Videotape Deposition of Mike Gula — Blue Flame Medical LLC v. Chain Bridge Bank, N.A. (E.D. Va., Dkt. 130-1)
Summary
Exhibit 1, Case 1:20-cv-00658, Document 130-1, filed 05/06/21 (E.D. Va.): excerpts from the remote videotape deposition via Zoom of Mike Gula, taken Tuesday, January 12, 2021, marked CONFIDENTIAL, in Blue Flame Medical LLC v. Chain Bridge Bank, N.A., John J. Brough and David M. Evinger. Gary Orseck examines for the Defendant/Third-Party Plaintiff, and Alan Schoenfeld appears for the Third-Party Defendant JPMorgan Chase Bank, N.A. Gula testifies that he graduated from the University of Richmond in 2002 with a political science major, then worked at Keelen Communications and started Mike Gula & Associates, Gula Graham and Prime Advocacy. Gula describes Prime Advocacy as a logistical and meeting, fly-in business that was recently sold, and says he did not tell Mr. Brough and Mr. Evinger he would be unreachable after the transaction.
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“Videotape Deposition of Mike Gula — Blue Flame Medical LLC v. Chain Bridge Bank, N.A. (E.D. Va., Dkt. 130-1).”
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Case 1:20-cv-00658-LMB-IDD Document 130-1 Filed 05/06/21 Page 1 of 13 PageID#
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EXHIBIT 1
Mike Gula CONFIDENTIAL 1/12/2021
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1 IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
2 FOR THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF VIRGINIA
3 (Alexandria Division)
4 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X
5 BLUE FLAME MEDICAL LLC, :
6 Plaintiff, :
7 v. : Civil Action No.
8 CHAIN BRIDGE BANK, N.A., : 1:20-cv-00658
9 JOHN J. BROUGH and DAVID M. :
10 EVINGER, : CONFIDENTIAL
11 Defendants. :
12 _____________________________ :
13 CHAIN BRIDGE BANK, N.A., :
14 Third-Party Plaintiff, :
15 v. :
16 JPMORGAN CHASE BANK, N.A., :
17 Third-Party Defendant. :
18 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - X
19 Remote Deposition
20 Tuesday, January 12, 2021
21 Videotape Deposition via Zoom of MIKE
22 GULA, a witness herein, called for examination by
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1 counsel for Defendant/Third-Party Plaintiff in the 1 APPEARANCES (Continued):
2 above-entitled matter, pursuant to notice, the 2
3 witness being duly sworn by MARY GRACE CASTLEBERRY, a 3 On behalf of the Defendant/Third-Party Plaintiff
4 Notary Public in and for the District of Columbia, 4 Chain Bridge Bank, N.A.:
5 taken at 10:05 a.m. EST, Tuesday, January 12, 2021, 5 GARY A. ORSECK, ESQ.
6 and the proceedings being taken down by Stenotype by 6 CAROLYN FORSTEIN, ESQ.
7 MARY GRACE CASTLEBERRY, RPR, and transcribed under 7 MATTHEW M. MADDEN, ESQ.
8 her direction. 8 Robbins Russell Englert, Orseck,
9 9 Untereiner & Sauber
10 10 2000 K Street, N.W., 4th Floor
11 11 Washington, D.C. 20006
12 12 (202) 775-4500
13 13
14 14 On behalf of the Third-Party Defendant JPMorgan
15 15 Chase Bank:
16 16 ALAN SCHOENFELD, ESQ.
17 17 ALBINAS PRIZGINTAS, ESQ.
18 18 Wilmer Cutler Pickering Hale & Dorr LLP
19 19 1875 Pennsylvania Avenue, N.W.
20 20 Washington, D.C. 20006
21 21 (212) 663-6981
22 22
Page 3 Page 5
1 1 APPEARANCES (Continued):
APPEARANCES:
2 2
3
On behalf of the Plaintiff Blue Flame Medical 3 On behalf of the Third-Party Defendant JPMorgan
4 4 Chase Bank:
LLC:
5 5 GABRIEL TORRES, ESQ.
PETER H. WHITE, ESQ.
6
GREGORY KETCHAM-COLWILL, ESQ. 6 JPMorgan Chase
7 7 Assistant General Counsel
BILL GUSSMAN, ESQ.
8 8 383 Madison Avenue
JASON MITCHELL, ESQ.
9 9 New York, New York 10179
KENI UKABIALA, ESQ.
10 10 (212) 270-6000
Schulte Roth & Zabel
11 11
901 15th Street, N.W., Suite 800
12 12 ALSO PRESENT:
Washington, D.C. 20005
13 13 JASON AQUI, Videographer
(202) 729-7476
14 14
and
15 15
ETHAN BEARMAN, ESQ.
16 16
The Bearman Firm
17
10250 Constellation Boulevard, Suite 100 17
18 18
Los Angeles, California 90067
19 19
(747) 344-1004
20 20
21 21
22 22
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1 firm and Ethan Bearman, legal counsel and chief legal 1 -- I don't believe it was a full year.
2 counsel for Blue Flame. 2 Q. How long have you lived in the Washington,
3 MR. ORSECK: I should have said as well -- 3 D.C. metropolitan area?
4 this is Gary Orseck -- that my colleagues, Matthew, 4 A. I moved up here the summer of 2002.
5 Matt and Carolyn Forstein are with me as well. 5 Q. Can you tell us what you did to prepare
6 MR. SCHOENFELD: And this is Alan 6 for your deposition today?
7 Schoenfeld for WilmerHale for third-party defendant, 7 A. I met with our legal counsel and reviewed
8 JPMorgan Chase Bank, NA, and I'm joined by my 8 documents.
9 colleague, Albinas Prizgintas. 9 Q. When did you do that?
10 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Will the court reporter 10 A. Over the last couple of weeks.
11 please administer the oath. 11 Q. You're aware that your partner, John
12 Whereupon, 12 Thomas, had his deposition taken yesterday?
13 MIKE GULA, 13 A. Yes.
14 was called as a witness by counsel for 14 Q. Have you read any sort of rough transcript
15 Defendant/Third-Party Plaintiff, and having been duly 15 of his deposition since that happened yesterday?
16 sworn by the Notary Public, was examined and 16 A. I have not.
17 testified as follows: 17 Q. Have you been -- this is a yes or no
18 EXAMINATION BY COUNSEL FOR 18 question -- have you been briefed on Mr. Thomas'
19 DEFENDANT/THIRD-PARTY PLAINTIFF 19 testimony?
20 BY MR. ORSECK: 20 A. Yes.
21 Q. Good morning, Mr. Gula. 21 Q. Was that by legal counsel?
22 A. Good morning. 22 A. Yes.
Page 11 Page 13
1 1 Q. Have you spoken -- again, a yes or no
Q. Where are you coming -- where are you
2 2 question -- have you spoken with Mr. Thomas since his
sitting today?
3 3 deposition?
A. At the law offices of Schulte Roth &
4 4 A. Yes.
Zabel.
5 5 Q. Was that in the presence of counsel,
Q. In Washington, D.C.?
6 6 outside the presence of counsel or some of each?
A. Yes.
7 7 A. With some of each.
Q. What is your current residence?
8 8 Q. Did you meet with Mr. Thomas outside the
A. Current residence is 700 Rose Square,
9 9 presence of counsel?
Alexandria, Virginia 22314.
10 10 A. Yes.
Q. How long have you resided there?
11 11 Q. Where did you do that?
A. Since August of this year.
12 12 A. At my residence.
Q. Where did you reside before that?
13 13 Q. That was last night?
A. I was at The Gables in Alexandria, 525
14 14 A. Yes.
Montgomery Street, Alexandria, Virginia 22314.
15 15 Q. How long did you meet for?
Q. How long were you there?
16 16 A. I don't recall.
A. One year.
17 17 Q. Did he stay for a while? Did he stay for
Q. And before that?
18 18 dinner?
A. I was at The Arris, A-r-r-i-s, in
19 19 A. No.
Washington, D.C.
20 20 Q. What do you recall discussing last night
Q. For how long?
21 21 with Mr. Thomas?
A. I believe around eight or nine months.
22 22 A. We discussed the deposition a little bit.
I'm not 100 percent sure of the exact date. It was
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1 Q. Did he tell you what any of his testimony 1 as best you can, to run through your professional
2 was? 2 career from the time you graduated in 2002 up until
3 A. Not in any great detail. 3 the end of 2019. Can you do that?
4 Q. What do you recall? 4 A. Yes. What specifically?
5 A. That he felt it went fine. 5 Q. I don't know what your professional career
6 Q. He didn't go into any substance -- I'm 6 is. So I'm asking you to tell us what you did
7 sorry. 7 chronologically from the time of graduation up
8 A. That he felt great. 8 through the end of 2019.
9 Q. Did he tell you what any of the questions 9 A. I had a job right after school working for
10 were? 10 Keelen Communications. After Keelen Communications,
11 A. I don't recall. 11 I started Mike Gula & Associates and I started Gula
12 Q. Mr. Gula, I want to just start by getting 12 Graham and then I started Prime Advocacy.
13 some basic background from you and I'm looking at 13 Q. Anything else?
14 this point for relatively high level of generality 14 A. No, not that I'm aware of.
15 and if there's something specific I want to follow up 15 Q. What is Keelen Communications?
16 on, I'll let you know. Is that all right? 16 A. Fundraising and consulting firm.
17 A. Sounds great. 17 Q. Where is that -- or where was that based?
18 Q. Did you graduate from college? 18 A. It was a Washington, D.C. consulting
19 A. Yes. 19 and -- and fundraising firm.
20 Q. When and where? 20 Q. According to the complaint that Blue Flame
21 A. The University of Richmond. Graduated in 21 Medical filed in this case, you founded Mike Gula &
22 2002. 22 Associates in 2005. Is that accurate?
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1 Q. Did you have a major? 1 A. It's accurate.
2 A. Political science. 2 Q. So is it correct that you were at Keelen
3 Q. Did you say political science? 3 Communications from sometime after you graduated in
4 A. Yes, sir. 4 2002 up through around 2005?
5 Q. Did you attend any grad school? 5 A. That would be accurate.
6 A. No. 6 Q. How long did Mike Gula & Associates stay
7 Q. While at the University of Richmond, did 7 in business?
8 you take any courses that related to the healthcare 8 A. It's still in business. It never ceased
9 field? 9 to exist.
10 A. I may have. 10 Q. What is the business of Gula & Associates?
11 Q. Can you recall anything specific? 11 A. It started as a fundraising and consulting
12 A. No, but I may have. It was four years and 12 firm.
13 it was a long time ago. 13 Q. Is that political fundraising and
14 Q. Did you take business courses? 14 consulting?
15 A. I may have within the political science 15 A. Yes.
16 department. 16 Q. And what sort of clients have you worked
17 Q. Do you remember anything specific? 17 with over that time period at Gula & Associates? I'm
18 A. I do not remember anything specific as it 18 looking for general statements if you're able to give
19 related to a detail of political science major. 19 them.
20 There could have been a couple hours that I took of a 20 A. Members of Congress on the Republican
21 business format in a political science degree. 21 side.
22 Q. Okay. I'm going to ask you, if you can, 22 Q. The complaint also says that you founded
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1 Gula Graham Group in 2006. Is that accurate? 1 with the lingo in that area, can you -- can you
2 A. That would be accurate. 2 provide a little more color as to what that means?
3 Q. Is Gula Graham still in business? 3 A. Yes. For example, if the National
4 A. Yes. 4 Association of Convenience Stores were bringing in
5 Q. I understand that Mr. Graham died sometime 5 convenience storeowners to Washington, D.C. to lobby
6 in the last number of years; is that right? 6 Congress, Prime Advocacy would be responsible for
7 A. August 24th, 2018. 7 scheduling all of their appointments on Capitol Hill
8 Q. And Gula Graham has stayed in business 8 with various members of Congress.
9 after that time? 9 It would also not be limited to meetings,
10 A. Yes. 10 but also scheduling flights, hotels, buses, rallies,
11 Q. What is the business of Gula Graham? 11 logistics for attendees and participants.
12 A. Political fundraising and consulting. 12 Q. I saw a statement in one of the Blue Flame
13 Q. Is the nature of that business different 13 Medical presentations that referred to Prime Advocacy
14 from Gula & Associates? 14 as, quote, "D.C.'s leading fly-in and logistics
15 A. No. 15 firm."
16 Q. Is there a reason you had two different 16 Does that characterize what you just
17 entities that did the same type of business? 17 explained?
18 A. No. 18 A. It does.
19 Q. During the entire period of time from 2002 19 Q. All right. Let me expand the question
20 when you joined Keelen Communications up through the 20 that I asked a few minutes ago. Other than now the
21 end of 2019, did you have any other business 21 four entities you've mentioned, Keelen, Gula &
22 activities unrelated to those three entities? 22 Associates, Gula Graham and Prime Advocacy, did you
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1 A. Between Keelen Communications, Mike Gula & 1 have any other business activities outside of those
2 Associates and Gula Graham? 2 four between 2002 and the end of 2019?
3 Q. Yes. 3 A. By business -- what do you mean by
4 A. Yes. 4 business activities?
5 Q. What else did you do besides those three 5 Q. Did you do any other professional work
6 businesses? 6 outside of your work with those entities during that
7 A. A company called Prime Advocacy. 7 roughly 17, 18-year period?
8 Q. Right. You mentioned that. The complaint 8 A. Paid or unpaid?
9 says Prime Advocacy was founded in 2010, right? 9 Q. Either one.
10 A. Yes. 10 A. I'm sure I did. I'm sure I did.
11 Q. Did you found -- you founded that company? 11 Q. Were all of the activities in the same
12 A. With my late partner, John. 12 general area, which is to say dealing with members of
13 Q. That's John Graham? 13 Congress or people who wish to appear before them?
14 A. Yes. 14 A. There were many opportunities that I would
15 Q. Is that entity still in business? 15 listen to that never came to fruition or was working
16 A. The business was recently sold. 16 to become in fruition, but nothing -- but yes, around
17 Q. When did you sell it? 17 politics, logistics, yes.
18 A. Sometime this summer. 18 Q. Okay. How do you know John Thomas? Let
19 Q. What was the business of Prime Advocacy? 19 me -- let me withdraw that and ask it better.
20 A. It was a logistical and meeting, fly-in 20 When did you first meet John Thomas?
21 business. 21 A. Probably -- I can't say for certain.
22 Q. For people like me who are not familiar 22 Three or so years ago at least, ballpark.
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1 Q. In what -- I'm sorry. Were you finished? 1 running in California.
2 A. Yes. 2 Q. Running for the United States Congress?
3 Q. In what context did you meet Mr. Thomas? 3 A. Yes.
4 A. I met him through a mutual friend. 4 Q. Did you develop a personal friendship with
5 Q. Can you give me any more detail on that? 5 Mr. Thomas over the last three years?
6 A. I met him through Matt Robbins, a mutual 6 A. Of course.
7 friend. 7 Q. In March of last year, you and Mr. Thomas
8 Q. Did you have any business dealings with 8 formed Blue Flame Medical LLC, correct?
9 Mr. Thomas? 9 A. That's correct.
10 A. By business -- again, business dealings is 10 Q. Can you give me the background as you
11 a very broad question. What do you mean by business 11 remember it as to how that came about?
12 dealings? 12 A. John and I wanted to help people. There
13 Q. Did you have any dealings with Mr. Thomas? 13 was a massive need. We had an opportunity to help
14 A. Yes. 14 millions of people and we wanted to help and that's
15 Q. What were those? 15 how that business came about.
16 A. We shared certain political clients. 16 Q. Whose brainchild was this in the first
17 Q. What do you mean by that? 17 instance? Was it yours or Mr. Thomas' or somebody
18 A. There were certain candidates that we were 18 else's?
19 working on together where the candidate hired 19 A. I can't recall who came to one another
20 multiple vendors and he was one of the vendors. 20 first. It's like we came together at the same time.
21 Q. Which candidates fell into that category? 21 Q. When did you first have discussions about
22 A. I can't say for certain. It's been a 22 forming this enterprise?
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1 number of years. 1 A. Sometime in the winter of 2019-2020.
2 Q. Well, it's only been the last three years, 2 Q. Was it after the Coronavirus pandemic
3 right? 3 began to spread around the world?
4 A. Correct. 4 A. It was around the time that there was
5 Q. Can you name any of the candidates on 5 frays of a pandemic.
6 whose behalf both you and Mr. Thomas worked? 6 Q. As of the time that you and Mr. Thomas
7 A. I had a lot of clients. 7 began to have these discussions, did you have any
8 Q. You can't think of any? 8 experience in the field of medical supplies?
9 A. The person running against Katie Hill or 9 A. No.
10 Katie Porter, excuse me, Katie Porter. Whoever lost 10 Q. Do you have any specialized training or
11 to Katie Porter. I remember that. 11 certifications relating to supply chain management?
12 Q. What campaign was that -- or what position 12 A. No.
13 was that for? 13 Q. Any experience in that field prior to last
14 A. I honestly don't remember the candidate's 14 winter?
15 name. I had a lot of clients. 15 A. No.
16 Q. I didn't mean that. Was that someone 16 Q. How about any specialized training or
17 running for the U.S. Congress? 17 certifications in the healthcare industry?
18 A. Yes. 18 A. No.
19 Q. And you can't think of any others as you 19 Q. You know what I mean when I refer to an
20 sit here? 20 N95 mask?
21 A. This past cycle, the one I can remember 21 A. I do.
22 was a gentleman by the name of Sedgwick who was 22 Q. And that was one of the items of PPE or
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1 personal protective equipment that Blue Flame Medical 1 Q. Do you have any experience with the
2 wanted to supply to customers, correct? 2 process of customs for items entering the
3 A. Correct. 3 United States from other countries?
4 Q. When was the first time that you heard the 4 A. No.
5 expression or the term "N95" in connection to 5 Q. Mr. Gula, we're going to try this on the
6 personal protective equipment? 6 first -- let me withdraw that.
7 A. 2019 or '18 -- 7 I'm going to be showing you some exhibits
8 Q. Was that in -- I'm sorry, I was speaking 8 throughout the day and we'll have to work it out on
9 over you. You know, Mr. Gula, let me pause for a 9 the first one and after that, I think it will be
10 moment. This is always an issue in a deposition, but 10 easy, but we'll show you how to do it.
11 it's more of an issue in this sort of virtual 11 And Carolyn, my colleague, is going to
12 deposition. 12 drop into the chat function on your screen a document
13 If we happen to speak at the same time, it 13 that we're going to mark as Defendant's Exhibit 34.
14 dubs us both out and nobody gets heard. So I'm 14 That's picking up from where we left off yesterday.
15 trying, but failing, sometimes to not speak over you 15 MR. ORSECK: And that will be tab -- I'm
16 and I'll ask you to try as well to wait for me to 16 sorry, tab 235, Carolyn.
17 finish a question and we'll do our best, okay? 17 MR. WHITE: Do you have the chat function,
18 A. Okay. 18 Mr. Gula?
19 Q. Okay. So I had asked you when you first 19 THE WITNESS: Let's see. Chat. I have
20 heard the term "N95," and I think you said 2019, but 20 the function open.
21 then you said something more and I didn't catch it. 21 MR. WHITE: Yes. And once --
22 A. It was in 2019 or around 2019, yes. 22 THE WITNESS: I see the Exhibit 34.
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1 Q. Okay. And was that in connection with 1 MR. WHITE: It will take a while. Just
2 this pandemic? 2 press save, I believe.
3 A. Possibly. 3 THE WITNESS: Got it.
4 Q. Well, when in 2019 do you think you heard 4 MR. WHITE: Then it will populate in the
5 that term first? 5 chat function so that you can open it, once it
6 A. I cannot recall. 6 downloads.
7 Q. Was it prior to the time that news began 7 THE WITNESS: Click open?
8 to spread that a virus that originated in Wuhan, 8 MR. WHITE: Yes.
9 China was potentially spreading? 9 THE WITNESS: Okay. Got it.
10 A. It could have been. 10 (Defendant's Exhibit No. 34 was
11 Q. I'm sure it could have been anything, but 11 marked for identification.)
12 I'm asking for your recollection. 12 MR. WHITE: Greg, while Mr. Gula is
13 A. It could have been. I could have heard 13 getting that file open so that you can ask him about
14 the term "N95" sometime in 2019 not related to the 14 it, I just want to state on the record that today's
15 pandemic. 15 deposition and yesterday's deposition are considered
16 Q. And why would you have heard about an N95 16 confidential under the terms of our discovery order
17 mask prior to that time? 17 that's been entered in court.
18 A. Because I watch the news. I read. 18 Do I have all counsel's agreement to that?
19 Q. Okay. In your business experience since 19 MR. ORSECK: Yes. Understood.
20 2002, have you ever dealt with importation of any 20 BY MR. ORSECK:
21 goods into the United States? 21 Q. Mr. Gula, were you able to open Exhibit
22 A. No. 22 34?
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1 A. Yes. 1 your life?
2 Q. Can you identify that document? 2A. To a degree. I've sketched one out.
3 A. I can identify it just to make sure I'm 3Q. Did you prepare one for either Gula &
4 reading the correct one that you're looking at. 4 Associates or Gula Graham or Prime Advocacy?
5 It's -- the first -- the top says Delaware and 5 A. Not -- not really. I sketched one out on
6 underneath the first state. Is that the correct 6 what we wanted to accomplish.
7 document? 7 Q. Did you prepare any sort of written
8 Q. That's the one. 8 business plan for Blue Flame Medical?
9 A. Yes. 9 A. We absolutely may have done that, yes. I
10 Q. Do you see on the first page it says that 10 cannot recall it specifically, but we had a business
11 this is a certificate of formation of Blue Flame 11 plan, yes, to succeed, yes. We had one.
12 Medical filed on the 23rd of March, 2020? 12 Q. Have you seen a written business plan for
13 A. I see that. 13 Blue Flame Medical?
14 Q. And the second page says State of Delaware 14 A. I can't recall.
15 Limited Liability Company Certification of Formation, 15 Q. Have you provided a written business plan
16 right? 16 for Blue Flame Medical to your counsel in connection
17 A. Yes, I see that. 17 with the discovery process in this case?
18 Q. And at the bottom of the page, that's 18 A. Every document I had that he needed and
19 executed on March 23rd, 2020? 19 was required, I presented.
20 A. I see that. 20 Q. Did you or Mr. Thomas or anybody else on
21 Q. This is the documentation with the state 21 behalf of Blue Flame prepare pro formas for the
22 of Delaware by which you and Mr. Thomas incorporated 22 business?
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1 Blue Flame Medical; am I right? 1
A. I don't know what that means. I'm sorry.
2 A. Yes. 2 Q. You don't know what the term "pro formas"
3 Q. In connection with the formation of Blue 3 means?
4 Flame Medical, did you or Mr. Thomas or anyone else 4 A. No.
5 associated with Blue Flame Medical prepare a written 5 Q. Did you prepare any sort of prospective
6 business plan? 6 financial statements by which you anticipated to
7 A. We may have. 7 anticipate what the expenses and revenues of the
8 Q. Do you recall preparing a written business 8 business would be?
9 plan? 9 A. I personally did not.
10 A. We very well may have. 10 Q. Have you seen such a document?
11 Q. That's the very question I'm asking. Do 11 A. Absolutely could have. Do not recall if
12 you recall -- do you have any recollection of doing 12 that was ever presented.
13 that? 13 Q. Was there a means by which the business --
14 A. What do you mean by business plan? 14 Blue Flame, I'm referring to -- was capitalized at
15 Q. Do you know the term "business plan"? 15 the outset of its life?
16 Have you heard of that term before? 16 A. John and I both capitalized the company to
17 A. I have. 17 start a business, yes.
18 Q. They take many forms, don't they? 18 Q. Did you put your own money into the
19 A. Yes. 19 business?
20 Q. Have you seen a business plan before? 20 A. Yes.
21 A. I'm sure I have. 21 Q. How much did you put in?
22 Q. Have you ever prepared a business plan in 22 A. Anywhere -- tens of thousands of dollars.
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1 long you are planning to keep these funds on your 1 tell them the wire amount.
2 account," right? 2 BY MR. ORSECK:
3 A. She did ask that. 3 Q. That's the first time you emailed that to
4 Q. And then she says, "With such dollar 4 Maria Cole, correct?
5 amount, we need to inform our financial department 5 A. That is correct.
6 about these funds and how long they will stay in your 6 Q. Do you have a specific recollection of a
7 account." 7 phone conversation earlier in the day in which you
8 She emailed you that at 4:21, right? 8 told her that -- told her that amount?
9 A. Yes. 9 A. I don't have any specific recollection,
10 Q. And then you ask, "When is the wire cutoff 10 but I know I told the bank that.
11 time and what are operational days," correct? 11 Q. Maria Cole apparently didn't know that at
12 A. That's correct. 12 4:11 when she asked you how much is the wire you're
13 Q. Is it fair to say you were eager to 13 expecting, right?
14 receive the wire? 14 MR. WHITE: Objection. Calls for
15 A. Yes, because we needed to order N95s to 15 speculation about what Maria Cole could have known.
16 save lives. 16 You can answer if you know what she knew.
17 Q. Earlier we looked at the 11:19 email -- 17 THE WITNESS: I had no idea what she knew
18 well, it's on this same document. No, I guess it's 18 other than me telling the bank.
19 not on this document. Give me a moment. 19 MR. ORSECK: Object to the instruction
20 Yeah, in Exhibit 44, we looked at an 11:00 20 from counsel.
21 a.m. email from you to Ms. Cole that said, "Also" -- 21 BY MR. ORSECK:
22 it's right here. Forgive me. On the very document 22 Q. Have you seen any evidence that you
Page 175 Page 177
1 we're looking at, on page 1461 at 11:19, that's when 1 emailed Maria Cole prior to 4:12 to tell her the
2 you emailed Maria Cole and said, "Also need email 2 amount of the wire?
3 ASAP when the wire hits from Cali," right? 3 A. I sent a lot of emails. I may have told
4 A. I said that, correct. 4 her on an email, but I don't see it on this thread.
5 Q. And in that email and in any of the 5 Q. All right. If you find such an email,
6 previous emails with Maria Cole, you didn't say what 6 will you let us know?
7 the size of the wire was, correct? 7 A. Absolutely.
8 A. I may have on the phone. 8 Q. And do you have any specific recollection
9 Q. Well, let's take it a piece at a time. 9 of having told Maria Cole, prior to 4:12 p.m. by any
10 Did you say it by email? 10 means, that the bank should be expecting a $450
11 A. I don't recall in this thread, no. 11 million wire?
12 Q. And the first time you said it by email 12 A. I had a number of phone calls with the
13 was at 4:12 p.m., right? 13 bank.
14 MR. WHITE: Is your question the first 14 Q. Right. One of them was the one we
15 time he said it on this email was at 4:12 p.m.? 15 listened to with Heather Schoeppe, correct?
16 MR. ORSECK: That's -- that's what I said. 16 A. That's correct.
17 MR. WHITE: Okay. 17 Q. Can we do tab 253, please. That will be
18 MR. ORSECK: That was exactly verbatim my 18 Exhibit 54. It's Bates CBB 1433 through 1436. And
19 question. 19 I'm just going to point you to the first page, but
20 MR. WHITE: Just wanted to clarify. Thank 20 look at whatever you'd like to.
21 you. 21 (Defendant's Exhibit No. 54 was
22 THE WITNESS: On this email at 4:12, I did 22 marked for identification.)
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1 MR. WHITE: Give me a minute here while 1 Q. What time did the call occur?
2 I'm downloading this one as well. 2 A. After 4:12.
3 THE WITNESS: I've read the first page. 3 Q. How do you know?
4 BY MR. ORSECK: 4 A. Because that's what my Verizon records
5 Q. In response to Maria Cole's 4:21 p.m. 5 indicate and I know that's what prompted the call.
6 email that said, "Thanks for letting us know," you 6 Q. What prompted the call?
7 respond at 4:38 p.m. and you say, "When is the wire 7 A. My email to Ms. Cole.
8 cutoff time and what are operational days," right? 8 Q. I'm lost. What email prompted the call?
9 A. I did say that. 9 A. When I told Maria Cole the size of the
10 Q. And she responded at 4:49, "5:00 p.m. 10 wire, that's when the bank president called me.
11 Monday through Friday, not on holidays," correct? 11 Q. I see. And that -- you're referring to
12 A. That's what she said. 12 the 4:12 email from you at page 1434 in Exhibit 54,
13 Q. And you follow up at 5:18 p.m. on the 25th 13 right?
14 and you ask, "For domestic? I thought it was later 14 A. Yes.
15 than 5:00," with three question marks. "I know Cali 15 Q. Does your Verizon record tell us how long
16 wanted to do it today," right? That's what you 16 the call lasted?
17 wrote. 17 A. Nineteen minutes.
18 A. That's what I wrote. 18 Q. Did you make a recording of the call?
19 Q. How did you know Cali wanted to do it 19 A. I really wish I did.
20 today? 20 Q. Did you tell Mr. Evinger and Mr. Brough
21 A. I believe that's what John told me. 21 that Great Health Companion would be the supplier and
22 Q. And that references the wire transaction, 22 that he was a friend of Blue Flame Medical?
Page 179 Page 181
1 right? 1 A. I told Mr. Evinger and Brough that we
2 A. Yes. 2 had -- we were going to be supplying California with
3 Q. Do you recall, Mr. Gula, at 4:00 or 5:00 3 100 million masks with multiple suppliers. I'm sure
4 p.m. in the afternoon on that day receiving a call 4 I said Great Health Companion was one of them.
5 from David Evinger and John Brough? 5 Q. Did you say that Mr. Huang's factory or
6 A. Absolutely. 6 factories would be retooled to make the masks?
7 MR. WHITE: Counsel, what was that time? 7 A. I'm unsure of that specific point.
8 I missed part of what you said. 8 Q. Was that your understanding on March 25th?
9 MR. ORSECK: Yeah, the -- the 9 A. My understanding was that Henry was going
10 transcription is not what I said. I meant to say at 10 to be able to supply 100 million masks for this order
11 4:00 or 5:00 p.m. 11 if needed.
12 MR. WHITE: I misheard you as well. Thank 12 Q. Forgive me, but I feel like you're evading
13 you. I appreciate the clarification. 13 my question. And I know I'm going to get an
14 BY MR. ORSECK: 14 objection from that. But I'm asking you something
15 Q. You remember receiving that call, right? 15 specific and I'm hoping, so that we can get through
16 A. Absolutely. 16 this, you can say yes, I remember that or no, I don't
17 Q. And you conferenced in Mr. Case, didn't 17 remember that or something else.
18 you? 18 So my question is, was it your
19 A. I did. 19 understanding on the 25th that Mr. Huang would be
20 Q. Do you have any better record or 20 retooling his factory or factories in order to make
21 recollection of exactly what time that call occurred? 21 the masks that you intended to supply to California?
22 A. Yes. 22 A. That's a very odd word choice that I may
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1 or may not have used. Unfortunately, the bank chose 1 fundraising?
2 to not record the phone call supposedly, so I don't 2 A. I probably would have said that, yeah.
3 know if I expressedly said retool. 3 Q. Did you confirm on that call that Blue
4 Q. My question is, was it your understanding 4 Flame Medical had no mask inventory of its own at the
5 at the time that that's what Mr. Huang was going to 5 time?
6 do? 6 A. No, I have no recollection of telling them
7 A. My understanding was Henry was going to be 7 that we had no mask inventory.
8 able to provide 100 million masks. 8 Q. That was the case, though, right?
9 Q. All right. I'm going to ask it a third 9 A. That's not true. We had absolutely a
10 time because you're not answering my question. 10 supply of mask inventory.
11 A. All right. 11 Q. Did you own any masks as of March 25th?
12 Q. I understand -- I understand you 12 A. We had an incredible supply from all over
13 understood -- let me just finish. I understand that 13 the world of masks.
14 you understood that Henry was going to be able to 14 Q. Did you own any masks on March 25th? Are
15 provide 100 million masks. You've said that a few 15 you able to answer that question?
16 times. 16 A. What do you mean by owned?
17 A. Yeah. 17 Q. Are you serious?
18 Q. I'm asking if it was your understanding at 18 MR. WHITE: Counsel, that's inappropriate.
19 the time that he would be retooling his factory or 19 You're allowed to ask questions. That's it.
20 factories in order to be able to do so. 20 BY MR. ORSECK:
21 A. If that is the characterization that 21 Q. If you don't know what the word "owned"
22 Mr. Brough and Evinger interpreted what I said, 22 means, then I'll move on. Did you own any masks on
Page 183 Page 185
1 that's their interpretation.My interpretation of 1 the 25th?
2 what I told them was Henry would be able to provide 2 MR. WHITE: Him personally?
3 100 million masks for the state of California. 3 BY MR. ORSECK:
4 Q. I'm going to try yet again because I don't 4 Q. Blue Flame Medical.
5 believe I'm getting an answer. I want you to put 5 A. Blue Flame Medical had a supply pipeline
6 aside the conversation with Mr. Brough and 6 that we could produce as many masks as necessary.
7 Mr. Evinger for this -- purposes of this question. 7 Q. Did you tell Mr. Brough and Mr. Evinger
8 I'm not asking you about that call. I'm asking you 8 that you got the California deal through political
9 about you. 9 contacts?
10 A. Okay. I'm sorry. 10 A. I don't know if I characterized it that
11 Q. My question is -- my question is, did you, 11 way. Unfortunately, they chose not to record
12 on March 25th, have an understanding one way or the 12 supposedly the phone call.
13 other whether Mr. Huang was going to need to retool 13 Q. I don't understand what you mean, "They
14 his factory or factories in order to produce those 14 chose not to record supposedly." Is it -- is it your
15 masks? 15 belief that there is a recording that's not been
16 A. My understanding was that Henry would be 16 provided?
17 working with dozens and dozens of factories to 17 A. Oh, yeah.
18 provide not just masks, but PPE. I was not under the 18 Q. You believe that there's a recording of
19 impression that there was one factory that we would 19 that call and that it has not been provided in the
20 be receiving N95 masks from. 20 litigation; is that what you're saying?
21 Q. Did you tell Mr. Brough and Mr. Evinger 21 A. Absolutely.
22 that you were sick and tired of political 22 Q. And what's your basis for that?
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1
A. Because this bank was about to receive a 1 A. Me personally or Blue Flame Medical?
2
$450 million wire transfer and it's convenient they 2 Q. Sorry. Blue Flame or anyone associated
3 3 with Blue Flame. Did anybody contact or seek advice
did not record a 19-minute phone call.
4 4 from a government contracting and procurement lawyer?
Q. Okay.
5 5 A. Ethan Bearman may have.
A. When so many other phone calls were
6 6 Q. You don't know?
recorded of much less significance.
7 7 A. I don't know for certain.
Q. Did Mr. Evinger ask you if you had
8 8 Q. Do you recall Mr. Brough and Mr. Evinger
established any international letters of credit in
9 9 asking you if the masks were ready as of that date?
connection with this transaction?
10 10 A. I don't remember. But I do remember
A. I don't recall.
11 11 telling them that we did have masks that we needed
Q. Do you recall telling him that you didn't
12 12 and could get to California within 72 hours, and we
need such an instrument?
13 13 had an extensive pipeline to provide California.
A. I don't recall. I wish the phone call was
14 14 Q. Do you remember telling them that the
recorded.
15 15 pipeline you're referring to would involve
Q. I'm just asking for your recollection. Do
16 16 manufacturing the masks as opposed to merely shipping
you recall saying that?
17 17 already completed masks?
A. I don't recall, which is why I'm saying I
18 18 A. I do not believe I would have made a
wish we had a transcript of that conversation.
19 19 characterization that there were masks sitting in a
Q. The record is very clear that you with --
20 20 warehouse just ready to be shipped. They had to be
wish that point. But now I'm asking for your
21 21 manufactured. Some we knew were manufactured and
recollection. You don't recall that?
22 22 could get to California immediately.
A. No.
Page 187 Page 189
1 Q. Do you know what an international letter 1 Q. Do you remember telling Mr. Brough and
2 of credit is? 2 Mr. Evinger that the California transaction amounted
3 A. No. 3 to your payday, quote, unquote.
4 Q. Would you know how to go about getting one 4 A. I don't believe I would have characterized
5 if you needed to? 5 it as my payday.
6 A. Yes. 6 Q. Do you think you used words to that
7 Q. Have you ever done that before? 7 effect?
8 A. No. 8 A. No, I do not believe that.
9 Q. In connection with the California 9 Q. Did you tell Mr. Brough and Mr. Evinger
10 transaction, did Blue Flame engage a lawyer with 10 that by this transaction, you'd make enough money
11 experience in international trade? 11 that you'd no longer have to worry about anything?
12 A. I had the utmost confidence in our chief 12 A. No, I don't believe I would have used
13 legal counsel of his expertise. 13 those words with him, no.
14 Q. Do you know whether Mr. -- you're talking 14 Q. Did you tell Mr. Brough and Mr. Evinger on
15 about Mr. Bearman? 15 that call that, after this transaction, you'd no
16 A. Correct. 16 longer be reachable?
17 Q. Do you know whether he had experience in 17 A. God, no. Not to them.
18 international trade prior to this time? 18 Q. Did you tell them you'd be going far away?
19 A. I believe he did. I'm not 100 percent 19 A. What do you mean by far away?
20 certain, but just had confidence that -- in him. 20 Q. I don't know. Did you tell them that?
21 Q. Did you consult a lawyer in the field of 21 A. I have a seven-year-old and a
22 government contracting and procurement? 22 five-year-old. I would not be going far away.
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