Kick Starting Entrepreneurship and Main Street Economic Recovery (House Small Business subcommittee hearing, September 10, 2020)
Summary
Transcript of a September 10, 2020 hearing of the House Small Business Subcommittee on Rural Development, Agriculture, Trade, and Entrepreneurship, Small Business Committee Document Number 116-091, on entrepreneurship and Main Street recovery. Chairwoman Abby Finkenauer presided from 1:00 p.m., in person and via Webex, and John Joyce gave the minority opening statement. Witnesses were Chad Nath of LINK Grinnell Inc., Jeremy Ketelsen of Ketelsen RV in Hiawatha, Mark Rembert of the Center on Rural Innovation and Jason Duff of Small Nation in Bellefontaine. Added material came from Engine and the National Association of Federally-Insured Credit Unions.
Summary drafted by a model from the document's text below and checked by script against that text before publication. It is a navigation aid, not a reading of what the document proves. Where AI is used
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“Kick Starting Entrepreneurship and Main Street Economic Recovery (House Small Business subcommittee hearing, September 10, 2020).”
Original at www.govinfo.gov. Archived at Pandemic Darlings, https://pandemicdarlings.com/source-documents/kick-starting-entrepreneurship-and-main-street-economic-recovery-house-b7ed921725/
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KICK STARTING ENTREPRENEURSHIP AND MAIN
STREET ECONOMIC RECOVERY
HEARING
BEFORE THE
SUBCOMMITTEE ON RURAL DEVELOP-
MENT, AGRICULTURE, TRADE, AND
ENTREPRENEURSHIP
OF THE
COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
UNITED STATES
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
HEARING HELD
SEPTEMBER 10, 2020
Small Business Committee Document Number 116–091
Available via the GPO Website: www.govinfo.gov
U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
41–345 WASHINGTON : 2021
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HOUSE COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
NYDIA VELÁZQUEZ, New York, Chairwoman
ABBY FINKENAUER, Iowa
JARED GOLDEN, Maine
ANDY KIM, New Jersey
JASON CROW, Colorado
SHARICE DAVIDS, Kansas
KWEISI MFUME, Maryland
JUDY CHU, California
DWIGHT EVANS, Pennsylvania
BRAD SCHNEIDER, Illinois
ADRIANO ESPAILLAT, New York
ANTONIO DELGADO, New York
CHRISSY HOULAHAN, Pennsylvania
ANGIE CRAIG, Minnesota
STEVE CHABOT, Ohio, Ranking Member
AUMUA AMATA COLEMAN RADEWAGEN, American Samoa, Vice Ranking Member
TROY BALDERSON, Ohio
KEVIN HERN, Oklahoma
JIM HAGEDORN, Minnesota
PETE STAUBER, Minnesota
TIM BURCHETT, Tennessee
ROSS SPANO, Florida
JOHN JOYCE, Pennsylvania
DAN BISHOP, North Carolina
MELISSA JUNG, Majority Staff Director
JUSTIN PELLETIER, Majority Deputy Staff Director and Chief Counsel
KEVIN FITZPATRICK, Staff Director
(II)
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CONTENTS
OPENING STATEMENTS
Page
Hon. Abby Finkenauer ............................................................................................ 1
Hon. John Joyce ....................................................................................................... 3
WITNESSES
Mr. Chad Nath, Executive Director, LINK Grinnell Inc., Grinnell, IA .............. 6
Mr. Jeremy Ketelsen, Vice President, Ketelsen RV, Hiawatha, IA ..................... 8
Mr. Mark Rembert, Head of the Rural Innovation Network, Center on Rural
Innovation, Hartland, VT .................................................................................... 9
Mr. Jason Duff, Founder, Small Nation, Bellefontaine, OH ................................ 11
APPENDIX
Prepared Statements:
Mr. Chad Nath, Executive Director, LINK Grinnell Inc., Grinnell, IA ....... 21
Mr. Jeremy Ketelsen, Vice President, Ketelsen, RV, Hiawatha, IA ............ 23
Mr. Mark Rembert, Head of the Rural Innovation Network, Center on
Rural Innovation, Hartland, VT .................................................................. 26
Mr. Jason Duff, Founder, Small Nation, Bellefontaine, OH ......................... 33
Questions for the Record:
None.
Answers for the Record:
None.
Additional Material for the Record:
Engine ............................................................................................................... 36
National Association of Federally-Insured Credit Unions (NAFCU) ........... 40
(III)
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KICK STARTING ENTREPRENEURSHIP AND
MAIN STREET ECONOMIC RECOVERY
THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 10, 2020
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,
COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS,
SUBCOMMITTEE ON RURAL DEVELOPMENT, AGRICULTURE,
TRADE, AND ENTREPRENEURSHIP,
Washington, DC.
The Subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 1:00 p.m., in Room
2360 and via Webex, Rayburn House Office Building. Hon. Abby
Finkenauer [chairwoman of the Subcommittee] presiding.
Present: Representatives Finkenauer, Craig, Chabot, Joyce, and
Bishop.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. I call this meeting to order.
I want to thank everyone for joining us this afternoon or morn-
ing, depending on where you are in the country right now. I want
to make sure to note some important requirements as we conduct
this official remote hearing.
Standing House and Committee rules and practice will continue
to apply during remote proceedings. All members are reminded
that they are expected to adhere to these standing rules, including
decorum.
During the covered period as designated by the speaker, the
Committee will operate in accordance with H.Res. 965 and the sub-
sequent guidance from the Rules Committee in a manner that re-
spects the rights of all members to participate. House regulations
require members to be visible through a video connection through-
out the proceedings. So please keep your cameras on. If you have
to participate in another proceeding, please exit this one and then
log back on later.
In the event a member encounters technical issues that prevents
them from being recognized for their questioning, I will move to the
next available member of the same party and I will recognize that
member at the next appropriate time slot provided they have re-
turned to the proceedings. Should a member’s time be interrupted
by technical issues, I will recognize that member at the next appro-
priate spot for the remainder of their time once their issues have
been resolved.
In the event a witness loses connectivity during testimony or
questioning, I will preserve their time as staff addresses the tech-
nical issues. I may need to recess the proceedings to provide time
for the witness to reconnect. Hopefully we do not have any of those
issues.
(1)
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Finally, remember to remain muted until you are recognized to
minimize background noise. In accordance with the rules estab-
lished under H.Res 965, staff have been advised to mute partici-
pants only in the event that there is an inadvertent background
noise. Should a member wish to be recognized, they must first
unmute themselves and then seek recognition at the appropriate
time.
Before we really get started, I want to start by recognizing the
Iowans in my community and across the state who I know have
gone through so much over the last month—obviously, because of
the pandemic, but we also got hit in Iowa and in my district with
what were essentially category four hurricane-style winds in Au-
gust. These 140-mile per hour winds took down many trees that
been standing for 150 or 200 years. The City of Cedar Rapids and
the surrounding areas had already been through a lot before 2020,
including the floods back in 2008 and 2016. This disaster was just
on a different scale affecting the City of Cedar Rapids at all the
surrounding areas. Marion, Hiawatha, all of Lim County essen-
tially and then our surrounding counties as well, like Buchanan,
Poweshiek, Tama, Marshall, Iowa County, just to name a few. The
two witnesses from Iowa today also have been impacted, whether
by damage to their own businesses or to their homes. Mr. Nath and
Mr. Ketelsen, when you agreed to be a part of this hearing, we
were going to have a whole new host of challenges that we are
dealing with here in Iowa. As Mr. Ketelsen told me this morning,
though, we are Iowans—we’ll get through this. But it is still going
to be tough. We are really grateful to have Jeremy and Chad with
us today.
Now we have a whole new host of challenges that we are dealing
with here in Iowa. As Mr. Ketelsen told me this morning, we are
Iowans—we’ll get through this. But it is still going to be tough. We
are really grateful to have Jeremy and Chad with us today.
We are also grateful to our other witnesses for joining us, from
Vermont and Ohio. You guys have been through a lot with the pan-
demic, so we are just very, very grateful to you for taking the time
to join us today as well.
We all are still going through this pandemic. In Iowa, we have
had over 69,000 folks who tested positive for COVID-19, and we
have lost over 1,100 Iowans. There is still a long way to go, but
we need to make sure we are doing everything we can to help our
friends and neighbors. The pandemic has also caused hardship for
our small businesses due to the downturn in our economy, and 7.5
million small businesses are now at risk of closure, many of them
in our rural areas.
What is especially frustrating is that we have spent nearly a dec-
ade recovering from the recession in 2008, only to now have our
rural economies take another devastating hit. The Recession had a
lasting and disproportionate impact on rural America. Two out of
every three rural counties experienced a decline in their total num-
ber of businesses and a decline in their population as families left
to find different opportunities.
This is something that I saw happen firsthand in Iowa, where,
in much like the rest of the country, recovery took hard work.
Iowans took very big risks to start their own businesses, and it
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paid off. In 2016, nearly 1,900 new businesses started in Iowa, cre-
ating 7,000 new jobs.
This did not just happen in Iowa, though.
In 2017, America’s small businesses created 8.4 million new jobs
across the country. But not every community bounced back from
the recession, and there are still places, especially in rural areas,
that have never been able to bring back the jobs and opportunities
that they lost.
And now as we deal with the fallout from this pandemic, we need
to make sure that no businesses or communities are left behind.
Recently, I introduced the Unlocking Opportunities in Emerging
Markets Act, which would create a new office at the Small Busi-
ness Administration to focus entirely on how can we help improve
access to capital for underrepresented entrepreneurs like in those
rural areas, people of color, women, and our Nation’s veterans. This
is just one of the many bipartisan bills that are being put forward
to help our small business owners to be successful in the long term,
which is what we need to continue to be thinking about.
I know that all of my colleagues here today have been working
hard to come up with new ideas and solutions to help get our econ-
omy back on track, and that’s why I am very, very thankful to get
to serve on this Committee with you all.
We wanted to hold this hearing to hear directly from America’s
rural small business owners about what they need to move forward
and what the pandemic has meant for their businesses.
I also look forward to hearing from our policy expert about how
rural America can be a catalyst for job creation across the country.
We can create opportunities in rural America if we do this right,
whether it is ensuring access to broadband or creating opportuni-
ties so folks who are in bigger cities right now can move back home
to the small towns they are from. We just have to do our job to ad-
dress these issues on the federal level, working with folks at the
local and state levels.
Before I pass it over to Ranking Member Joyce, I want to thank
Dr. Joyce for joining. Dr. Joyce, it has been great to get to work
with you over the last year and a half, and I am happy to have
you here today and would love to pass it over to you and yield to
you for your opening statement.
I think you have got it on mute, Dr. Joyce. There you go.
Mr. JOYCE. Thank you, Chairwoman Finkenauer. Thank you for
your leadership. I send my greetings from my district office in Som-
erset, Pennsylvania, where tomorrow we will hold a memorial of
the Flight 93 tragedy which occurred on 9/11. Echoing the senti-
ments from my district, tomorrow will be a somber day, and yet we
are all in stages of recovery which we will continue.
In this Subcommittee, this important Subcommittee on Rural De-
velopment, Agriculture, Trade and Entrepreneurship, we have dis-
cussed the importance of economic development and of rejuvenation
of America’s small businesses. The global pandemic has only under-
scored the importance of these small businesses. And while there
is little data that is truly available on the number of rural small
businesses, some estimate that there are approximately 5.5 million
rural small businesses in the United States. We know, particularly
on this Subcommittee, that small businesses are a critical compo-
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nent of the rural economy, which makes them a focal point of many
Federal rural economic development efforts.
Rural small businesses do, indeed, differ from urban and subur-
ban small firms in many ways. Generally, rural firms are more
likely to be profitable long term and typically more successful than
nonrural firms in getting financing. Additionally, rural businesses
tend to be smaller in size, smaller in revenue, and often smaller
in growth opportunities.
We have had multiple hearings on the major challenges experi-
enced by rural small businesses, including inadequate access to
rural broadband, fewer methods to access capital, higher
healthcare costs with limited access to rural physicians, increased
childcare expenses, and workforce shortages. We know that small
towns and rural communities struggle with these issues each and
every day. But the coronavirus pandemic has continued to bring
these issues to the forefront of our Nation’s attention.
About 46 million Americans live in rural areas, and unfortu-
nately, some rural residents are at increased risk of getting
COVID-19. Demographic characteristics and geographic features
coupled with reduced healthcare disrupt the ability of rural regions
to respond to the pandemic. The slowdown in aggregate demand
has affected some primary sectors and the expected further slow-
down in trade and global demand might continue to negatively im-
pact rural economies.
And due to these factors, we must be proactive in our goal of
helping America’s Main Street to recovery. Unfortunately, we find
ourselves once again discussing the persistent challenges that we
in rural communities face every single day. As this issue has yet
to receive a resolution, we have witnessed in real time the destruc-
tive lack of access to healthcare, telehealth, and broadband specifi-
cally in our rural communities.
The question is no longer what is the issue but rather, what can
we do? In partnership with private and nonprofit organizations, we
can increase access to these lifesaving and life-providing resources
in order to create equitable opportunity for rural small businesses.
The Hill recently released an article discussing the significant
dynamic of Americans who are moving in waves to suburban and
rural areas. Some reasons cited include the pandemic, social un-
rest, and economic uncertainty. While the permanency and benefit
of this change remains to be seen, we will assess the impact that
this will have on our communities as our economics continue to re-
cover and the pandemic continues to slow. Now, when we see a
great migration from cities to rural and suburban communities, we
must not only talk about the strain on resources but we must dis-
cern how to leverage these resources so that we can retain those
who have moved into our communities and foster the opportunities
for further growth and development.
For these pressing issues, I am proud to work with you on this
Committee where we host witnesses on a wealth of knowledge on
these specifics and can come up with bipartisan solutions that ben-
efit all of our Nation’s rural communities. It is imperative that we
learn from those who, like our panel today, know what it is like
to steer a small business through a pandemic.
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I look forward to hearing the testimony of our witnesses today
and to the continued partnership and bipartisan nature of this
Subcommittee.
Thank you, Madam Chairwoman, and I yield back.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. Thank you, Dr. Joyce. The gen-
tleman yields back.
If Committee members have opening statements prepared, I
would ask that they be submitted for the record.
I would like to just take a minute now to explain the timing
rules. Each witness gets 5 minutes to testify and then each mem-
ber gets 5 minutes for questioning. There is a lighting system to
assist you. The green light will be on when you begin, and then the
yellow light comes on when you have 1 minute remaining. The red
light comes on when you are out of time, and we ask that you stay
within the 5-minute timeframe to the best of your ability.
Now I would now like to introduce our witnesses.
Our first witness is Mr. Chad Nath. Mr. Nath is the director of
LINK Grinnell, a nonprofit organization that offers daycare and
afterschool care. LINK—which stands for lead, inspire, nurture and
keep children educated, enriched, and engaged in the Grinnell com-
munity—aims to provide a safe and inclusive learning environment
for all children. Mr. Nath holds a B.A. in Education from Buena
Vista University, has held positions as a kindergarten and special
education teacher, and has also worked in the healthcare sector.
Mr. Nath, you have done a lot and you have done it all in our rural
areas like Grinnell, and we are very, very grateful to have you
here. Welcome, Mr. Nath.
Our second witness is Mr. Jeremy Ketelsen. Mr. Ketelsen is the
vice president of Ketelsen RV located in Hiawatha, Iowa. Ketelsen
RV began as a small RV business on the family farm in 1962, when
Mr. Ketelsen’s grandfather wanted a camper. The business opened
a storefront in Marion, Iowa, and later started a service depart-
ment, a parts department, and eventually a sales department. Mr.
Ketelsen, we are really happy to have you here. It was great to
chat with you and Mr. Nath this morning. I am really interested
to hear how you are hanging in there with both the pandemic and
the derecho now. Welcome, Mr. Ketelsen.
Our third witness is Mr. Rembert. Mr. Rembert is a regional
economist and head of the Rural Innovation Network at the Center
on Rural Innovation in Heartland, Vermont. He started in this line
of work when his hometown of Wilmington, Ohio faced the loss of
10,000 jobs during the recession. It led him to cofound the non-
profit Energize Clinton County in 2008, and he later served as the
executive director of the Wilmington Clinton County Chamber of
Commerce. He holds a Ph.D. in Regional Economics from The Ohio
State University. Welcome, Mr. Rembert.
I would now like to yield to our Ranking Member, Dr. Joyce, to
introduce our final witness.
Mr. JOYCE. Thank you, Chairwoman Finkenauer.
Our final witness is Jason Duff, founder and CEO of Small Na-
tion, a company in Bellefontaine, Ohio that revitalizes small towns
and helps small town entrepreneurs across the country. Jason is a
fourth generation in a family of entrepreneurs and grew up gaining
firsthand knowledge of how entrepreneurship, good financial prac-
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tices, and hard work can bring great success. After graduating from
the Ohio Northern University with a Bachelor of Science in Busi-
ness Administration, he founded Community Storage and Prop-
erties, a local self-storage company that allowed Jason to invest in
the redevelopment of Bellefontaine. He then founded an outdoor
media company operating over 400 billboards in Ohio and Indiana.
In 7 years, Jason and his business, Small Nation team have helped
to revitalize the City of Bellefontaine. Using their hustle-hard ap-
proach, they have managed to renovate more than 30 historic
buildings that have been sitting empty for decades, and then re-
cruit tenants for 14 new business concepts. This created 18 new
loft apartments, adding a crucial residential component back to the
city’s downtown. The combination of retail, restaurant, and resi-
dential have brought a small-town Main Street back to life. He is
a member of the Small Business Council for the U.S. Chamber of
Commerce, the Small Business and Entrepreneur Council, and
serves on the Board of Trustees of Ohio Northern University.
Jason, my sister is also an alum of Ohio Northern University. We
welcome you to our Subcommittee meeting today.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. Thank you very much, Dr. Joyce.
Mr. Nath, you are now recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENTS OF CHAD NATH, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, LINK
GRINNELL, INC.; JEREMY KETELSEN, VICE PRESIDENT,
KETELSEN RV; MARK REMBERT, HEAD OF THE RURAL INNO-
VATION NETWORK, CENTER ON RURAL INNOVATION; JASON
DUFF, FOUNDER, SMALL NATION, BELLEFONTAINE, OH
STATEMENT OF CHAD NATH
Mr. NATH. Thank you, Chairwoman Finkenauer, Ranking Mem-
ber Joyce, and distinguished members of the Committee.
My name is Chad Nath. I an born and raised in Iowa. Northwest
Iowa is where I grew up and then settled down in the Grinnell
area. I taught school for 7 years. I was a middle school special edu-
cation teacher and a kindergarten teacher, and then after that I
went to Grinnell Regional Medical Center where I held several dif-
ferent roles in that organization—emergency preparedness, safety
security, incident commander for any events that had occurred, and
then also public health. So, and then we also had a day camp pro-
gram which then made me change to my new career right now
which is I am the executive director of LINK Grinnell. It is a non-
profit that was dreamed up on May 30, 2019, and we knew that
there was a huge demand and need for childcare in rural Iowa as
well. So we had a study that had been done 4 years ago that identi-
fied that there were 500 children that did not have the designated
home for childcare and basically the need and demand was there.
So I decided to leave the hospital in order to lead this venture.
What we ended up doing was to work very hard and were very dis-
tinct on the name LINK. So Lead, Inspire, Nurture and Keep chil-
dren active and engaged.
So we are basically a cradle-to-career program. So we look at
ways that we can enrich and provide services to children of all
ages. We started with afterschool programs. So last year, about a
year ago, we opened our doors and started providing care. And we
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saw that that was a huge benefit. Then all of a sudden in March
is when COVID hit, and being someone that has done a lot of plan-
ning for hospitals, I know that the surge capacity for a hospital and
long-term care facilities and first responders is desperate and they
need the staff to be focused and engaged with their patients and
clients and that type of thing. So we pivoted from an afterschool
program to providing care for children of essential workers. We
sent out a survey. We identified that there were 98 families who
filled out the survey. There were 163 children that were identified.
And of that, as things got big, bad, and ugly with community
spread that there would be 86 children. So what that did in my
emergency mind thinking was we needed to have capacity to have
86 children with groups smaller than 10.
So what we ended up doing is we created what we call isolated
pods. So we have no more than 10 individuals in each of these
pods. And they are basically like a family unit. So they have an en-
trance and an exit, restrooms, dedicated staff. With that I needed
facilities. So I talked to the State of Iowa. Ended up getting memo-
randum of agreements with seven different facilities in order to ba-
sically contract or expand depending on the situation in the com-
munity spread. Now, we ended up seeing 37 children, and a major-
ity of those were in one long-term care facility that in Poweshiek
County we had 166 positive cases as of today, and 83 were all from
this one long-term care facility. So they got hit really hard. So we
were taking care of their staff children and also hospital staff as
well.
We also continued all the way to June 1st where then we pivoted
to allowing the public in as well. So we did a summer program.
That was 76 children. We ended up doing six isolated pods in two
different facilities. The school system has been wonderful in our
area to allow us to utilize a lot to do six, four pods and then ulti-
mately, two pods. Now, all along, we have been making sure that
we are disinfecting. We use PPE, all these different types of things
in order to make this function and work appropriately.
So I did not get through everything. There are so many things
to unpack and unwind with it but, you know, we did fieldtrips. We
did some other things that are pretty creative and unique. Bussing,
cleaning the bus and all those different types of things in order for
that to happen. And then obviously derecho hit and Grinnell actu-
ally lost power for more than 12 days and obviously you cannot
have childcare during that time because there was a lack of power.
Although we did restore power 12 days later and then the demand
for childcare, because again, because our school year got pushed
clear back, so they just started Tuesday of this week, and so we
filled that gap as well. And now we do afterschool care Tuesday,
Wednesday, and then that is where I will go after this discussion.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. You are a very busy guy. You have
been doing so much. I look forward to asking questions and hearing
even more later.
Now we will go to Mr. Ketelsen. You are now recognized for 5
minutes.
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STATEMENT OF JEREMY KETELSEN
Mr. KETELSEN. Thank you, Chairwoman Finkenauer and
Ranking Member Dr. Joyce and distinguished members of the
Committee.
I am Jeremy Ketelsen, Vice President of family-owned Ketelsen
RV with locations in Hiawatha and De Soto, Iowa. Our dealership
was founded in 1962 and we roughly employ about 60 people. We
sell new and used travel trailers, horse trailers, used motorhomes.
We also provide repair services and property services to customers.
It is our family’s life work to enable people to enjoy the great out-
doors and travel this great country.
Our dealership is working hard to come back from the economic
shock of the pandemic. We have made progress, but challenges re-
main. Among our top concerns are keeping our customers and em-
ployees safe each day, inventory shortages, and parts supply chain
issues.
We were very fortunate that we did not need to completely close
our business this spring, but that is not the case in other states.
RV dealerships in several states were open for service only, and
could only transact sales by phone or the web, and in some cases
the RV dealers could not be open at
all. So RVDA, RVIA, the Outdoor Recreation Roundtable and
several RV associations worked to allow dealerships to remain open
to serve the traveling public. The quick succession of state stay-at-
home orders left some RV travelers stranded on
the road and some had to leave both public and private camp-
grounds due to state and Federal ordered closures. In the mean-
time, RV ‘‘snowbirds’’ who winter in the south had to travel back
home to their home state, and it was vital that RV dealerships re-
mained open to provide those services to get them home.
In the early days of the pandemic, first responders, including
medical personnel, law enforcement, and critical utility workers
used RVs to self-quarantine in areas. In Iowa, workers at the Des
Moines RV Water Works utilized 20 RVs for temporary housing.
As the assistant fire chief for Springville, Iowa, I have seen this
firsthand and experienced it, and it is in our community’s plan.
With business operations severely restricted, a dealer survey con-
ducted by RVDA in early April showed that 26 percent said their
service, parts, and accessories business were ‘‘down 75 percent or
more’’ when compared with the level of business prior to the pan-
demic. Another 35 percent said their fixed operations business was
‘‘down 50 to 74 percent.’’ Forty-four percent of the dealers respond-
ing to that RVDA survey said their new RV sales volume was down
75 percent or more when compared with pre-pandemic levels, and
21 percent said that they were down 50 to 74 percent.
With almost no revenue coming in, many dealers were forced to
furlough or lay off, including ourselves.
Because of crushing job losses throughout the country, the Small
Business Administration’s PPP loan initiative offered forgivable
loans to small businesses. At the time of the RVDA survey, 92 per-
cent of RV dealers responding said that they either had or planned
to apply for a PPP loan. While my dealership did not apply for the
program, it has been important to many RV dealers across the
country. Since those
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Since those uncertain days of March and April, Americans have
made it clear with the increase in business and enthusiasm to-
wards the great outdoors that this is an industry that can help
heal the Nation during times like these.
We are now faced with supply chain issues. Like many dealers
in the country, our inventory is down, and even more down after
the derecho. These supply chain issues have the potential to create
a storm after a storm. If manufacturers of RVs, which are pri-
marily American made, cannot get components from the suppliers
to build the product, it will lead to a challenge because we do not
have products in stock during the time that consumers are seeking
the outdoor experience.
Some areas that we are watching down the road include access
to campgrounds. People need public and private places to camp in
an RV or tent. We thank those of you who voted for the Great
American Outdoors Act, which will help modernize and improve
the public campgrounds in our National Parks, forests, and Federal
lands.
Continued public investment in the outdoor recreation is ex-
tremely important to our country’s future. Since the pandemic we
have seen an increase in younger and first-time buyers at our deal-
ership and at dealerships across this country. In our conversations
with these customers, we are finding that there are a lot of parents
who are using the outdoors to reconnect with their families. They
want to get away from fear of the virus and spend time together
as a family unit.
We have been told by public health officials to get outside and
recreate responsibly. People are hearing that message loud and
clear. Nature heals our body and mind.
So, on behalf of the $778 billion outdoor recreation industry, and
the RV industry which has an overall economic impact of $114 bil-
lion and supports nearly 600,000 jobs, thank you for your support
of small businesses like mine that help millions of Americans enjoy
the great outdoors. We will continue to be part of the public health
and the economic
solution in rural communities across this country.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. Thank you, Mr. Ketelsen. We real-
ly appreciate it and look forward to asking questions here in a few
minutes.
I now would like to recognize Mr. Rembert for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF MARK REMBERT
Mr. REMBERT. Chairwoman Finkenauer, Ranking Member
Joyce, and distinct members of the Subcommittee.
My name is Mark Rembert, and I am the head of the Rural Inno-
vation Network at the Center on Rural Innovation. I am a regional
economist by training, with a focus on rural development, and I
spent nearly a decade leading economic development efforts in my
hometown of Wilmington, Ohio following the Great Recession. It is
a pleasure to be with you today to discuss the role of entrepreneur-
ship in economic development.
Even before the pandemic, rural America faced a crisis of eco-
nomic opportunity. As recently as February 2020, more than 1,200
rural counties had not recovered all the jobs lost during the Great
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Recession. This recent history suggests that the traditional ap-
proaches to rural development have not delivered economic pros-
perity on their own.
Addressing the immediate economic issues faced by rural Amer-
ica is critical but it is not enough. Restoring rural America to its
pre-pandemic trajectory will mean that most rural communities
will continue to lag behind. Rural America needs a new economic
model.
One key factor driving the rural opportunity gap has been the
growth of the digital economy. Between 2002 and 2016, the share
of jobs requiring digital skills quadrupled from 4.8 percent to 23
percent, and tech jobs experienced one of the fastest job growth
rates from 2010 to 2016. Yet, today, rural America is home to just
5 percent of the workers in tech occupations, even though it ac-
counts for 15 percent of the total U.S. workforce.
At the Center for Rural Innovation, we believe that for rural
communities to thrive, they must participate in the digital econ-
omy. Building digital economies and rural communities will require
scalable tech startups that can create digital jobs in rural places.
Supporting rural tech startups requires a different model than
supporting Main Street businesses. Just like their metro counter-
parts, rural startups need access to equity-based risk capital, deep
mentor and advisor networks, incubator and accelerator programs,
and a trained digital workforce to draw upon. Yet, in most rural
communities, these resources are lacking or do not exist at all.
There is a need for new economic development models and in-
creased Federal support to grow scalable entrepreneurship in rural
communities.
As the head of CORI’s Rural Innovation Network, I have the
pleasure of working with 18 rural communities in 17 states that
are at the forefront of building tech-focused entrepreneurship eco-
systems in rural areas. Communities like Red Wing, Minnesota;
Durango, Colorado; Waterville, Maine, and Wilson, North Carolina
are helping to lead the way by demonstrating that scalable tech en-
trepreneurship is possible in rural areas.
The Federal government has already played an important role in
supporting the success of the communities like these in the Rural
Innovation Network. Each community in the network has received
technical assistance from CORI’s sister organization, Rural Innova-
tion Strategies, Inc., through a collaborative agreement with the
Economic Development Administration. RISI supports communities
as they develop digital economic development strategies and then
provides assistance as they apply for the EDA’s Build to Scale pro-
gram which was formerly the i6 program.
Last year, three out of the eight communities that RISI sup-
ported received an i6 grant to expand their digital economy eco-
system work. Even though not every community RISI works with
wins a grant award, the technical assistance they receive still pro-
vides them with a strategy and a foundation from which they can
continue to grow their digital economy.
Other Federal programs can also help accelerate scalable entre-
preneurship in rural America. The SBA’s Small Business Innova-
tion Research program has a strong track record of spurring job
creation through innovation. In theory, the SBIR should offer a
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critical source of capital for rural tech entrepreneurs, yet just 3
percent of SBI awards have been made to firms located in rural
communities.
The Build to Scale and SBIR programs illustrate two key in-
sights for the role the Federal government can play in supporting
tech entrepreneurship in rural communities. First, there should be
more programs like Build to Scale that support the development of
innovation-driven entrepreneurship ecosystems. We have seen first-
hand how this program can accelerate the development of entrepre-
neurship ecosystems in rural communities. Second, the SBIR pro-
gram shows that Federal funding alone is not enough. Without
technical assistance to promote access in rural areas, programs
aimed at supporting scalable entrepreneurship are likely to end up
concentrated in areas where tech jobs already exist.
While there is still great uncertainty about the long-term effects
of the pandemic, one thing that we know for sure is that rural
America cannot wait for the next recession to join the digital econ-
omy. In the age of the Internet, there should be no limit to where
digital economy jobs and scalable entrepreneurship can take place.
Thank you.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. Well, thank you, Mr. Rembert. I
know I got excited when you talked about Red Wing, Minnesota.
They have great walleye fishing up there, speaking of outdoor ac-
tivities, right, Mr. Ketelsen? I look forward to asking you some
questions, too, to hear even more about your expertise and ideas.
Thank you, Mr. Rembert.
Mr. Duff, you are now recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF JASON DUFF
Mr. DUFF. Thank you, Chairwoman Finkenauer, Ranking Mem-
ber Joyce, and the distinguished members of the Subcommittee. My
name is Jason Duff and I am the founder of Small Nation. Estab-
lished 14 years ago in Bellefontaine, Ohio, Small Nation was
formed during our Nation’s economic crisis and is dedicated to in-
vesting in places, spaces and dreams for small towns and entre-
preneurs.
Bellefontaine is a town of 13,000 people in Logan County, 60
miles northwest of Columbus, 25 miles from the nearest major
interstate, and an hour from the closest metropolitan area. It is
like many other important and valuable courthouse communities
across the country. We have a strong
commitment and reliance on agriculture, manufacturing and
tourism. We are rural and depend on the vibrancy of our local econ-
omy and jobs to generate taxes which support local government,
schools, and our community’s health and social safety nets.
Eighty percent of our downtown’s storefronts were vacant when
I began my journey 14 years ago. Blight, crime, arson and opioid
abuse plagued our town. Working with city, county and other local
leaders, my team and I developed a vision for how to restart our
local economy that began with finding unique ways to reduce un-
employment by investing in people as well as places.
The kinds of new businesses which have flourished in our town
include new dine-in restaurants, coffee shops, hair salons, shopping
boutiques, air-bnb’s, health and wellness studios and locally owned
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professional offices and services. All of these businesses have
thrived because of the fact that they belong to a supportive, grow-
ing and innovative small business community. That community
had to be created.
Thankfully, we were introduced to organizations like the Small
Business and Entrepreneurship Council, the local Chamber of
Commerce, historic preservation organizations like Heritage Ohio
and resources and grants from the Small Businesses Administra-
tion.
COVID-19 and the ongoing pandemic poses an unprecedented
new set of challenges for small businesses as they strive toward re-
covery. McKenzie estimates that between 1.4 million and 2.1 mil-
lion small businesses could permanently close, and that estimate
was based on just the first 4 months of the pandemic.
The disruption has also created a host of new business opportu-
nities and industries that small and local businesses can play an
important role and win against their multinational competitors. We
have seen the creativity of American entrepreneurs in ways they
prepare and deliver food, create and provide education and training
and using technology and video in ways that we never thought pos-
sible. We have also seen how businesses can step up and solve im-
portant health and safety needs during the pandemic. From cre-
ating masks, shields and much needed PPE, businesses of all sizes
are responding and willing to serve. Small businesses are all essen-
tial.
At the heart of all of this are people who listen, solve problems
and create solutions and get paid for those solutions. A recent sur-
vey by Getapp shared that 92 percent of U.S. small businesses
have reinvented themselves during the pandemic and that says a
whole lot about this group of people. Small business owners are
scrappy go-getters and there is no quit in them.
Here are some key recommendations. Let’s work together to ex-
pand programs that support small businesses’ financial resilience.
While the PPP program and EIDL programs provided much needed
relief to many businesses, there is still so many micro businesses
who have been left out. These micro businesses need access to cap-
ital to sustain, grow and expand their businesses. For example,
small businesses need a long-term recovery loan program with low
interest rates and favorable payment terms. Federal policies could
also incentivize and leverage the success of equity and debt-based
crowdfunding to provide entrepreneurs and businesses with a sus-
tained source of capital to help them accelerate recovery and boost
new business creation.
Improve access to rural broadband. Now more than ever we need
to find ways to enhance the access, speed and affordability of rural
broadband to everyone. The next great business idea, invention or
breakthrough can happen on a family farm, makerspace or inde-
pendent specialty retail store.
And the last is creating and expanding entrepreneurial eco-
systems. We must continue to support the business organizations
and nonprofits who train, advocate and bring entrepreneurs to-
gether, organizations like the Small Business and Entrepreneur-
ship Council, the U.S. Chamber and the Small Businesses Admira-
tion.
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In closing, I want to thank the Subcommittee for the opportunity
to testify today. Now more than ever we need to find ways to really
own and define what it means to be small. Small is adaptive, nim-
ble and able to respond fast. It is the small ones in the small towns
and neighborhoods everywhere that keep not only the economy, but
the very spirit of our country alive and prospering. It is the mom
and pops, the food we eat, the measure of good service, and the
technology of the future. They are the people who create the beau-
tiful things, share our knowledge and build bigger, better and
stronger communities.
Thank you for believing and supporting and making smart poli-
cies that support small business.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. Thank you, Mr. Duff. I truly appre-
ciate your testimony and look forward to hearing from you later
today as well. And thank you all for sharing with us.
We are going to now begin our question portion. I will begin by
recognizing myself for 5 minutes.
My first question is to Mr. Nath. Mr. Nath, your work in
childcare, especially all that you have been doing for the last year
since LINK started, is pretty extraordinary. I know you dealt with
challenges you were not expecting to have to deal with when you
took over this endeavor.
Can you speak to me about why it was important for you to enter
the childcare sector, especially in a small town and some of the
things that are a little bit different when it comes to childcare in
rural areas versus our cities?
Mr. NATH. Thank you for the question.
Yes, it is vital. So when we started LINK, we went out to our
organizations and they supported us. We asked for 2 years of fund-
ing, 100 percent donated dollars to start up LINK to provide
childcare. This brings in a physician, you know, at the hospital, we
had been looking for oncology for how long and orthopedics and the
list goes on of different services and you cannot get those individ-
uals in because the schools and childcare are not there to support
those individuals. Plus, people want that for their families and to
help that community thrive.
So we were fortunate, and we were able to provide that essential
childcare for free because we had those dollars that were donated
in there. In order to have those people focus on the job they were
doing, they need to make sure that these other worries are wiped
away, and the only way to make a community thrive is to make
sure that you have all those facets into place along with opportuni-
ties for your family. And so that is why it was so critical and so
important for us to do what we did in that situation.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. Like you said, getting doctors and
being able to attract the right talent to small towns has so much
to do with the childcare that is available. Thank you for recog-
nizing that need, and it underscores why this is such an important
topic to be talking about on a Committee like this. As we are talk-
ing about rural development, we need to make sure that we do not
have child care access disparities across the country.
I have one other quick question for you before we move on to Mr.
Ketelsen. The folks who work at LINK Grinnell are essential work-
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ers. Could you speak just a little bit about what hazard pay would
mean to LINK Grinnell’s workforce and how it would be helpful,
Mr. NATH. Yeah, hazard pay would be critical in that situation.
And you know, these individuals, a lot of the individuals are in the
instant you need them. And so DHS was really good about getting
background checks and all those types of things back to us really
quickly. But you know, we are the front line of the front line. You
know, that was the thing that was very challenging was to find a
way to make sure that I kept my staff safe and the children safe
during COVID. And knock on wood, luckily we have not had any
instances where anybody has been positive, but we really adhere
to some strict standards and made that work very well. So thank
you for that question.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. Thank you so much.
Mr. Ketelsen, one thing we talked about this morning and was
mentioned in your testimony is a supply chain issue that you are
running into in your industry. What are some of the factors you see
leading to that? Would you find it to be helpful to make sure that
we are understanding what the needs are for manufacturing and
the industries—like those that are doing well during the pan-
demic—that could benefit from fixes to the supply chain?
Mr. KETELSEN. A lot of our supply chain issues are derived
from the fact of we went from zero during the COVID timeframe
where no one was thinking about recreation during those initial
times to 120 miles an hour of even the public officials saying the
best way to enjoy your family and recreate is to be outside. And
it is difficult for any industry to go from zero to not only where
they were and then put them into a growth spike. And that is a
lot of what that supply chain has created, which is a unique prob-
lem. It is an exciting problem for the future.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. Yeah. I know my time has expired,
but when we had that discussion, it really did make me start
thinking that we should be able to make up supply chain shortages
by giving production opportunities to some of our manufacturers
who may have slowed down in other areas of their business, includ-
ing by helping them retool their operations to meet the needs that
are there right now.
With your supply chain issues, and the derecho on top of that I
know it is going to be a long road for your business. I am very
grateful for your expertise and everything you talked about today.
Thank you, Mr. Ketelsen.
I know my time expired, so I now yield to Dr. Joyce for 5 min-
utes.
Mr. JOYCE. Thank you, Chairwoman Finkenauer.
My questions will start with Mr. Jason Duff. At Bellefontaine,
you told quite an amazing story. You have been able to revitalize
your small community with a balance of government, nonprofit,
and private organizations. You talked to us, Mr. Duff, about an 80
percent vacancy rate with blight and turning that around to de-
velop restaurants and small businesses and residences as well. Do
you think that your community specifically benefitted from a tax
base, from an enjoyment of life, from the development of new small
businesses, from your ability to turn around a blighted area, an 80
percent vacancy rate for your numbers into a prosperous area?
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Mr. DUFF. Thank you for the question.
The beginning of our journey began with recruiting that first
business and that first entrepreneur that would take a risk on our
town. And that happened to be an independent restaurant. You
know, asking the community what we felt that we were missing to
bring that traffic, that energy, that life, and luckily, an entre-
preneur that made brick oven pizza that had multiple units de-
cided to expand his business in our town. That was a big risk for
him. But when that place opened up, there were already 13 other
pizza places in our town but he had a distinct, unique recipe. He
provided a unique customer experience and we honored the historic
building that was there and the legacy of the traffic and energy
that it had 150 years ago. So that became the catalyst for seeing
that energy, that life, and that traffic come back to our town. When
the restaurant started, there were other specialty retail stores that
saw that traffic and saw the energy and life and said we want to
be clustered around that, too. And then later, as people saw the
specialty retail stores, the downtown gin decided to open up. And
then people said, we want to live in the upper floors of that build-
ing.
But now in the pandemic, you know, what we are challenged
with—so to answer your question, it did improve the tax base, and
it improved the tax base significantly not only for the employees
that were working the businesses, the business owners that were
developing profitable businesses, that they are earning income on,
but the property values appreciated. And when the property values
appreciated, that allowed more money to go back to local munici-
palities for our schools and for our area communities. So you know,
the challenge now in the pandemic is that many of our downtown
and independently owned restaurants have been forced to close.
And so that industry in particular has really been challenged, and
I think that we must work together to find programs that really
help those independent restaurants be able to open back up and
get their employees back engaged and working. And I know the
PPP program and the EIDL program have been two successful
measures on being able to do what it can do but there is still more
work that has to be done.
So the thing that we are working on right now is identifying if
restaurants are going to be slower to come back online, what are
the new ways that we can bring that traffic and energy and life to
our towns and bring that technology, that broadband, getting our
buildings wired up I think is going to be a huge step in the right
direction.
Mr. JOYCE. Mr. Duff, what you achieved at Bellefontaine, is this
a model for success in other rural communities? And are you look-
ing to implement that in other rural communities?
Mr. DUFF. Absolutely. We believe that the model starts with
finding ways to buy and invest in historic buildings, actively recruit
and identify people who are entrepreneurially minded. And those
people do exist in towns. Those ideas need to be heard, and we
need to connect those ideas with people, community banks, and in-
vestors that have resources. And once these ideas come online,
those folks need ongoing mentorship, coaching, and support. And I
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believe this model is working and can work and it can help towns
all across the country.
Mr. JOYCE. And thank you for being the conduit for joining
those different groups together.
My next question is for Mr. Chad Nath. Mr. Nath, you mentioned
searching for funding through nongovernment sources in donations
and grants and stipends. Approximately, how many of your dollars
were you able to make up from nongovernment sources?
Mr. NATH. From nongovernment sources? So you know, we start
off actually from our local businesses are the ones that actually
supplied us with the dollars that we thrived on during that time.
Not thrived but we worked with. We did do a community block
grant and the PPP, we did not get it in the first phase. And then
we had just some of the people that were essential staff provided
some donations. So those went into donated dollars. We did not as-
sess a fee or process a fee. We allowed them if they sort of chose
to give some dollars back and we had a few that did that. Some
just could not afford to do that. So those are the ways that we
made this work. We wrote grants all over the place and, you know,
from the Iowa Women’s Foundation in this area. We did 5-2-1 zero
dollars. We looked for different ways that we could fund this and
make this work. And luckily, at this point we hopefully can see the
clearing a little bit.
Mr. JOYCE. And I commend you.
My final question is for Mr. Rembert. We have talked in this
Committee at length about bridging the digital divide for rural
communities. We are committed to working for that. In your writ-
ten testimony you mentioned that each community has individual
challenges with this task. From a Federal level, we understand
that the Federal government needs to support these efforts without
imposing a ‘‘one size fits all’’ approach. Do you agree from your
stance, from your perch, that a ‘‘one size fits all’’ will not be suc-
cessful as we continue to bridge that digital divide?
Mr. REMBERT. Yes. I think we find that rural communities each
have specific assets and specific challenges that have to be ad-
dressed in unique ways to be successful in doing this, especially
when we are talking about building entrepreneurship ecosystems
that are really focused on building scalable companies.
You know, I think that in our experience, you know, programs
that sort of match resources with local capacity building that allow
the solutions to be built from the community level up and then are
matched with resources that can come in to really build the capac-
ity of the community to advance a strategy is really where we
think success can be achieved because, you know, in rural commu-
nities in particular, capacity is always going to be a significant con-
straint. And so to the extent that programs can actually build local
capacity based on strategies and ideas that are developed by local
leaders, I think the Federal government can play a really impor-
tant role in doing that. So in that sense, you know, having one so-
lution to every community develop is not necessarily the best if it
is not building that local capacity leadership strategy that can
bring local resources together to really advance a vision.
Mr. JOYCE. And again, we salute your commitment to the rural
communities.
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Thank you, Chairwoman, and I yield the remainder of my time.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. Thank you, Dr. Joyce. The gen-
tleman yields back.
Now I would like to recognize the gentlelady from Minnesota,
Congresswoman Craig, for 5 minutes.
Ms. CRAIG. Well, thank you so much, Madam Chairwoman. And
before I get into my questions about COVID-19 and economic recov-
ery, I want to recognize you specifically for all of your tremendous
work on behalf of your constituents as you recover from the August
derecho. So thank you, thank you for everything you have been
doing. I have been following you and just wanted to recognize your
work.
In getting back to our panelists, I just want to say thank you for
all of you for being with us today to talk about these topics, some
of the same topics that have greatly impacted my constituents.
And I want to first turn to Mr. Rembert for my question and tie
it back to the work of an organization called Red Wing Ignite, a
nonprofit that I am proud to have in my district. Red Wing Ignite
fuels economic development by working with key sectors of the
community to spur innovation by supporting entrepreneurs, busi-
nesses, and students.
As you mentioned in your testimony, and certainly Ignite has
done this in adapting to COVID-19, there has been adaptation
through virtual webinars, online mentoring programs, and more to
support entrepreneurs. However, in this time of remote working
and online events, internet access to these entrepreneurial pro-
grams and support is essential. So can you talk just a little bit
more deeply about how rural broadband fits into this work and how
the Center on Rural Innovation is working to expand rural
broadband so more entrepreneurs can access these services?
Mr. REMBERT. Yes. Broadband is the sort of foundational infra-
structure that is required to build tech startups in rural places.
And so it is extremely critical. When we look at communities to
work with, one of the things that we look for is do they have
broadband infrastructure in place. And you know, the fact is there
are a lot of rural places that have great broadband, Red Wing
being one of them. It has a fiber network which is exceptional. So
many rural communities are really equipped to start doing this
work but there are still significant parts of rural America that are
not connected. And that is just an issue that we cannot wait to
solve. It needs to be addressed yesterday before this pandemic hit,
and we are really seeing the effects of it now.
As an organization, we help to raise awareness through our data
and mapping research about the critical role of broadband and
where there are gaps. And our sister organization, Rural Innova-
tion Strategies, Inc. does do specific work with rural communities
that are developing, that need help developing broadband and fix-
ing gaps in their broadband infrastructures. So you know, we defi-
nitely encourage Congress to really focus on the need to bridge the
digital divide around broadband in rural America.
Ms. CRAIG. I just want to stick with you for one more minute.
In looking at the economic effects of COVID-19 and comparing it
to the Great Recession, how is it the same and how is it different?
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And does that speak to any future of what the recovery and what
entrepreneurial opportunities come out of that look like?
Mr. REMBERT. Yeah, so I mean, I think it is a little bit even
too soon to say what this is going to look like. As an economist, I
think that this is still an evolving situation. And so, you know,
what we have seen so far is that this recession actually looks quite
different than the Great Recession. So in one way in particular in
the Great Recession, rural communities were actually much more
severely impacted. So far in this economic crisis, rural communities
have been somewhat, you know, have been less impacted partly be-
cause they have not necessarily experienced the same severity of
outbreaks that more urbanized areas have.
The question is, what will the long-term effects be? I do not think
we quite know. You know, in our own analysis of like the most re-
cent ELS data, it looks like the recovery is starting to slow in rural
America. Before, you know, before rural America has recovered the
jobs lost since February, so you know, and the fact that rural
America is predominantly, has disproportionate employment among
small businesses is a real risk, too. And as we saw during the
Great Recession, small businesses are much more vulnerable to
these kind of shocks. And so that can have much longer-term im-
pacts in rural communities, which is one of the reasons why we
think it is probably the case that rural America has not recovered
from the Great Recession overall.
Ms. CRAIG. Thank you so much. I am sorry I did not get to ask
each of you a question but Madam Chairwoman, it looks like my
time is up, so I will yield back.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. Thank you, Congresswoman.
With that I will recognize the gentleman from Ohio, Mr. Chabot,
who is the Ranking Member of the Small Business Committee, for
5 minutes.
Mr. CHABOT. Thank you very much, Madam Chair.
I think Mr. Ketelsen, I will go to you first if I can.
You mentioned that one of your priorities is keeping your em-
ployees and your customers safe. And you know, one of the things
that we have been considering is liability protection. So for exam-
ple, if you have a customer that comes in, tests positive, and God
forbid should they perish from the disease, that you might be a tar-
get of a lawsuit or one of your employees, you know, comes down
positive. They might say you did not take every precaution and you
end up getting sued. Now, you might have workers’ comp in your
state but nonetheless, even if you ultimately prevail, even if you
win you lose because of the attorneys’ fees and all the costs in-
volved, any thoughts about whether we ought to be doing some-
thing in that area to protect small businesses like yourself from
being targets of liability, either from a customer or from an em-
ployee?
Mr. KETELSEN. You know, initially, that was a major concern
of what is our liability in this situation or in this current scenario
and then future scenarios as well and how do we plan that as a
company to help mitigate or reduce those risks. Who do we turn
to? And the people that we turned to obviously did not have great
clear answers as well either just due to it just being something that
was unknown.
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So that is an area that comes up that we constantly are dis-
cussing as a business, as leadership, and even as the employees on
what kind of risks that people are willing to take.
Mr. CHABOT. We have been considering a second round and
that has been one of the stumbling blocks because one side thinks
that we should have these protections in general and the other side
thinks we should not, so that is one of the stumbling blocks.
But let me shift over. I think Mr. Nath next.
I have visited I think 60-plus small businesses in my community
in trying to see how the PPP worked for them or how we could
have done things differently, just how they are getting along. And
several of them were in the childcare area. And you know, one of
the things that I have heard when they were allowed to reopen or,
you know, some were essential to begin with, but the bottom line
is they had to have fewer children and they had some problem with
some of the employees being concerned about their own health and
other matters like that.
Has that been an issue with you as far as the numbers of chil-
dren that you can have and do you see that evolving over time, and
is PPP allowing you to maybe weather that? You know, when do
you become profitable again I guess is what I am asking.
Mr. NATH. So PPP, the hard part about that is, you know, no-
body knows the duration. You know, so we just basically did a
guestimate of what we thought we would need and it basically
lasted for two and a half payrolls. We are biweekly. That is why
another round of that could be more beneficial because then we can
go off of the data and the information that we have.
Staff wise, you know, under these emergency guidelines, we were
able to get plenty of individuals to sign up and be able to be there
in case things increased. We ended up with about $22,000 in rev-
enue from the summer program, and our staff costs were about
$78,000. So that is a shortfall, you know, roughly $56,000. But
again, we have local businesses that are supporting us in a way
that I have had, you know, Grinnell College come up and say, hey,
if you need anything let us know. We will donate to that. But
again, it is a chicken or the egg type of situation with childcare.
You know, those businesses, if they are not open, it is hard for
them to support to generate revenue that can go to support
childcare within the community. So there is a lot of complex situa-
tions.
Mr. CHABOT. Thank you very much.
I have one more question to a fellow Buckeye here, Mr. Duff. Ob-
viously, we had a pretty aggressive governor in clamping down on
this and trying to keep the people safe on masks and how many
people could come in and dining inside and outside. Any thoughts
there? Anything that you would like to see from here on that could
be helpful to your businesses or others in your community?
Mr. DUFF. Well, based on our COVID counts here in Logan
County, you know, we have had experienced more of an economic
crisis that has been damaging health. And of course, you know,
every COVID case and every COVID death is a serious situation.
But in my county here, in April, we were 31 percent unemploy-
ment. That is the highest in Ohio by 10 basis points. And a big
part of that reason is that our Honda plants and our manufac-
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turing plants that support automotive manufacturing were all
closed and so were so many of our independent businesses in our
small towns and our recreation areas. And so that cost, and the
health crisis, what we are dealing with that cost is also very sig-
nificant. So I think that we need to be looking at strategies for how
we look at health in more of a global perspective that the virus is
here and we are going to continue to work on that. But I think the
work that this Committee is doing and then all of us here today
need to be focusing on the health crisis related to the economy and
how we can get people safely back to work and businesses safely
reopened.
Mr. CHABOT. Thank you very much. Thank you, Madam Chair.
And thank you to all the witnesses. I yield back.
Chairwoman FINKENAUER. Thank you, Mr. Chabot.
With that, I do not believe there are any more questions for
today, so we will conclude. I want to say thank you again to all of
our witnesses: Mr. Nath, Mr. Duff, Mr. Ketelsen, and Mr. Rembert.
I also want to thank Ranking Member Dr. Joyce. This has been our
first online official hearing, so we did it, but it would much better
to get to see everybody in person. We hold out hope that this pan-
demic will get under control, we get vaccines, and we get everybody
going again.
In the meantime, having these types of discussions is going to be
really, really helpful for us as we come through the pandemic and
figure out how to stimulate our economy while ensuring we do not
leave rural America behind as we do it.
Thank you to our witnesses for taking the time to uplift what is
happening on the ground. This was a really helpful discussion, and
I think the members would agree here. We remain committed to
listening and trying to figure out how we can do more of what
works, how can we fix what does not work, and how can we again
keep planning for the future. I will continue to uplift stories and
solutions to leaders in the House, the Senate, and the White
House, so we can come together, put differences aside, get people
out of their corners, and respond to the needs of our small business
owners, our essential workforce, and all the folks who are doing so
much for our country right now but are worried every single day
about what the future looks like.
I am honored to be the Chairwoman of this Subcommittee be-
cause we do find common ground here. That is the way this is sup-
posed to work. We will keep doing our best, and I know we are very
grateful for all of you guys on the ground doing yours as well.
Again, I want to say thank you and stay hopeful for the future
even though I know there is a long way to go.
With that, we will conclude this hearing. I would ask unanimous
consent that members have 5 legislative days to submit statements
and supporting materials for the record.
Without objection, so ordered.
If there is no further business to come before the Subcommittee,
we are adjourned. Thank you.
[Whereupon, at 2:15 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]
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APPENDIX
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Æ
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File and source
- File
- CHRG-116hhrg41345.pdf
- Size
- 14,666,991 bytes
- SHA-256
- e0871b9d48709115674f3bafd446d76d4d0d3c91261a8afd5c625cd37191a8ce
- Our copy
- CHRG-116hhrg41345.pdf
- Original
- www.govinfo.gov