.
                                                                     Mr. MOSER.—would be that instead of the big companies im-
                                                                  porting material, they would have their suppliers import the mate-
                                                                  rial, claim exemption under the Small Business Act, and then sell
                                                                  it up to the big companies, and they would have avoided—they
                                                                  would have made the tariffs totally ineffective. Unless you have
                                                                  something in it to prevent that from happening, then that would
                                                                  be a concern.
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. Okay. Thank you.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. I could add too. I think, with all due respect, you are
                                                                  exaggerating the effect on small business and the negative effect on
                                                                  tariff. We haven’t had a negative effect; we have had a positive ef-
                                                                  fect. We have customers that are able to compete more effectively
                                                                  so they buy more product from us.
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. Respectively, sir, that is not what I am hearing
                                                                  from small businesses in my district.




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                                                                     Ms. Modlin, could you speak to the National Association of Man-
                                                                  ufacturers’ proposal, the U.S. Manufacturing Investment Program,
                                                                  what that would mean for small businesses like yours?
                                                                     Ms. MODLIN. Thank you very much for the question.
                                                                     National Association of Manufacturers in any way, shape, and
                                                                  form to assist the small manufacturing environment would be wel-
                                                                  comed. So I can say that I would definitely encourage some con-
                                                                  versation to include the small manufacturing industry.
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. Thank you. Thank you.
                                                                     And I see my time has expired. I yield back. Thank you, Mr.
                                                                  Chair.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Downing, from the great State of Montana,
                                                                  for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you for holding
                                                                  this hearing. And thank you to the witnesses.
                                                                     I wasn’t planning on talking about health insurance at all, but
                                                                  some of the comments by Messrs. Voss and Crain kind of just
                                                                  sparked some thoughts here.
                                                                     You know, one of the things, Mr. Voss, that you mentioned is you
                                                                  didn’t want businesses or taxpayers through tax credits to be pay-
                                                                  ing into a broken system. And one of the things I just want to be
                                                                  clear on that is the tax credits that have gotten so much press the
                                                                  last couple of months, these enhanced premium tax credits, only af-
                                                                  fect the individual market. So that is not affecting, you know, the
                                                                  small groups which, you know, is probably mostly what you are
                                                                  talking about in terms of the costs for an employer for a small busi-
                                                                  ness.
                                                                     But what we have seen—we do have a broken system, and those
                                                                  premium tax credits are trying to, you know, mask a broken sys-
                                                                  tem. But what we have seen are 15 years of rising provider costs,
                                                                  15 years of rising drug costs. And because of that we have seen 15
                                                                  years of adverse selection which has concentrated the risk, which
                                                                  is driving those costs up. But I agree with you 100 percent, small
                                                                  businesses and taxpayers shouldn’t be bearing the brunt of those
                                                                  costs. So I appreciate those comments.
                                                                     Now on to my prepared remarks.
                                                                     You know, first of all, I am going to start with you, Mr. Crain.
                                                                  In your testimony, you mentioned that 44 percent of U.S. manufac-
                                                                  turers plan to increase their AI and smart factory technology in-
                                                                  vestments this year. What areas of manufacturing business oper-
                                                                  ations has AI technology been the most effective in streamlining?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. We have really seen this across the industry, and
                                                                  thank you for that question. You know, I know a lot of times folks
                                                                  think about Silicon Valley when they think about AI, and I under-
                                                                  stand why that is the case. But it really has been transformative
                                                                  for the manufacturing shop floor. It is making workers more pro-
                                                                  ductive. It is making supply chains more efficient. It is making
                                                                  shop floors safer for those workers. We have really seen it across
                                                                  the industry.
                                                                     From a small business perspective, we want to make sure that
                                                                  small businesses aren’t left behind from this transformative activ-
                                                                  ity.




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                                                                     And so anything we can do to ensure that they aren’t burdened
                                                                  from seeking to adopt or understand these technologies will be a
                                                                  huge step in the right direction——
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. And what do you see is the biggest hurdles for
                                                                  manufacturers in adopting AI technologies and incorporating these
                                                                  into their business?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. So if you look at the present AI action plan, which
                                                                  is designed to support American AI dominance, which is obviously
                                                                  a goal I—that NAM supports, I assume many of you do as well—
                                                                  he is focused, and we are as well as, preventing one-size-fits-all
                                                                  regulations. There are certainly risks associated with AI, but those
                                                                  are risk case-specific risks. Manufacturers using AI to make their
                                                                  supply chain more efficient doesn’t present the same risk as gen-
                                                                  erative AI, for instance.
                                                                     And so we want to be sure that any regulations that are applied
                                                                  to the AI space don’t impact manufacturers’ ability to invest in this
                                                                  technology.
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. Obviously, AI is going to have incredible power
                                                                  demands moving forward, and we need to be able to power this. We
                                                                  need the energy production in the United States.
                                                                     What should Congress do to support increased energy production
                                                                  so that we can fuel this economic growth?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. So manufacturers are both producers and users of
                                                                  energy. We are disproportionately users of energy because of the
                                                                  energy-intensive nature of manufacturing production. And that is
                                                                  even more true thanks to AI. So we need an all-of-the-above energy
                                                                  strategy. We need to unleash America’s natural resources; think
                                                                  offshore and onshore leases. We need more investment and critical
                                                                  minerals to improve battery technology. We need to invest in nu-
                                                                  clear fuel so that we have more baseload power generation.
                                                                     But it is not just production, it is also transmission. Do we have
                                                                  a reliable, resilient, affordable grid that can get the electrons where
                                                                  we need them to go? And, finally, do we have permitting reform to
                                                                  get these energy projects off the ground to ensure that we can in-
                                                                  vest in these energy resources that we need to power our industry?
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. Thank you very much. Running out of time
                                                                  quickly here. Thank you for those answers.
                                                                     I am going to move to Mr. Moser. Thank you for being here
                                                                  today. In your testimony, you highlighted a survey from this year
                                                                  showing that manufacturing costs are, on average, 50 percent high-
                                                                  er in the United States than in China.
                                                                     What have been the most effective policies and arguments to
                                                                  overcome this financial incentive to offshoring, convince businesses
                                                                  to—or I am sorry—yeah, to convince businesses to return their
                                                                  manufacturing operations to the U.S.?
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. What has probably been the most——
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. Microphone, please.
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. What has probably been the most effective so far,
                                                                  I would say—I believe the tariffs are starting. It is a difficult start,
                                                                  but starting to become effective. In the long run, we advocate most
                                                                  strongly the use of total cost of ownership instead of price for mak-
                                                                  ing the sourcing decision. And if all the Congressmen and the
                                                                  President were to urge their constituent companies to do that, that




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                                                                  alone could bring back a millions jobs without Congress having to
                                                                  spend a penny.
                                                                    Mr. DOWNING. Outstanding. Unfortunately, I have run out of
                                                                  time. Thank you all for your participation and your answers.
                                                                    And on that, Mr. Chair, I yield.
                                                                    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                    I now recognize Mr. Patronis, from the great State of Florida, for
                                                                  5 minutes.
                                                                    Mr. PATRONIS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. This has been great.
                                                                  I have just really enjoyed all of the commentary, the questions, and
                                                                  especially y’all’s participation.
                                                                    I was back in the Florida Legislature years ago and, at that time,
                                                                  Governor Rick Scott was just adamant about trying to find advan-
                                                                  tages for manufacturers in the State. So we were successful on
                                                                  passing a sales tax exemption on manufacturing equipment, and
                                                                  just trying to compete with the Joneses of what other States are
                                                                  doing.
                                                                    But I have never kind of thought about here, you know, or—are
                                                                  there advantages? I am all about—look, I am in the restaurant
                                                                  business for 30 years, and I am all about, you know, not trying to
                                                                  reinvent the wheel, especially if I can steal somebody else’s wheel
                                                                  and make, you know, a version of it that works for me.
                                                                    Are we doing the same thing for y’all? Are we taking advantage
                                                                  of other ideas? Or I mean—look, an idea you may have in one of
                                                                  your State markets that you are in, there is no reason why that
                                                                  can’t be federal policy either. I mean, I would just loving anybody
                                                                  to chime in with whatever.
                                                                    And I really—Mr. Voss, I wrote it all down. You blasting the
                                                                  healthcare system is something I totally take to heart as a family
                                                                  in a small business. That is something we feel every single day.
                                                                  How am I going to be competitive in the most competitive business
                                                                  when you can go anywhere to serve dinner for your family?
                                                                    So but any comments y’all have regarding solutions that we
                                                                  should be stealing from somewhere else, I am good with that. Any-
                                                                  body? Yes, sir?
                                                                    Mr. MOSER. Are you asking what Florida can do or what the
                                                                  U.S. can do?
                                                                    Mr. PATRONIS. U.S.
                                                                    Mr. MOSER. Both? U.S.?
                                                                    Mr. PATRONIS. Yes, sir.
                                                                    Mr. MOSER. I come back finally to skilled workforce. Engi-
                                                                  neers—for example, college loans should be preferentially awarded
                                                                  to people—Americans that want to study engineering, physics, et
                                                                  cetera, et cetera. And then those who don’t get loans should be ex-
                                                                  cellent candidates to become toolmakers, welders, precision ma-
                                                                  chinists, who will have fewer defaulted loans and we will have
                                                                  more people doing the work that needs to get done.
                                                                    Mr. PATRONIS. So let me dovetail off of that. Again, I don’t
                                                                  know if the Chairman sees it in his garage, but do we have the
                                                                  right temperament in the workforce in order to try—I mean, I
                                                                  know we can continue to throw money at education, but are we
                                                                  sending the right type of people into the workforce that want to
                                                                  work in these type of positions? Are there other solutions that we
                                                                  are not thinking of?




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                                                                     Mr. MOSER. I think, as the youth and their parents see manu-
                                                                  facturing coming back—and, once again, it is a wonderful career
                                                                  and a great way to get ahead. I was in a meeting 2 days ago, and
                                                                  the average service engineer for the machine tool companies is
                                                                  making somewhere between $100,000 and $150,000 a year.
                                                                     Mr. PATRONIS. That is great.
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. Which is higher than the average for Ph.D.s. But
                                                                  the kids don’t know that because the guidance counselors don’t tell
                                                                  them.
                                                                     Mr. PATRONIS. So my own story. My first degree was a culinary
                                                                  arts degree. It was a 2-year certificate program. And after I got fin-
                                                                  ished with it, I thought, wow, I can do more with myself than just
                                                                  cook. But I got that immediate gratification. I just did something
                                                                  with my hands.
                                                                     So I didn’t have to look at a paper and see an A. I saw somebody
                                                                  enjoying what I just created. So now I am motivated—to get to
                                                                  your point that you just said—to want to go ahead and get a bach-
                                                                  elor’s degree.
                                                                     And I get these roadblocks by academics because now none of the
                                                                  classes I took at the same institution would qualify towards a bach-
                                                                  elor’s degree because they are too specialized. So it was crazy.
                                                                     And I went as far as to the university president. I said to the
                                                                  college president—I said, ‘‘Why is this the case?’’ And he says,
                                                                  ‘‘Jimmy, there is just a part of our society where we have got to
                                                                  keep the plumbers out of the classrooms.’’
                                                                     And it broke my heart, but it gave me a reason why I have got
                                                                  to fight to make sure that, again, the tech schools get somewhat
                                                                  of equal footing with the glamour of the academic institutions.
                                                                     Mr. MOSER. I have got an actual story about that. I met a VP
                                                                  from Milwaukee Area Technical College, a big community college.
                                                                     And he was bragging about the fact that that institution was the
                                                                  second-largest graduate school in Wisconsin because only Madison
                                                                  got more people who already had bachelor’s degrees because those
                                                                  with bachelor’s degrees who couldn’t find a job to pay off their debt
                                                                  came and learned to become a plumber or a toolmaker or welder
                                                                  so they could make a good income and have a good career.
                                                                     Mr. PATRONIS. Well, I am with you.
                                                                     Look, I am a big believer in the 2-year degree program. I am
                                                                  here because of it. But it was a stepping stone and helped me just
                                                                  become some maturity and understand the importance of work-
                                                                  place efforts.
                                                                     Anyway, thank you all for showing up.
                                                                     Thanks, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Bresnahan from the great State of Pennsyl-
                                                                  vania for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. BRESNAHAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and to the Rank-
                                                                  ing Member.
                                                                     And thank you all for taking time out of your day to come spend
                                                                  some time with us up here on Capitol Hill, and to all the witnesses
                                                                  for appearing before the Committee today.
                                                                     The need to expand domestic manufacturing in this country is
                                                                  more important than ever, and we must be clear-eyed about the
                                                                  challenges that come with it.




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                                                                     Years of offshoring have weakened our economy and left us vul-
                                                                  nerable and overly reliant to foreign entities. In just a few months
                                                                  of working to bring manufacturing back home, we have already
                                                                  made tremendous strides to rebuild our domestic base, especially in
                                                                  northeastern Pennsylvania.
                                                                     NEPA businesses that make products on American soil strength-
                                                                  en our economy, maintain a strong local workforce, and protect our
                                                                  national interests from foreign dependence, from Sugar Notch’s
                                                                  own American Paper Bag company providing shopping bags and
                                                                  the Amazon shipping bags for families across the country, to
                                                                  Gentex producing military-grade fighter pilot helmets for our
                                                                  troops.
                                                                     And today I am joined with one of our constituents, Lieutenant
                                                                  Gavin O’Donnell, who is an F-18 Super Hornet pilot who actually
                                                                  wears one of those helmets that are manufactured and created in
                                                                  our district.
                                                                     So thank you for tagging along today as well.
                                                                     One company that exemplifies the power of domestic manufac-
                                                                  turing is i2M in Mountain Top, Pennsylvania. Under CEO Chris
                                                                  Hackett’s leadership, i2M is producing American-made flexible
                                                                  polymer films that promote sustainability, bolster domestic supply
                                                                  chains, and support high-quality, good-paying local jobs.
                                                                     I also want to highlight another company, United Envelope in
                                                                  Monroe County, and their high-quality mailers.
                                                                     These businesses, along with countless others around the dis-
                                                                  trict, have a profound impact on northeastern Pennsylvania’s econ-
                                                                  omy and communities, but as we continue to expand domestic man-
                                                                  ufacturing we must acknowledge the challenges ahead.
                                                                     Domestic manufacturing is great, but it means nothing if there
                                                                  is no power to keep the building running or workers to fill it.
                                                                     Mr. Crain, I know you had made some comments about gener-
                                                                  ating power, transmitting power, and ultimately distributing
                                                                  power, and as a former electrical contractor before coming to Con-
                                                                  gress, I am going to be definitely interested in some of your insight.
                                                                     But keeping good capacity aligned with industrial growth will be
                                                                  one of the most difficult, most important aspects of increasing do-
                                                                  mestic production. If energy prices skyrocket, if families can’t af-
                                                                  ford to heat their homes, the benefits of domestic manufacturing
                                                                  won’t mean much.
                                                                     I guess my first question would be—and to piggyback on a
                                                                  former question—talking about permitting reform, I sit on the
                                                                  Build America Caucus, and we just had a bipartisan meeting yes-
                                                                  terday about some intuitive ways.
                                                                     And something that we are seeing locally—and perhaps you have
                                                                  some insight as to a way that—when you are talking about trans-
                                                                  mission distribution, and construction, you have the federal govern-
                                                                  ment, you have State government and local government involved.
                                                                  And the majority of new transmission lines that are being created
                                                                  are usually falling within the parameters of one utility.
                                                                     So I would be really curious to see and get your perspective on
                                                                  opening up transmission distribution, increasing the permitting
                                                                  time, and ultimately getting shovels in the ground faster.
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. You are absolutely right that we need to reduce the
                                                                  timelines to get permits reviewed and approved in order to get any




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                                                                  type of manufacturing online, but certainly energy production and
                                                                  transmission, as you just indicated.
                                                                     What we are seeing at the federal level as well as at the local
                                                                  and State level is often a lack of coordination. We have overlapping
                                                                  statutes. We have different agencies that have jurisdiction over bits
                                                                  and pieces of a permit or of a statutory scheme. And so it results
                                                                  in a lot of box-checking and paperwork for manufacturers who just
                                                                  want to get shovels in the ground.
                                                                     And so if we can streamline those processes, if we can increase
                                                                  coordination, then you are less likely to have those roadblocks at
                                                                  the outset of a project and less likely to have delays in terms of
                                                                  getting people actually employed and getting them to work.
                                                                     Mr. BRESNAHAN. I appreciate that.
                                                                     Mr. Voss, based on your experience leading a company that man-
                                                                  ufactures domestically, if you had a magic wand for companies
                                                                  looking to relocate to northeastern Pennsylvania—and I am going
                                                                  to give a quick plug here that, within a 1-day CDL drive in north-
                                                                  eastern Pennsylvania, you can reach 60 percent of the United
                                                                  States population, as well within 200 miles you can reach 50 mil-
                                                                  lion Americans, but sometimes that barrier to enter is extremely
                                                                  troublesome.
                                                                     What, if you had a magic wand, what is one thing we can do as
                                                                  Members of Congress to help alleviate some of those stresses?
                                                                     Mr. VOSS. Boy, there is a list. Obviously, access to working cap-
                                                                  ital is really important. There are a lot of great ideas out there,
                                                                  and many times the reason they fail is because they ran out of
                                                                  money before they got to the finish line. So, I mean, that would be
                                                                  one big thing.
                                                                     Obviously, the business has to have a value proposition that
                                                                  translates into value in the marketplace. That is also important.
                                                                     And then fight, like, for an even playing field. That is all we can
                                                                  ask for.
                                                                     There were some comments today like the sky is falling because
                                                                  of this tariff strategy, and I am here to say it is exactly the oppo-
                                                                  site.
                                                                     In the business world, it is filled with unpredictability. We have
                                                                  to adjust. And we can’t be victimized by whatever policies or things
                                                                  we can control and what we can’t control. We have got to develop
                                                                  a plan and work our way around it.
                                                                     And so, from a congressional standpoint, I think the biggest
                                                                  thing from a big-picture standpoint is to understand and help ev-
                                                                  erybody——
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman’s time is up.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS.—understand the importance of small business and
                                                                  what it does, and then support it in every way we can, whether it
                                                                  is with health insurance reform, whether it is with banking re-
                                                                  form——
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman’s time is up.
                                                                     Mr. VOSS.—whether it is carving out specifics for the tariff pol-
                                                                  icy that could be improved.
                                                                     Mr. BRESNAHAN. Thank you. I yield.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Jack from the great State of Georgia for 5
                                                                  minutes.




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                                                                     Mr. JACK. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     And I want to echo many of the things my colleague, Mr.
                                                                  Bresnahan, said.
                                                                     I want to thank Gavin for his service, and I hope you are enjoy-
                                                                  ing this hearing today. Your Congressman is deeply respected. I am
                                                                  proud to serve alongside him and sit to his right in this Committee.
                                                                     And I would like to thank you, Mr. Chairman, for convening this
                                                                  important hearing. It has been inspiring to hear some of the testi-
                                                                  mony today.
                                                                     Increasing domestic manufacturing is a priority for this Com-
                                                                  mittee, and we are very proud of our record of success thus far this
                                                                  Congress, and, likewise, we are proud of our record of partnership
                                                                  with the Trump administration.
                                                                     I should note for the record that, under Administrator Loeffler’s
                                                                  leadership, the Small Business Administration is implementing its
                                                                  Made in America Manufacturing Initiative, pledging to cut $100
                                                                  billion in red tape and expand access to capital.
                                                                     One of the first legislative victories this Congress had directly
                                                                  impacted my own district. I have got a company in my district that
                                                                  manufactures tankless water heaters, and it was subject to the
                                                                  most onerous, burdensome regulations you could imagine from the
                                                                  Biden administration.
                                                                     And, thankfully, we were able to use the Congressional Review
                                                                  Act and earn a bipartisan majority in not just the House but also
                                                                  the Senate, sending it to the President’s desk for signature, ena-
                                                                  bling over hundreds—I would say 300 jobs in my district to be
                                                                  saved thanks to our legislative action.
                                                                     So we have a record of success we are proud of in this Com-
                                                                  mittee.
                                                                     And I would like to begin my line of questioning with Mr. Crain,
                                                                  although I should note at the outset I understand you are a grad-
                                                                  uate of Mercer University. Am I correct in that assumption?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. You are. That is correct.
                                                                     Mr. JACK. Are you a Georgia native, by chance?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. I am not. My grandparents lived in Georgia for a big
                                                                  chunk of their life. I am from Birmingham, Alabama, originally.
                                                                     Mr. JACK. Wonderful. Well, you are from Alabama.
                                                                     So, Mr. Chairman, we will have to check his allegiances. Mercer
                                                                  is one of the top-ranked teams in Division 1AA football and is play-
                                                                  ing Auburn this weekend, so we are looking forward to the outcome
                                                                  of that.
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. My folks are Auburn grads, and I am a Mercer grad.
                                                                     Mr. JACK. Well, I won’t put you on the record.
                                                                     But in that vein, you have discussed today the importance of in-
                                                                  novation for manufacturers and how manufacturers account for 53
                                                                  percent of private R&D spending. So despite only making up 10
                                                                  percent of GDP, they account for 53 percent of private R&D spend-
                                                                  ing.
                                                                     So how do provisions like immediate R&D expensing ensure that
                                                                  manufacturers are able to continue to lead in innovation?
                                                                     Mr. CRAIN. Thank you for that question, Congressman.
                                                                     You are absolutely right that innovation is the lifeblood of manu-
                                                                  facturing. Innovation is so critical that immediate R&D expensing
                                                                  had been the law of the land for 40 years, reducing the cost of R&D




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                                                                  and empowering manufacturers to invest more in transformational
                                                                  technologies.
                                                                    Unfortunately, that policy expired in 2022. And so through the
                                                                  One Big Beautiful Bill Act, you all revived immediate R&D expens-
                                                                  ing and made it permanent, providing manufacturers the certainty
                                                                  they need to invest in long-term R&D projects and the capital
                                                                  availability they need to make those projects cheaper, to have life-
                                                                  changing, lifesaving products on manufacturing shop floors and
                                                                  manufacturing labs across the country, which is so critical to our
                                                                  industry’s place here in America and on the world stage.
                                                                    Mr. JACK. And you mentioned in your written testimony how
                                                                  the various elements of your comprehensive manufacturing strat-
                                                                  egy work together to support economic growth. I was hoping you
                                                                  could elaborate a little bit more about that comprehensive manu-
                                                                  facturing strategy and where you see us going in the next few
                                                                  years.
                                                                    Mr. CRAIN. Absolutely.
                                                                    Tax reform laid the foundation, but more must be done to build
                                                                  on the success of tax reform and to truly unlock growth and invest-
                                                                  ment by small manufacturers.
                                                                    That means rebalancing regulations at a time when the small
                                                                  manufacturing industry shoulders a significant burden from federal
                                                                  compliance.
                                                                    It means permitting reform, which we have talked about today,
                                                                  helping companies get shovels in the ground faster and with less
                                                                  uncertainty on the back end from ongoing, never-ending litigation.
                                                                    It means bolstering American energy dominance so we have the
                                                                  power that we need to drive manufacturing in the future.
                                                                    And it means the workforce that manufacturers need, ensuring
                                                                  that they have the skill—and that they exist at all—to fill the
                                                                  400,000 open jobs that we need.
                                                                    All of those policies work together to drive a manufacturing ren-
                                                                  aissance, which is something that the industry supports, you all in
                                                                  Congress support, and the President supports.
                                                                    Mr. JACK. Well, I thank you for your testimony today. I worked
                                                                  with the National Association of Manufacturers in my previous job.
                                                                  In the first term, I was in the Trump administration. And I think
                                                                  your mission is noble, and I think we are all here committed to en-
                                                                  suring that manufacturing in America continues to thrive.
                                                                    And if I could close with Mr. Moser. We have 30 seconds.
                                                                    I would just love for you to share with this Committee in our re-
                                                                  maining time the impact of tax reform that we saw earlier this
                                                                  year through the One Big Beautiful Bill Act and where you see our
                                                                  economy headed because of it.
                                                                    Ms. MODLIN. I have long been in favor of immediate expensing,
                                                                  and that is absolutely essential because of the importance of in-
                                                                  creasing productivity in the U.S. to become more competitive and
                                                                  to deal with our relatively limited number of skilled workers.
                                                                    So that piece of the bill—I support the whole thing, but that
                                                                  piece especially is important.
                                                                    Mr. JACK. Thank you both.
                                                                    And, Mr. Chairman, thank you for convening this hearing. I yield
                                                                  back.
                                                                    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.




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                                                                     And I also want to thank all of our witnesses for their testimony
                                                                  and for appearing before us today. We appreciate it greatly.
                                                                     Without objection, Members have 5 legislative days to submit ad-
                                                                  ditional materials and written questions for the witnesses to the
                                                                  Chair which will be forwarded to the witnesses.
                                                                     I want to, again, ask the witnesses to please respond promptly
                                                                  if that happens. I want to thank you again for being here.
                                                                     If there is no further business, without objection, the Committee
                                                                  is adjourned.
                                                                     [Whereupon, at 12:14 p.m., the Committee was adjourned.]
                                                                     [Ms. Shirley Modlin did not submit her responses to QFR’s in a
                                                                  timely manner.]




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                                                                                                       APPENDIX




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                                                                                                                      70




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 70 here 62203.025


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                                                                                                                      71




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 71 here 62203.026


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                                                                                                                      72




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 72 here 62203.027


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                                                                                                                      73




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 73 here 62203.028


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                                                                                                                      74




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 74 here 62203.029


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                                                                                                                      75




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 75 here 62203.030


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                                                                                                                      76




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 76 here 62203.031


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                                                                                                                      77




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 77 here 62203.032


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                                                                                                                      78




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 78 here 62203.033


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                                                                                                                      79




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 79 here 62203.034


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                                                                                                                      80




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 80 here 62203.035


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                                                                                                                      81




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 81 here 62203.036


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                                                                                                                      82




                                                                                                                      Æ




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 82 here 62203.037


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CHRG-119hhrg62203.pdf
Size
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SHA-256
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CHRG-119hhrg62203.pdf
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