Examining the Policies and Priorities of the U.S. Department of Labor — House Hearing, Serial No. 117-48
Summary
Printed transcript of a June 14, 2022 hearing of the Committee on Education and Labor, Serial No. 117-48, examining the policies and priorities of the Department of Labor. The witness is Secretary Walsh of the Department of Labor, and Chairman Scott opens the hybrid hearing with rules for remote participation under House Resolution 8. Additional submissions include letters from Ranking Member Foxx to Secretary Walsh dated February 23, 2022 and November 2, 2021, a letter from Rick W. Allen dated March 8, 2022, a letter from Jim Banks to Secretaries Walsh and Yellen dated May 18, 2022, and a Toronto Star article dated June 15, 2018 submitted by Ilhan Omar. The closing remarks cite the International Monetary Fund on the size of the economy, and the hearing adjourns at 2:19 p.m.
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[House Hearing, 117 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
______
EXAMINING THE POLICIES AND PRIORITIES
OF THE U.S. DEPARTMENT OF LABOR
=======================================================================
HEARING
Before The
COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND LABOR
U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED SEVENTEENTH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
__________
HEARING HELD IN WASHINGTON, DC, JUNE 14, 2022
__________
Serial No. 117-48
__________
Printed for the use of the Committee on Education and Workforce
GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT
Available via: edworkforce.house.gov or www.govinfo.gov
_______
U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
58-093 PDF WASHINGTON : 2025
COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND LABOR
ROBERT C. ``BOBBY'' SCOTT, Virginia, Chairman
RAUL M. GRIJALVA, Arizona VIRGINIA FOXX, North Carolina,
JOE COURTNEY, Connecticut Ranking Member
GREGORIO KILILI CAMACHO SABLAN, JOE WILSON, South Carolina
Northern Marina Islands GLENN THOMPSON, Pennsylvania
FREDERICA WILSON, Florida TIM WALBERG, Michigan
SUZANNE BONAMICI, Oregon GLENN GROTHMAN, Wisconsin
MARK TAKANO, California ELISE M. STEFANIK, New York
ALMA S. ADAMS, North Carolina RICK W. ALLEN, Georgia
MARK DeSAULNIER, California JIM BANKS, Indiana
DONALD NORCROSS, New Jersey JAMES COMER, Kentucky
PRAMILA JAYAPAL, Washington RUSS FULCHER, Idaho
JOSEPH D. MORELLE, New York FRED KELLER, Pennsylvania
SUSAN WILD, Pennsylvania MARIANNETTE MILLER-MEEKS, Iowa
LUCY McBATH, Georgia BURGESS OWENS, Utah
JAHANA HAYES, Connecticut BOB GOOD, Virginia
ANDY LEVIN, Michigan, Vice Chairman LISA McCLAIN, Michigan
ILHAN OMAR, Minnesota DIANA HARSHBARGER, Tennessee
HALEY M. STEVENS, Michigan MARY MILLER, Illinios
TERESA LEGER FERNANDEZ, New Mexico VICTORIA SPARTZ, Indiana
MONDAIRE JONES, New York SCOTT FITZGERALD, Wisconsin
KATHY MANNING, North Carolina MADISON CAWTHORN, North Carolina
FRANK J. MRVAN, Indiana MICHELLE STEEL, California
JAMAAL BOWMAN, New York CHRIS JACOBS, New York
SHEILA CHERFILUS-McCORMICK, Florida VACANCY
MARK POCAN, Wisconsin VACANCY
JOAQUIN CASTRO, Texas
MIKIE SHERRILL, New Jersey
ADRIANO ESPAILLAT, New York
KWEISI MFUME, Maryland
Veronique Pluviose, Staff Director
Cyrus Artz, Minority Staff Director
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C O N T E N T S
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Page
Hearing held on June 14, 2022.................................... 1
OPENING STATEMENTS
Scott, Hon. Robert C. ``Bobby'', Chairman, Committee on
Education and Labor........................................ 1
Prepared statement of.................................... 5
Foxx, Hon. Virginia, Ranking Member, Committee on Education
and Labor.................................................. 7
Prepared statement of.................................... 9
WITNESSES
Walsh, Martin J., Secretary, Department of Labor............. 11
Prepared statement of.................................... 14
ADDITIONAL SUBMISSIONS
Ranking Member Foxx:
Letter to Secretary Walsh dated February 23, 2022........ 96
Letter to Secretary Walsh dated November 2, 2021......... 98
Allen, Hon. Rick W., a Representative in Congress from the
State of Georgia:
Letter to Secretary Walsh dated March 8, 2022............ 100
Banks, Hon. Jim, a Representative in Congress from the State
of Indiana:
Letter to Secretaries Walsh and Yellen dated May 18, 2022 48
Omar, Hon. Ilhan, a Representative in Congress from the State
of Minnesota:
Article dated June 15, 2018, by the Toronto Star......... 103
QUESTIONS FOR THE RECORD
Responses to questions submitted for the record by:
Secretary Walsh.......................................... 105
EXAMINING THE POLICIES AND PRIORITIES
OF THE U.S. DEPARTMENT OF LABOR
----------
Tuesday, June 14, 2022
House of Representatives,
Committee on Education and Labor,
Washington, DC.
The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:18 a.m., 2175
Rayburn Building, Hon. Robert C. ``Bobby'' Scott (Chairman of
the Committee) presiding.
Present: Representatives Scott, Courtney, Sablan, Wilson of
Florida, Bonamici, Takano, Adams, DeSaulnier, Jayapal, Wild,
McBath, Hayes, Levin, Stevens, Leger Fernandez, Jones, Manning,
Mrvan, Bowman, Castro, Sherrill, Espaillat, Foxx, Wilson of
South Carolina, Thompson, Walberg, Grothman, Stefanik, Allen,
Banks, Comer, Fulcher, Keller, Miller-Meeks, Owens, Good,
McClain, Harshbarger, Fitzgerald, Cawthorn, Steel, and Jacobs.
Staff present: Brittany Alston, Staff Assistant; Ilana
Brunner, General Counsel; Rasheedah Hasan, Chief Clerk; Sheila
Havenner, Director of Information Technology; Eli Hovland,
Policy Associate; Stephanie Lalle, Deputy Communications
Director; Kevin McDermott, Director of Labor Policy; Kota
Mizutani, Deputy Comms Director; Max Moore, Policy Associate;
Kayla Pennebecker, Staff Assistant; Veronique Pluviose, Staff
Director; Jessica Schieder, Economic Policy Advisor; Michele
Simensky, Oversight Counsel-Labor; Banyon Vassar, Deputy
Director of Information Technology; Sam Varie Press Assistant;
ArRone Washington, Clerk and Special Assistant to the Staff
Director; Tanisha Wilburn, Director of Labor Oversight and
Counsel; Cyrus Artz, Minority Staff Director; Caitlin Burke,
Minority Professional Staff Member; Michael Davis, Minority
Legislative Assistant; Cate Dillon, Minority Director of
Operations; Mini Ganesh, Minority Staff Assistant; Amy Raaf
Jones, Minority Director of Education and Human Resources
Policy; Audra McGeorge, Minority Communications Director; Ethan
Pann, Minority Press Assistant; Krystina Skurk, Minority
Speechwriter; Kelly Tyroler, Minority Professional Staff
Member; and Joe Wheeler, Minority Professional Staff Member.
Chairman Scott. The Committee on Education and Labor will
come to order. Welcome everyone. I note a quorum is present.
The committee is now meeting today to hear testimony on
Examining the Policies and Priorities of the U.S. Department of
Labor. This is a hybrid hearing.
Pursuant to House Resolution 8, and the regulations
thereto, and all microphones, both in the room and on the
platform should be kept muted as a general rule to avoid
unnecessary background noise. Members and witnesses will be
responsible for unmuting themselves when they are recognized to
speak, or when they wish to seek recognition.
When members wish to speak, or seek recognition they should
unmute themselves and allow a pause of 2 seconds to ensure that
the microphone picks up their speech. I also ask that members
please identify themselves before they speak. Members who are
participating in person should not be logged on into a remote
platform to avoid feedback, echoes, and distortion.
Members participating remotely shall be considered present
in the proceeding when they are visible on camera, and they
shall be considered not present when they are not visible on
camera. The only exception to this is if you are experiencing
technical difficulties and inform the committee staff of such
difficulty.
If any member experiences technical difficulty during the
hearing, you should stay connected on the platform, make sure
you are muted, and use your phone to immediately contact the
committee's IT Director whose number was provided in advance.
Should the Chair need to step away for any reason, another
majority member is hereby authorized to assume the gavel in the
Chair's absence.
In order to ensure the committee's five/minute rule is
adhered to, staff will be keeping track of time using the
committee's digital timer on the remote platform. For members
participating in person the timer will be broadcast in the
Committee room on the television monitor as part of the
platform gallery view, and visible in its own thumbnail window.
The committee room timer will not be in use. For members
participating remotely this will be visible in gallery view in
its own thumbnail window on the remote platform. Members are
asked to wrap up promptly when their time has expired.
Finally, while recent guidance from the Office of Attending
Physician has made mask wearing optional at this time, please
note that we have in our midst, both at the member and staff
level, individuals who are immunocompromised, and/or have
immediate family members who are immunocompromised, and we ask
you to govern yourselves accordingly.
Pursuant to House Rule 8(c), opening statements are limited
to the Chair and Ranking Member, so I recognize myself for the
purpose of an opening statement.
Today we are meeting to discuss the Department of Labor's
budget request for Fiscal Year 2023. Secretary Walsh, I thank
you for being with us today and look forward to hearing your
vision to help all workers and their families succeed in our
economy. I will begin by reflecting on how far we have come in
our economic recovery during the Biden-Harris administration.
Two years ago in May 2020, our Nation's unemployment rate
was 13.2 percent. In May 2021, the unemployment rate had fallen
to 5.8 percent, thanks largely to the congressional democrats
and President Biden's American Rescue Plan. By last month it
had fallen to 3.6 percent, so as President Biden took office in
January 21, the economy has added nearly 8.7 million jobs.
In fact, 2021 saw the largest job growth in modern history.
This historic recovery is not by happen stance. It was
connected to President Biden and congressional democrats'
leadership, and thanks to the administration's comprehensive
efforts to mitigate COVID-19, and the American Rescue Plan,
more than 221 million Americans have been fully vaccinated,
allowing workers to return to safer workplaces.
Also, through the American Rescue Plan, we saved more than
one million retiree's hard-earned pensions through the
multiemployer pension fund. Had we not acted, pensions would
have failed, workers and retirees from truckers to bricklayers,
would have lost nearly everything they had worked to save, and
many participating employers would have been forced to close or
cut jobs because they were legally obligated to pay those
pensions until the businesses went broke.
While these steps are significant, our progress has not
been limited to just rebounding from the pandemic. I am pleased
to see that the administrations share the committee's
commitment to advancing workers' rights, and preparing workers
to compete in the modern economy.
Last September the administration took a critical step to
put money back into worker's pockets by increasing the Federal
minimum wage for Federal contract and subcontract workers. As a
result, nearly 400,000 low wage workers received a much-needed
raise. Just last April President Biden signed an Executive
Order to create a task force dedicated to promoting worker
organizing and collective bargaining.
The task force's recommendations, coupled with increased
investments in the Department's sub-agencies, will help ensure
that all workers can be empowered to build a better life for
themselves and their families. In addition, the Department's
Good Jobs Initiatives, and the budget's sizable increase in the
workforce development programs, will help ensure that
businesses can fill job openings with qualified candidates.
Simply put, it is evidenced by a year and a half of
progress, and the President's budget request that the Biden
Harris administration is the most proworker administration in
history. Although I recognize that our economic progress is
clouded by the rising costs of everyday goods that are
impacting people around the world, I applaud the President for
communicating a clear and responsible plan to address global
inflation.
Similarly, House Democrats continue to advance legislation
that will help bring down costs for America's workers and
families. For example, in March the House passed legislation
that would cap out-of-pocket insurance costs for insulin users
at $35.00 a month, slashing the average cost of patients nearly
in half, and for many it is a much more significant a
reduction.
Regrettably, this is not unanimous. An overwhelming
majority of Republicans opposed it. Last month the House passed
legislation that would help lower costs for consumers at the
gas pump, by putting an end to price gouging. Every House
Republican opposed that legislation. This week the House is
expected to consider legislation to lower food costs at the
grocery aisle by strengthening the food supply chain, and
insuring robust competition in the meat and poultry sectors.
One of the most important steps the Congress can take to
ease global inflation and strengthen our supply chains, is for
the House and Senate to reach an agreement on a bipartisan
innovation bill that retains the key worker provisions in the
House passed Competes Act.
Anticipate that we may hear some comments from our
colleagues on the other side about rising costs. We share those
concerns, and that is why we have been advancing responsible
bills that I mentioned, and others, to lower costs for working
people. Merely identifying the problem, and levering criticism,
without also offering credible solutions, is not constructive,
and it certainly does not constitute a plan.
Any comment from Republicans about global inflation should
be met with one simple question: what is the plan to address
it? The bottom line is that as lawmakers we must continue to
improve the lives of workers and their families. Over the past
year and a half, congressional Democrats have done exactly
that, leading to one of the strongest economic recoveries in
history.
Businesses are open, job market is booming, wages are
rising, pensions have been saved, and workers are safer on the
job. I am confident that together we can work to address the
challenges facing families and continue to build an economy
where everyone can succeed.
Thank you, Secretary Walsh for your time, and I look
forward to your discussion. I now recognize the distinguished
Ranking Member of the committee, Dr. Foxx for her opening
statement.
[The Statement of Chairman Scott follows:]
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Ms. Foxx. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. This Labor Department is
up a creek without a paddle. The Biden administration's
policies have created a worker shortage, record high inflation,
an environment of uncertainty for employers, and fewer choices
for job seekers.
The Department of Labor's response to these crises drag our
country further from solutions that will help the American
people. One of the biggest problems with this DOL is its
obvious union favoritism. In fact, this Department has bowed
low enough before union bosses to taste dirt.
How many times has the Biden administration's DOL cow
tailed before union bosses instead of standing up for workers.
Let me count the ways. First the DOL keeps attacking the nearly
19 million Americans who choose to act as independent
contractors. Why? It is harder to put independent contractors
under the thumb of union bosses, or DOL's army of regulators.
The American people are capable of choosing how they want
to work without Washington bureaucrats butting in. Second, the
White House Task Force on Worker Organization and Empowerment,
Vice Chaired by Secretary Walsh, is attempting to bypass
Congress to implement Pro Act policies through Executive Fiat.
The so-called Protecting the Right to Organize Act is an
attack on worker's rights and privacy, not to mention a massive
Washington power grab. By negating right to work laws in 27
states, the Pro Act would force more workers to give their
paychecks to big labor, which spends more on left wing special
interests than on worker representation.
Third, the DOL proposed an egregious Davis Bacon regulatory
change that uses an outdated prevailing wage definition from
decades past to favor union wage rates. This rule change will
disadvantage non-union construction workers bidding for Federal
contracts and lead to skyrocketing costs of Federal
construction to projects.
On the note of Federal contractors, your proposal to
rescind the Trump administration's rule protecting religious
organizations seeking Federal contracts is appalling. Faith-
based organizations should be able to bid for Federal contracts
without fear of having to compromise their religious identity
or mission. In all these ways DOL favors unions with proposals
and policies that will leave workers with less freedom, less
flexibility and fewer opportunities.
By undermining the right of the American people to enter
into contracts and to choose when, where and how to work, the
Biden DOL undermines the functioning of a free society, and a
robust workforce. These are just some of the ways the DOL has
favored unions above American job creators and workers.
DOL is also actively implementing plans that favor so-
called environmental justice over retirees and workers saving
for retirement. As inflation is eroding the spending power of
retiree's fixed income, and harming current workers abilities
to save, DOL is proposing to direct retirement plan fiduciaries
to consider environmental and social factors when selected, and
in monitoring investments.
This focus on left wing social policy hinders retirement
plan fiduciaries from maximizing the financial return on
workers and retirees' investments. Mr. Secretary, you said in
your statement that you are proud of what your department has
accomplished this year. I notice you did not mention the
illegal COVID-19 vaccine and testing emergency temporary
standard OSHA issued. The mandate that would cost many hard-
working Americans their jobs and would have worsened the worker
shortage.
Are you proud of this tyrannical mandate? Since you
requested a budgetary increase of nearly 50 percent to OSHA's
office in charge of devising and writing regulations, it seems
that you are proud of its work. How out of touch. I would also
like to know if you are proud of OSHA's predatory actions
against job creators.
OSHA continuously chooses to punish job creators, rather
than empower them to comply with Federal guidance. We know that
this trend will continue as your budget requests an 18 percent
increase for enforcement measures, and a mere 1 percent
increase for a program assisting small businesses in complying
with OSHA regulations.
Further, DOL's proposed a rule to end flexibility for
employment service staffing models, funded through the Wagner-
Peyser Act. This will have serious consequences for numerous
states that use private sector employees, local public sector
merit staff, or other staffing models to administer services
for job seekers and employers, such as job placement and
recruitment.
This rule will only do harm, increasing costs at a time of
already record high inflation, and removing a crucial tool
states use to hire staff, and deliver these critical services
to job seekers. Last, the skill gap is fueling the current
worker shortage, but instead of making the workforce system
more responsive to employer needs, the Biden administration had
doubled down on burdensome registered apprenticeships, while
shuttering the industry recognized apprenticeship program.
This is not something to be proud of. With this kind of
record, I am astonished that you have the gall to come here and
ask Congress to increase your budget. Mr. Secretary, we are not
that dense. We know that you would use a $1.6 billion dollar
budgetary increase to write more onerous regulations, to grow
DOL's fulltime staff by nearly 10 percent, and to enhance DOL's
capacity to litigate against employers.
We will not endorse more of the same policies that have
been failing our country. We have already seen that your
policies will not work. They will not create more jobs. They
will not fill the skills gap. They will not help our economy
recover, and they will not bring inflation down.
Republicans on the other hand have an agenda that will
foster a strong economy, remove unnecessary regulations, give
Americans the change to upskill and empower businesses to
create more jobs. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
[The Statement of Ranking Member Foxx follows:]
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Chairman Scott. Thank you. Without objection, all other
members who wish to insert written statements to the record may
do so by submitting them to the committee clerk electronically
in Microsoft Word format by 5 p.m. on June 28, 2022.
I will now introduce the witness. The Honorable Martin
Walsh is the 29th Secretary of the Department of Labor. He has
previously served almost 17 years in the Massachusetts House of
Representative, and 7 years as Mayor of Boston. He also served
as President of Laborers Union Local 223 and was head of Boston
Building Trades.
He is also, as I understand it, a season ticket holder of
the New England Patriots for almost 30 years. Mr. Secretary, we
appreciate your participating today and look forward to your
testimony. Your written statement will appear in full in the
hearing record, and you are asked to limit your oral
presentation to a 5-minute summary.
After your presentation, we will move to member questions.
I am sure you are aware of your responsibility to provide
accurate information to the committee, and therefore we will
proceed directly with your testimony. Secretary Walsh, you are
recognized.
STATEMENT OF HON. MARTIN WALSH, SECRETARY, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF
LABOR
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, very much Chairman Scott and
Ranking Member Foxx, and members of the committee today. I want
to thank you for inviting me to testify here in this hearing.
am certainly pleased and honored to outline the Biden-Harris
administration's priorities for the Department of Labor's
Fiscal Year 2023.
My mission as Secretary of Labor, and quite honestly, my
mission in all my roles I have ever held, is to empower
workers, all workers, morning, noon and night. The frontline
workers who carried us through the worst days of the pandemic,
who continue to carry us through the pandemic.
The marginalized workers who face barriers to employment
and opportunity. The veterans who served proudly our Nation.
The rural workers serve through targeted workforce training
grants. The Department of Labor stands with all workers, in
every community to build a stronger, more resilient, and
inclusive economy for all.
I certainly am very proud of all of the Department of
Labor's accomplishments in the past year. We implemented key
provisions of the President's American Rescue Plan, supporting
healthcare, pensions, and unemployment insurance. We protected
workers from COVID-19, and heat exposure. We strengthened
retirement security and access to mental health services and
continue to do it every day.
We expand career training programs to connect more
Americans to opportunity. We connect more industries with
skilled workers. We implemented the President's $15.00 an hour
minimum wage for Federal contractors, legislation to stop
surprise billing, protections for tip workers.
We advanced governmentwide initiatives to support workers'
organizing rights, climate action, and infrastructure
implementation. In all of our work we are committed to equity
for the most vulnerable workers in communities all across
America in your districts.
We have in this moment a unique opportunity to help all
workers thrive. The President's plans have produced historic
job recovery. Congress has made major investments in workers
through the bipartisan Infrastructure Law. In the Department of
Labor's Good Job Initiative, we are partnering across the
government to make sure these investments create good jobs, and
access for all people.
I am committed to supporting congressional efforts to
invest in the workforce, training, child support, education,
healthcare, that working families need and depend upon. In the
2023 budget submission goes in these investments, and renews
our pledge to serve workers, job seekers, and retirees in
America.
Workforce development is a vitally important area of
opportunity. High-quality job training programs lift workers
into the middle class and increase equity in each of our
economies. These programs meet the talent needs of employers
and strengthen our supply chain. That is why this budget
requests $303 million to expand registered apprenticeships,
because they are proven successful.
$100 million dollars for career training in growing
industry sectors, $100 million dollars for community college
partnerships with employers. I visited community colleges in
dozens of states. I have visited Job Corps Centers all across
this country. I see innovation programs designed in
collaboration with employers working with students of all
backgrounds.
We need to invest in these partnerships and reach out to
more employers. We need to provide more workers with better
opportunities. This budget also increases funding for veterans
through our Veterans Employment and Training Service Agency,
and it increases funding the Women's Bureau to expand access
for women's careers where they are underrepresented.
This budget invests $2.2 billion in the Department's Worker
Protection Agencies, their worker protection agencies. This
work is more essential than ever as we rebuild our staffing
levels. That includes OSHA's efforts to double the number of
inspectors by the end of the President's first term.
It would restore MSHA's capacity for enforcement in mine
plan and equipment review. It will restore staffing and our
Employment Benefits Security Administration to protect workers'
health, retirement, and disabilities benefits. It would
increase funding for our Wage and Hour Division to safeguard
wages of vulnerable workers. It would fund the Office of
Federal Contract Compliance Programs to ensure Federal
contracting advances America's promise of fairness for our
workers.
This budget increase is funding to the Office of Labor
Solicitor, rebuilding the entire Department's capacity to
enforce the laws that you pass. We are also requiring resources
for the Bureau of International Labor Affairs. ILAB ensures our
training partners uphold the labor commitments, so American
workers can compete on a level playing field.
The budget fully funds and updates the State funding
formulas for unemployment insurance. This will be the first
comprehensive update in decades. It allows states to serve
claimants more effectively, and our request includes 150
million dollars to strengthen the integrity of our system.
Finally, the budget requests $4 million to support the Good
Jobs Initiative. This enables us to advance the President's
priority of good jobs with the free and fair choice to join the
union if people want to. I see it everywhere I travel. Workers
are showing up and each and every day to move our communities,
and our Nation forward.
In return, we must do all we can to ensure their well-being
and empower them with the opportunity. I want to thank each and
every one of you for the opportunity to testify today. I look
forward to discussing the budget requests with the committee,
and with the members of this committee. Thank you, Mr.
Chairman.
[The prepared statement of Secretary Walsh follows:]
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Chairman Scott. Thank you, Mr. Secretary. Under Committee
Rule 9(a), we will now question the witness under the 5-minute
rule, and I will be recognizing committee members in order of
seniority. I now recognize the gentleman from Connecticut, Mr.
Courtney.
Mr. Courtney. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and good morning,
Secretary. Thank you for your testimony. I want to go back to
your point about the fact that we actually are at a moment of
opportunity right now with the number of job openings that are
in the U.S. economy. It is estimated there two openings for
every unemployed person.
One of the biggest challenges is closing the skill gap for
many of those job openings. You talked about the registered
apprenticeship funding, the Fitzgerald Act program, which has
you said is tried and true. Can you talk about what the
Department's, you know, sort of focus is going to be in terms
of trying to extend that help to, again, underrepresented
groups who have not, who--I think would be the ones that would
benefit the most from expanding registered apprenticeships.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, Congressman. You know one of
the--as I go around the country, and I visit districts and
businesses, I talk to businesses every day, and they talk about
the need for hiring people, and they talk about the need for
workforce development. They talk about the need for scaling
people up. People that might have worked in a different
industry, that they left the industry for the salary, and they
left the industry for a particular reason, and they are looking
for another skill.
I will just give two quick stories. One, when I was in your
district at Electric Boat. We had the opportunity to see young
people that worked at Job Corps, that came out of Job Corps
that were welders. They had an opportunity to work at Electric
Boat and see the expansion that has happened at Electric Boat,
and seeing the opportunity to create pathways in there for
young people of color in Connecticut, the opportunity to get
into those good paying jobs, an opportunity to raise their
family moving forward.
Another one, I was with Congressman Cole a couple of weeks
ago, down in Oklahoma, at Tinker Air Force Base. Again, we were
talking about the need to expand opportunities that the job
openings that were happening in electrical engineering, and
mechanical engineering, and welding, and places like that, and
talking about the opportunity.
How do we partner with not just our armed services, but how
do we partner more with businesses in America to create that
pathway into good paying jobs. There is a will for that. I have
done it in my whole career. I continue to do it as Secretary of
Labor. That's why we are asking for increases in workforce
development money. That is why we are asking for WIOA
reauthorization. That is why we are making these different
investments, is really, we are at a unique moment in time where
we are scaling workers up and helping workers that want to get
in a better position, creating those pathways into good paying
jobs.
We have a huge opportunity for people of color, and women,
and young people of color in our country right now. The
unemployment rate in America is 3.4 percent. The unemployment
rate in the Black community is 6.2, 6.2 percent. We should do
better than that.
Mr. Courtney. Thank you. To go back to your point about
Electric Boat. This year's hiring target is 3,600 new hires,
and again, the registered apprenticeship program, and the pre-
apprenticeship program, 10 weeks. You are hirable as a welder,
and then you again then transition into the full registered
apprenticeship program.
This year they have increased the number of Hispanic
workers at EB by 19 percent, so it shows that again, that is
where I think the opportunity is to really expand opportunity
for people.
Secretary Walsh. If you do not mind Congressman, I will
just take 30 seconds because I do not want to take your time. I
was in Germany a couple weeks ago, and we were at Volkswagen.
There was 16, 17, 18-year-old young people there as
apprentices, learning how to code, learning how the technology
of the future, and creating a pathway into good paying jobs.
That is an apprentice program that works.
We have programs in this country, apprentice programs that
work in the building trades, through trucking challenge, and
other ways. We want to expand those opportunities into other
industries, into the tech sector, into the biotech sector, into
sectors that need help. There are opportunities. We do not have
to look that far across the Atlantic Ocean and see so much
success in apprenticeship programs in so many different
industries. We should be taking some of those models here in
the United States.
Mr. Courtney. Great, thank you. In my last minute here on
June 1, at St. Francis Hospital in Tulsa, Oklahoma, four
individuals were killed in gun violence. Again, irate patient
who came in to complain about problems in his care, and it is
another example of where again, healthcare workplace is still
the site of the highest level of violence for workers.
Again, I know your department is moving forward on the OSHA
standard, and again, when you talked about the need to you know
bolster the workforce there of your OSHA programs, I mean it is
precisely to make sure that we get you know these types of
rules through the process quicker. It is a life and death
situation.
We passed the bill obviously in the House, which the
President endorsed. Maybe again, 10 seconds or so on that
issue.
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I had, 3 weeks ago in the Department
of Labor, we had the nurses in for Nurse's Week, and the
violence against nurses is up 20 percent this year, so we are
taking these issues very seriously, both the violence again in
the workplace, but also, and--we will talk a little later about
it, what the heat standards.
Mr. Courtney. All right. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman yields back. The
Ranking Member of the full committee, Dr. Foxx, you are
recognized for 5 minutes.
Ms. Foxx. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Secretary, your
written testimony did not mention the word inflation, but I
will. On Friday, the Bureau of Labor Statistics had bad news
for consumers and retirees, but it confirmed what consumers are
already feeling.
Over the last 12 months inflation increased 8.6 percent.
The largest 12 month increase in more than 40 years. Energy
prices are up 34.6 percent, food prices are up 10.1 percent,
shelter prices up 5.5 percent, the price of new vehicles up
12.6 percent, and the price of used cars and trucks up 16.1
percent.
With inflation running rampant and squeezing families,
workers, small businesses, and retirees, what is DOL doing to
ensure new regulations in the large increase in spending that
it is requesting will not exacerbate inflation?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, Ranking Member Foxx. There is
no question that inflation is causing pain for families in
America. That is why the President certainly has been very
focused on lowering the costs that families face and reduce the
Federal deficit as well. We are making real progress. Quite
honestly, the inflation issue that we are dealing with in the
United States of America is not just being dealt with the
United States of American, it is being dealt with all across
the globe.
What I am doing at the Department of Labor is working on
No. 1, on the supply chain issues, to get more goods and
services into our country. Part of the inflation is due to lack
of goods and supplies coming into this country in the early
days of the pandemic.
We are working with--across agency lines to bring the costs
of inflation down. I think we cannot ignore the facts that
inflation was not caused by President Joe Biden, the inflation
was not caused by the American Rescue Plan, and the inflation
will not be exacerbated by making other investments in job
training, workforce development, worker protections.
What we have to do, we have a war in Ukraine, and we are
still----
Ms. Foxx. Thank you, Mr. Secretary. I think we strongly
disagree on the fact that this is not being caused by the Biden
administration and the America Rescue Plan, definitely those
are the issues. Even Democrats are saying that. Mr. Secretary,
on October 27 you participated in strike activity at the
Kellogg's plant in Lancaster, Pennsylvania.
You are one-sided participation on behalf of the union in
this strike was inappropriate. As Secretary of Labor, you have
an obligation to demonstrate impartiality in both appearance
and in form. I have twice written to you about this matter and
have yet to receive a written response. I will ask you again,
did you seek ethics advice from DOL's attorney prior to your
visit to Kellogg plant, yes or no?
Secretary Walsh. Well, I will tell you I did go out to
Kellogg to talk to the workers. I went out there to try and be
helpful.
Ms. Foxx. Mr. Secretary, did you seek attorney's advice?
Secretary Walsh. Of course, I did.
Ms. Foxx. That is all I need to know.
Secretary Walsh. Of course, I did.
Ms. Foxx. OK. Will you provide me any written guidance or
advice you received on the legality of this visit, or your
ethical obligations related to the visit?
Secretary Walsh. I will also give you information on the
conversation I had with the CEO of Kellogg last week.
Ms. Foxx. OK. Will you commit to respond comprehensively in
writing all the questions in my previous two letters by the end
of this week?
Secretary Walsh. I do not know what the questions are in
your letter.
Ms. Foxx. OK. We have given them to you, we can send it
again.
Secretary Walsh. OK, thank you.
Ms. Foxx. The Office of Secretary General published a
report earlier this year that reviewed the education and
training administration's spending over the past 10 years and
found that upwards of 489 billion in grant funds intended for
workforce development were inefficiently used. The OIG
expressed three ongoing areas of concern in how ETA is handling
taxpayer dollars, including how the agencies are awarding
grants, reviewing grantee's use of funds, and measuring grantee
performance.
Any misuse of hard-earned taxpayer dollars is always
unacceptable. We are in the middle of a job crisis, and we must
ensure money is being put to its proper use so that we can
close the skills gaps and get Americans back to work. What
steps is ETA taking to ensure grant applicant's proposals meet
all program solicitation requirements?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I cannot speak to what happened 6, 8
and a half years ago as far as agreements, but I will look into
that for you, and get back to you on that. I can tell you my
team, our team at ETA is working extremely hard to make sure
that we are getting as many grant applications through the
process, and we are getting the funding to those applicants,
because right now at this moment in time as you alluded to in
your opening statements.
Ms. Foxx. Yes, what we need to know is that the money is
being used for their intended purposes. Getting the money out
the door is one thing, but getting accountability is even more
important.
Secretary Walsh. Yes, I was going to get there. My point is
we make sure we followup with the grant applicants. It is
something that I have demanded responses from, from my team, to
make sure that every dollar that we are spending in taxpayer's
dollars in America is getting spent in the proper way.
Ms. Foxx. Thank you, Mr. Secretary, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from the Northern
Mariana Islands, Mr. Sablan.
Mr. Sablan. Good morning, good morning, Chairman Scott.
Welcome, Mr. Secretary. Secretary Walsh wage theft--it is a
pervasive problem throughout the country, but my question is
directly is how many immigrants who obtain a visa to come to
the United States to work are victims of wage theft, and often
this issue is overlooked.
I would like to ask you if the Department is paying enough
attention to this serious problem. Reporting has shown for
example that the Department's closed cases increased only
slightly based on this from 424 cases in 2011 to 478 in 2019.
However, the total number of these annual workers visas has
went from 106,000 to 302,000. I am concerned that there are
many workers facing wage theft, who will never see those
illegally stolen wages returned, or maybe the Department is
doing something so well that this issue is becoming to get
under control.
Could you please explain why has the number of those cases
remained consistent from 2011 to 2019, despite the fact that so
many additional employers are hiring and reaping benefits from
these workers?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, Congressman. Let me just
address this two ways. In 2021, the Department of Labor Wage
and Hour Division recovered more than $230 million in back
wages for over 190,000 workers all across America. Last year,
in one of the responses that we had to that 2021 and going
back. The Department of Labor held over 4,700 outreach events
involving 179,000 participants.
What we are trying to do is to let people know, understand
what their rights are, and that the Department of Labor Wage
and Hour are there for them. On the questions that go back pre-
2021, I will have to get back to you on the answers on that
one.
Mr. Sablan. All right. OK, thank you, Mr. Secretary. I do
have another question, but I will enter it into the record for
your attention, and your response. Mr. Chairman, I yield back
my time.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Next is the gentleman from South
Carolina, Mr. Wilson. You are recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. Wilson. Thank you, very much Chairman, for your
leadership. Thank you, Mr. Secretary, for being here. Mr.
Secretary, your budget requests sadly favors more regulations,
more enforcement, and more litigation, but not much to help
workers and business comply. If enacted, your budget request
would increase OSHA's office in charge of writing regulations
by nearly 50 percent, and you proposed incredibly to hire
nearly 200 more employees for the disgraced Office of the
Solicitor of Labor.
South Carolina has successfully overcome an out-of-control
Solicitor of Labor with the leadership of Governor Nikki Haley,
Senators Tim Scott and Lindsay Graham, Attorney General Allen
Wilson, we were able to stop the Department from what they were
attempting to do, which was to close Boeing to Charleston ever
before they began production.
Fortunately, with Nikki Haley's leadership, we now have
9,000 people who work for Boeing and suppliers across South
Carolina, but that would have not been possible if we had an
out of control Solicitor of Labor. Your OSHA budget for
compliance assistance only increases by 11 percent with only a
1 percent increase, obviously below inflation, for small
business compliance assistance.
As the American people struggle with inflation, war on
service stations, and looming recession, how do you justify
policies that penalize businesses without providing them the
compliance assistance?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, Congressman, for the question.
First and foremost, just the goal of the Department of Labor is
not to punish businesses. The goal of the Department of Labor
is to work collectively with businesses, to enhance businesses
for success. That is why in this budget we are proposing $2.2
billion investment for work protections to work a job
enforcement and worker training and workforce development
grants.
The two areas that you talked about, which, I am going to
throw in a third one. We are asking for 9.6 million dollars for
OSHA for standards to make sure that we can make sure that we
have worker protection for workers. We are asking for $3.4
million for MSHA, and we are asking for in our solicitor's
office, a modest increase. We are not asking for these large
increases that we are looking for.
What we want to do is make sure that when we are doing
regulations, and when we are doing worker protections, that we
are able to work across the board. I can honestly say in my
entire career I have never gone after businesses. I work
collectively with businesses.
Mr. Wilson. Well, that is encouraging, but again the
experience in my home State. We will never get over the
Department of Labor, the Solicitor General coming in to close
an extraordinary business being Boeing Aircraft, even before
they began production, except that they had a million square
foot building, they had 1,000 employees, and then your
Department, prior to you, came in and said you cannot build
planes here.
I am just so proud of Governor Haley, Senator Scott,
Senator Graham, Attorney General Allen Wilson, who is on the
ballot today in a primary. South Carolina stood firm that we
need to be working together, rather than because hey, aircraft
sales, export, are so important to the United States.
Another issue is right to work. I am really grateful to
have introduced H.R. 1275, the National Right to Work Act in
the House. Over 100 co-sponsors. This leaves it up to the
states to determine the requirement of union membership. This
bill erases automatic dues clauses in the Federal statute
without adding a single letter to Federal law. Given that
employment rose by 11 percent in right to work states, as a
group of 2010 to `20, five times as much as the force union in
some states.
Why is the Biden administration pushing to eliminate the
right to work laws? Would that not inevitably pose great harm,
destroy jobs, at a time when we are trying to have a recovery
of our economy?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, Congressman, for that question.
I do not support right to work states. I do not support right
to work. I support people's rights to be able to join a union
freely, and fairly if they choose. It does not mean it is
automatic. There are many states in this country that do not
have right to work laws that workers have decided not to
organize.
The Biden administration believes in people's collective
right if they want to organize. They do not force them to
organize, you do not have to organize, and that is been the
policy of President Biden since he has been in Congress.
Mr. Wilson. I respectfully disagree. What you all are
proposing is forced unionization. My home State of South
Carolina--because of right to work, we are now the leading
producer and exporter of cars of any State in the union. We are
the leading manufacturer and exporter of tires of any State in
the union, due to French, Japanese, German, and Singapore
investments.
Right to work works, and I hope that you will look into it.
I yield back. Thank you.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from Florida, Ms.
Wilson, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
Ms. Wilson. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and Ranking Member
Foxx. Thank you, Secretary Walsh, for being here today. It is
always good to see you. I am proud to have you fighting on
behalf of American workers. I am also proud though you have a
Floridian as an assistant, Secretary Jose Javier Rodriguez, on
your team supporting the re-employment assistance. We are so
proud of him from Miami Dade County.
Secretary Walsh, we learned at a hearing on WIOA
reauthorization last year that retaining high-quality
instructional staff at Job Corps centers is challenging because
local school districts can pay more, and draw talent away. At
the same time, no wage floor is tied to locality pay raise in
Job Corps centers because the Department has taken
administrative action to exempt Job Corps from the service
contract act.
This is puzzling because nothing in the Service Contract
Act prohibits coverage for Jobs Corps center contractors. Will
you commit to looking into this exemption and the Department's
steps to ensure that the contractors who are running Job Corps
centers are covered under the Service Contract Act?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, Congresswoman. Right now, what
we are doing with Job Corps in the Department of Labor is we
are looking at realigning and reevaluating, and strengthening
Job Corps. Part of that is going to be looking at the
contracts, making sure that first and foremost the staff are
being treated fairly, and paid good wages.
No. 2, making sure that the effectiveness of the program is
effective. We have 57,000 young people that go through Job
Corps every year, and there is no reason why those 57,000 young
people that go through Job Corps are not connected to a job.
Almost everyone in this hearing has a Job Corp in your
district, or near your district.
I think quite honestly, in some cases Job Corps is very
successful. In other cases, I think the Job Corps program has
let our young people down over the last 20 years in this
country. We are in the process right now of reevaluating, and I
would not say reconstructing is still too hot of a word, but
reevaluating, and making adjustments in Job Corps so that the
programs are impactful, both for the participants that go
through it, and No. 2, the staff that work there.
Ms. Wilson. Thank you so much. As Subcommittee Chair of
Higher Education and Workforce Innovation, and an original co-
sponsor of WIOA, I am looking forward to following up with your
team to ensure contract workers are covered. Secretary Walsh, I
have had several hardworking newspaper workers from South Miami
reach out to me since Trump left office about overtime pay.
Before President Trump left office his wage and hour
division classified newspaper workers as creative
professionals, and not eligible for overtime. That is horrible,
and this has resulted in thousands of our newspaper employees
doing work they are not compensated for, including my
constituents at my local paper, the Miami Herald.
What is the Department's position on rescinding this Trump
era provision, which is not fair?
Secretary Walsh. On the overtime provision, what we are
doing, we have just completed listening sessions. We have not
taken any action yet as far as moving forward, but we have done
listening sessions all across the country, so I will have to
get back to you on what the next step is.
Ms. Wilson. Well, thank you so much. I appreciate you
looking into it and getting back with me. I want to thank you
for your commitment to equity, but further as a Black woman,
when I heard you speak of the struggles Black women have to
obtain high-quality jobs in our workforce I was sadden beyond
belief.
In Miami this issue has been further complicated by decades
of underinvestment in the agency by Republican leadership,
namely Governor DeSantis. Just last year, and even today I
received dozens of calls from well-meaning Floridians begging
for help with the long waits at the Florida Department of
Economic Opportunity to both talk to someone, and then also
receive the unemployment benefits they are rightfully owed.
Mr. Secretary, what, if any, help can you and your staff
give to every day Floridians who are waiting for help and their
benefits? Is there anything in this budget to address these
challenges?
Secretary Walsh. There is money that we are looking for in
our Women's Bureau to get a path for getting more people and
more women, particularly women of color, engaged, opening,
expanding pipelines to careers in infrastructure, including
apprenticeships, pre-apprentice programs historically jobs like
the trades pay better than other jobs.
Women have not gone into those areas. Childcare, and elder
care are careers where a lot of women are, and they are
underpaid. We are working through the Women's Bureau, and we
are also when we think about in my opening statement when I
said we are focused on equity, inclusion, those are the areas
we are going.
There are lots of different areas in this budget, including
the WIOA reauthorization.
Ms. Wilson. Thank you so much, Mr. Secretary. I look
forward to working with you in the coming days to address these
critical issues, and I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Next, the gentleman from
Pennsylvania, Mr. Thompson, 5 minutes.
Mr. Thompson. Chairman, thank you so much. Thank you, Mr.
Secretary, for being with us today. It is no surprise that
within my colleagues, that workforce development is a top
priority of mine, and my questions center around that. From
career technical education to apprenticeships, I fully support
programs that provide learners of all ages with career ready
skills.
One of my proudest moments as a Member of Congress was when
President Trump signed into law the Strengthen Career and
Technical Education for the 21st Century Act that passed with
unified support of my colleagues, Republican and Democrat
alike, back in 2018, you know which bolstered our Nation's
workforce system by increasing alignment with in demand jobs,
and improving employer engagements so that more students have
the opportunities to move into in demand jobs and successful
careers.
As you know the Bureau of Labor Statistics released its job
report earlier this month. Sadly, the report indicted there are
11.4 million jobs open and available, which remains a record
high. Now this report also found that 4.4 Americans quit their
jobs just in April. Now it is abundantly clear businesses are
still struggling to hire qualified candidates with skills
necessary to fill these job needs, and this is highly
concerning to me.
One of--I think one of the things that has made part of
American exceptionalism, whether you agree or disagree with
that, is the fact that it is the quality of our workforce here
in this country. Now, Mr. Secretary, my question is simple.
What is the Department doing to ensure that individuals have
the skills necessary to fill these jobs and get people back to
work?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, Congressman. First of all,
thank you for your opening statement there. It is great to see
that we need to continue to work together, and I think the
issues of workforce development is an area that every one of us
in this Congress, in the administration can work together on.
When you think about the job openings in the country, and
you think about the quit rates in the country, people leaving,
look, they are looking for better opportunity. What I really
want to do at the Department of Labor, we talked about a little
while ago in my opening statement, and what we try to do every
day, and I would love to work with you directly on this, is
work with companies in looking for the folks that they want to
hire.
What the job workforce development needs are, what the job
skills needs are, and how do we make sure that we are putting
these investments, somebody asked me a question earlier today,
we are making these investments in taxpayer's dollars that they
are actually making a difference, and creating a pathway into
good paying jobs all across America.
Whether it is Boeing in South Carolina, whether it is
Electric Boat in Connecticut, whether it is Tinker Air Force
Base in Oklahoma, or any part of the country. We are working to
make sure we are expanding apprenticeships, No. 1, and No. 2,
we are having dialogs through the Good Jobs Initiative.
We have an event at the Department of Labor next week. We
are going to have 475 different businesses and legislators, and
mayors, and organizations talking about how do we create better
pathways? Quite honestly, we cannot miss this opportunity. I
think rather than sitting saying this is a tragedy what is
going on in America, this is an opportunity that we have, so I
look forward to working with you on that.
Mr. Thompson. Mr. Secretary, I certainly agree, and I have
always focused on adding rungs to the ladder of opportunity,
and that upward mobility that comes through that. Following-up
on this, local employers have flexibility to replace the 3
million workers, those that are looking to climb that rung on
the ladder of opportunity. 3 million workers have gone missing
from the workforce since the start of COVID-19.
As you know, apprenticeships can help states fill open
jobs, but the 85 year old registered apprenticeship system
needs to be updated to provide employers more flexibility.
Given this situation, why is Washington not updating the
apprenticeship system, so that industry experts have more say
in apprenticeship programs?
Secretary Walsh. Yes, what we are looking at two things.
No. 1, is we are looking at expanding apprenticeship programs
to bring more industries into it, and I think that that is
something that is really important to do. Second, we have an
advisory board on apprenticeship that has been very active,
that is made up of community colleges, workforce development
boards, businesses, labor, organizations, and we are working in
the Apprenticeship Committee, Advisory Committee right now is
working on ways of strengthening our apprenticeship programs in
the United States of America.
As we continue to do that work, we will get that
information to you. As a matter of fact, I would love to
offline have a conversation with you about some of the ideas
you might have.
Mr. Thompson. Mr. Secretary, I look forward to that. I
would encourage you in the makeup of that Apprenticeship
Advisory Committee, take a page out of the WIOA legislation
that this committee passed a number of years ago where we set a
standard of workforce investment boards being at least 60
percent of employers--those folks that sign the front of the
paycheck, not the back of it.
I think that would serve your efforts with apprenticeships
very well. Thank you so much. Thank you, Chairman.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Next, the gentlelady from
Oregon, Ms. Bonamici.
Ms. Bonamici. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Secretary
Walsh, for being here today and for your leadership. When you
were visiting in Oregon, you talked about the importance of
pre-apprenticeships, and the great work of Oregon tradeswomen.
Few people can afford to dedicate weeks or months to a pre-
apprenticeship program without income to support themselves and
their families. Unpaid programs will therefore,
disproportionately exclude people with fewer financial
resources, and likely result in a pool of apprentices that
lacks racial, ethnic and gender diversity.
Secretary Walsh, how would investments in registered
apprenticeships, as outlined in the department's budget request
increase the affordability of pre-apprenticeships, and expand
diversity in the trades?
Secretary Walsh. Well thank you very much, Congresswoman.
First and foremost, in my career I have created two pre-
apprentice programs. Those pre-apprentice programs, the
importance of the pre-apprentice program is getting somebody
the knowledge of what field they might go into. When I created
those programs, there were two things we did.
No. 1 is we were able to--and they are both in construction
at the time, so just so we know what I am talking about. We are
able to create a stipend where these workers would come in,
join the pre-apprentice program, get paid while they are in a
pre-apprentice program.
We also provided them with the boots and the tools, and the
belts, and the things that people needed because quite
honestly, we are taking people off the street that we are
trying to open up a whole new world for, and they do not have
the money to buy a hammer. They do not have the money to buy a
pair of work boots, and they certainly do not have the money to
take time off of their job, usually making minimum wage to go
to a pre-apprentice program.
That is what we think about pre-apprentice programs. We
have to think about how do we help people funding and creating
pathways? The second thing is with pre-apprentice programs, we
need to make sure that people get the knowledge in the pre-
apprentice program that they know what they are going to be
challenged with when they get into an apprentice program and
get into a career.
Now the model that we all think about when we think about
apprenticeships is building trades. They spent their own money,
and it is a $2 billion investment a year. They do their own
money in that, and in some cases, non-union companies have
apprenticeships too in the construction trades, so they have
the apprenticeships.
We have to take that model from the construction industry,
and put that into other industries, and get those pre-
apprenticeships in there, so people get an understanding. When
I talked about Volkswagen last week, when I was in Volkswagen,
these are 16, 17, 18-year-old kids that were learning a skill,
but they also got a stipend.
They would be getting paid while they were learning on the
job training, and then they were going to school, they were
doing other things, so that is the magic success to a pre-
apprentice program.
Ms. Bonamici. It does make a difference, and I have had
conversations with people in pre-apprenticeship programs. It is
life changing. Mr. Secretary, we hear a lot about staffing
shortages these days, and workforce challenges. What difference
would it make if workers had access to affordable childcare?
Secretary Walsh. I mean childcare, if anybody in this
committee goes out to the local coffee shop, or the grocery
store this weekend when you are out there shopping, ask a young
person about childcare. Ask about the costs. Oftentimes what we
have seen during this pandemic, we have seen particularly women
leave the workforce quite honestly, because they were not
making it work.
They were paying 50, 60, 70 percent of their salary to go
to work just to provide childcare, when they could just stay at
home and do it. What you are seeing a lack of workers in the
field, and you know in the Build Back Better provision there
was one aspect of that, well--a couple aspects, but the one
aspect I think is really important for the future of our
economy, is dealing with the childcare system that we have in
America.
Much of the childcare system is either left for the states,
the locals, or communities to try to figure out on their own,
and they cannot keep the workers there because they are
underpaid, and they are overworked. The pandemic really had big
impacts on childcare facilities, because from March 2020
through the end of 2020, childcare providers were shut down
because people were working from home.
What happened was they lost their staff. They lost their
overhead, they lost their funding, they lost their money, and
there is nothing to support that. I honestly feel that as the
Labor Secretary, if we are thinking about what the crises are
in the future, one of our crises is childcare for our workers,
another crisis which may come up later on is immigration.
We have to figure out those two issues. Those are two big
issues looming for our economy.
Ms. Bonamici. Mr. Secretary, we are not giving up on the
childcare issue. We want to unleash the power of women, we
absolutely must make sure that our childcare workers make a
living wage, and that childcare is affordable for families.
Mr. Chairman, I wanted to say that as a member of the
Select Committee on the Climate Crisis, and the Committee on
Science based on Technology and Education and Labor, I am
interested in addressing policy issues at the intersection of
workforce and energy. I have spoken with members of the energy
efficiency industry, which employs more Americans than any
other energy profession, about the challenges they faced with
accessing Federal workforce training dollars.
I am going to be submitting questions for the record, Mr.
Secretary and Mr. Chairman, to explore this issue in depth,
because as we transition to clean energy, we need to build a
clean energy workforce as well, so I will look forward to the
Department's prompt response on that, and look forward to
working with you and the committee on addressing that issue.
Secretary Walsh. I would like to say to you Chairwoman,
thank you so much for your willingness and offer to speak at
the Good Jobs Initiative next week. We are very excited. You
have a lot to offer there and thank you for that.
Ms. Bonamici. Thank you, Mr. Secretary, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from Michigan, Mr.
Walberg.
Mr. Walberg. I thank you Mr. Chairman, and I probably
should hesitate, but I am not going to. Hearing the opening
statements of both the Secretary and the Chairman, talking
about the great things that were going on--historic successes
that are taking place in our economy, I just wanted to make
sure the citizens who might be listening to this hearing do not
assume that those statements were taking from Babylon B.
I say that in good humor, but I say it in reality,
especially when I just read a recent survey that says at least
83 percent of Americans ascribe their view of the U.S. economy
negatively, and by other measures, Americans are experiencing
levels of economic dissatisfaction not seen in years, for only
the second time in a half century, more than three in 10
respondents said their financial situation was worse off.
I mean that is the reality of what we are living in right
now, and the challenges we have. Let me ask you Secretary Walsh
or make a statement here. First, on April 20, the department
noticed a proposed rule that will require states to use their
State and merit staff to provide services under the Wagner-
Peyser Act of employment services.
This one size fits all rule would require all states to use
State and merit staff, regardless of whether states had a long-
standing waiver to operate under alternate staffing models,
such as Colorado, Massachusetts, and my home State of Michigan.
The Michigan system of providing employment services has a
track record of success, consistently outpacing the national
median for performance, and has one of the lowest costs per
participant in the country.
However, because of this rule, 20 job centers will be
forced to close in Michigan, two in Detroit alone, and more
than 220 jobs will be placed in jeopardy. Secretary Walsh, as
you know the Trump administration issued a rule granting states
maximum flexibility in their staffing models to provide
employment services. The rule that your Agency is now proposing
seeks to undo that flexibility to align employment service with
unemployment insurance staffing models.
The text argues that this will allow staff to respond to
demand for unemployment insurance, which is more important.
``I'll personally take employment over unemployment insurance
any day.'' Secretary Walsh, the labor shortage continues to be
a challenge for small businesses, with 51 percent of owners
reporting job openings, which matches a 48-year record high.
With all due respect, I believe this rule suggests the
administrations lacks touch with reality, and is focused on
keeping people out of work, rather than getting people back
into good paying jobs. I hope this is not the case. Mr.
Secretary, with the current workforce crisis facing our
country, why is the department proposing to end this
flexibility when the change will drive up program costs and
harm employers and job seekers by limiting available resources?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, Congressman. I just you know in
regards to the rulemaking, because of the deliberative of
rulemaking process and it is still pending, I am unable to
really provide you with a timetable concerning the final rule
or concerning what is in the rule, and as you know the rules, I
cannot talk about that.
Mr. Walberg. You have suggested the ending of that
flexibility that was in the last administration's handling of
employment issues.
Secretary Walsh. Again, it is in the rulemaking process. I
cannot get into, actually I do not know what is in the final
rule because the rules going through the process.
Mr. Walberg. Well, we will submit questions for the record
then.
Secretary Walsh. Yes, please.
Mr. Walberg. Hoping at the very least we get your staff to
give us some idea relative to what is going on in this process.
Let me move on. I am disappointed to hear multiple statements
from the Department of Labor officials that the department is
determined to resurrect some or all of the 2016 fiduciary rule.
This was an unmitigated disaster and was invalidated by the
Fifth Circuit U.S. Court of Appeals.
As you know the Administrative Procedure Act governs the
process by which Federal agencies develop and issue
regulations. Earlier this year, a lawsuit was filed against the
department's Employee Benefits Security Administration alleging
that EBSA issued sub-regulatory guidance that amounted to
rulemaking, and failed to comply with APA requirements.
Have you reviewed this suit, and EBSA's work on the
fiduciary rule? What is your office doing to ensure that the
Department of Labor and EBSA fully comply with APA's
requirements?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you very much. When retirement
savers receive advice on how to best meet their particular
financial needs, they should be able to trust in the advice
that they are receiving, and understand that is the best
interest. We want to make sure that American workers and their
families are protected as they save for their retirement.
Last year the Department of Labor allowed a new exemption
to go into effect, including protections for advice on
rollovers such as from employee's benefits to IRA's. These
types of rollovers often represent a lifetime of savings and
deserve better protections. What we want to do is make sure
that the person, the employee, or the private citizen is
protected. We also want to make sure that the playing field is
level, and the level playing field for companies that exist
right now.
Mr. Walberg. Well, the Court is not in agreement with you
on this, and I just am concerned that we are going back after a
dead horse as it were, that will not do what you are
suggesting, that I would want to see as well. We found a better
way to do it than go backward as well. With that I yield back.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, sir.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from California,
Mr. Takano.
Mr. Takano. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Secretary Walsh, thank
you for coming before the committee today. I am not sure if you
are aware of not, but last year my office alongside with some
members of this committee submitted a letter to the department
asking for the adoption of a salary threshold in line with the
historical high point of salary thresholds, the 55th percentile
of earnings, of fulltime salaried workers nationwide, which
would be at least $82,732.00 by 2026.
I want you to know that I am planning to send another
letter reiterating that same request and asking for an update
on the rulemaking process because I am frankly concerned that
we are going to be running out of time to get this rule
promulgated. Now do you believe that the current overtime pay
threshold of $35,568.00 for white collar employees is too high,
too low, or just about right?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, Congressman. I actually do not
have an opinion on that at the moment. We would have just gone
through listening sessions, so I do not have an opinion, a
public opinion, on that at this moment.
Mr. Takano. I understand. Well, maybe I can ask you this.
Are you aware that the 1970's roughly 65 percent of all
salaried workers qualified for overtime pay?
Secretary Walsh. I was not.
Mr. Takano. It is true. What I also believe is true if you
happen to know what the overtime pay, what percent of workers
were covered by the overtime threshold, who was eligible, what
percent were eligible by the time Obama was President?
Secretary Walsh. I do not have that number either.
Mr. Takano. Between 7 and 10 percent. The overtime, the
threshold had never been updated or had been so infrequently
updated that the numbers of Americans who worked fulltime
salaried jobs who were covered by overtime pay, under the FLSA,
had atrophied, had declined from 65 percent to around 10
percent.
Well, you know President Obama and his Secretary of Labor
clicked through a promulgated rule toward the end of the second
term of the Obama administration, second administration. That
rule was validated by a conservative Federal Court Judge,
however the Obama--the Labor Secretary under Obama, under
actually Trump, appealed that case, and is it your belief that
you have the authority of Secretary of the Department to
establish the threshold?
Secretary Walsh. I believe we do through the rulemaking
process. At the end of the Obama administration, and I believe
in the beginning days of the Trump administration they did
address the issue of overtime. They moved it in a positive way,
not quite to the 55 percentile, but I know that they did move
it. I believe from what I have been told by my solicitor into
the process, we do have the ability to look at not just
overtime, but also duty stations if we choose.
Mr. Takano. Well, were you aware that the Trump DOL rule
gutted overtime pay and protections for roughly 4.2 million
workers that were previously eligible to receive overtime pay
compensation under the Obama administration rule?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I knew the rule, that the Trump rule
was very different than the Obama rule.
Mr. Takano. There was a differential. Even though President
Trump argued that he was a populist, trying to do right by
America's working people, the rule that they promulgated meant
that 4.2 million workers that would have been covered, would
have been made eligible, were not eligible under the Trump
rule. You were aware of that, right? OK.
Can you speak further about when DOL plans to issue a
notice of proposed rulemaking?
Secretary Walsh. I do not have an exact timeline. We just
finished the public--taking input from the public comment, and
we are going to be looking and seeing what the information we
receive from people.
Mr. Takano. Well, many legislators such as myself, are
under the impression that time is working against us, and that
important window of opportunity may soon close. In the past I
have introduced legislation to index the overtime threshold. Do
you believe that this is necessary?
Secretary Walsh. I believe that we have to look at it. Take
a serious look at it as we move forward.
Mr. Takano. OK. You know your policy sets the Federal
minimum wage, overtime threshold and the standard work week all
exist to mandate standards for the well-being of workers. I
recently introduced the 32-hour work week bill, to reduce the
standard work week from 40 hours to 32 hours by lowering the
maximum hours threshold for overtime compensation to nonexempt
employees under FLSA.
We started to see countries around the world begin to
experiment with truncated work weeks. Have you paid attention
to these preliminary pilot programs?
Secretary Walsh. I certainly, after you mentioned it to me
when we visited your district, I have been paying attention to
it.
Mr. Takano. All right. Well, I am running out of time, but
maybe we can have further public discussion of this.
Secretary Walsh. Absolutely. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Takano. I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman's time has
expired. The gentlelady from New York, Ms. Stefanik.
Ms. Stefanik. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Secretary Walsh,
during last year's hearing I asked you why the Biden
administration abruptly ended the Payroll Audit Independent
Determination, or the PAID program, which was a successful
compliance assistance program created out of the Trump
administration.
At the time you said you were not familiar with this
program at all, that is a quote. That was very concerning to me
that as the Secretary of Labor you were not aware of the
decision of your own department to unwind this program. After
you have taken the time to learn about it, which I am sure you
have, I hope you found which are the facts, that the PAID
program incentivized employers to proactively identify and fix
any inadvertent payroll mistakes, getting workers 100 percent
of the wages they earned faster than a traditional
investigation would.
This also allowed DOL to reach employers that typically
were not prioritized for enforcement. This was a resounding
success under the Trump administration millions of back pay--
millions of back wages were paid, and this benefited tens of
thousands of workers.
Given this success, why did the administration end this
program that helped employers comply with the law, a program
that is a pro-worker program?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you very much. Last year when I was
asked the question, I think I was about 6 weeks on the job, so
it was you know there was a lot that happened in the
administration before I even got to be Secretary of Labor. That
is yesterday's news. Workers are certainly entitled to every
single penny that they have earned.
The last administration's Payroll Audit Independent
Determination program, after looking at it we understood that
it deprived workers of their rights to put employers that
played by the rules at a disadvantage. In January 2021,
obviously we ended the program, wage and hour.
The provision provides significant outreach in educational
resources for employers seeking assistance to understand the
responsibility to comply with the wage and hour laws. We
continue to work with businesses. U.S. Department of Labor is
rigorously enforcing the law, and we will see that all the
enforcement tools we have available, so we are going to
continue to work with businesses on this.
Ms. Stefanik. Sure. I know that your argument is that it
deprives workers of their rights, and that is simply not
accurate. After an employer identifies back wages owed to
employees through the PAID program, each individual employee
has the choice to accept the back wages from the employer, or
to decline the settlement, and this preserves their private
right of action. The decision remains, and is squarely in the
hands of the worker.
Moving onto worker classification, which is an important
issue. Nearly 19 million Americans choose the freedom and
flexibility of engaging in the modern economy as independent
contractors. This is something that as a new mom, many of my
fellow new moms pursue this flexibility.
They choose being their own boss over working as an
employee for someone else. They choose when and how to provide
their services, earning on their own terms instead of being
told when to clock in, and when to clock out. My question is
why Secretary Walsh, is the Department targeting independent
contractors, and trying to take away that freedom and
flexibility that are currently enjoyed by redefining employee
status under the Fair Labor Standards Act?
My frustration is that the administration does not believe
Americans--they do not trust Americans to choose for themselves
how to earn a living, and that bureaucrats in Washington should
dictate how they work. I simply disagree with that, but I am
curious why the department is making that determination.
Secretary Walsh. 19 million people do not choose to be
independent contractors all across the board. Some of those
folks are being forced into those different jobs understanding,
thinking that they are hired as employees, and then they get
paid as with a 1099. What we want to do is make sure workers
that do choose to work as independent contractors, have the
protections they have, and workers that want to be employees,
should be treated as employees.
Ms. Stefanik. Sure. To address the misclassification of
workers, I would urge you to work with Congress to update the
FLSA and insert the common law standard for work classification
that is used by most other Federal agencies, bringing a clear
and consistent set of rules across the Federal Government.
I have legislatively been very active on that. I think it
is very important that you know that Congress is working on
this. Also, if you truly wanted to address this
misclassification, we should leave the Trump administration
rule in effect, as it provided clear rules of the road for
workers and employees on what constitutes an employer/employee
relationship, and when a worker is an independent contractor,
and I yield back the balance of my time.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from North
Carolina, Ms. Adams.
Ms. Adams. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Secretary
Walsh, I would like to start with lessons you learned as a
result of the pandemic. What has the impact of COVID-19
pandemic, and other recent events on workers taught the
Department about the need to have a national comprehensive paid
family and medical leave program?
Secretary Walsh. I think that the pandemic actually
exasperated that. I think we needed a comprehensive paid family
leave program prior to the pandemic. I think what we have
learned during the pandemic, I mean we are still living in the
pandemic times, but we are seeing lots of families that need to
take care of their families, take care of sick relatives, so
paid family leave if you look at the world, the global economic
world, we are at the bottom of the list when you talk about
paid family leave.
It seems to be very successful in Europe and other
countries, that offer paid family leave for the employees. I
have spoken to companies in America that have offered paid
family leave, and quite honestly the benefits for the companies
has been retention, retaining people, and a workforce that is
very productive.
Ms. Adams. OK. Well, thank you for that. Let me turn our
attention to the issue of workforce preparedness and
apprenticeships. That is one thing that we also previously
talked about. One of the Department's budget priorities is the
registered apprenticeship system. You and I both agree on the
importance of apprenticeship programs in fortifying our
workforce pipeline.
Can you talk about partnerships that the Department of
Labor has with HBCU, or other minority serving institutions in
recruiting events, or hosting registered apprenticeship
programs.
Secretary Walsh. Yes. Well first and foremost, partnership
are key to a registered apprenticeship programs and pre-
apprenticeship programs. You have those partnerships to create
a pathway into different industry it is going to be key. As a
matter of fact, later on today I have a meeting in my office
with Marc Moriel from the Urban League to talk exactly about
workforce development job trainings. The budget request that we
are asking for here is 303 million dollars for registered
apprenticeships.
Quite honestly, it is to expand, modernize, and diversify
registered apprenticeships by investing in high quality youth
and pre-apprentice programs. Historical Black colleges,
community colleges, organizations, community workforce
development boards, all of those folks need to be at the table
in different parts of this country if we want to be successful
in creating a pathway in.
The Department of Labor through Congress allocates this
money, this revenue to do these programs. We do not carry these
programs out. It is the local authorities and local cities and
towns and the organizations that are the ones that are going to
be helping us carry these programs out, so it is vitally
important. If we do not have it, it is not successful.
Ms. Adams. OK. Can you share a couple of examples of
successful outreach efforts with these institutions? Can you
name one in particular?
Secretary Walsh. Yes, Youth Build being one. We just
provided workforce development program money through Youth
Build. I want to say it is $24 million to expand Youth Build,
and to get Youth Build into this space of clean energy and
solar panels, that is one. Then I talked a little bit earlier
about it--two programs that I created, Building Pathways and
Operation Exit, that work on, we work with the police, the
criminal justice system, the NAACP. We work with different
organizations all across Boston, so that is another program,
and I have seen it work in cities all across America.
Oregon is doing a program, and that has been very
successful to Oregon's tradeswomen getting folks in. They are
doing it in California. They are doing it in Chicago. They are
doing it in New York, and we need to expand those programs.
Ms. Adams. OK. Thanks for sharing that, and of course we
look forward to seeing what the department will do in 2023 with
respect to apprenticeships. Last, I would also like to know
with respect to enforcement of the DOL issued health and safety
standards, does the Office of the Solicitor have what it needs
to process standards in a timely manner?
Secretary Walsh. It does not. Our Solicitor Office is quite
honestly in the last 4 years, many of the departments at the
Department of Labor, and many of the different agencies have
been decimated by not back filling and budget cuts, and not
replacing workers in our own department, and the Solicitor's
Office is no different to that.
We are asking for an increase. I would argue a modest
increase, in the Solicitor's Office to make sure that we can
make sure that we're doing the rules and regulations to make
sure we're protecting workers in America.
Ms. Adams. OK great. Well thank you, and Mr. Chairman I
yield back, thanks very much.
Chairman Scott. Thank you, and the gentleman from
Wisconsin, Mr. Grothman.
Mr. Grothman. In your testimony you spent a great deal of
time talking about equity, and I would say that is a priority
of yours. You put a lot more money, or you are requesting a lot
more money in the pursuit of equity than the baseline figures
would suggest. Is that right?
Secretary Walsh. Yes.
Mr. Grothman. OK. One of the things that I kind of wonder
about as a practical matter how it works out, and I talk to
employers about this. You enforce affirmative action
requirements against Federal contractors. That results in
employers hiring people maybe differently than they would
otherwise. I have a general question.
Does this result in non-citizens being able to check the
box against preferences, and does it result in the illegal
people? Our people who are not here legally being able to get
preference and Federal contractors. How were those handled by
an employer?
Secretary Walsh. I do not believe that somebody who is an
undocumented citizen has the ability to access those jobs
unless it is an H-2 program where we raise the cap on H-2 visa
programs. That is a different story.
Mr. Grothman. Do you enforce it?
Secretary Walsh. Pardon me?
Mr. Grothman. Do you enforce it? I mean we all know right
now. I have actually talked to an employer that many people who
are here not legally are being employed, and I wondered
whether, and some people who are here legally right? I mean
there are certain people who are legally, who are getting
employed. I wondered for the purposes of filling out the forms
that are required for Federal contractors, if people who are
not citizens, but members of favored groups, are getting jobs
ahead of citizens?
Secretary Walsh. In Federal contracting you are talking
about?
Mr. Grothman. Correct.
Secretary Walsh. Yes, no. I mean we do not enforce the law
at the Department of Labor on that. That is Homeland Security
that enforces the law.
Mr. Grothman. I am not talking about Homeland Security. I
am talking about----
Secretary Walsh. I am telling you the answer is Homeland
Security. We do not do the enforcement, only DHS does. If
somebody were to fill out a form and check the box, and they
were not, they--didn't have a social security number.
Mr. Grothman. No. I am not talking about that. I am talking
when somebody comes in either illegally and have a phony social
security number, or are here legally, but are a non-citizen.
Secretary Walsh. Yes. They do not work on those jobs, and
that is enforced by DHS. If DHS was to find that out, the
employer is responsible to make sure that their employees----
Mr. Grothman. You do not understand the question.
Secretary Walsh. I do not.
Mr. Grothman. OK. There are people here, many people who
are non-citizens who work legally OK. There are other people
who are here not legally, but get phony social security numbers
and work for big companies that do business with the
government. The question is when these companies fill out the
forms, and somebody is a member of a favored group.
Secretary Walsh. What does that mean favored group? Can you
describe that to me?
Mr. Grothman. Well, for the purpose--for equity purposes
right, just we talk a lot about equity, and one of the ways you
get to what you would consider equity is through the Office of
Federal Contract Compliance programs.
Secretary Walsh. Yes.
Mr. Grothman. Which are your programs. Every employee--the
employer must fill out a form, putting that employee somewhere
on the form. Now if I am either here illegally, and have a
wrong social security number, which is very common. I hope you
know that. Or if you are here legally, somewhere you are going
to have to appear on that form for the purposes of reaching
what you would describe as equity. I am asking you what becomes
of those people on the form?
Secretary Walsh. Let me just clarify something. I do not
think I would describe a person of color in our country as
favorable. When we do equity programs it is to make sure that
we have equity in our hiring, to make sure that women of color,
the man of color, somebody who is here, who is a citizen in
this country has access to jobs that quite honestly
historically have been shut out for.
Mr. Grothman. Great. I will just ask you what happens to
non-citizens who are working.
Secretary Walsh. DHS, Homeland Security.
Mr. Grothman. No, no, no, I am talking about people are
here legally, or people who--which is very common, with a phony
social security number.
Secretary Walsh. You are not listening to me. If somebody
fills out a document with a fake social security number, which
you said to me, and on a contract and gets employment in the
United States of America, that is the responsibility of the
Department of Homeland Security to followup on that.
We have some compliance officers. We would work with
Homeland Security, but I do not think that is a big issue.
Mr. Grothman. Well, and I will ask you just to clarify
because I do not know if you are getting at what I am getting
at here. If you are here legally, and there are people here
legally working for 40 years.
Secretary Walsh. Yes, my mother was an immigrant in this
country that had a green card. She was here. She was a
documented immigrant before she became a United States citizen.
Mr. Grothman. Correct. The question is can somebody like
that, where did they wind up with on the government form? Are
they are--we as a practical matter giving them preference, or
are people here illegally getting that?
Secretary Walsh. I actually will get back to you. Let me
find out from my Office of Federal Contracting and Compliance
and get back to you on that answer.
Mr. Grothman. OK. The next question I have----
Chairman Scott. The gentleman's time.
Mr. Grothman. OK, OK. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. OK. The gentleman's time has expired. The
gentleman from California, Mr. DeSaulnier.
Mr. DeSaulnier. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Secretary, it
is delightful to see you. I am not going to ask questions and
make comments about basketball games, you will be happy to
know. Be happy to watch the next game with you, a great series.
Secretary Walsh. Game six is at the Boston Garden by the
way.
Mr. DeSaulnier. You are welcome to come to the Bay Area if
there is a game seven. I have a couple questions about
different subject matters, and I know that graduates of Boston
College can handle different subject matters, Mr. Chairman.
First, your comments in your introductory comments about the
International Labor Affairs Bureau.
We have a bill that would authorize for the first time
American full engagement in that, in a global economy, as you
said in your comments. We need to be engaged in that to protect
all workers. Any comments you have about that. A subject you
came out to my district, an area that has five refineries, and
good paying jobs, best performing refineries in terms of
industrial safety and the environmental consequences, also the
headquarters of Chevron in our area.
Those jobs we want to transition. You saw our
apprenticeship programs. You went to one of our pre-
apprenticeship programs. We actually think there are more jobs,
good paying jobs in the transition. Big impact. My colleague
from Oregon has talked about this, so how can we work with you,
the Department of Commerce, EPA, to make sure that we identify
this transition because there are generations of jobs between
NOAA--NOAA has a whole list of jobs for sea level rise, for
wildfires, for hurricanes.
This is just good policy, but we have to coordinate our
assets and make sure that the workforce knows that there are
good paying jobs, and there are jobs that do not need career
changes, just continuing investments in education. Those two
things, and then I wanted to followup on a couple around mental
health that we have talked about.
Secretary Walsh. All right thank you sir, and real quickly,
on the transition into good paying jobs, thank you, and to the
climate jobs. I want to thank you for having me in your
district very early on in my tenure as Secretary of Labor. I
learned a great deal. We sat with the steelworkers that day.
People were upset about the jobs being transitioned.
When we think about workforce development job training
grants, we are thinking about how do we create these pathways
so we are able to maybe not tomorrow, but over time transition
people into new industries, so they do not lose their place in
society.
One of the grants that we did, I spoke a little bit earlier
about is the work is Youth Build. We are also thinking about
young people. In the Youth Build grant I want to say there is
$24 million if I am mistaken, my office will correct it later
on, that went to Youth Build. Historically, Youth Build has
been a program in training folks in carpentry and woodworking,
and things like that.
We have a component of that with clean energy and creating
a pathway. We have to really think about our grantmaking
process and getting more ability to be able to do that. When it
comes to ILAB, we are in lots of different spaces. I have asked
for an increase in this budget both to keep an eye on the trade
agreements that we have around the globe, making sure we have
worker protections around the globe.
I am spending a lot in the last couple of months, the last
year or so, I have been to Cabo Verde, I have been to Germany,
I have been to South Korea, and also Deputy Secretary Su has
been to Mexico working with the international community on
labor standards, laborers' rights and also creating pathways.
Mr. DeSaulnier. These are terrific opportunities. This is
all while we keep to our goals of reducing carbon reductions.
As somebody who is very involved at that time with now Senator
Padilla on the California Renewable Portfolio Standards. We can
make those goals, I think, and pass them, and at the same time
provide a new economy with good paying jobs.
Two separate subjects. First of all, telehealth and
telework I should say, but related. Chairman DeFazio was a
member of the T&I Committee. We have talked a lot about this
that the opportunity coming out in places like Boston and San
Francisco and others, to help people be able to improve their
quality of life so they do not spend hours getting to and from
work but protect their labor rights.
At the same time ensure that the employer is getting good
productivity. Could you talk about where the Labor Department
might be helpful in that regard?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I also think telehealth, we learned a
lot in the last couple years with the pandemic. We talked about
childcare, we talked about workforce development. We talked
about people leaving their jobs. Telehealth is one of those
areas that it was in some cases a bright spot where people have
been able to use the telehealth, whether it is a COVID
diagnosis, and not having to bring people into hospitals that
had emergency numbers in the hospital.
Also, I have spoken to employers around the country that
are using telehealth in response to the mental health crisis,
and doing mental health counseling, and so we are certainly
working, our--EPSA Department is working, looking at
telehealth, and want to make sure we are expanding benefits in
those spaces. With the Mental Health Parity Law, jumping back a
little bit.
With the Mental Health Parity Law, we need to increase our
counseling services in the United States of America, and our
coverage service in America, for American workers that want to
get healthcare.
Mr. DeSaulnier. Mr. Chairman, we just happened to have a
conversation this morning, Mr. Allen and I about things that we
could work on together and help with telehealth, but also
telework, so I look forward to the continued conversation.
Thank you, Mr. Secretary. Good luck.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from Georgia, Mr.
Allen, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. Allen. Hello, Mr. Secretary. Thank you for being here.
Just a quick note. In the previous administration we had an
all-time high of about 160 million Americans working. Now we
have got around 132.8, this includes part-time workers, 132.8
million, so it is down substantially. We know we have got about
11 million job vacancies, plus or minus out there today.
You got a lot of work to do, and I want to help you. One of
the things that we really noticed the last time, which is why I
introduced the Employee Rights Act, which protects independent
contractors from overreaching classifications. Nearly 19
million Americans, which my colleague Ms. Stefanik, pointed
out. These are entrepreneurs. They are building tremendous
wealth, and they were responsible for 70 percent of the job
growth under the previous administration.
I think it would be well-served that you know you get into
the research on who is really creating jobs in this country,
and who is really building wealth in this country. In fact,
this is really a part of the momentum of the modern workforce,
and we seem to be stuck in the past. We have got to move into
the future. We have got to get folks back to work, so I want to
help you with that.
Additionally, I would like to discuss the DOL's proposed
environmental social governments, or ESG, investing in proxy
voting rule. Currently, ARISA requires retirement plan
fiduciaries to act solely on the interest of plan participants
for the exclusive purposes of providing benefits to those
participants. This has been upheld by the U.S. Supreme Court.
That being said, the DOL's proposed ESG rule is clearly at odds
with the law, and the Supreme Court decision.
I introduced the Ensuring Sound Guidance Act, which would
ensure investment advisors prioritize maximizing returns and
empower plan participants to choose how to invest their
capital. Why is DOL, why have you issued this proposed rule in
defiance and breaking the law, and the Supreme Court decision
in their clear decision?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, sir. Let me just real quickly
on your first point. Last year--first of all I want to take you
up on your offer as far as working with you on creating more
opportunities for employment in the country. Just so we saw
last year if I remember the numbers correctly. We had saw an
increase, a 20 percent increase on entrepreneurships in this
country, 4.7 million people who went off on their own, last
year alone.
One of the positive signs is that a lot of the folks that
did that were women and people of color. We saw a big increase
in entrepreneurships in America last year. Again, I would love
to work with you on that more.
Mr. Allen. You are in favor of independent contractors
continuing this process as far as creating jobs?
Secretary Walsh. Oh yes, I am in favor of entrepreneurship.
I mean a lot of times I mean you can define it as independent
contractor, you can define it as somebody who starts on their
own going out, and then eventually they become companies, and
making investments in those folks. I mean a lot of companies--
no company started--Amazon did not start as Amazon.
Wayfair did not start as Wayfair. You had somebody who sat
in a room. I know Wayfair for example, two college roommates
from Boston sat in a room and they created this company and now
it is Wayfair.
Mr. Allen. I am talking about steelworkers, steelworkers
started being independent contractors, and again the DOL is
pushing to try to combine independent contractors under union
agreements preventing them from being entrepreneurs, and Ms.
Stefanik covered that pretty well with you.
Anyway, getting back to this ESG thing, can you tell me why
you are breaking the law there?
Secretary Walsh. I do not know if I'm breaking the law
but--we will see. I think the Court did rule, we will see.
Certainly, last year we released a proposal to empower
financial plan fiduciaries to safeguard American workers. We
are working through this process. I will gladly get you--I do
not have enough information in front of me at the moment,
because you are going to run out of time, but I would love to
talk to you.
Mr. Allen. Well, I have got a couple other questions. I am
out of time, with the H-2A and the wage requirements there that
are going to put our farmers out of business, so I will submit
those in writing, and I would appreciate your responding to
them, thank you.
Secretary Walsh. I support the H-2A program, and the H-2B
program.
Mr. Allen. Right, good. Thank you, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. The Gentleman's time is expired. The
gentlelady from Georgia, Mrs. McBath.
Mrs. McBath. Thank you so much, Chairman Scott, for hosting
this important hearing today, and thank you Secretary Walsh,
for taking the time to be with us. I would also like to thank
you, and also your staff, and the administration for proposing
a budget at the Department of Labor that truly puts working
families first. Thank you for that. Not large corporations and
overpaid CEOs.
Each of us here today has an obligation to every family in
this country. An obligation to give every parent the
opportunity to make the lives of their children better, and
their own. An opportunity to better themselves and live a
healthy and a fulfilling life through a good job, hard work,
and plain ole good determination.
The American Dream is a promise to the American people. It
is one that I do not take lightly, and it is one that I intend
to keep. In the words of President Biden, he said, ``Show me
your budget, and I'll tell you your value, what you value.''
Through the Department of Labor's proposed budget, it is
obviously to those of us who are here engaging in good faith
with you today, and the current administration, that you also
take this promise to heart, and that you truly do value
American workers and their voices in the workplace.
A cornerstone of this budget proposal is creating an
economy that works for everyone. During the COVID-19 pandemic,
we have seen how crucial it is for workers to have access to
not just job protected family and medical leave, but also job
protected paid leave. While the Family Medical Leave Act, FMLA,
was an important step in the right direction, the average
American knows that they cannot afford to take more than just a
few days of unpaid leave, or time off to welcome a newborn, or
care for sick, or disabled loved one.
Under current law, workers who are in urgent, dire need of
job protected leave, are the workers who are the least likely
to be able to afford it. The guarantee of leave means nothing
to the American people if they cannot afford to take the unpaid
time off to actually use it.
My first question for you is, Secretary Walsh, can you
briefly discuss the barriers that workers are facing in this
Nation when they are attempting to utilize their leave under
the FMLA program?
Secretary Walsh. I will have to get back to you on specific
cases, but again I think one of the biggest barriers that
employees are facing is that FMLA is not necessarily uniform
across the board, and paid family leave is not uniform across
the board. I know there are several pieces of legislation that
deals with those two issues, and particularly paid family
leave, medical leave.
As I mentioned a little earlier today, I think two, well
maybe there is more than two, but two big crises facing our
economy is No. 1, childcare, and the second would be paid
family leave, which is in the same line with that. We saw it
during the pandemic in the beginning days, we see it now,
today. There are certainly opportunities for us to do more
there for American workers, and quite honestly, American
companies.
Mrs. McBath. Well, thank you for that. Then also Secretary
Walsh, in the President's State of the Union Address he called
for creating a new Federal paid family and medical leave
program. If such a program were to be created, it would bring
the United States in line with most of the other developed
nations around the world.
Can you tell us why job protected paid family leave is such
a crucial policy for the betterment of American workers and
their families in the United States?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I am going to just answer it through
the other side for a minute, from the business standpoint. I
have spent enough time now as Secretary of Labor, talking to
companies that provide paid family leave, and the benefit for
their company is retention and retaining workers and attracting
workers to the company.
A better work environment that the workers, the companies
have said to me, feel more productive. That is on the company
side. On the worker side, it allows the families to have less
stress and opportunity, and allows families, more people to go
back into the workforce.
We saw in the beginning days of the pandemic where women
dropped out of the workforce in historic numbers, and there was
a fear at one point in my tenure as Secretary of Labor, that we
were not going to get women back into the workforce. They are
critical for our economy.
We are starting to see more women go back into the
workforce, but it is not because that they want to because they
still have a child at home, it is because they have to, to
support their family. If we had a good pay family leave program
in place, we would have opportunities for our employees and
employers. This program benefits both sides. It does not
benefit one.
It benefits both sides, and it benefits the employee in the
company, and it benefits the employer.
Mrs. McBath. Thank you so much, and I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady's time has
expired. The gentleman from Indiana, Mr. Banks.
Mr. Banks. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Secretary, can you
briefly explain your roles and responsibilities as Secretary of
Labor related to the thrift savings plan, the Federal pension
program?
Secretary Walsh. I mean, I am the Chair of the PBDC Board,
along with the Secretary of the Treasury and the Secretary of
Commerce, and we have quarterly meetings. We have an
administration over there that runs the program.
Mr. Banks. Pretty significant role. Secretary of Labor
plays a pretty significant role in oversight of the thrift
savings plan.
Secretary Walsh. I would say so, yes.
Mr. Banks. I agree. Mr. Secretary, I sent you a letter
dated March 18, 2022, with a number of my colleagues, and Mr.
Chairman, I would like to submit this letter for the record.
Mr. Chairman, I would like to submit this letter for the
record. Mr. Chairman--Mr. Chairman, I would like to submit this
letter for the record.
Chairman Scott. Without objection, I am sorry.
[The information of Mr. Banks follows:]
GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT
Mr. Banks. Mr. Secretary, we have not heard back from you
yet, a response to this letter dated May 18th. The letter is
about the thrift savings plan's investments in Chinese
companies that pose a threat to U.S. national security, and
that use Uighur slave labor. In the letter I note a number of
companies that the thrift savings plan invest in that uses
Uighur slave labor. Do you care about human rights abuses of
Uighur slaves in China?
Secretary Walsh. Yes, I do, and my team does not remember
getting the letter, so I would like to get a copy of the letter
if you do not mind.
Mr. Banks. OK. Well, I am glad you care about it. Are you
aware that there are companies that the thrift savings plan
invest in that uses Uighur slaves?
Secretary Walsh. No. Not to my knowledge.
Mr. Banks. OK. Mr. Secretary, how can the United States
challenge China while simultaneously allowing investments in
the very same companies whose activities threaten the U.S.
national security and use forced slave labor in China. How can
we accomplish that?
Secretary Walsh. I have no idea.
Mr. Banks. You would agree that that is problematic.
Secretary Walsh. Again, I am going to do some homework on
this. We have not received the letter. If I had the letter on
March 21, and had the information, I would be prepared for this
question.
Mr. Banks. Do you believe, Mr. Secretary, that it is in
America's best interest to not finance our adversaries?
Secretary Walsh. I certainly believe it is in America's
best interest to create more manufacturing opportunities here
in the United States of America, supporting the bipartisan
Innovation Act, doing more of the opportunity for investment
here in our country is what we should be doing.
Mr. Banks. You would agree it is wild that we would allow
our Federal pension dollars to invest in the military of our
biggest adversary?
Secretary Walsh. Again, I am not familiar with what you are
talking about sir.
Mr. Banks. You would agree that would be wild.
Secretary Walsh. I am not going to speculate on the
question.
Mr. Banks. It is not speculation, it is happening.
Secretary Walsh. Well, I want to make sure it is accurate.
Mr. Banks. OK. Clearly, you have not been paying attention
the last few years. In 2020, when the Federal Retirement Thrift
Investment Board plans--in 2020, it plans to make investment in
Chinese companies. When that first surfaced, the Trump
administration directed the FRTIB to halt such investment
citing national security human rights concerns. Clearly, if you
are not aware of this, you were not paying attention to this in
2020.
Secretary Walsh. I was the Mayor of Boston in 2020.
Mr. Banks. Yes.
Secretary Walsh. Was not paying attention to a lot of what
the administration was doing at the time.
Mr. Banks. Hopefully you can catch up on this quickly, Mr.
Secretary, this is important. Human rights abuse is against
Uighur slaves in China is not a laughing matter.
Secretary Walsh. Yes, I am not laughing, I am well aware of
it.
Mr. Banks. It appears that you are dismissing it, and I
want you to pay attention to it, that is why I am raising it.
Can you commit to halting all investment in Chinese companies
that abuse human rights in the thrift savings plan?
Secretary Walsh. Again, I have to do some more research on
it.
Mr. Banks. Do you believe that it is in America's best
interest to not have our futures invested in, and our
retirement security dependent on the success of investments in
non-market economies, and non-democratic countries?
Secretary Walsh. Again, I am going to do some research on
it.
Mr. Banks. That is not a question that is worth
researching. It is a yes or no question.
Secretary Walsh. I just gave you an answer.
Mr. Banks. Is it worth investing in our adversary's
military through our Federal pension program?
Secretary Walsh. Again, I will do some research on it, and
I will get back to you.
Mr. Banks. Is it worth it? Mr. Secretary, do you care that
there are dollars of Federal retirees going toward companies
that use Uighur slave labor in China?
Secretary Walsh. If that is the case, absolutely.
Mr. Banks. Do you care about that?
Secretary Walsh. If that is the case, absolutely.
Mr. Banks. Mr. Secretary, how does your department intend
to separate good Chinese companies from bad Chinese companies?
What are you doing about that? Like what would you do about
that?
Secretary Walsh. What do you mean by that?
Mr. Banks. Well, it is what I am asking you.
Secretary Walsh. Are you talking about American companies
in China?
Mr. Banks. Companies that violate human rights, and
companies that do not.
Secretary Walsh. Some of the companies that violate human
rights are also working for American companies, so we have a
bigger issue there.
Mr. Banks. OK. Mr. Secretary, I get the impression that you
do not care. You do not care that the Federal pension program
invests in companies that use Uyghur slaves, and that you are
not intent upon doing anything about it. You have been in this
job for long enough that you should know something about it,
and you do not. With that Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Secretary Walsh. I would like if you could, would not mind
sending that letter to my office because according to my office
we did not receive the letter, so I would like to get the
letter before I get questioned on something that might not have
happened.
Chairman Scott. The gentleman's time has expired. The
gentlelady from Pennsylvania, Ms. Wild.
Ms. Wild. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Secretary, thank you
for being here today. I will tell you that based upon your
visit to Pennsylvania 7, some time ago, the workers of
Pennsylvania 7 believe that you care very, very much about
them, and I appreciate that.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you very much.
Ms. Wild. I hope you will come back. I want to talk about
the portion of your budget that proposed $3 billion for WIOA
employment and training State grant programs. Specifically, I
want to talk about the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act,
which of course is a historic bipartisan investment in our
Nation's infrastructure, but I also have concerns about whether
we have the skilled labor that we need to build, and rebuild,
our Nation's infrastructure. I suspect that that is a concern
shared by you?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. It is a big priority, and certainly
when we look at the, when--I look at the jobs numbers every
month, we look at the industries, and what is happening in
those industries, and we are seeing growth and construction. We
are seeing growth in manufacturing.
We are seeing historic growth in manufacturing in our
country as far as workers going into those fields, and we need
to make sure that we have the workforce to continue that
growth, particularly with the investment of whether it is the
clean drinking water, broadband access, the roads and bridges
that we are going to be building, and then the work that is
going to come off of that.
Ms. Wild. What are some of the ways that we need to make
sure that we are investing in our workforce, and so that we are
going to have the skilled workers available, not only to
fulfill the goals of the Infrastructure Act, but also the needs
of our employers and manufacturers?
Secretary Walsh. Some of it is what has been said today, it
is about creating pathways, and making sure that we are
creating good pathways, and letting people understand that
these professions are there for them, and they have access to
them. Part of it is through pre-apprenticeships, part of it is
through apprenticeships. Part of it is through workforce
development job training programs, workforce development boards
around the country.
We really have to make sure that we are understanding it,
and we are intentional about it. I also feel very strongly that
we need to bring companies to the table as well, more companies
to the table, to explain to us what exactly they need for their
workforce.
Ms. Wild. Um-hmm, and that leads me into my next question
about community colleges, of which I am proud to host two of
the 14 that are in Pennsylvania. I will tell you the
partnership between employers and manufacturers and these
community colleges is nothing short of phenomenal. I hope I get
to show you around them.
What we have seen here in the Lehigh Valley is that the
community colleges can quickly pivot to design programs to meet
the needs of employers, manufacturers and the like, and it
happens on a regular basis, and they can do that very, very
quickly in a way that a 4-year school cannot necessarily do.
Community colleges need funding so that they can develop
those partnerships that you spoke of. We did in the WIOA Act of
2022, authorize a $100 million community college grant called
Strengthening Community Colleges training grant, and I would
like you to just comment generally, based on your experience,
of the importance of community colleges, and their ability to
expand their capacity to develop short-term training programs.
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I visited dozens of community
colleges in my time as Secretary of Labor, and traveling around
the country, and I see in a lot of communities, community
college is the largest employer, is the opportunity for people
to get better skills and opportunities for training and grants
and certificates and programs like that.
I think that you know when I talked to Governors as well, I
talked about in some cases depending how the funding goes, the
importance that states need to continue to fund community
colleges. One of the disappointments with Build Back Better was
that there was $100 million in there for community colleges,
and the advancements of community colleges, and then
unfortunately that went by the wayside.
Many of the community colleges in America partner with the
major corporations in America to train up, and to create
workforce development programs for those employers, so I think
that the need for investment in community colleges is a public-
private partnership as well.
In some parts of this country some of the largest
benefactors, or the largest donors to community colleges, are
actually employers to skill up workers.
Ms. Wild. Yes, and I think you make a point that I try to
make all the time, which is this is not just about the
students, and it is not just about the schools, although both
of those are very, very important, but it is really about
building our employers capacity to take on more, and to
perpetuate this made in America attitude that we have, and that
I am very happy that we have.
On a more personal note, before I yield back let me just
say you have another chance to come to Musikfest in my district
later this summer. I hope you will avail yourself of that, and
we would be happy to welcome you, and with that Mr. Chairman, I
yield back.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from Pennsylvania,
Mr. Keller.
Mr. Keller. Thank you, Chairman. Mr. Secretary, Americans
are facing a shortage of baby formula. One of the reasons for
the shortage was a recall on formula produced by Abbott at its
Sturgis, Michigan plant. The Wall Street Journal has reported
that OSHA received a whistleblower complaint all the way back
in February 2021, about issues at the Sturgis plant.
OSHA passed this complaint to the Food and Drug
Administration, which apparently did not act upon the
information. However, I understand that Abbott conducted an
internal investigation and found no evidence to corroborate the
whistleblower complaint, so the question I have, Mr. Secretary,
is did OSHA follow protocol in its handling of this
whistleblower complaint?
Secretary Walsh. It is currently under investigation with
OSHA still, so I cannot get too much into the investigation,
but OSHA did followup, and has followed up.
Mr. Keller. OSHA followed up, and they handled it all by
the----
Secretary Walsh. I do not have the details on it, because I
cannot get into the investigation, because it is currently
under investigation. I just wanted to give you that. I can get
more information for you later. I will just let you know what I
can say publicly because I believe it is still an active
investigation.
Mr. Keller. OK. OSHA's working on an investigation. Was the
White House, or the FDA alerted about the complaint when the
Abbott plant was shut down a year later?
Secretary Walsh. I do not have the timeline for you on
that. You would have to--I would have to get that information
from the White House. I do not have the timeline on that.
Mr. Keller. It is a pretty significant event. I would
think.
Secretary Walsh. No, it certainly is, sorry go ahead.
Mr. Keller. I would think that we would have those details.
I mean it resulted in critical supply chain shortages for
families across our Nation, and I would think we would have
that information.
Secretary Walsh. Yes. That is why the President knows
exactly that it is scary for families, and for mothers and new
babies, and that is why the President has got this information
and launched Operation Fly Formula, invoking the Defense
Production Act to address the issue, and certainly has been on
top of the issue. I do not know when the President was notified
on this, but I certainly know that the President has been very
active in the response.
Mr. Keller. Well, it was the complaint was back in February
2021, so.
Secretary Walsh. Yes.
Mr. Keller. When did OSHA make you aware of the complaint?
Secretary Walsh. I do not have that date.
Mr. Keller. OK. Also, I just want to talk a little bit
since we are on a thing here of OSHA, there have been reports
that during recent inspections, OSHA inspectors have been asked
employers to provide documentation of employee's COVID-19
vaccination status. Do you believe these are appropriate
requests in light of the Supreme Court's rebuke of OSHA's
vaccine and testing mandate?
Secretary Walsh. I was not aware of that, but certainly
what the Supreme Court ruled was it was not a mandate with the
Department of Labor, what OSHA was doing. It was a vax or test;
it was not a mandate.
Mr. Keller. OK. Do you think that it is appropriate for
OSHA inspectors to be inquiring on employees' vaccination
status for COVID?
Secretary Walsh. It is there for a reason, or COVID related
issue, absolutely.
Mr. Keller. OK. Even though the Court said that you know--
--
Secretary Walsh. The Court ruling is completely different
than OSHA going out and checking to make sure that workers are
safe.
Mr. Keller. Workers can be safe, but my point is so OSHA is
allowed to go out and pry into people's personal medical
records?
Secretary Walsh. I am not aware of what that is, so I would
have to get some specifics in front of me.
Mr. Keller. You are not aware that OSHA inspectors go and
do, ask questions that they are not authorized to by the
Supreme Court?
Secretary Walsh. Can you give me an example of a company
they did it to?
Mr. Keller. We will make sure we get you that information,
but my question is, and I would like an answer. Do you think it
is OK for OSHA to go out and ask any questions they want?
Secretary Walsh. I do not know if it is happening.
Mr. Keller. Regardless of whether they are permitted to do
it by the Courts or not?
Secretary Walsh. I do not know if that is happening, that
is why I just asked you if a company complained.
Mr. Keller. OK. If it were happening, would it be OK for
OSHA to go out and ask any question they would want to?
Secretary Walsh. Again, it depends on what the violation,
or the question is, and when the timeline was. Are we talking
yesterday, or are we talking April 2020?
Mr. Keller. Still happening.
Secretary Walsh. I look forward to following up with you on
that.
Mr. Keller. OK, absolutely. It goes back to the whole point
that I guess I brought up a while ago, and when I talked to you
last year when you were new on the job. Whether or not you
believed that people that operate businesses care about the
well-being of the people that come to work every day.
You know I do. I worked in a factory. I knew that the
people that owned the business cared about me, and as a manager
later on, and a person that ran that factory, I cared about the
people every day. I would hope that you believe that the vast
majority of the people of America care about the people that
work in their business. Do you believe that?
Secretary Walsh. I believe that.
Mr. Keller. OK. I am glad. That is a much better answer
than I got a year ago, so.
Secretary Walsh. Yes, I do not remember the question a year
ago, but----
Mr. Keller. Well, the same question, but it took me four
times to get you to say that, thank you.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you very much sir, appreciate the
question.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from Connecticut,
Mrs. Hayes.
Mrs. Hayes. Thank you, Secretary Walsh for being here
today. I think my question ties into what Representative Wild
was asking. We have seen a 12 percent decline in registered
apprenticeships during the COVID pandemic, and with the
unprecedented investment in infrastructure that Congress has
made. Your department has requested increase in funding for
apprenticeship grants in Fiscal Year 2023.
Can you describe a little bit about what is included in the
plan for this funding, and what your strategy is to expand
apprenticeships to support the demand that is brought on by the
Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. Quite honestly, we have been working,
looking at communities that have not had opportunities, people
have not had opportunities to get into these industries in the
past. We are looking at, as far as the like construction
trades, creating opening doors to make sure that we get more
people in of color, and women into the access of those numbers.
The numbers are low in some cases in some of those areas.
Some parts of the country have done a really good job of
expanding those opportunities like Oregon, and Oregon's
tradeswoman, and some places need to do a better job.
We are looking at creating opportunities of expanding those
programs, particularly around the pre-apprentice side of it. As
I mentioned earlier, I do not know if you were in the room, but
we talked about pre-apprentices and creating a pathway into an
industry that people might not understand that that industry
can be for them, so we are working on that side of it, and
working with community colleges and other places.
Mrs. Hayes. Thank you. I have heard you talk a lot about
apprenticeships in construction, but as you all know that
careers in precision manufacturing, green energy, healthcare,
information technology, these are also high demand careers that
are expanding. The Department's budget also requests $100
million for a new sectoral employment through career training
for occupational readiness programs to support training in
these growing industries.
Secretary Walsh. Yes.
Mrs. Hayes. What is your vision for the sector program, and
how do you believe this investment prepares Americans for a
competitive workforce?
Secretary Walsh. I think, you know, one thing the pandemic
taught us, and what we are seeing now in the workforce is
people leaving jobs, looking for better paying jobs, looking
for better opportunities.
Quite honestly, these other areas that we are looking at is
creating a pathway into the middle class for people, and
creating a good, strong career that people can get in these
different areas. That is what we are focused on, and that is
what I think that you know we should be striving for, and that
is what American companies should be striving for to get better
prepared, more opportunities for people into these workforces.
The last 30 years we have been focused on college, college,
college, college. In some cases, young people have had the
opportunity, they have missed different industries, and we have
a real opportunity to put people into different industries.
Mrs. Hayes. I appreciate that, and I hope that I hear you
talk a lot about colleges, and partnerships. The sooner we can
introduce young people to these programs, as soon as high
school, for career readiness and expansion, it's well worth it
because generally the decision is made before they graduate
what types of careers they want to pursue.
To your point, people switching careers. A March study
found the majority of people quitting their jobs did so because
they felt the pay was too low, they lacked opportunities for
advancement, or they felt disrespected at work. Reports show
that the healthcare hospitality and retail trade industries are
experiencing the highest rates of turnover.
How will your apprenticeships be a pathway for Americans
seeking different careers and better pay opportunities,
especially among the populations that are disproportionately
impacted by the pandemic?
Secretary Walsh. I mean I think in some cases the Federal
Government and the Department of Labor should be a pass
through, meaning that we need to be--we need to be working with
workforce development boards around the country. We need to be
working with local mayors and Governors, and in communities,
local communities. I do not think we should be telling
communities how to spend their money, or what careers are out
there.
We need to be working with them, and this needs to be an
all of government approach. This needs to be all of community
approach, and I think that if we are thinking that the
Department of Labor is going to solve all the challenges in
front of us in America, that is not the case. We need to be
working with people on the ground that understand it.
When I was the Mayor of Boston, if the Secretary of Labor
came in and told me how to run my city, I do not think I would
be too welcome to it. They came in to offer support on how to
workforce development people, I would welcome that input.
Mrs. Hayes. I am glad to hear you say that because while we
do need the support of the Federal Government, I can tell you
that preparing people for jobs that do not exist in the
communities where they live is not a productive strategy. My
district is a very different district. We have lots of
manufacturing towns, we have agricultural communities, small
farms, greenhouses, so our needs for precision manufacturing
are very different than some of the needs of other parts of the
country.
That is what I hear 100 percent of the time from business
owners, industry, that we have all these people, but no one has
the skillset that we need for the jobs that we have available,
so I think that those types of partnerships are incredibly
valuable. With that Mr. Chair, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from Iowa, Dr.
Miller-Meeks.
Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Thank you, Chairman Scott, and thank you
Secretary Walsh. I hope you are not getting too tired. We are
in the middle of a job crisis, and I think that we all know
that. There are currently 11.4 million unfilled jobs in
America, and the labor participation rate is not at the level
it was prior to the pandemic. The constant refrain that I hear
from employers in my district is they cannot find workers who
have the skills, and even if they do not have the skills, they
are willing to train if they can find people to fill those
jobs.
Aside from the administration's focus on the outdated
registered apprenticeship system, which does not meet the needs
of most employers, what steps is the Department taking to
alleviate the shortage of skilled workers and respond to
employer needs?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you very much. I think first and
foremost, just to kind of put this in context. The challenges
that employers have today is not new. The challenges employers
are facing today are kind of highlighted or magnified because
of what we have gone through as a country over the last 2 years
with workers and pandemic, and people getting sick and dying.
I think that you know the investments, and--again, I cannot
speak too much of what has happened with the Department of
Labor in the past, but our focus moving forward is really
creating a pathway. I think we as a country, we are focused on
just college, college, college, as I mentioned a minute ago.
We have not made investments in skilled trades. We have not
made investments in expanding trades, and what we are doing at
the Department of Labor really is creating more opportunities
for registered apprenticeships. We are encouraging
entrepreneurship. We are encouraging workforce development job
growth. We are encouraging making sure that we make these
investments.
The companies in Iowa, in your district, you know we need
to be having conversation with them about what they need out of
job training for workers in the community.
Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Yes, I would wholeheartedly agree that
collaborating with employers, rather than looking to penalize
employers is a much--and having been an employer, I can say
that. What we are going through now is very vastly different
than what we have gone through before in the task in looking
for workers.
Some innovative programs were launched in recent years to
help improve opportunities and outcomes for disadvantages
youth. One of those programs, the Job Corps Scholars program,
allows Job Corps eligible youth to enroll in career and
technical education programs at their community colleges to
learn in demand job skills.
How did the Department utilize this program during the
COVID-19 pandemic to help young people continue their education
despite all the challenges they faced in the midst of the
pandemic?
Secretary Walsh. Well, the problem that Job Corps had
during the pandemic is the same that our schools and colleges
had. A lot of these folks--a lot of these kids were sent home
to learn online. Colleges were shut down, learning online. The
difference is getting kids back into Job Corps, you know, I
think we have lost a little bit of that, lost some of our kids
coming back into Job Corps.
Right now, I want to say we have about 12,000 people in
person, we have another 20,000 people online. My role is to get
everyone back in person to Job Corps. I want to realign the Job
Corps program. I think there is a huge opportunity being missed
in this country right now where 57,000 people going through Job
Corps every year.
We should be making sure that those folks, by the end of
their time at Job Corps, whether it is a year or 2 years, that
they are partnered with an employer with a job. I mean it just
makes sense. Job Corps in similar cases to schools, and high
schools and colleges, have gone through the same challenges.
Mrs. Miller-Meeks. When Assistant Secretary Parker appeared
at the Workforce Protection Subcommittee on May 25, I asked him
if OSHA has an estimate of how many taxpayer dollars were
wasted in pursuing vaccine and testing mandate. He was
unprepared to answer my question, but I am hoping you might be
able to provide an answer. Do you have an estimate?
Secretary Walsh. No. Again, the Department of Labor did not
put a mandate out there. What we did was we went through a
rulemaking on process on vaccinations or testing, which meant
that--and the Supreme Court voted it down, so we know that.
That is gone now, that is beyond there. We were not spending
money on vaccinations in the Department of Labor.
What I wanted to do was create that vax or test option. It
was not a mandate.
Mrs. Miller-Meeks. I had hoped however, that you would
commit to providing the committee with information on how much
was spent on a vaccine and testing program, and----
Secretary Walsh. Yes. If there are dollars spent to it, I
will get it to you.
Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Thank you, Mr. Secretary. I would like
to talk to you a little bit different about step therapy. I am
a physician, a former Director of the Department of Public
Health, also military veteran, and so I wanted to talk about
step therapy, and how it relates to the ARISA health plans.
I know the burden that is placed on providers by extended
prior authorization, such as step therapy, which is essentially
a failed first requirement. And it certainly leads to people
failing therapy, going to the emergency room, and being
hospitalized when they were on a medication that was successful
for them.
It requires patients to try different medications and
treatments before they can access the right treatment, even if
they had the right treatment in the past. It can lead to
burdensome delays of care, severe, and even irreversible damage
to patients, which is why I am a proud co-lead of the Safe Step
Act along with my colleagues, Representative McBath on this
committee, Dr. Wenstrup and Dr. Ruiz. Our bill takes care of
patients first and considers patient medical history by
providing a transparent plan to provide an exception process
for patients.
Over 30 states across the Nation have passed very similar
laws to the Safe Step Act, including Iowa. These laws apply to
State regulated plans namely, marketplace plans, and meaningful
insured plans. They do not apply to self-insured employer
plans, which are governed by ARISA under the Department of
Labor.
My question is do you commit to work with Congress to
eliminate the burdensome delays in care caused by prior
authorization by helping us implement a solution like the Safe
Step Act?
Secretary Walsh. Yes, let me get back to you. Let me work
with your team on that. I am not as familiar with that as I
should be to this particular moment, we will work with you on
that.
Mrs. Miller-Meeks. We would love to work with you on that.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you.
Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I yield back my
time. Thank you, Secretary Walsh.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from Washington,
Ms. Jayapal.
Ms. Jayapal. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Secretary Walsh it is
great to see you. The last time we appeared before the
committee I was very grateful to hear you express your strong
support for my Domestic Workers Bill of Rights, which would
extend essential protections to nannies, housecleaners, and
home healthcare aids, who have been on the frontlines of so
much, and yet left out of our civil rights protections as you
know.
Domestic work has changed dramatically in recent years, and
it is really growing at a rapid rate. Secretary Walsh, when was
the last significant update to Federal labor law as it applies
to domestic work?
Secretary Walsh. I think it was roughly 50 years ago.
Ms. Jayapal. That is right.
Secretary Walsh. Something that is as comprehensive as the
proposal you have filed in Congress, we have not looked at
this. There is a lot of different other areas that we have not
looked at in 30, 40, 50 years when it comes to labor law.
Ms. Jayapal. Thank you. When we think about it, there's an
estimated 2.2 million domestic workers employed in private
homes to provide care for children, elders, and disabled
individuals, and housecleaning services. These workers who
often work alone, can be subjected to sexual harassment, and
workplace health and safety hazards, without any recourse, and
some still do not earn overtime pay.
For example, Ethyl Bena Houser, is a Seattle housecleaner.
She has had three separate male employers expose themselves or
proposition her. Unfortunately, Title VII of the Civil Rights
Act, which protects against sexual harassment in the workplace,
only covers employers with 15 or more employees, leaving Ms.
Houser with little legal recourse. Secretary Walsh, can you
explain how a National Domestic Workers Bills of Rights, such
as what I have proposed would extend anti-discrimination, and
other workplace protections under Federal law to benefit these
domestic workers?
Secretary Walsh. I mean I have not read your whole bill,
but I know that when I was in the legislature in Massachusetts,
we had a similar piece of legislation that went out there,
provided lots of protections for workers' rights, for immigrant
workers that are in this country. It extends benefits on some
of the sexual harassment that you just talked about. Also, some
are making sure that workers are being paid fairly, their wages
are not being stolen.
I think that you know certainly, when you think about 50
years from the last time we did it, this bill is long overdue,
and hopefully that you know, I guess I cannot advocate for
legislation, but I certainly support this legislation. I know
the President and the Vice President supports it as well, and I
know that there are labor organizations.
Quite honestly, I know there are some employers in the
country that support this legislation as well.
Ms. Jayapal. That is right. Exactly right. Secretary Walsh,
this year I submitted an appropriations request for DOL to fund
the establishment of a hotline for domestic workers to
anonymously report harassment, abuse, and other workforce
hazards, and exploitation, and get connected to relevant
resources. Do you think it is important? Why do you think it is
important for such a hotline to exist for domestic workers?
Secretary Walsh. I think a lot of times workers are afraid
to come forward. They're afraid to report atrocities that
they're facing on the jobsite, and I think having that ability
to be able to call in, so that we can properly go out and
inspect to make sure that workers are being treated fairly is
fine.
We get many, many calls in the Department of Labor on a
daily basis, on a monthly basis, and a yearly basis, whether
it's the wage and hour, OSHA violations. People are afraid to
report. They're afraid to lose their job. And quite honestly,
people should not be afraid to report something, whether it's a
domestic violence action on the jobsite, whether it's a safety
violation of the jobsite, and we need to make sure we create a
safe space for people to be able to report whatever they want
to report.
Ms. Jayapal. Well, your support is going to be really
crucial as we move through the appropriations process, so thank
you for that. The homecare workforce was truly on the
frontlines of the COVID-19 pandemic and provided this critical
care that enabled people with disabilities and seniors, who
were the most vulnerable to the virus, to avoid congregate
settings that often saw high rates of COVID-19 infection.
Home health workers are paid on $13.81 an hour on average,
that is roughly half of what the average U.S. worker is paid.
Benefits as you know are often very poor or nonexistent. What
role, if any, does the department have in expanding this often-
low paid workforce, and approving the recruitment, retention,
and advancement of such a critical workforce?
Secretary Walsh. I mean I think one of the roles we have,
or I have as Secretary is advocacy. I think that you know I
think that this can be addressed in our own contracts to our
budget process. I think we have to work with the states. I
think we have to work with the non-profit providers. I think we
have to work with the organizations, the unions that are in
this work.
I think that you know, I think that is one of the biggest
things we can do. I mean this is also a crisis, not just
underpaying workers in these industries, but that means cutting
back on the appropriate care that our loved ones are getting in
these facilities. I think it needs to be kind of all of society
approach if you will.
Ms. Jayapal. Secretary Walsh, I really appreciate all your
work and service to our country, and to the workers of our
country, and Mr. Chairman my time is expired. I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from Utah, Mr.
Owens.
Mr. Owens. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you Secretary
Walsh. In recent sub-regulatory guidance from the Employee
Benefits Security Administration, EBSA, sets a concerning
precedent of the department choosing which investments are
having the appropriate, or inappropriate in ARISA retirement
plans. Recent news articles reported EBSA officials justifying
issuance as to guidance to avoid notice and comment rulemaking
because there was not enough time.
Secretary Walsh, does DOL believe that it is authorized to
issue guidance in lieu of engaging in notice, and comment
rulemaking when it believes there is evolving regulatory
landscape?
Secretary Walsh. Are you talking about the crypto currency?
Mr. Owens. Yes.
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I mean I think that we made a
recommendation because we were concerned about employees having
20 percent of their retirement savings put in crypto currency,
and I think that our role is to make sure that we are
protecting the rights of American workers and the investments
going in. Since we have made that determination, we have seen
lots of losses in the crypto currency space.
Mr. Owens. I guess the question is though is do feel DOL is
qualified to make certain guidance without the input of the
experts in that industry, around that industry?
Secretary Walsh. Well, I think any time that, to my
knowledge, any time that our folks at EBSA have been making any
type of either if it was the rulemaking process, or a
recommendation, we take very seriously having conversations
with the industry professionals. It is not just something that
is randomly done. We do have those conversations to make sure
we are not making any determination based off of a personal
feeling. We should never do that.
We should always be talking to the field experts in what we
do.
Mr. Owens. Well, my understanding is that the engagement is
the notice and comment rulemaking process, correct?
Secretary Walsh. That is in the rulemaking process.
Mr. Owens. OK. This seems that we did not go through that
process. Maybe I am doing this wrong, but did they go through
the traditional notice and comment rulemaking process and make
a decision on these investments?
Secretary Walsh. I believe that we are looking at
potentially going to a rulemaking process moving forward on the
industry as a whole, but this was a one off, if you will,
investment that we wanted to let investors know that we had
major concerns about it. We did not tell them they could not do
it, but we told them we had major concerns about it.
Mr. Owens. OK. A 2017 Harvard study estimated that under
the ARAP proposal, the number of occupations commonly field
through apprenticeships, could nearly triple from 27 to 74.
That number of job openings still through apprenticeships could
expand eightfold up to 3.2 million, and occupations ripe for
apprenticeship expansion could offer 20 percent higher wages
than traditional apprenticeship occupations.
The Trump administration created an industry recognized
apprenticeship program to expand apprenticeship programs. It
was working with more than 130 new programs developed in over a
year, and most of those programs were in healthcare nursing,
which is now experiencing massive labor shortages that threaten
people's health and lives.
Why did the administration cancel these programs that could
offer desperately needed education for healthcare workers?
Secretary Walsh. Representative Owens, they were not good
programs. They were duplicate programs from the apprentice
program that we have currently. They were not industry proven.
When we think about expanding apprenticeships, we are expanding
the apprenticeships that we currently have in this country that
have been successful for a long time.
I have heard a couple people here say today that our
apprenticeships are old and they are not working right. No,
they are absolutely working right. We are creating good
pathways, and what we want to do is take the apprenticeship
programs that we have in our country right now and expand
those. We did not need a duplicate set of rulemaking to get
around the laws.
Mr. Owens. In other words, there were not 130 new programs
developed in an industry that we needed development in, health
and those--yes, and we are talking about the healthcare
industry, and 100 new, 130 new programs were developed in a
little less, a little bit over a year. Are you saying that was
not a successful process?
Secretary Walsh. It was not a successful process, but we
are looking into industry-wide. When we think--I will give you
an example. One is the example of nursing. We are going to have
in the next 10 years, we are going to have a shortage of nurses
in this country. We have a real opportunity to make
investments.
I mean I do not know if you would call it apprenticeships,
but about creating pathways into nursing programs. We are
seeing it with the trucking industry, the supply chain trucking
industry. We cut back on the timeline to create a registered
apprenticeship program with trucking.
We said we have 100 companies now that have signed up that
are working to deal on the supply chain issues in our country
by doing expanded registered apprenticeships through trucking.
Mr. Owens. OK, well thank you Mr. Secretary, I yield back.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you, sir.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from Michigan, Mr.
Levin.
Mr. Levin. Thanks so much Mr. Chairman, and for being here,
Mr. Secretary. I want to start by picking up what Ms. Miller-
Meeks was talking about, and just how bipartisan the issue of
step therapy is. Two of my four kids have Crohn's disease. They
are 28 and 26, and they were diagnosed at 11 and 9, so we have
been going through this a long time, and I am aware personally
of the hurdles that health plans, including employer plans,
pose that can limit patient access to care.
Patients and advocates in this space have shared stories,
patients requiring (inaudible), even requiring a total
colectomy because of delays in care caused by step therapy, and
these findings were underscored recently by a study among
pediatric IBD patients that demonstrated that even the presence
of prior authorization requirement on a formulary increased the
changes of a serious adverse event like hospitalization by 13
percent within 180 days.
As you know, most of us Americans get our insurance through
our employers. What I want to ask is will you work with us in
Congress with patient and provider community leaders, to make
improvements to ARISA plans to ensure that patients get access
to needed care, and avoid the devastating consequences of
patients getting sicker needlessly because the insurance plans
make them try things that are cheaper, but do not work before
trying, getting the treatment they need.
That is what we would love to do. I am telling you, you are
going to love this issue when you get into it----
Secretary Walsh. Well, the short answer to the question is
absolutely. I mean I think any time that we can work
collectively together to create better opportunities for people
with their insurance with healthcare, whatever it might be,
with mental health services, certainly we'd be foolish not to
have those conversations about how we can try and work
together, absolutely.
Mr. Levin. Thank you, thank you so much. All right. Another
thing that I have been excited about is that the President
asked you and Vice President Harris to lead the White House
Task Force on Worker Organizing Empowerment. I am really
grateful for the initiative, and for your leadership on it.
On February 7, the Task Force issued a report that included
at least 70 recommendations to promote worker organizing and
collective bargaining for Federal employees, and for workers
employed by public and private sector employers. Can you give
us an update on here, on this? What is next? What steps has the
Department taken since the report to implement the
recommendations, and how can we be helpful to advance this
important objective of the President?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. First, thank you for that. First and
foremost, we are working across eight departments and agencies
or cabinets I should say, more so. Some of its through the Good
Jobs Initiative, some of its having direct conversations with
other cabinet members. There is a report due, I want to say
another 6-month report due sometime in August, and my office is
working, Lynn Reinhart from my office is working to help put
that report together.
Working very closely with the Vice President's office and
with other liaisons in different cabinets across the board. I
mean there are different levels of involvement here, what is
going on, and looking at what we can do. We can get you more
concrete in--the report that is going to be out, I want to say
it is August, we will have a full comprehensive report of what
is happened to date.
Mr. Levin. Well thanks. We are very supportive of that
work. I also want to focus on the Persuader Rule, which
requires employers and their labor consultants to report on
activities that persuade employees about how to exercise their
rights to union representation and collective bargaining.
The Task Force recommended that the Department, and I im
quoting here, ``review its rules and policies on persuader
reporting, and take all appropriate actions to strengthen its
rules and enforcement to ensure maximum reporting of persuader
activity,'' and that it worked with the Office of Federal
Procurement Policy to develop a mechanism for ensuring that
contracting agencies are aware of persuader reports filed by
Federal contractors, and for ensuring compliance with the
executive order, which is Number 13494.
This is really important. What steps has the department
taken to ensure that persuader reporting rules is strengthened
and enforced, given how much you know union busting is going on
out there?
Secretary Walsh. Certainly, OMS's role is to advance the
stated U.S. public policy that we are moving forward here on.
We do not have at this time a rulemaking process. It is not on
the rulemaking agenda, but OMS is looking at all of the
reporter requirements out there, both on the union side as
well. The reports of unions, and as well as the reports of any
activity that that is persuading, or trying to push people away
from collective bargaining, having their free and fair rights
to organize.
Mr. Levin. All right. Well thanks so much. Thanks for your
service, and I think my time has expired, so Mr. Chairman I
yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from Tennessee,
Ms. Harshbarger, 5 minutes, after which we will take a 5-minute
break.
Mrs. Harshbarger. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you
Secretary Walsh for being here today. I am going to ask a
question about farming and wages. The H-2A program uses the 80-
WR to prevent an adverse effect on the U.S. workers. I hear
from my constituents in East Tennessee constantly that they
cannot find local workers anywhere, even when they advertise at
the $13.89 adverse effect wage rate.
In recent comments to the 2019 and 2021 wage proposals, AG
employers have asked that the department analyze whether the
adverse effect wage is even needed because there is such a
shortage of domestic workers. Would the department be willing
to do that before finalizing their most recent proposal sir?
Secretary Walsh. Sorry I apologize, I was just talking to
my team behind me. It is in the rulemaking process, so I do not
have any updates on it, but we are in the process of--we just
announced it the other day, I think on all the H-2 programs. We
are big on the rulemaker process. What we do is take a public
comment on it, and I certainly would love to, my--office will
talk to your team, but you and I should probably have a
conversation about this as well, and how it impacts your
district.
Mrs. Harshbarger. OK. That would be great. I appreciate
that. What I want to do now is just turn it to the independent
contractor model for a second. Recent Bureau of Labor
Statistics surveys have noted that independent contractors
across the board overwhelmingly prefer the work arrangements,
that is at a 79 percent approval.
In the trucking industry for example, Americans choose the
independent contractor model because of the economic
opportunity it provides, and the impairments to select the
conditions like for example wage and hours that suits that
particular person's lifestyle.
What would you say to hundreds of thousands of owner
operators in trucking, who despite choosing to be independent
contractors, could lose their businesses immediately upon
Federal enactment of a restrictive IC test, sir?
Secretary Walsh. One of the things, just real quickly,
about 8 months ago we had a meeting at the White House with the
trucking industry, and the Independent Trucking Association was
there. One of the things that they said was their concern was
that the independent truckers weren't being paid the way they
used to be, and that they were being undercut in the fact that
they owned their own truck, and they owned their own rigs, but
they were not there, so what we wanted to do was strengthen
that opportunity.
Any process that we do with independent contracting is not
to put companies out of business. Anything that we do for
independent contracting should be about protecting workers,
protecting workers' rights, but also protecting the
independence of companies that want to be independent
contractors.
Mrs. Harshbarger. Well, we know that this administration
really is pushing unionization and Federal control over the
workforce regardless of what their preference is. Saying you
want to protect the workers, but yet you know that is due to
unionization, that is a no go. Being your own boss, or being
unionized, that is the decision these truckers are having to
make, and they do not want to do that.
They want to be their own boss. They want to set their
hours. They want to set their wage. If they are woefully
underpaid that needs to be looked at, but they should not be
told well in order to get this pay you have to be unionized. I
do not agree with that either.
Secretary Walsh. Well, I have not said that, and that is
not the case. If companies--and I was very clear in the very
beginning, if people choose, they do not want to be part of a
union, and independent trucking is a whole different situation.
If companies, if employees at a company want to join a union,
they should have the right to. If they do not want to join a
union, they should have the right to do that as well. It should
be based on the employee, not the employer.
Mrs. Harshbarger. Well, I agree that they should have the
choice to do one or the other, and I don't ever want to take
their rights away for the American dream, and that is own your
own business, and be your own boss. With that said, Chairman, I
will yield back the balance of my time.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. The gentlelady's time has expired. We will
take a 5-minute break, and we will return in 5 minutes.
(Break.)
Chairman Scott. The gentlelady from Michigan, Ms. Stevens,
is recognized for 5 minutes.
Ms. Stevens. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to our
incredible Labor Secretary for taking our questions today.
Before we dive in, I did want to take an opportunity to flag
some concerns coming out of Michigan's 11th District regarding
the Department of Labor's notice of proposed rulemaking on
Wagner Peyser Act employment service staffing requirements,
something that you know well, Mr. Secretary.
Your home State, like Michigan, has operated under Federal
demonstration waivers with the ability to set their own
staffing requirements since the 90's, and I know this is an
issue that you are weighing very carefully. I just want to let
you know sir, that we look forward to--I look forward to
submitting comments and continuing this conversation with your
office as we work to solidify a final rule that allows for
states, such as ours, to maintain their successful, local
standards of service for workers and job seekers, something
that in Michigan worked very well during the pandemic.
Now Mr. Walsh, I would like to discuss the decision from
Oshkosh Defense to move their awarded $6 billion contract to
build the next generation of electric vehicles for the United
States Postal Service to a totally new non-union plant in
another State, instead of having UAW members in Wisconsin carry
out this lucrative contract.
We have seen the pitfalls that happen when some automakers
look to reduce their labor costs by building their ED
manufacturing facilities elsewhere where right to work laws
allow companies to short change their workers on wages,
benefits, and workplace safety standards.
This egregious decision is one of the reasons why I
introduced the Union Autoworkers Job Protection Act. My bill
would require bids and contracts to build motor vehicles for
the Federal Government to stipulate in which plants motor
vehicles will be made or assembled.
If a contract awardee wants to move production, they must
get written permission from the executive agency and provide
same day notification to impacted labor unions when they seek
this permission. Sir, would you mind just speaking to how a
policy like this can work to reward employers who are doing
right by their workers?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. Thank you for that. I think any time
that we can have policy that supports not just workers, but
supports communities that have historically had companies like
that in their district. I think that you know as we think about
expanding manufacturing in the United States of America, we
want to make sure that, like parts of your district, and other
people's districts who was on the podium today, that they
benefit from the manufacturing that used to be in their
communities years ago.
I think moving, it is--not a net gain for America, moving
an industry from one part of America to another part of
America. It actually hurts the community that it is in, so I
think anything that we can do to encourage more keeping
companies invested in their community that they are in, but
also expanding those opportunities in other parts of the
country are important.
Ms. Stevens. Yes, well thank you. Mr. Secretary, the Labor
and Management Reporting and Disclosure Act requires employers
and antiunion consultants to report arrangements involving
direct and indirect activities to persuade employers on how to
exercise their right to organize.
These activities, as we know, are significantly
underreported, and while there were over 1,125 union organizing
campaigns in 2021 alone, research shows that employers hire
consultants in 75 percent of these campaigns, and the Office of
Labor Management Relations standards received only 166 reports
documenting such arrangements.
I am just kind of wondering what is going on there. What
steps is the Department taking to improve employer compliance
with the reporting obligations in such ways?
Secretary Walsh. We are looking at making sure that there
is a requirement for companies, just like there is a
requirement for labor to file reports. A lot of it is the
Department of Labor, OMS does not have the enforcement ability
to enforce the rule of the law. We really push to make sure
that these reports are filed, whether it is antiunion
persuasion rules, that is the law, or labor forms.
Unions have to file the forms as well. We do everything we
can to make sure these forms and these reports get filed.
Ms. Stevens. Well thank you so much for that response, sir,
and I would also like to note that penalties for violations of
reporting requirements are currently nonexistent. With that Mr.
Chair, I will yield back, but I also thank Mr. Secretary to
mentioning our work on the Rescue Act in his opening statement
to save the multiemployer pension plans, thank you for your
leadership, sir.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Now my distinguished colleague
from Virginia, Mr. Good.
Mr. Good. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you Secretary
Walsh for being with us. In your testimony you talk about how
you sort of bemoan the fact that only 10 percent of American
workers are unionized, which I would say is about 10 percent
too many. You also say that it is a great priority to this
administration to pass the Pro Act, to get more employees
unionized.
If you look at the Pro Act, and what it would do, it would
force more workers into one size fits all union contracts,
subject more workers and job creators to union harassment,
stifle worker's rights, increase union strikes. The American
Action Forum found that employers could face more than 47
billion in new annual costs if the Pro Act became law.
As you know, Federal law already protects employees' rights
to organize, but this--the Pro Act would reform U.S. Labor.
When we make reforms to U.S. labor laws, we ought to help
workers, not just union bosses. The Pro Act would infringe on
the right to workers and employees, hurt the economy by making
it more difficult, more costly to invest in the American
workforce.
It overturns, as you know, right to work laws in 27 states.
You have already said this morning that you are against right
to work, and it forces workers to pay millions of dollars from
their hard-earned paychecks to labor unions, even if they do
not want to be represented by a union.
You probably also know that over the last 10 years a couple
billion dollars has been taken from member union dues to go to
left wing groups to help Democrat causes. The Pro Act would
require employers to hand over their workers, private, personal
information to union organizers, including home addresses, cell
phones, land line numbers, personal email and more without the
consent of the workers.
It would take away workers' rights to secret ballot in many
circumstances, impose a bias card check scheme which workers
could be unionized without the union winning a secret ballot
election rather. New penalties up to $100,000 could be imposed
on small businesses for unfair so-called labor practices, and
which would potentially close thousands of businesses that are
just trying to come back after the government crushed them
during the COVID supposedly mitigation strategy, bankrupted
many small business owners.
To say that we want to get more companies to unionize, more
workers to be unionized, do you believe that the good of an
organization--do you believe the good of an organization is in
conflict with the good of its employees? Are the good of an
employee and the good of an organization in concert, or in
conflict?
Secretary Walsh. They should not be in conflict. They
should be very much together.
Mr. Good. OK. The union mentality pits an us against them
mentality, employee versus union, instead of a concerted
mentality of they are working together. In your opinion, when
an advancing employee, someone who gets hired, and they are an
employee. They want to work up the chain if you will. They want
to advance their careers. When do they become part of the
problem because they become part of management, therefore we
need unions to protect them from the company?
Secretary Walsh. Well before we get there, I do not agree
with your assessment of unions, and the way that you put it out
there that unions are bad, and that they are bad for business,
and they are bad for communities.
Mr. Good. Well, I think that you, and your administration,
democrat majority, has demonstrated you have contempt and
distain for employers and job creators and businesses, and you
believe if left to their own devices they would exploit and
abuse, and harm their employees, so therefore we need these
costly union organizations to protect them.
When an employee advances into management, do they become
part of the problem just because they are part of management
now?
Secretary Walsh. Yes, my recommendation----
Mr. Good. Where should employees aspire to become part of
management and to rise up within an organization?
Secretary Walsh. My recommendation to you, Congressman, is
I would have a conversation with the U.S. Chamber of Commerce
and ask them if the Secretary of Labor is anti-worker, anti-
business. You should ask that question. I think the answer you
will get is surprising.
Mr. Good. You know in addition off your testimony, really
focused on the fact that we need to spend more money. You said
that the American Rescue Plan has 260 million in it to promote
equitable access to unemployment compensation programs. We have
got 11 million open jobs in this country. One of the greatest
contributing factors to the failed democrat policies, the
majority party, on our economy is the excessive spending on
unemployment.
Where did all the workers go? We have got 11 million open
jobs. I have people close to me who work as employment
consultants trying to find people, help people find jobs, and
these people are suddenly telling them in the last year and a
half, hey, do not contact me until I stop getting paid not to
work. We have grown the welfare State, we have grown the
dependency State.
How can you possibly say we need to make it easier for
people to access unemployment insurance with what is going on
in our country today?
Secretary Walsh. Well, I think the failure came with the
workforce development right now that we are dealing with--the
last administration not having a plan for the pandemic, either
going into the pandemic, or coming out of the pandemic, and
there was no plan by the last administration. President Biden
inherited a plan that he needed to get people back to work, and
in this first 13 months, 14 months, of being President of the
United States of America, 8.7 more million people are back to
work that were not going to work the day he got sworn in as
President.
Mr. Good. How can you possibly say in your testimony that
every dollar paid in unemployment benefits translates into two
dollars to boost the economy? How in the world does that? We
borrow money to pay people not to work. You are saying that
helps the economy?
Secretary Walsh. Well, I did not say that in my testimony.
What I----
Mr. Good. Reading from your testimony, ``Studies have shown
that every dollar paid in unemployment benefits translates into
two dollars to boost the economy,'' page 4.
Secretary Walsh. Well, if you want to let me answer the
question. If you look at the facts and figures of what it is,
the investments, that is what all the experts are saying. The
investment is back into our economy. I mean your constituents
benefited from that, that were out of work, that do not have
work today, so I recommend that we try and help constituents
all across this country.
Mr. Good. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. The gentleman yields back. The gentlelady
from New Mexico, Ms. Leger Fernandez.
Ms. Leger Fernandez. Thank you, Chairman, and thank you
Secretary Walsh for being the Secretary during the time when
we've had the greatest job growth of any President, and in
history. At the same time that we have brought down the
deficit, so this has been both a fiscally responsible
administration, as well as one dedicated to increasing jobs in
America. I also want to thank you for the work you have done in
terms of increasing wages of our workers, and protecting our
workers, because that is what we are about.
We are about increasing the money that our working families
get to take home as well as creating opportunities. I
appreciated your emphasis on the manner in which we are
creating opportunities for our working families. I want to talk
a bit about the concept of protecting our workers. I know we
have money in the budget for protecting miners.
As you know, and this is something of importance to me
because of historical mining, and the lack of protections that
we did historically for uranium miners. These workers, many of
whom are Latino and Native American, toiled away for national
security, but then suffered from cancers and other serious
illnesses.
We did pass the Radiation Exposure Compensation Act, and
the Energy Employees Occupational Illness Compensation Program
Act, but unfortunately, both of these laws left out many who
suffered, and that includes uranium miners who worked after
1971, as well as core drillers and DOE remediation workers.
We know that these workers fell ill precisely because of
their job. Secretary Walsh, would you agree that it is
important that the government provide assistance to these
individuals, just as it does to others who worked in the
uranium industry?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I think we have to be very supportive
and helpful in any way we can, and just to your earlier point
about some of the safety, mine safety, we are seeing an
increase in fatalities in mines this year. We had a meeting
with some of the major mining companies in America to talk
about sharing best practices moving forward.
We want to try to get ahead of this because we have seen an
increase of fatalities, and then obviously when you think of
the other diseases, black lung, silica, all the things that we
are dealing with, those challenges always remain there.
Ms. Leger Fernandez. Thank you very much. I have the
Radiation Exposure Compensation Act of 2021 to make sure we
capture all of these uranium miners who are now receiving
compensation. I also then want to turn to another, since we are
on miners, and other energy industries like coal that have--and
oil and gas, that have basically kept the lights on at home.
They have fueled American business and innovation for
decades, but as market forces shift, the landscape of energy
generation they also deserve opportunities, and we want to
diversify our economy and grow local, good paying union jobs. I
really appreciate your budget request of $100 million to
provide employment and training assistance to workers in
communities facing job losses related to the extraction of
fossil fuels, or energy production.
I similarly urge appropriations to include robust funding
for this program in Fiscal Year 23. What is the department
currently doing to assist workers in these communities?
Secretary Walsh. I mean I think as we think about the
transitioning, one is making sure that we are getting prepared
to, even at a faster pace, transition workers from the fuel,
the fossil fuel industry, into other industries, and part of
that is through our workforce development. Part of that is
through the efforts of pre-apprenticeship, apprenticeship
programs, and also working very closely with the White House
and the Department of Energy, and Department of Commerce as we
transition on these industries.
Ms. Leger Fernandez. Right. Do you see these new jobs as
also being good paying union jobs as they might have been good
paying jobs in the fossil fuel industry.
Secretary Walsh. Well, I think they need to be. I think
that when you think about these industries, I think that when
people are transitioning from one industry to another, we
cannot transition somebody from being a coal miner who has
worked hard every day, goes down you know 600 feet underground,
four miles out in a tunnel, and then all of a sudden when their
industry is not there expect them to be paid less money working
in a solar plant.
I mean we have to make sure these are good paying jobs in
the green economy.
Ms. Leger Fernandez. How would continued funding of the
programs that you have help serve these communities and these
workers?
Secretary Walsh. Well, I think that we have to continue to
fund these programs, and then at some point actually look to
expand some of these programs as well, because as we think
about dislocated workers, we are going to see larger numbers as
time goes on, as these industries--as we get greener, and
cleaner, we are going to start to see these industries changing
faster.
Now is the time to lay down the foundation for that and
really focus on certain parts of the country where mining is a
big issue, and making sure that those like West Virginia,
making sure all the workers in West Virginia are not left with
nothing, that they have something to really think about raising
their families.
We are talking intergenerational families that have been
working in these industries.
Ms. Leger Fernandez. Thank you, and I really did appreciate
you going to one of those orphan wells.
Secretary Walsh. Loved it.
Ms. Leger Fernandez. Where we will have good paying jobs as
we cleanup those environments, so thank you very much Secretary
Walsh.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from North
Carolina, Ms. Manning.
Ms. Manning. Thank you, Mr. Chairman for holding this
important hearing, and thank you Mr. Secretary, for being with
us today and for your patience. Secretary Walsh, during your
discussion with Representative Bonamici, you said that we need
to address the issue of childcare, and you also said that we
need to address the issue of immigration.
I would like to ask you about both of these issues. First,
immigration. Let us step on that third rail together. We passed
two great bills in the House on immigration, and we have been
working on comprehensive immigration reform, which I believe is
critically important because our immigration system is so out
of date, and it does not address the needs of our country.
Can you elaborate on what you meant when you said we need
to address immigration?
Secretary Walsh. Yes, thank you for the question. When you
talk about third rail, immigration should not be a third rail.
When you think about in our country folks that are here
undocumented, creating a pathway to citizenship would help us
with filling these jobs that are unfilled, so we do not quite
honestly have enough people to fill these jobs.
We also have students that come from other countries to get
educated in America, in our college universities. When their
time is done here, if they do not get a visa program, we kick
them out. No other country in the world would do that. By
educating people they would keep them there.
Every employer and business I have spoken to in America,
almost I should say, big employers, big companies, are all like
we need immigration reform, so this should not be a Democrat,
Republican issue, this should be an American economy issue, and
I think we need to think about it, rather than fool around
every year on expanding H-2B visas, and H-2A visas, and kind of
getting a couple workers in here temporarily.
Those industries--I get calls from Democrats and
Republicans on the H-2B program all the time, and those
industries that they're talking about, some of them are year-
round industry, and they do not have workers in those
industries for a whole bunch of reasons. Quite honestly, some
people are not going into those industries.
I think having comprehensive immigration reform with a good
pathway, with also dealing with the border, President Biden has
talked about that. That us the path forward.
Ms. Manning. Thank you so much. In my district I have
talked to business leaders, and business owners from farmers to
manufacturing companies, to people who are looking for very
high-skilled workers, and we cannot find enough workers. I
really appreciate your mentioning that issue, and explaining so
carefully what you meant by that, and my office is ready to
work with you on those issues because we think they are so
critically important.
I want to turn to the childcare issue. You mentioned in
response to Representative McBath, at one point, that at one
point during the pandemic you were afraid we would not be able
to get women back into the workforce, and you said, ``Women are
critical to our economy.'' You discussed with Representative
Bonamici the importance of addressing our inadequate childcare
system.
I know from talking with childcare providers in my
district, and particularly I remember a meeting I had with some
Head Start managers in my district who said that there is a
severe shortage of childcare workers in large part because the
pay is so inadequate.
In fact, many childcare workers actually qualify for SNAP
benefits, and they need these benefits to make ends meet, and
that is absolutely unacceptable. Many of the workers also lack
professional development opportunities that would allow them to
increase their skills and develop a career path that would help
them get into higher paid jobs.
Can you talk about what the Department of Labor is doing to
address this important issue?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. It is one of the issues that we are
looking at when we talk about pre-apprenticeship and
apprenticeship programs, and getting--creating pathways into
more industries. Childcare is one of them. The problem is also
always going to be until we come up with a better system, the
pay, salary for folks.
What happened during the pandemic, a lot of people left the
industry, not because they wanted to, but because the industry
was not there, it evaporated, disappeared. When the industry
came back, a lot of those workers found better paying jobs
because they were doing the job because they loved the job, not
because they were getting paid in the job.
I think that you know reevaluating, and we had to do it
pre-pandemic quite honestly, reevaluating what childcare looks
like in America, and you know the costs on families that, the
President put forth a bill that, I want to say any family that
earns $150,000.00 jointly, or less, would pay no more, or less,
than 7 percent of their salary for childcare.
That makes sense. Again, I think that if you talk to
industry, business leaders, they will all say childcare is one
of the biggest obstacles families have, and people have to get
employees back into work.
Ms. Manning. I assume you would feel the same way about
universal pre-K?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I mean as the Mayor of Boston we
brought universal pre-K into the city of Boston, and you know
it was really the people that benefited from the universal pre-
K were low-income families that got their kids into school.
Universal prekindergarten is, if you look at the studies of
child development and brain development, you will find that
families that have the means, and middle-class income, and two
parent structure, young people hear more words, and they are
more prepared for school.
Families that do not have that, little kids that do not
have that, they are not prepared. You have universal pre-
kindergarten, now we are preparing everyone, and the studies
show that the success rate of graduating high school and onto
college, some type of secondary education, even a program, is
so beneficial. We saw it in Boston, we saw it in New York City,
where you have universal pre-kindergarten.
Not everyone has to take advantage of it, but it is
tremendously helpful. Forget the family, forget the businesses,
for the little kids.
Ms. Manning. Thank you. My time has expired. I yield back.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from Michigan,
Mrs. McClain.
Mrs. McClain. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you Mr.
Secretary for being here. We really appreciate it, especially
we are definitely struggling in my district with the labor
shortage. I do not care if it is nurses, manufacturing,
restaurants, it is across the board. I cannot even pinpoint it
to one specific industry, and the comments that I get back from
my district is you and Washington are out of touch with what is
going on.
I think part of that is because of the data that we give,
and we are not giving the data context. Sometimes we do these--
we make these quotes, you know, Biden will say, ``Our plans and
our policies have produced the strongest job creation economy
in modern times. In addition, that 8.3 million jobs in my first
15 months in office.'' It is a record, and you will say, ``We
remain focused on empowering all of our workers to seize the
opportunities in a growing economy by working to improve job
quality, and job access all across the country.''
It sounds good, but it is just not trickling down, and it
is not working, and I can share with you at least in my
community, in my district, you have Janet Yellen saying that I
do not think we are about to lose control of inflation, right?
I think the issue is how can the administration possibly
try and take a victory lap on the economics when we know that
there are nearly 3 million workers excluded right, from the
unemployment data. Pre-pandemic, or whatever, let us say it was
100, then we dropped down to 30, then OK we take a victory lap
because we are up to 60. We are still 40 percent off the mark.
What is--I mean how can we, how do we take a victory lap on
that? I am just struggling with that.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you very much. First of all, I don't
think the President is taking a victory lap, and I think he
should take a victory lap.
Mrs. McClain. I would strongly disagree. I have heard some
members in this committee say you know we should celebrate.
Secretary Walsh. I mean there has definitely been some
successes, but I think the fact that--and we acknowledge, the
President acknowledges, I acknowledge this, that we still have
inflationary pressures that are out there that people in your
district are facing, and people in this city are facing it.
People in my old city as Mayor are facing it. There are
challenges certainly. We are seeing the President reducing the
deficit, I think it is 1.7 trillion dollars, which is great for
the bottom line for the Federal Government, but we still have
challenges with Ukraine, and the war going on in Ukraine, and
obstacles.
I think that you know again when I say I do not think the
President has taken a victory lap, I think that you know we
have to continue to collectively, where we can, collectively,
bring down the pressures at home.
Mrs. McClain. I appreciate that. What do you feel about the
question is when will this administration stop this madness,
and end the public health emergency, and reinState work
requirements to get the people back to work? I mean at the end
of the day we infused a ton of money. I am not here to argue
whether it is good, bad or indifferent, but we printed a ton of
money into the economy, right?
Average full-time minimum wage right, is $1,257 bucks a
month. Full-time median, median is roughly $3,500 bucks a
month. With all of the spending, all of the programs, all of
the incentives to keep people out of the workforce and on the
couch, it is $3,100. Listen, people are logical, especially
with gas at five bucks a gallon.
Listen, I would rather stay on unemployment and not put gas
in my car because it makes logically more sense. How is this a
sustainable future because all of these people are not paying
taxes. Remember, the government does not produce anything. We
need this tax revenue. We have roughly 4 million people, higher
today on unemployment. How is this a sustainable future?
Secretary Walsh. Well actually our unemployment number is
the lowest it has been since the 1970's.
Mrs. McClain. We are not--but you and I both know what the
unemployment number doesn't count, and that's the people who
are actively not seeking work. There are 4 million more people
on food stamps right now today, so if you want to account for
our job openings has gone from increased by--I am trying to
find the number here. What, 40 percent?
We still have our job openings is huge. I think it has a
lot to do with the pandemic, and the social programs that we
are putting out there. What is frustrating is we can't ignore
this, and nobody ever talks about this.
Secretary Walsh. Let me just quickly just respond before we
get shut off here. One thing that, in my budget, in the budget
that is in front of Congress, is really thinking about
workforce development and job training, expanding
apprenticeships. What we want to do is create again, I talked
about this all day today, and I will continue to talk about
this, I talk about it all the time, is creating partnerships
with industry and businesses about how do we get some of those
folks that are not engaged in the workforce.
Mrs. McClain. Industry is ready, and they are paying.
Industry is begging people. Again, I am not talking the $15.00
an hour busboy, I am talking about nurses. I am talking about
$60,000, $100,000 a year jobs.
Secretary Walsh. I was in Rochester Hills talking to the
business leaders in Rochester Hills with my friend Brian Bonnet
early last year and talking to businesses. I was in not too
long after that I was in Detroit with Mayor Duggan, talking
about the same--different business, but the same.
Mrs. McClain. I would encourage you to come to my district.
Secretary Walsh. I will.
Mrs. McClain. I say that because are you in agreement that
we need to stop, ending some of this public health emergency
programs?
Secretary Walsh. I mean I think we have to be careful with
that because there is a need in America for some of them, but I
think if we have to identify the----
Mrs. McClain. Clearly there is no crisis at border. We do
not have a public health crisis there, why do we have a public
health crisis?
Secretary Walsh. I will come to your district; we will have
the conversation. How is that?
Mrs. McClain. I appreciate it, thank you sir.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. The gentlelady's time has expired. The
gentleman from New York, Mr. Jones, you are recognized for 5
minutes.
Mr. Jones. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you Secretary
Walsh for being here, for your patience and for your work
supporting Americans as they recover economically from the
pandemic. As others on the committee have highlighted, in May
the unemployment rate fell to 3.6 percent, a testament to the
Biden administration's work, vaccinating the country, and
getting people back to work.
As you also noted in your written testimony, unemployment
does not fall evenly across the American population. Women
continue to be unemployed at higher rates than men. Black and
Hispanic Americans are unemployed at higher rates than white
Americans. For formerly incarcerated individuals, an
unemployment rate of 3.6 percent has little bearing on their
experience in the labor market.
As we heard from Tracy Scott of the National Urban League,
in a hearing before this committee earlier this Congress, prior
to the COVID-19 pandemic, individuals returning from
incarceration had an unemployment rate of 60 to 75 percent 1
year after their release, and overall, formerly incarcerated
persons faced an unemployment rate of 27 percent.
We incarcerate more people than any other country on earth,
and we fail to make the investments needed to provide those
individuals with stable employment opportunities, and secure
economic futures. I applaud the Labor Department's request for
additional reentry employment opportunities funding, and the
administration's Second Chance Opportunities Initiative.
I would respectfully suggest to you that that is not yet
enough. The administration proposes serving approximately
20,000 individuals during program year 2023, through the
Reentry Employment Opportunities Program. This is a small
fraction of the 640,000 individuals released from incarceration
every year.
That leads me to ask how does the department decide which
of the hundreds of thousands of individuals released from
incarceration every year, gets targeted for RAO services?
Secretary Walsh. Thank you very much. First and foremost,
we do not run, the Department of Labor, all of the re-entry
programs, as you know, that happen throughout the country. In
some cases, you have good re-entry programs, I should not say
good--adequate re-entry programs if you will in states that do
it.
I certainly think that we need to come up with--there is an
opportunity here in my opinion in America, to really capitalize
on 600,000 people coming out of incarceration and creating
opportunities and pathways into the workforce. I think that we
need to do a better job of that as a society, not just as a
Federal Government, but as a local government.
I have, you know, again I have seen these programs at work,
they are very successful, and I have seen these programs that
do not. We have some successful programs from the Federal
Government working to our American job centers. We are actually
in some penal systems in America doing some re-entry work.
I think that we need to do more, so certainly I would
welcome any additional money that Congress wants to allocate to
this budget, to me, at the Department of Labor to do this work.
I know how to do this work, and I know how we can build
partnerships.
Mr. Jones. OK. Mr. Secretary, so do I understand you to be
saying that the reason you are only able to target 20,000 of
the approximately 640,000 formerly incarcerated persons being
released every year is because you need a larger budget to be
able to serve more people?
Secretary Walsh. No. I think you said that. You said we did
not ask for enough money, so I am just agreeing with you.
Mr. Jones. I do not recall saying that you did not ask for
enough money, look I am trying to understand how do you choose
the 20,000 of the 640,000.
Secretary Walsh. Sorry, I think the numbers are bigger than
20,000. No. 1, I think that that is a talking point, or a
bullet point in what we are doing. You know we are working
right now; we just launched a program with the White House on
reentry and trying to do more with reentry programs working. I
think we have a unique opportunity with this bipartisan
Infrastructure Bill, to create a pathway into industry that you
might not have seen on paper, to the building trades, into
other industries.
A lot of this stuff you are not going to see the numbers. I
think a number is a number. It is what programs can we set up,
and what industries can we actually create pathways into for
folks that are returning citizens. I mean I do not know if you
were on the Zoom earlier today, but I talked about a program
called Operation Exit, that is a returning citizen program in
the city of Boston.
92 percent of the folks that go through that program are
African-American, most of them were incarcerated. Most of them
had a penal--everybody had a record. There is some great
success if you do a real targeted program. That will not show
up on any chart anywhere, but that is a really strong program.
Mr. Jones. OK. You also referenced other Federal employment
assistance programs, such as those provided by DOJ and DOE. How
do you coordinate with those, your REO (inaudible) with those
agencies?
Secretary Walsh. We are coordinating now through the Good
Jobs Initiative in a lot of these different places that we are
working very closely with these different agencies, making sure
that we're on the same page when we talk about creating a good
pathway into a good job, whether it's on equity inclusion,
whether it is about re-entry, or programs like that.
Mr. Jones. OK. Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from Wisconsin,
Mr. Fitzgerald.
Mr. Fitzgerald. Mr. Secretary, thanks for being here today.
I appreciate it, thanks for hanging in there. Since COVID there
is obviously a higher sensitivity to the gathering of health
information, especially from--by employers of employees. I do
not know how much truth it is; I know it is out there, but OSHA
has been looking at asking for employers to submit injury and
illness data.
I think that you know there are some rules, or there is
certainly it looks like some directives that are going to be
coming down soon on that, and I was wondering if you can give
us an update, or if you know anything about where we are at on
that because I think it is going to be controversial,
obviously.
Secretary Walsh. Yes, no it came up earlier today. I think
Wisconsin as well. I am not aware of it, so I have to--I just
quickly asked behind me if we knew about that. I will have to
look into that. I am not aware of us asking any new
information, new questions, particularly around COVID, or
around mandates, and things like that. I am completely not
aware of that.
I will have an answer by the end of the day, and we will
get in touch with you on that.
Mr. Fitzgerald. That sounds great. Let me just shift
quickly. Representative Crow and I are also members of small
business, and we just had a bill that we worked on together,
and it has passed the House already. It deals with industry
recognized apprenticeships.
In my district over the last year or so, and I know it has
been discussed almost ad nauseum today, the labor shortage
stuff. It seems that specifically kind of tech colleges
throughout the Nation have been doing a good job of kind of
pairing up with industries to develop strategies, and actually
developing curriculums, and in some instances, even employers
funding those apprenticeships by paying X amount of dollars per
day for anybody who has throughout the entire period of time
that they are in training.
I would encourage you, and I know you have got involvement
in this, and experience in this. I am just wondering kind of
where Department of Labor is on this stuff, and if you guys--I
am actually trying to tell you that I think there are some good
things coming out of Congress right now related to this, and
would love to hear kind of your take on apprenticeships and
this private sector pairing that is going on.
Secretary Walsh. Yes. First and foremost, I would love to
talk to you if you want to put a group of small businesses
together from your district, or from Wisconsin, I would either
go there, or we can do a Zoom, love to talk to them about what
they are experiencing, and what their needs are, number 1.
Mr. Fitzgerald. That would be great.
Secretary Walsh. That is important. No. 2, we are looking
at expanding, and we talked about a few times, different times
today, so I will not repeat too much of it, but apprenticeship
programs into other industries outside of historically we think
of construction as apprenticeships. We do not think of IT, we
do not think of retail, we do not think of these different
sectors, maybe even restaurants potentially where we have a
shortage of restaurant workers.
We are looking into expanding registered apprenticeship
programs in the Department of Labor, and we are also looking at
continuing to, I would not say expand but create more pre-
apprentice programs so that companies that make investments in
apprenticeship programs, rather than getting somebody that goes
into an apprenticeship program, does a year and then realizes
well I do not want to be here.
That company just lost that investment if you will.
Mr. Fitzgerald. Right.
Secretary Walsh. Is there an opportunity for us to have
more pre-apprentice programs. Again, a feel for people going
into an industry, so they are getting paid a stipend, but they
get a chance to kind of get a feel for the industry before they
make that full commitment to the industry. I would love to--and
I am serious about this.
Even if it is through Zoom, we do not have to visit but let
us set a Zoom up with your companies to talk about what they
want, the needs that they have, the needs that they want to
see, and how they can be successful.
Mr. Fitzgerald. Sounds good, we will take you up on that.
Thank you very much. Mr. Chair, I yield back.
Secretary Walsh. All right.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from Indiana, Mr.
Mrvan.
Mr. Mrvan. Mr. Chairman, I thank you very much for this
opportunity. Secretary Walsh, I want to thank you for your
patience, and I also want to take this opportunity to thank you
for your visit to Northwest Indiana, where we advocated for the
bipartisan Infrastructure Bill, along with the steel industry,
and along with the United Steelworkers.
That being said, I also want to take this opportunity to
advocate my strong support for the Section 232 policies in
order to protect our steel industry from over capacity, and all
the downstream industries within my district of Northwest
Indiana. That being said, there has been an increase in
reshoring of domestic manufacturing in the United States.
I just want to give you an opportunity to be able to talk
about the bipartisan Innovation Act, and the value of that to
workforces for the future.
Secretary Walsh. Yes, I think that a lot has been discussed
here today. We talked about inflation several times. We have
talked about workforce development several times. We have
talked about issues around training and workforce development,
and job training, apprenticeships. The opportunity in front of
us with the bipartisan Innovation Act is really about bringing
real strong manufacturing jobs back to America.
We invented the chip. We invented the computer chip, and
everything that we have, the computer, the TV in front of me,
the two phones in my pocket, the iPads in my desk, all of that
stuff needs computer chips, the cars we drive, everything we
have. We do not create them in America, and the bipartisan
Innovation Act would allow us the opportunity to create these
computer chips back where we create--we invented them, so why
not build them here in America.
We help us not with inflation today, but long-term would
help us with inflation, creating pathways into good jobs, in
Indiana and Michigan, and Wisconsin, all these places that
Iowa--all these different Congress people that we hear today,
talking in Virginia, talking about their industry. Every one of
those cities, including Massachusetts, has a part of the State
that is not the same as it was 50 years ago because the
manufacturing base left.
We have such an opportunity to bring back good jobs,
manufacturing back to the United States of America. The
bipartisan Innovation Act is probably I would argue--I might
get myself in trouble saying this, this potentially is bigger
than the Infrastructure Bill that was passed by this Congress
this year.
You are talking about long-term. We are building roads and
bridges, clean drinking water, broadband, but we are talking
about creating a pathway for good paying jobs in communities
all across America, but we are also talking about being less
reliant on foreign inputs.
Mr. Mrvan. I cannot agree with you more. I have been
advocating for the Innovation Act consistently with those same
thought processes, and even create the eco-system as I talked
about. Gary, Indiana produces steel. Car manufacturers, they
wait for those chips. They wait for those semi-conductors, and
when they stopped production, those workers stopped working in
my community, then the steel workers stopped working.
That is why I have been advocating for that bill from the
very beginning, and then for the future. I want to be at the
seat at the table to make sure that Indiana, Northwest Indiana,
is one of those innovation hubs creating the next future jobs
for the next future generations.
I also have a next question about whistleblowers if I
could. Secretary, Congress and the public have benefited from
whistleblower testimony. In fact, a study that has found that
whistleblowing is highly effective at detecting improper and
illegal activity, and that whistleblowers were responsible for
43 percent of the fraud detection.
The voice of whistleblowers has led to improved safety in
the workplace protection of workers' rights and helped to
improve the dignity of work. However, whistleblowers to the
Federal Trade Commission, the FTC are not protected from
retaliation and therefore take their information to the
Securities and Exchange Commission, rather than the FTC.
Regrettably, whistleblowers from private companies are not
protected by the SEC, and currently have no protections. My
question is would the Department of Labor reviewed the FTC
Whistleblower Act of 2021, which creates a right of action for
whistleblowers to have suffered retaliation for disclosing a
violation of any law, rule, regulation, or order enforced by
the Federal Trade Commission.
Secretary Walsh. Let me--my answer to that is let me look
into see what jurisdiction we have, what we can do as a
department. I am not aware of it at the moment. I know somebody
is scrambling behind me to try and give me a paper right now
but let me get back to you on that one.
Mr. Mrvan. I thank you very much. I appreciate what you are
doing and again let us work together as we have in the past to
make sure working men and women have a future, and an
opportunity to provide for their families.
Secretary Walsh. You brought up Gary, Indiana, Working
Families Diner, great burgers in there.
Mr. Mrvan. Absolutely, thank you sir.
Chairman Scott. The gentleman yields back. The gentleman
from New York, Mr. Bowman.
Mr. Bowman. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Mr.
Secretary, good to see you here. Thank you for joining us
today. I am especially interested in how your department is
supporting workers across the country in their efforts to
engage in collective bargaining and unionization, especially
given recent reporting about companies like Amazon, spending
millions on antiunion efforts.
In January, your department put out a blog proposal about
the work of the Office of Labor and Management Standards and
noted that OLMS was planning to relaunch a program highlighting
the benefits of collective bargaining and cooperative union and
employer bargaining relationships.
No. 1, can you provide an update on this effort and discuss
why such a program is so important right now, especially in
light of the reporting on union busting by large employers like
Amazon? Two, what are some of the challenges this program
faces, and what additional resources Congress can provide to
support this vital work.
I have got two other questions I am going to try and get
to, so try to be concise.
Secretary Walsh. I will be really fast. First and foremost,
you know the President, myself, support collective bargaining.
We support workers' rights or organized, there is no secret
about that. I have said that a couple of times here today. I
think that you know the President filed the Pro Act that passed
the House that's over in the Senate now, and the President is
encouraging the Senate to pass the Pro Act.
Surely all the messages, and we talked a little bit about
reporting today, reporting kind of anti-union investments that
the companies have made. They have a legal obligation to do
that. We do not have a lot of enforcement when it comes to
making sure those get filed, so kind of in a nutshell, I mean I
certainly support collective bargaining.
I was at the AFL CIO convention yesterday. I spoke, I
talked about--the one thing I will be honest with you, I said
to the unions is that it is not the responsibility of the
President, or the Federal Government to organize, it is their
responsibility to organize, and then need to go out and
organize. It is our responsibility, I guess in some cases,
Congress, to pass laws that might help unions, but right now we
do not have that.
Mr. Bowman. Thank you. Nationwide unemployment in the black
community remains over 6 percent, the highest of any racial
group in the country. In New York, unemployment in the black
community was over 9 percent for the first quarter of 2022. We
have to do better as you know to support black workers and
their ability to unionize and bargain collectively, to get and
keep good quality high paying jobs. What is your department
doing to support union noncompliance, but specifically for
black Americans, especially in the context of high rates of
unemployment?
Secretary Walsh. Well certainly, one of the things in the
Good Jobs Initiative we are very focused on making sure we are
creating a pathway into not just the innovation and the
bipartisan Infrastructure Law, but all of the policies, and
some of the work that we're doing in the Federal Government, as
far as investments.
Second, we are working across the line in places like Job
Corps, and other job training, and American job centers, making
sure our people have pathways into good paying jobs. We have to
be intentional about the way that we invest in workforce
development programs, partnering with local authorities and
creating pathways.
It is no surprise, it should not be a surprise to any of us
that the unemployment rate for the black community is twice
that of white, it historically has been, but the President has
been very clear that he wants this time, this moment in time,
coming out of a pandemic, the investments that are being made,
that we do it differently, and he is directed all of us to make
sure this happens. It starts with us, and it goes right down.
We have to work with the private sector, we have to work with
the local governments to make sure that this time it is
different.
Mr. Bowman. Can you speak to any collaboration that is done
at the Federal level, the local level, that you know of between
the Department of Labor, and law enforcement? The reason why I
am asking is because we have been doing a lot of re-entry work
in our district. What we are seeing is there is such a lack of
opportunity for people who are returning citizens, but also for
youth who are returning citizens.
They may have not been incarcerated for long periods of
time, maybe a day or so, but there is just a lack of resources
in terms of their workforce development. Can you speak on the
collaborations there, and some of the investments that are
being made there so that youth do not escalate to violence in
certain circumstances?
Secretary Walsh. There is some collaboration, but I think
there should be more collaboration. When I was in Boston, the
Mayor of Boston, my program that we talked about, Operation
Exit, I worked very closely with the Boston Police Department,
with the Courts. We put a lot of young people into a pathway
into pre-apprenticeship programs before they get into trouble.
I think that often times if we wait until after an arrest
happens, or incarceration happens, it is almost too late for
that person because they have to do their time when they get
out. We have to try and catch them again. I think what we want
to do is get on the forefront when somebody just gets into that
beginning time of trouble, and how do we maybe work with
probation and clerks and courts?
Rather than we put them in prison, we put them on a pathway
to a job, and give them that chance. Like you hear the story
with the old days that the Judge would say you go to the
service, or you go to jail. Well now the Judge could say if you
go into an apprentice program, or you go to jail. Give them
that chance.
Mr. Bowman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from North
Carolina, Mr. Cawthorn.
Mr. Cawthorn. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Mr.
Secretary, you mentioned in your testimony that the pandemic
also highlighted that more could be done to ensure that workers
had timely and equitable access to UI benefits, and that
fraudsters, particularly sophisticated international criminal
rings, not flood the UI system with false claims to wrongly
acquire taxpayer funds, while creating further delays for
genuine claims and need.
Secretary, that brings up an interesting question, not
touched in any other part of your testimony that I can find.
Can you answer two questions for me? What was the nature of the
other employment insurance system fraud? What exactly was the
scope of the fraud that you have alluded to?
Secretary Walsh. I mean the nature of the fraud was the
amount of money that went into the system, and this is back
with the CARES Act, and the cares investment that was made in
the very beginning of the pandemic, and we have never seen to
my knowledge in any time in the history of our country, this
type of fraud that happened.
Part of it was because the rules that Congress put on the
money that allowed people to access this money, and I support
you for doing it, access this money easily. It just opened up a
system that was wrong. No. 2, you had antiquated systems all
across the country, and in the American Rescue Plan I want to
thank Congress for allocating two billion dollars, because we
have created the Office of Unemployment Insurance Reform, and
we are working with states all across the country, both
democrats and republican Governors, and the investments in
those states to fix those systems that are antiquated.
With a system that is quite honestly, that is a very old
system, meaning computer systems all across this country.
Mr. Cawthorn. Thank you, Secretary. I have another question
on the same theme. There is an old saying, you know, I am sure
you have heard it, that haste makes waste. I feel that the
requisite spending over the last few years exemplifies that.
The PPP program reports, for instance, was absolutely ripe with
outright theft.
What steps were you taking at the time to prevent fraud and
abuse in the unemployment insurance program?
Secretary Walsh. We are working now; we are working with
Tiger teams. We have gone--I want to say in 27 states. We have
investigated the challenges that they have had and the
breakdowns in their system, and what we want to do is make sure
that this never happens again, and that we have a system that
has strong integrity might be the wrong word, but we are going
to need an investment from Congress, and states are going to
need investments across the country to bring up their systems.
Part of it is that we have you know 53 different systems in
our country the way our system works. We fund it through the
Federal Government a lot of unemployment, but each State is
independent, and some of them are working on systems as old as
30 years old, computer systems. We need to make investments in
this system.
Mr. Cawthorn. All right. Let us move on. Staying on
something that you seem to be quite proud of in the submitted
testimony, just before your comments--I believe you said the
utilized system in particular, the emergency unemployment
compensation programs, and extended by the American Rescue Plan
provided life-savings benefits to American families throughout
the COVID-19 pandemic.
Milton Friedman once said that inflation is taxation
without legislation. Inflation actually robs our working
families of the fruits of their labor and deprives them of
their spending power. Knowing what we know now about the link
between inflation and government spending, just how likely is
it that funds you are touting as providing life saving
benefits, actually contributed to runaway inflation that this
administration set loose.
Secretary Walsh. Well, I think at that time with that
money, whether it was the CARES package, that $600.00
additional a week, or the $300.00 by the Congress earlier in
2021. I think at that particular moment in time you are living
in that moment, and you have to take care of the constituents
and the American people at that particular moment.
I personally do not think it necessary. I do not know if it
added to inflation, but it certainly has not added to inflation
to the point of 9 percent, but you also have to remember in the
context of that particular moment in time American people were
hurting. American people were scared, and we were still in the
early days of the pandemic.
Mr. Cawthorn. All right Secretary Walsh, thank you very
much. Mr. Chairman, with that I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from Minnesota,
Ms. Omar.
Ms. Omar. Thank you, Chairman. The USMCA included over 200
million dollars to ILAB for technical assistance to help with
Mexico with enforcement of its new labor law. This funding can
also be used for capacity building to monitor compliance with
the new trade agreement. Secretary Walsh, what steps is ILAB
taking to support the enforcement of Mexico's new labor laws,
and what steps are being taken to protect the rights of
independent union workers.
Secretary Walsh. Yes, thank you. Back about a month ago my
Deputy Secretary, Julie Su, I mentioned this earlier today, was
in Mexico and met with the Labor Minister in Mexico. We have
four labor attaches on the ground that are working on
enforcement of this trade agreement.
We have a fifth that would be coming forward. I was at the
AFL-CIO convention yesterday, and I met with a worker that
organized a union in Mexico for automobiles and was very
excited to be here in America talking about their organizing
drive.
ILAB is working very closely to monitor that agreement, to
make sure workers are being protected. Workers are being
treated fairly. Making sure--that is why I am looking for an
increase to help ILAB in not just in Mexico, but around the
globe to make sure that we are doing everything.
We saw increases in child labor violations last year. I am
sure you saw the report, Congresswoman. The report is not a
good one. This was the first time in about 10 years we have
seen violations go up, so we have some work to do on the
international stage.
Ms. Omar. Thank you, Secretary Walsh. Since we are on the
topic of trade, I wanted to know if your department has studied
the consumer and labor impacts of US-MCA in certain sectors
since it has been implemented?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I work very closely with Katherine
Tai. Our office works very closely with Katherine, the
Ambassador, so there are a lot of different spaces that we work
very closely together.
Ms. Omar. Yes. I asked because I want to take your focus to
an article that was published in 2008, and it was the headline
says how baby formula might end up as a collateral damage in
Trump's war, Trump's NAFTA war. I just wanted, you know, you
might not have the answer right now, but just wanted to see if
there is sort of looking at some of these things because this
price was foreshadowing some of the trade factors that could
possibly contribute to the current formula shortage that we are
seeing, and I do not know if you can speak to any impacts that
it might have had to the supply and market?
Secretary Walsh. That is one I would have to get back to
you on.
Ms. Omar. All right. Appreciate that. The Bureau of
International Labor Affairs in the U.S. Government needing a
voice in the strengthening the rights of workers
internationally. One of these initiatives is the Labor Attache
program, which posts attaches in a strategic U.S. embassy
overseas to increase labor monitoring. Some of these countries
include Vietnam, Colombia, and Mexico.
Each aspect of this coordinated approach is vital to
ensuring that U.S. trade policy benefits workers in the U.S.
and abroad. Mr. Secretary, can you expand upon how this program
and ILAB generally supported labor rights for foreign workers
and their communities, and can you quickly explain how
protecting and promoting such human rights benefits, is
beneficial for American workers and our economy at large?
Secretary Walsh. Well, I think you know one of the things
that we are very interested in, and making sure in our ILAB
office is that we have good strong relationships with
governments around the world to make sure that worker's rights
are adequately protected in those states, in those countries. A
lot of our own companies are working in those same countries.
We want to make sure that we are not taking advantage of
workers, even though they might not be American workers. We are
working closely with them, and this is--I just came back from
the G-7 in Germany, where the seven largest economies in the
world, we sat down and talked about the labor atrocities
happening in the world, and you know, Italy and Germany,
ourself, we are all there talking. Japan was there.
We talked about--Australia was there. We talked about
really making sure we can continue to work together to support
workers right around the globe. You are on mute, Congresswoman.
Chairman Scott. The gentlelady's time has expired. The
gentlelady is on mute if you are trying to say anything.
Ms. Omar. I will just yield back since I ran out of my
time. I did have a quick question but thank you, Chairman.
Thank you, Mr. Secretary.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. I would advise the members that they have
called votes. The gentleman from New York, Mr. Jacobs.
Mr. Jacobs. Thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. Secretary.
I just had a couple questions. We have been here a long time,
so thank you for that. Regarding mental health parody. The
Mental Health Parody and Addiction Equity Act of 2008 prohibits
group health plans filed by large employers that provide mental
health benefits from imposing less favorable treatment
limitations on those benefits, than medical or surgical
benefits.
Mr. Secretary, ensuring that patients have access to mental
health coverage and treatment is a priority to this committee.
Many health plans, and employers seek to abide by mental health
parody laws to find the department's rules on nine un-
quantitative treatment limitations to be subjective and
confusing. Despite receiving explicit directions from Congress
outlining the information DOL must provide to plans, the
department has yet to issue guidance illustrating how plans may
demonstrate compliance with the law.
DOL could more effectively advance mental health if its
focused on efforts on establishing clear guidance and
compliance assistance, instead of focusing solely on the non-
compliance of the employers. Right now, DOL believes that every
plan is out of compliance, which leads me to believe there is a
problem with what they are getting from the DOL.
Can the committee expect you to release additional guidance
in this regard?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. Thank you for that. That is the first
I have heard it that way, but let me be clear. We had--I had a
meeting with Secretary Becerra in my office because we are
working with HHS on this, 2 weeks ago with the insurance
providers of the healthcare plans from the country.
I think that if that is the case, and yes, I am not saying
it is not what you just said to me, we need to be very clear on
what's expected of insurance companies in America to provide
good, strong, comprehensive parity when it comes to mental
health and substance use. The answer to your question is yes. I
will work with you. We will work with everyone, and I would
love to--any information you have on that from companies saying
that it is not clear information I would love to get that
personally.
Mr. Jacob. Thank you. As you know, we have talked in the
last couple weeks for obvious reasons with the tragedies about
mental health needs for more support services, more funding,
but of course the majority of people are covered by plans like
this, and the more we can do to make sure that they are having
access, whether it is online, remote, or otherwise, I think
would be a major part of this equation.
With that again, thank you for your time. We have votes, so
I will yield back.
Secretary Walsh. No, thank you for that.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Thank you for your consideration
to the other members. The gentleman from Texas, Mr. Castro.
Mr. Castro. Thank you, Chairman, and thank you Secretary
Walsh, for your leadership with the Department, and all of your
work at the Department of Labor. I was pleased to see the
Department of Labor's June 10th guidance on preventing abusive
recruitment practices of prospective workers in the H-2A and H-
2B programs.
Problems with the H-2 visa programs as you know, are well
documented, as numerous investigative reports have shown
systemic exploitation of guest workers, as employers are able
to game the system when it comes to recruiting. Guest workers
play an essential role in our economy, and it is critical that
there be rulemaking to strengthen the protection of wages and
working conditions, and to ensure accountability of employers
who abuse workers' rights.
I wanted to ask you does the department have plans to
include H-2B's reform in its agenda of regulatory action?
Secretary Walsh. We are in the process right now of looking
at our H-2 programs, H-2B, H-2A, and you know we are having
conversations. We did some strengthening of our H-2B worker
requirements, worker protections if you will, when we did a lot
of the 35,000 new visas. We are looking at both the H-2A
programs as we move forward, so the answer to your question is
yes.
Mr. Castro. Well, thank you for that, and I appreciate it
very much, and I know other members of the committee, and other
Members of Congress appreciate that. In the interest of time,
because I know people are trying to go vote, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you very much. The gentleman from New
York, Mr. Espaillat, you are recognized for 5 minutes. The
gentleman from New York. The gentleman from New York.
Mr. Espaillat. Hello, I am here, Mr. Chairman. Thank you so
much for giving me this opportunity to address these very
important questions. First, my first question is really one
that is very personal to me as my first job as a young teenager
was a summer youth job in the city of New York. It gave me
great opportunities and taught me skills like getting to work
on time, dressing appropriately for the job, being job ready,
and positive at the jobsite.
The evidence shows that a significant percentage of young
people that are involved in the summer youth job like I was,
will not engage in felony--felonious action, and will not be
convicted of a felony. The recent study has identified that
high quality summer youth employment, like those in New York
City and Chicago, focus on recruiting and supporting youth and
employers, and technologies to administer the programs and
facilitate communications with stakeholders are very effective.
I wanted to ask you what do you feel, how can Congress best
support your agency's work to guarantee summer youth job
programs across the country? High quality jobs, what
recommendations do you have for Congress to bolster the summer
youth employment prospects for young people across the country?
Secretary Walsh. Yes, I have lots of opinions on that. No.
1, I think that if Congress is going to pass anything like that
you need to talk to the mayors because that is where it is
going to be carried out. As a member of the former--member of
the U.S. Conference of Mayors, a lot of people modeled the
summer job program after the city of Boston.
We employ roughly 11,000 young people a year in the city,
both in the public sector and private sector. We need to have a
component of that. You need to have a component of those summer
job programs that the private sector is making investments in,
and they are not going to complain about it. They actually like
the program.
New York has a good private sector, a piece of that. Boston
has a great private sector, Kentucky, Louisville--Kentucky has
a great private sector, and I think that you know when we think
about these programs, summer job programs, it doesn't have to
be all funded by public entities, it can be a public-private
partnership.
I would suggest that before, as Congress is moving forward
on any type of legislation, or any type of investment, you need
to get cities and towns at the table, because those are the
ones that are going to carry it out. It is not going to be
carried out by the Federal Government. It is not going to be
carried out by the Congress.
It is going to be carried out by the local authorities.
Mr. Espaillat. Well, thank you, thank you for that answer.
My next question is, Secretary Walsh, ProPublica found that
only 13 percent of jobless Black workers received unemployment
benefits between April and June 2020, compared to 24 percent of
white workers.
To address these egregious inequities, the department has
begun distributing funding provided by the American Rescue Plan
to help promote equitable access to State unemployment
insurance systems. How do these equity grants allow states to
reinforce their UI system, and ensure workers get the benefit
they are owed if they become unemployed?
Secretary Walsh. Well, I think a lot of what the pandemic
showed in the UI systems around the country shortfalls, and
pitfalls, that these different systems have. I think that we
talked earlier about--I talked to you earlier about the fraud
side of it. I think on the other side there is accessing
benefits.
We are making these investments, but what's going to be
needed is other investments, both on the Federal level and the
State level, to make sure that these systems that are in place
in states--and when I say systems, I am talking computer
systems, make it more easier to be able to access the benefit,
but also can allow the states to have better protections in
place to make sure the people that are accessing these
benefits, are actually the person that's accessing the benefit.
I think as we continue to move forward in the reform of UI
insurance, we are going to be making recommendations, and
working with states and territories around the country on this.
The equity grants allows people the opportunity as well to
create better access to these programs.
Mr. Espaillat. Thank you. Thank you, Secretary, thank you
Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from New Jersey,
Ms. Sherrill.
Ms. Sherrill. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Secretary Walsh, a
critical component of our workforce system is the registered
apprenticeship system, which helps workers access high quality,
good paying jobs while also assisting employers in filling high
scale positions. I was proud to cosponsor the National
Apprenticeship Act in both the 116th and 117th Congress, which
will create over 1 million new registered apprenticeship
programs.
Given the success of the program, I was excited to see that
the Department of Labor's Fiscal Year 202023 budget request
includes over 300 million dollars for registered apprenticeship
grants. Can you discuss the impact of registered
apprenticeships on the ability of workers to access high
quality jobs, as well as their role in helping to combat the
labor shortages currently affecting our economy?
Can you also discuss the importance of the Senate passing
the National Apprenticeship Act? Thank you.
Secretary Walsh. Yes, thank you very much. You know the
National Apprenticeship Act is a really important piece of
legislation, and more importantly, an important piece of the
puzzle for us as far as workers in America. I know that the
Chairman and the committee were trying to make sure that this
moves forward, and potentially in the Innovation Act. We would
love to see that happen.
Having any type of apprenticeship that we can move in this
country right now, and expanding apprenticeship, registered
apprenticeships, and expanding pre-apprenticeships is really
going to be I think the future of our economy and economic
success in America. Hopefully, we could see not just this bill
move forward, but even investments in apprenticeship.
Ms. Sherrill. Thank you. And a key factor behind the
success of the registered apprenticeships is the partnerships
between the labor unions, employers, and the workforce system.
Unions play an important role imposing living standards for
tens of millions of working families, and they also are crucial
in helping Americans access high quality job training, and
workforce development programs.
As we work to expand the scale and scope of our workforce
system, unions must have a significant role in developing and
implementing these high-quality training programs. I was proud
to introduce legislation to increase labor representation on
State and local boards, and I was excited to see this
provisions included in the House passed WIOA reauthorization
this year.
Secretary Walsh, can you discuss the important of strong
labor involvement in our workforce system, and what steps are
the Department of Labor taking to ensure that labor unions have
a seat at the table in developing and implementing the expanded
workforce training programs.
Secretary Walsh. Yes. Whether you like the building trades
or not, and I am just saying that for members of the committee.
$2 billion a year is invested from the company, the management
side of the aisle when it comes to organized labor into the
building trades.
The building trades apprentice programs are the gold
standard of apprenticeships, no matter who you talk to in the
industry. When I am thinking about apprenticeships, some of
these apprenticeships will be union, and some will not be
union, but what we need to do is make sure that the companies
are investing in apprenticeships in this country.
It cannot just all be public investment. In the building
trades there is zero public dollars in apprenticeships. In some
pre-apprentice programs there are public dollars in pre-
apprentice programs. When you think about creating an
apprenticeship, when I think about creating an apprenticeship
program, No. 1, the apprenticeship program needs to work, needs
to create a pathway into an industry.
No. 2, it needs to support the companies that are looking
for workers. No. 3, what it will do, it will create a pathway
into a good middle class job for people that get into these
different industries.
Ms. Sherrill. Thank you. I think as you said our building
trades apprenticeship programs are the gold standards, so
ensuring they have a seat at the table in developing these
programs is really important. Another key piece of our
workforce system is the use of evaluations and evidence to
determine what works best for job seekers, and then fund those
moving programs, which is why I introduced the bipartisan
Expanding Pathways to Employment last year, to fund evidence-
based workforce programs.
Can you discuss the importance of evaluating programs, and
specifically funding and scaling those with the largest impacts
on workers?
Secretary Walsh. Well, I think first and foremost, anytime
you have evidence-based practices, it shows it right there the
importance of it. I think that we will see through, and you
will see that is why you filed the bill, the need for it, and
the need for the expansion. I think that there is no secret
that we need to continue to look in other industries as well
and make those same expansions.
Ms. Sherrill. Well thank you so much, Mr. Secretary, I hope
to see you up in New Jersey soon, and I yield back.
Secretary Walsh. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from California,
Mrs. Steel, you are recognized for 5 minutes, and I would
advise you that there is no time left on the clock on votes.
Mrs. Steel. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. Mr. Secretary,
we are seeing the threat of work stoppages across the globe at
ports. In Southern California, the United States busiest and
largest ports, could soon also have a work stoppage in the
coming days. If there was a work stoppage, the result would add
fuel to the unprecedented supply chain prices.
Earlier this year you supported one side over the other in
a labor dispute. How are you handling this crisis due to the
national and international implications? Do you think a work
stoppage should be off the table for international longshore
and warehouse union? The American people trust that you will be
truly dependent and put the well-being of the American people
first.
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I need to first and foremost, in your
first comment I did not take a side in any dispute, No. 1, just
to be publicly clear on that. No. 2, I was in California on
Friday. I met, we met with the President, we met with the
companies and the long shoremen and today the company in the
long shoremen union both sent a joint statement out saying that
the contract expires July 1. There will be no work stoppage.
They are going to continue to work through until they get
an agreement. So, they both put that public statement out
today, so that fear is not an issue.
Mrs. Steel. That is not an issue?
Secretary Walsh. No. Today the company, the union and the
company put a joint statement out today saying they are going
to continue to negotiate through the end of the contract, and
continue the negotiation, even though they know the contract is
going to expire July 1, so there is no fear of a work stoppage,
or strike, or walk out at this point.
Mrs. Steel. OK. Then let us move on to AB-5. California's
AB-5 proved to be a disaster, and it is a failed policy. It is
now riddled with exemptions. Yet D.C. Dem's tried their best to
make that a national law. Following these policies is
guaranteed to cause more harm to workers at the national level.
Many occupations use an independent contractor model and want
the flexibility it provides.
I again ask you why are you continuing to push for a failed
policy in California that limits the flexibility and
opportunity offered by independent contracting?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I do not think--I am not pushing a
failed policy. What I am pushing here is making sure that we
truly have people that are independent contractors are truly
independent contractors, and they are not being misclassified
as independent contractors, when in fact they do not want to
be.
Certainly, in situations, and we are going to have these
conversations as we move forward here in the coming months, and
I look forward to working with your office on this, and you
know, making sure that we are not making errors of the past.
Mrs. Steel. OK. Well, you know what this AB-5 is really
hurting the supply chain crisis, and the ports, and especially
in California. This is not really helping for a job crisis
here. My constituents want transparency. Your recent regulatory
moves have lessened transparency in the use of union funds.
Do you feel that unions should ensure they are fully
transparent with the dues taken from wages earned by the
workers? Why did DOL withdraw the form T-1 rule on trust fund
reporting for unions?
Secretary Walsh. The unions already have an obligation to
report to us. It was a duplicate effort. All the information
that was in the T-1, you get that same information to the DOL.
It was just a duplicate report that was not needed.
Mrs. Steel. Thank you.
Chairman Scott. The gentlelady's time has expired, yielded
back. If there are no other members seeking recognition, I
recognize myself for 5 minutes. Mr. Secretary, a lot has been
said about inflation, and I think you said it was a global
problem. Is it true that gas prices in America are high, but it
is about $8.00 a gallon in Europe?
Secretary Walsh. To my knowledge at this point yes, it is
higher in Europe. Europe obviously is far more dependent on
Russian oil than we are in the United States, but we are seeing
this issue of gas unfortunately all across the globe.
Chairman Scott. Our strategy needs to first put money in
people's pockets, so that they can deal with the global
problem. A family of four, got about $5,600.00 in stimulus
checks, is that right? Plus, thousands more $14.00 each, $5,600
and stimulus checks, thousands more in child tax credit, more
in earned income tax credits, and reduced Affordable Care Act
premiums.
That put a lot of money in people's pockets to help them
deal with this problem, is that right?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. I do not know if I would characterize
it as a lot of money in people's pockets, but it certainly gave
people comfort during a very difficult time in the American
history.
Chairman Scott. When you are dealing with supply by dealing
with the infrastructure investments in ports, childcare, job
training, to put more people to work, and the Federal Reserve
publishes the credit card delinquencies. It should be an
indication of financial stress. Did the Federal Reserve over
the last year publish the lowest credit card delinquencies, and
mortgage delinquencies, historically?
Secretary Walsh. Yes. People have less debt today.
Chairman Scott. You know on the apprentice, registered--
apprenticeship programs, one of the advantages there is they
are national recognized, and high quality, and if you do not
have registered apprenticeships, you lose that. Is that true?
Secretary Walsh. True.
Chairman Scott. The ESG investments, is there anything that
you are recommending that would require ESG, or just make it
permissible?
Secretary Walsh. There is nothing. I do not think--let me
get back to you on that one.
Chairman Scott. It is--you are not----
Secretary Walsh. I am sorry, it is permissible.
Chairman Scott. Yes. I mean you are not requiring.
Secretary Walsh. No, no, we are not requiring, no.
Chairman Scott. Yes. In OSHA you are asking for more money.
Is it true that right now you can only inspect each business
about once every 100 years?
Secretary Walsh. I think it is roughly once every 100
years.
Chairman Scott. There is a thing called training repayment
agreements, are you familiar with those?
Secretary Walsh. A little bit.
Chairman Scott. What is wrong with those? You will get back
to me.
Secretary Walsh. I will get back to you on that one.
Chairman Scott. OK. I will yield back the balance of my
time. We are getting very close to the end of votes, so at this
time, pursuant to committee practice, materials for submission
to the hearing record must be submitted to the committee clerk
within 14 days following the last day of the hearing, that is
June 28, preferably in Microsoft Word format.
Only a committee member, or the invited witness, can submit
materials, so Mr. Secretary, I want to thank you for your
participation today. There may be additional questions, which I
would request that you answer forthwith, so that we can receive
those. We will hold the record open to receive those responses.
I remind colleagues that pursuant to practice, witness
questions must be submitted to the majority committee staff
within 7 days. Questions must be relevant to the hearing. I now
recognize the Ranking Member for a closing statement.
Ms. Foxx. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Secretary,
it is good to have had you fulfill your obligation today, to
help the committee in its obligation for oversight of the
Department of Labor. You have painted a very rosy picture of
this administration, and its destructive policies, but we know
that 83 percent of the country is dissatisfied with the
direction the country is headed.
I am not sure how you informed your opinion as stated
today. Workers, businesses, retirees, and families are facing
historic economic challenges. They are experiencing the worst
12 month increase in inflation in 40 years kicked off by the
Democrat policies that rewarded people for staying home.
Businesses are clamoring for more skilled workers. The
Biden administration is shuttering innovative solutions like
the industry recognized apprenticeship program, and you just
mentioned the registered apprenticeship program that you all
are pushing as having the gold standard.
The gold standard for the registered apprenticeship program
is a 43 percent completion rate. I do not know anybody who
thinks 43 percent is a passing grade. Small businesses, and
independent contractors are seeking fewer regulatory burdens
and more guidance from DOL to understand complex regulations,
but your regulatory agenda and your budget requests will give
them the opposite.
Listening to your answers to our questions your so-called
solutions for workers and businesses were more government
programs, more grant money for bureaucrats to determine who
gets a handout. Expansive new laws like the Pro Act and Build
Back Better Act and tipping the scales in favor of union
bosses.
Republican led policies fostered an exceptionally strong
economy prior to COVID. Republicans will continue to put
forward solutions to reduce unnecessary regulations, to offer
more Americans opportunities for skill development, promote job
creation and hire real wages, and to improve the lives of
everyday Americans. I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Thank you Secretary Walsh for
joining us today, and for your leadership on behalf of workers.
Your testimony has made clear the administration is the most
pro-worker administration in history. Since your administration
came in, created the most jobs in 1 year in the history of the
United States.
Unemployment has declined, Americans have been getting
better jobs with better pay. Moreover, our economic progress
fairs better than many of our partners. According to the
International Monetary Fund the U.S. economy will be larger at
the end of the year relative to its pre-pandemic size, than any
other Group 7 economy.
Our global advantage proves that President Biden and
congressional democrat strategy is working. We invest in
workers. Our economy can grow from the bottom up and the middle
out. As you know, work to secure economic stability continues
as we have heard today, lowering the costs of groceries, gas,
and everyday goods is a top priority for both the
administration and for House democrats, we're just not
complaining about inflation. We are trying to do something
about the global problem that afflicts everybody here.
As we move forward, I invite my colleagues on the other
side to join us in advancing legislation that will actually
help workers and their families succeed. Secretary Walsh, I
look forward to our continued partnership, and look forward to
working together as we continue working for workers and
businesses across America.
If there is no further business, without objection the
committee stands adjourned.
[Whereupon the hearing adjourned at 2:19 p.m.]
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