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Career and Technical Education: Developing the Future of Main Street Success (House Small Business Committee hearing, February 24, 2026)

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Transcript of the House Committee on Small Business hearing Career and Technical Education: Developing the Future of Main Street Success, convened February 24, 2026 during the 119th Congress, Second Session, published as Small Business Committee Document Number 119-031 (GPO 63-057). Opening statements were delivered by Hon. Roger Williams and Hon. Derek Tran. Witnesses were Dr. Keith E. Gunuskey of Wallenpaupack Area School District, Mike Gibson of Associated General Contractors of Kansas, Dr. Nikki Nix of Godley Independent School District, and Zach Boren of Apprenticeships for America. Appendix submissions include statements from Associated Builders and Contractors, Greenhut Construction Company, Inc., the National Roofing Contractors Association, carpenter apprenticeship councils, and a letter from Hon. Lateefah Simon.

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“Career and Technical Education: Developing the Future of Main Street Success (House Small Business Committee hearing, February 24, 2026).” Original at www.govinfo.gov. Archived at Pandemic Darlings, https://pandemicdarlings.com/source-documents/career-and-technical-education-developing-the-future-of-main-street-su-d96ce9789d/, SHA-256 d23b3c5d55e3829fcbc4c00ae728bfd0074fc5558f540e219d66796ee9522eaa.

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                                                                            CAREER AND TECHNICAL EDUCATION:
                                                                          DEVELOPING THE FUTURE OF MAIN STREET
                                                                                        SUCCESS


                                                                                                      HEARING
                                                                                                             BEFORE THE


                                                                            COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
                                                                                   UNITED STATES
                                                                             HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
                                                                                    ONE HUNDRED NINETEENTH CONGRESS
                                                                                                           SECOND SESSION


                                                                                                        HEARING HELD
                                                                                                       FEBRUARY 24, 2026




                                                                                    Small Business Committee Document Number 119–031
                                                                                      Available via the GPO Website: www.govinfo.gov




                                                                                               U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
                                                                        63–057                             WASHINGTON : 2026




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                                                                                        HOUSE COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
                                                                                             ROGER WILLIAMS, Texas, Chairman
                                                                                                  PETE STAUBER, Minnesota
                                                                                                  DAN MEUSER, Pennsylvania
                                                                                                   BETH VAN DUYNE, Texas
                                                                                                      JAKE ELLZEY, Texas
                                                                                                    MARK ALFORD, Missouri
                                                                                                    NICK LALOTA, New York
                                                                                                  BRAD FINSTAD, Minnesota
                                                                                                     TONY WIED, Wisconsin
                                                                                               ROB BRESNAHAN, Pennsylvania
                                                                                                      BRIAN JACK, Georgia
                                                                                                  TROY DOWNING, Montana
                                                                                        KIMBERLYN KING-HINDS, Northern Marina Islands
                                                                                                   DEREK SCHMIDT, Kansas
                                                                                                   JIMMY PATRONIS, Florida
                                                                                         NYDIA VELÁZQUEZ, New York, Ranking Member
                                                                                               MORGAN MCGARVEY, Kentucky
                                                                                                HILLARY SCHOLTEN, Michigan
                                                                                               LAMONICA MCIVER, New Jersey
                                                                                                   GIL CISNEROS, California
                                                                                                KELLY MORRISON, Minnesota
                                                                                                GEORGE LATIMER, New York
                                                                                                    DEREK TRAN, California
                                                                                                 LATEEFAH SIMON, California
                                                                                               JOHNNY OLSZEWSKI, Maryland
                                                                                            MAGGIE GOODLANDER, New Hampshire

                                                                                                LAUREN HOLMES, Majority Staff Director
                                                                                                 MELISSA JUNG, Minority Staff Director




                                                                                                                      (II)




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                                                                                                                  CONTENTS
                                                                                                               OPENING STATEMENTS
                                                                                                                                                                                                 Page
                                                                  Hon. Roger Williams ................................................................................................             1
                                                                  Hon. Derek Tran ......................................................................................................           2

                                                                                                                          WITNESSES
                                                                  Dr. Keith E. Gunuskey, Superintendent of Schools, Wallenpaupack Area
                                                                    School District, Honesdale, PA ...........................................................................                     6
                                                                  Mr. Mike Gibson, Executive Vice President, Associated General Contractors
                                                                    (AGC) of Kansas, Wichita, KS ............................................................................                      8
                                                                  Dr. Nikki Nix, Chief Academic Officer, Godley Independent School District,
                                                                    Godley, TX ............................................................................................................       10
                                                                  Mr. Zach Boren, Senior Vice President, Apprenticeships for America, Wash-
                                                                    ington, DC .............................................................................................................      11

                                                                                                                           APPENDIX
                                                                  Prepared Statements:
                                                                      Dr. Keith E. Gunuskey, Superintendent of Schools, Wallenpaupack Area
                                                                        School District, Honesdale, PA ....................................................................                       40
                                                                      Mr. Mike Gibson, Executive Vice President, Associated General Contrac-
                                                                        tors (AGC) of Kansas, Wichita, KS ..............................................................                          44
                                                                      Dr. Nikki Nix, Chief Academic Officer, Godley Independent School Dis-
                                                                        trict, Godley, TX ............................................................................................            48
                                                                      Mr. Zach Boren, Senior Vice President, Apprenticeships for America,
                                                                        Washington, DC ............................................................................................               57
                                                                  Questions for the Record:
                                                                      None.
                                                                  Answers for the Record:
                                                                      None.
                                                                  Additional Material for the Record:
                                                                      Associated Builders and Contractors (ABC) ...................................................                               67
                                                                      Greenhut Construction Company, Inc. ...........................................................                             69
                                                                      National Roofing Contractors Association (NRCA) ........................................                                    71
                                                                      Central Midwest Regional Council of Carpenters (CMRCC) and the Indi-
                                                                        ana-Kentucky-Ohio Joint Apprenticeship Training Fund (IKORCC
                                                                        JATF) .............................................................................................................       73
                                                                      Hon. Lateefah Simon letter .............................................................................                    76
                                                                      International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers (IBEW) Local Union 369
                                                                        letter ...............................................................................................................    78




                                                                                                                                 (III)




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                                                                         CAREER AND TECHNICAL EDUCATION:
                                                                       DEVELOPING THE FUTURE OF MAIN STREET
                                                                                     SUCCESS

                                                                                               TUESDAY, FEBRUARY 24, 2026

                                                                                            HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,
                                                                                        COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS,
                                                                                                                   Washington, DC.
                                                                    The Committee met, pursuant to call, at 10:01 a.m., in Room
                                                                  2360, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Roger Williams [chair-
                                                                  man of the Committee] presiding.
                                                                    Present: Representatives Williams, Stauber, Meuser, Van Duyne,
                                                                  Finstad, Wied, Bresnahan, Jack, Downing, Schmidt, McIver,
                                                                  Cisneros, Morrison, Tran, Olszewski, and Goodlander.
                                                                    Chairman WILLIAMS. I want to welcome everybody to the hear-
                                                                  ing today.
                                                                    The first thing I want to say is that I want to congratulate Con-
                                                                  gressman Stauber from the great State of Minnesota, a former
                                                                  Olympic hockey player. And the hockey USA team, we know, won
                                                                  the gold medal.
                                                                    I want to say congratulations to you and your sport.
                                                                    Mr. STAUBER. Yes.
                                                                    [Applause.]
                                                                    Chairman WILLIAMS. And before we get started, I would like to
                                                                  recognize Congressman Schmidt from the great State of Kansas to
                                                                  lead us in the Pledge of Allegiance and the prayer.
                                                                    Please stand.
                                                                    Mr. SCHMIDT. Will you join me in prayer?
                                                                    Heavenly Father, thank you for this opportunity to come together
                                                                  today, for bringing us all safely here. And please keep watching
                                                                  over those who are traveling in and traveling around our country
                                                                  in this time of difficult weather.
                                                                    Give us the courage, the wisdom, and the fortitude to come to-
                                                                  gether and lead this great country as you would see fit.
                                                                    In the name of your son, Jesus Christ, amen.
                                                                    Please join me for the pledge.
                                                                    I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America
                                                                  and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, in-
                                                                  divisible, with liberty and justice for all.
                                                                    Chairman WILLIAMS. I want to say good morning to everyone.
                                                                  I want to call the Committee on Small Business to order.
                                                                    And, without objection, the Chair is authorized to declare a re-
                                                                  cess of the Committee at any time.
                                                                    I want to now recognize myself for an opening statement.
                                                                                                                      (1)




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                                                                                                                      2

                                                                     And I want to say welcome to today’s hearing, ‘‘Career and Tech-
                                                                  nical Education: Developing the Future of Main Street Success.’’
                                                                     First, I want to thank our witnesses for joining us today during
                                                                  the National Career and Technical Education Month.
                                                                     Thank you all for being here.
                                                                     And career and technical education programs, also known as
                                                                  CTE programs, play a vital role in society that is all too often over-
                                                                  looked.
                                                                     Today, the Committee will focus on several issues holding Main
                                                                  Street America back. There is no denying that small businesses
                                                                  across the nation are facing a shortage of skilled American work-
                                                                  ers. Millions of trade jobs remain unfilled, and this crisis is com-
                                                                  pounded as baby boomers retire in record numbers.
                                                                     The shortage is even worse in rural communities, like those I
                                                                  represent in Texas, where employers face additional barriers to
                                                                  finding qualified workers. And I hear from people back home every
                                                                  day that we need more plumbers, we need more welders, we need
                                                                  carpenters, we need nurses, we need mechanics.
                                                                     Yet where there is a crisis, there is also an opportunity. CTE pro-
                                                                  grams have proven to provide students with effective pathways to
                                                                  high-wage, high-demand careers.
                                                                     President Trump and his administration have made workforce
                                                                  development a priority to address the growing demand for skilled
                                                                  workers in skilled trades.
                                                                     The Working Families Tax Cut Act created Workforce Pell
                                                                  Grants to cover the costs of short-term credential programs, not
                                                                  just traditional college degrees.
                                                                     In addition to the SBA’s workforce development resources, the
                                                                  Department of Labor announced a $145 million investment oppor-
                                                                  tunity on January 6, 2026, to support the national apprenticeship
                                                                  program and system.
                                                                     Earlier this Congress, the House passed my bill, H.R. 1642, the
                                                                  Connecting Small Businesses with Career and Technical Education
                                                                  Graduates Act. And this bill requires Small Business Development
                                                                  Centers and Women’s Business Centers to provide educational re-
                                                                  sources to small businesses on hiring CTE program graduates.
                                                                     Now, I would like to once again thank my colleagues for their bi-
                                                                  partisan support of this measure, and I look forward to hearing
                                                                  more today about additional actions this Committee can take to
                                                                  strengthen the pipeline to high-demand jobs and help address our
                                                                  nation’s workforce shortage crisis.
                                                                     I want to thank our panel, again, of witnesses for taking the time
                                                                  from your home to participate in this important hearing, and we
                                                                  look forward to your testimony today.
                                                                     I now recognize the distinguished Ranking Member, Representa-
                                                                  tive Tran from the great State of California, for his opening re-
                                                                  marks.
                                                                     Mr. TRAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for convening this hearing
                                                                  on one of the most pressing issues facing small businesses—a
                                                                  shortage of workers with needed skill sets.
                                                                     The American workforce is facing a series of compounding crises.
                                                                  An aging population means millions of baby boomers are soon retir-
                                                                  ing. Aggressive immigration enforcement is removing capable and
                                                                  law-abiding workers from the labor pool. And artificial intelligence




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                                                                  is rapidly reshaping which skills are valuable. Investing thought-
                                                                  fully in workplace development is more urgent than ever.
                                                                     These workforce shortages are hitting hardest in the sectors
                                                                  where affordability has become a defining challenge for young
                                                                  Americans. In healthcare, we will be short over 267,000 registered
                                                                  nurses by 2028. In housing, we already lack as many as half a mil-
                                                                  lion builders, contractors, and construction managers. And as we
                                                                  attempt to reshore critical manufacturing, we lack the electricians,
                                                                  welders, and the advanced manufacturing workforce to make it a
                                                                  reality.
                                                                     The trend is clear: Traditional education pathways are failing
                                                                  workers and employers. Revamping career and technical education,
                                                                  or CTE, is a promising solution that builds on a system that has
                                                                  existed for decades. It is already widely present in high schools,
                                                                  and students who concentrate in it see successful outcomes.
                                                                     Despite this success, it has long been underfunded. Adjusted for
                                                                  inflation, it has been cut by more than 50 percent since 1980. Over
                                                                  the past two decades, high school enrollment has flattened, while
                                                                  post-secondary enrollment has dropped by 25 percent. Bolstering
                                                                  these budgets is a worthwhile investment.
                                                                     Conversely, registered apprenticeships have become one of the
                                                                  fastest-growing CTE strategies, with the number of apprentices
                                                                  doubling over the past decade. By combining classroom education
                                                                  with paid on-the-job training, they provide a direct pipeline into a
                                                                  job. Ninety-four percent of apprentices retain employment after
                                                                  completion, with an average starting salary of $80,000.
                                                                     They don’t just benefit workers; they benefit businesses as well.
                                                                  By strengthening retention and growing the labor pool, they pro-
                                                                  vide a proven return on investment.
                                                                     Despite the benefits, small businesses face significant barriers to
                                                                  participation. The registration process is time-consuming and com-
                                                                  plex, making it difficult for resource-constrained small employers.
                                                                  Promising solutions like apprenticeship intermediaries and consor-
                                                                  tiums give us an opportunity to reduce that burden. These models
                                                                  remove much of the administrative work for small businesses and
                                                                  allow them to partner together to address shortages.
                                                                     I look forward to hearing from our witnesses about how strength-
                                                                  ening CTE and apprenticeships can relieve our workforce short-
                                                                  ages, bolster small-business growth, and make life more affordable
                                                                  for the American people.
                                                                     Chairman, I yield back.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I will now turn to witness introductions and recognize Mr.
                                                                  Bresnahan from the great State of Pennsylvania to introduce his
                                                                  constituent testifying here today.
                                                                     Mr. BRESNAHAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     And I am proud to introduce our first witness today, north-
                                                                  eastern Pennsylvania’s very own Dr. Keith Gunuskey.
                                                                     Dr. Gunuskey currently serves as superintendent of the
                                                                  Wallenpaupack Area School District. He brings more than 24 years
                                                                  of experience in education, having served students in a range of
                                                                  roles, including special education teacher, assistant principal, prin-
                                                                  cipal, and assistant superintendent.




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                                                                     Dr. Gunuskey has been a strong advocate for expanding student
                                                                  access to career and technical education, helping ensure his stu-
                                                                  dents can pursue good-paying technical careers after graduation in
                                                                  fields like aviation, construction, culinary arts, and more. And they
                                                                  have a real-life 737 simulator.
                                                                     In Pennsylvania, career and technical centers allow school dis-
                                                                  tricts within a region to share high-quality facilities and equip-
                                                                  ment, partner with local employers, and provide students with
                                                                  hands-on training that aligns with local workforce needs. Yet
                                                                  Wayne and Pike Counties in my district remain the only two coun-
                                                                  ties in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania without access to a
                                                                  CTC.
                                                                     That is finally being fixed, as the Wallenpaupack School District,
                                                                  alongside neighboring school districts, is stepping up to fill this
                                                                  gap. I am proud to work with Dr. Gunuskey to make sure this
                                                                  project becomes a reality for the students and families in Wayne
                                                                  and Pike.
                                                                     Beyond his professional duties, he is actively involved in his com-
                                                                  munity, serving on the Wayne County YMCA Board and the
                                                                  Wayne Memorial Hospital Advisory Committee and volunteering
                                                                  for more than 30 years as a firefighter.
                                                                     Dr. Gunuskey earned his Doctorate of Education in leadership
                                                                  studies, with a concentration of disaster preparedness and emer-
                                                                  gency management from Louisiana State University Shreveport.
                                                                     And thank you for joining us today, taking time out of the busy
                                                                  day up in northeastern Pennsylvania. And I am looking forward to
                                                                  our meaningful conversation.
                                                                     I yield.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     And I would like to now recognize Congressman Schmidt from
                                                                  the great State of Kansas to introduce his constituent testifying
                                                                  here today.
                                                                     Mr. SCHMIDT. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you very much
                                                                  for convening this hearing today, and we appreciate your having a
                                                                  Kansan on the panel.
                                                                     It is my pleasure to introduce Mike Gibson. Mr. Gibson is the ex-
                                                                  ecutive vice president of the Associated General Contractors of
                                                                  Kansas.
                                                                     The AGC of Kansas often bills itself as the Chamber of Com-
                                                                  merce for the construction industry in Kansas, representing over
                                                                  300 Kansas general contractors, subcontractors, and professional
                                                                  service firms and their 20,000 employees. It is headquartered in
                                                                  Wichita, but we forgive that because they have their legislative af-
                                                                  fairs shop in Topeka.
                                                                     Before this role, Mike was involved in similar workforce develop-
                                                                  ment roles with the industry in New Mexico, Louisiana, and Hous-
                                                                  ton, Texas. He has served on the Board of Directors for the Na-
                                                                  tional Center for Construction Education and Research and cur-
                                                                  rently serves on that organization’s Workforce Development Com-
                                                                  mittee.
                                                                     He is here today to talk with us about the Build Up Kansas pro-
                                                                  gram. Each of our colleagues has a pamphlet on their desk. And
                                                                  I would just characterize it this way: This is an industry- and em-
                                                                  ployer-driven effort to connect all of the parts that are producing




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                                                                  plumbers and construction workers and electricians, so that the
                                                                  pipeline is feeding the actual jobs that are needed and fit in the
                                                                  local dynamics in every community around the State. It is a terrific
                                                                  initiative.
                                                                     I would just finally say, Mr. Chairman, Mike attended Texas
                                                                  Tech, which we forgive him for. But he is married to his wife,
                                                                  Rachal, for which we are grateful he brought her today.
                                                                     Rachal, wave for everybody.
                                                                     And, Mr. Chairman, thanks for having this hearing.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back. And you are
                                                                  right on Texas Tech.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Don’t hold that against me.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Our next witness today is Dr. Nikki Nix,
                                                                  one of my constituents, from the great State of Texas and the great
                                                                  city of Godley, Texas.
                                                                     Dr. Nix serves as chief academic officer for the Godley Inde-
                                                                  pendent School District in Godley, Texas. And Dr. Nix has worked
                                                                  for nearly 20 years in public education, serving as a teacher, dual
                                                                  enrollment instructor, academic advisor, director of career and
                                                                  technical education, and as chief readiness officer.
                                                                     She has served on district committees and advisory boards, in-
                                                                  cluding the Godley Chamber of Commerce Board of Directors.
                                                                     Dr. Nix holds a Bachelor of Business Administration from Mid-
                                                                  western State University, a Master of Education from Lamar Uni-
                                                                  versity, and a Doctorate in Education from Arkansas State Univer-
                                                                  sity.
                                                                     She is a respected leader in our district, and we appreciate her
                                                                  being here today.
                                                                     I now recognize the Ranking Member from the great State of
                                                                  California, Mr. Tran, to briefly introduce our last witness appear-
                                                                  ing before us today.
                                                                     Mr. TRAN. I got the pleasure of introducing Mr. Zach Boren,
                                                                  who is a senior vice president of Apprenticeships for America,
                                                                  where he leads national efforts to expand and modernize registered
                                                                  apprenticeships across the United States.
                                                                     With nearly two decades of experience in apprenticeship and
                                                                  workforce policy, he previously directed federally and privately
                                                                  funded apprenticeship initiatives at the Urban Institute and served
                                                                  as Director of Registered Apprenticeship and Policy at the U.S. De-
                                                                  partment of Labor.
                                                                     His work has been featured in multiple publications, including
                                                                  U.S. News & World Report, NBC News, the Pittsburgh Post-Ga-
                                                                  zette, Washington Monthly, and Real Clear Politics.
                                                                     Thank you, Mr. Boren, and I look forward to your testimony. And
                                                                  welcome to your family as well.
                                                                     I yield back.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     And I want to say thank you again to all of the witnesses. We
                                                                  appreciate you being here today.
                                                                     Now, before recognizing the witnesses, I would like to remind
                                                                  them—we have got some rules around here, okay? I would like to
                                                                  remind them that their oral testimony is restricted to 5 minutes in
                                                                  length.




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                                                                     If you see the light turn red in front of you, it means your 5 min-
                                                                  utes have concluded and you should wrap up your testimony. And
                                                                  if you hear this—[gavel banging]—that means you are going too
                                                                  long, you are ignoring the federal government and all that stuff
                                                                  that goes with it. So we won’t have much of that. But we do watch
                                                                  that very closely, so you will see the lights there.
                                                                     Now, before recognizing the witnesses, I want to remind them
                                                                  that your oral testimony is restricted to 5 minutes in length, and
                                                                  if you see the light turn red, you will know what the time is.
                                                                     So I want to now recognize Dr. Gunuskey for his 5-minute open-
                                                                  ing remarks.
                                                                  STATEMENTS OF KEITH GUNUSKEY, SUPERINTENDENT OF
                                                                   SCHOOLS, WALLENPAUPACK AREA SCHOOL DISTRICT; MIKE
                                                                   GIBSON, EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT, ASSOCIATED GEN-
                                                                   ERAL CONTRACTORS (AGC) OF KANSAS; NIKKI NIX, CHIEF
                                                                   ACADEMIC OFFICER, GODLEY INDEPENDENT SCHOOL DIS-
                                                                   TRICT; AND ZACH BOREN, SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT, AP-
                                                                   PRENTICESHIPS FOR AMERICA

                                                                                         STATEMENT OF KEITH GUNUSKEY
                                                                    Mr. GUNUSKEY. Chairman and Members of the United States
                                                                  House Small Business Committee, thank you for the opportunity to
                                                                  appear before you today. It is truly an honor to speak with you
                                                                  about the critical role career and technical education plays in
                                                                  strengthening Main Street America and building America’s work-
                                                                  force.
                                                                    I can say that this topic is so important to me that I literally
                                                                  drove through a blizzard to be here today. It was more of a blizzard
                                                                  warning.
                                                                    My name is Keith Gunuskey, and I proudly serve as super-
                                                                  intendent of the Wallenpaupack Area School District in north-
                                                                  eastern Pennsylvania. Our district serves 3,000 students from
                                                                  Wayne and Pike Counties and is very rural, covering 325 square
                                                                  miles. I am proud to say that our communities are rich in work
                                                                  ethic, resilience, and commitment to opportunity.
                                                                    Wayne and Pike Counties are unique in Pennsylvania. We are
                                                                  the only 2 counties out of the 67 counties in the State that do not
                                                                  currently have a dedicated career and tech center.
                                                                    Yet, despite this, we have never approached career and technical
                                                                  education with a deficit mindset. Instead, we have embraced a ‘‘do
                                                                  the best you can with what you have’’ mindset. Using limited space
                                                                  and shared facilities, we have built strong, high-quality programs
                                                                  in automotive technology; outdoor power equipment; building con-
                                                                  struction; childcare; allied health, which is our nursing program;
                                                                  engineering; culinary arts; protective services, which covers law en-
                                                                  forcement, EMS, and firefighting; rehabilitation aid; and aviation.
                                                                    These AI-resistant programs reflect the real workforce needs of
                                                                  our region and provide students with meaningful pathways to em-
                                                                  ployment, entrepreneurship, and life-sustaining wages, all while
                                                                  staying in the beautiful northern Pocono Mountains.
                                                                    I am privileged to be a part of a school district with a rich his-
                                                                  tory of identifying community and workforce needs and aligning
                                                                  those needs to curricular pathways and creating opportunities for




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                                                                                                                      7

                                                                  our students so that schools-to-work relationships can be strength-
                                                                  ened.
                                                                     My predecessors did not wait for the perfect conditions to make
                                                                  CTE programs a critical part of our school. Instead, robust pro-
                                                                  grams were created, and I am happy to report that, today, over 40
                                                                  percent of our high school students participate in CTE programs.
                                                                     We have accomplished this by flipping the script on career and
                                                                  tech education. Our programs are no longer viewed as vocational-
                                                                  ed programs for the non-academic or the non-college-bound stu-
                                                                  dent. Our programs are driven by certifications and post-secondary
                                                                  accreditation, which allows students to bank college credits in high
                                                                  school, thus allowing them to graduate from college quicker, with
                                                                  less debt, and allow the students to begin honing their skills and
                                                                  expertise earlier in their educational experience.
                                                                     At the same time, the demand for career and tech education in
                                                                  rural Pennsylvania is overwhelming. Our neighboring career and
                                                                  tech centers are operating at full capacity, with hundreds of stu-
                                                                  dents on waiting lists. For example, the Monroe County Technical
                                                                  Institute currently has more than 600 students waiting for admis-
                                                                  sion, and they are not alone. These are motivated students who
                                                                  want to learn, work, and contribute to their communities but who
                                                                  are being turned away simply because there is not enough space.
                                                                     We feel the same restriction in our own CT programs, as many
                                                                  of our class sizes are limited due to the lack of student space in
                                                                  our school. Where we might have 25 students in a CTE program
                                                                  in a CTC, that is held—we are limited to about a dozen students
                                                                  in our current high school. That reality underscores the need for
                                                                  a CTC in Wayne and Pike Counties.
                                                                     Today, we are in the process of building what will be the final
                                                                  CTC in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. This facility will rep-
                                                                  resent the completion of a statewide network of CTE infrastructure
                                                                  and will ensure that no region is left behind.
                                                                     A major reason this project is possible is the federal govern-
                                                                  ment’s investment, secured through the leadership of Representa-
                                                                  tive Bresnahan. Through his advocacy, Wayne Pike CTC was
                                                                  awarded $3 million in federal funding. This investment is allowing
                                                                  us to expand capacity, modernize equipment, and create learning
                                                                  environments that mirror today’s workplaces.
                                                                     This funding is not about bricks and mortar; it is about access.
                                                                  It is about workforce readiness. It is about giving rural students
                                                                  the same opportunities as their peers in more populated, affluent
                                                                  areas.
                                                                     In our region, 60 percent of our students are considered economi-
                                                                  cally disadvantaged. Career and tech education is not an ‘‘alter-
                                                                  native’’ path; for many families, it is the primary pathway to eco-
                                                                  nomic stability. It connects students directly to local contractors,
                                                                  healthcare providers, manufacturers, service businesses, and entre-
                                                                  preneurs. It prepares them not only to work on Main Street USA
                                                                  but to become Main Street USA.
                                                                     Our students graduate ready to participate in post-secondary
                                                                  education if they choose, ready to contribute to our country in the
                                                                  Armed Forces if they choose, and ready to contribute to our work-
                                                                  force if they choose. Our employers gain skilled workers. Our com-
                                                                  munities grow stronger.




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                                                                    Today, I look forward to sharing how strategic investments in ca-
                                                                  reer and tech education can strengthen small businesses, expand
                                                                  rural economies, and build a workforce prepared for long-term suc-
                                                                  cess.
                                                                    Thank you for the opportunity to be here, and I welcome your
                                                                  questions and our discussion.
                                                                    Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you.
                                                                    The gentleman yields back.
                                                                    I now recognize Mr. Gibson for his 5-minute opening remarks.
                                                                                               STATEMENT OF MIKE GIBSON
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
                                                                     First, I want to thank Congressman Derek Schmidt for his lead-
                                                                  ership and vision of Kansas and his invite today.
                                                                     I also would like to thank your staffer Colin Hall for his assist-
                                                                  ance in having us today.
                                                                     The purpose of my testimony today is to share with you some
                                                                  best practices and successes that AGC of Kansas has developed in
                                                                  Kansas.
                                                                     Our program, our workforce development program for CTE is
                                                                  called Build Up Kansas. And you have a brochure in front of you
                                                                  that is already outdated, but it gives you a little flavor of what it
                                                                  is all about.
                                                                     But this is the most successful public-private partnership in the
                                                                  State of Kansas and maybe Midwest in terms of focus, bringing to-
                                                                  gether policymakers, educators, and the construction industry to
                                                                  laser-focus on CTE technical training for our younger generation.
                                                                     A historical perspective: Over the last 40 years, schools have
                                                                  been told to send everybody to college. We all know that. But, with
                                                                  that, they have spent the lion’s share of their resources on pre-
                                                                  paring kids for college.
                                                                     In Kansas, we, with our focus groups—and I believe this reflects
                                                                  the country—nearly 70 percent of our students either can’t afford
                                                                  to go to college or don’t want to go to college. So what are they
                                                                  doing?
                                                                     We approached the Kansas Board of Regents, which oversees the
                                                                  college and community college and vo-tech colleges, and the Kansas
                                                                  Department of Education with our training curriculum partner, the
                                                                  National Center for Construction Education and Research, NCCER,
                                                                  to get that curriculum approved.
                                                                     It is the only construction trade materials approved by both
                                                                  agencies. The reason for that is, it has a credential component that
                                                                  the students have that they can demonstrate their proficiencies.
                                                                     But it now has become the number-one pathway, cited by the
                                                                  Kansas Department of Education. Construction technology leads
                                                                  the way of every profession pathway in the State. And we are real
                                                                  proud about that.
                                                                     What brought us to this point, in terms of CTE programming
                                                                  being a top priority for Kansas?
                                                                     Four years ago, Panasonic was looking to move out of California,
                                                                  and they looked at Oklahoma and looked at Kansas. The key ques-
                                                                  tion that they asked—and I would suggest to you, why your Com-
                                                                  mittee is so important to this country is—the question they asked
                                                                  our Governor, our Lieutenant Governor, and our legislature was: If




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                                                                  we are going to invest $5 billion in your State, we need 13,000 con-
                                                                  struction workers to build that facility. But the question was, can
                                                                  you build and can you maintain our facility?
                                                                     I will suggest to each one of you as policymakers, that is the key
                                                                  to success for every State that you represent, now and well into the
                                                                  future: Can you build and maintain our facility?
                                                                     And we stepped up with Build Up Kansas. We now, with funding
                                                                  from the State, which pays for the textbooks, the online testing for
                                                                  credentials, and the train-the-trainer for the instructors—in less
                                                                  than 3 years, we have had 150 high schools and community col-
                                                                  leges come on line with CTE programs, 10,000 students in car-
                                                                  pentry, welding, electrical, HVAC, sheet metal, plumbing, and the
                                                                  core curriculum.
                                                                     The great news is, 21 percent of those 10,000 students are fe-
                                                                  male. The female population is being migrated or drawn in to con-
                                                                  struction because of the great careers and great pay.
                                                                     We also, with the NCCER curriculum—it is approved by the De-
                                                                  partment of Labor, Department of Education, Department of Jus-
                                                                  tice, our Kansas Board of Regents, and Kansas Department of Edu-
                                                                  cation.
                                                                     We are not just stopping with the high schools and community
                                                                  colleges. We have four correctional facilities that are using our cur-
                                                                  riculum. The largest is right outside of Wichita. The El Dorado
                                                                  Correctional Facility has 150 low-risk inmates taking masonry
                                                                  training. Those low-risk inmates, as soon as they are being re-
                                                                  leased, are being hired by industry. They are telling me they are
                                                                  better employees than the ones they have.
                                                                     The other component that the Department of Commerce likes
                                                                  with what we are doing—we have an HR platform that we provide
                                                                  at no cost to the construction industry to post their jobs by craft
                                                                  and by city. And we geofence the high schools that are partners
                                                                  with us. The kids can download their resume and send it directly
                                                                  to the HR director who posted that job opening for an interview.
                                                                  That is something that no one else has.
                                                                     The publisher for NCCER curriculum is Pearson. Pearson has
                                                                  gone all over the country; they have not seen a partnership like
                                                                  what Build Up Kansas has brought to the table.
                                                                     My recommendations to you, in closing: increase funding. The
                                                                  Perkins Act is critical.
                                                                     I also would suggest that the administration, whether it be this
                                                                  one or in the future, establish a CTE czar. That way, business and
                                                                  industry and education knows who to go to in the Department of
                                                                  Labor that specializes in CTE.
                                                                     I would also take a page from my former life running the AGC
                                                                  Highway: Look at a funding formula, that if a State spends $1 on
                                                                  CTE, the Feds match those dollars.
                                                                     And the last one: Don’t forget about construction trade associa-
                                                                  tions. They have the finger on the pulse of policymakers, education,
                                                                  and business and industry. They know what their workforce needs
                                                                  are. And if you put provisions in your congressional——
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman’s time is up.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Yep. I am sorry, Mr. Chair. I appreciate the time.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you, again, for that great report.
                                                                     I now recognize Dr. Nix for her 5-minute opening remarks.




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                                                                                                STATEMENT OF NIKKI NIX
                                                                    Ms. NIX. Chairman Williams, Ranking Member Tran, and Mem-
                                                                  bers of the Committee, thank you for the opportunity to testify
                                                                  today on the critical connection between career and technical edu-
                                                                  cation, CTE, and our nation’s workforce in developing the future of
                                                                  main street success.
                                                                    My name is Dr. Nikki Nix, chief academic officer for Godley ISD
                                                                  in Texas. With more than 20 years in education as a CTE teacher,
                                                                  coordinator, and director, I have seen firsthand how education and
                                                                  small business must work together to prepare students for mean-
                                                                  ingful careers.
                                                                    Godley is a fast-growing, rural community southwest of Fort
                                                                  Worth, Texas. Our district serves around 3,300 students and covers
                                                                  122 square miles. Our residential growth has surged, but our large-
                                                                  scale industry has not grown. Strong public schools and thriving
                                                                  small businesses are truly the heartbeat of our community.
                                                                    In 2024, we opened The WILD, The Wildcat Innovative Learning
                                                                  Destination, a 77,000-square-foot CTE center intentionally de-
                                                                  signed within a traditional football-stadium footprint to maximize
                                                                  taxpayer dollars.
                                                                    What looks like a football stadium from the highway is actually
                                                                  more than 40 classrooms, collaboration spaces, and learning envi-
                                                                  ronments serving 13 CTE programs of study, ranging from agri-
                                                                  culture and health science to audio-video and entrepreneurship. In
                                                                  these programs, students earn industry-based certifications aligned
                                                                  with real workforce needs.
                                                                    Because local internship opportunities are limited for us, we in-
                                                                  tentionally designed student-run enterprises inside The WILD to
                                                                  replicate real-world experiences.
                                                                    Shop The WILD, our school store, is a fully student-run enter-
                                                                  prise, where entrepreneurship students manage every aspect of the
                                                                  business while selling apparel and spirit items. Shop The WILD
                                                                  also serves as the point of sale for programs within the facility like
                                                                  our drone students, who are often hired to film aerial footage of
                                                                  properties for our local real estate agents, and welding students
                                                                  building custom projects for community members.
                                                                    Wild Blooms is our floral design shop. It is open to the public
                                                                  during high-demand events like homecoming and Valentine’s Day,
                                                                  turning the classroom into a working retail business.
                                                                    iLEAD, our information technology program, supports and serv-
                                                                  ices all of our student technology devices across the district.
                                                                  Through this student-led enterprise, we are able to bring device re-
                                                                  pairs in-house, eliminating costly outsourcing fees while providing
                                                                  students with authentic, hands-on experience.
                                                                    Since opening The WILD, CTE enrollment has grown signifi-
                                                                  cantly. Our students are drawn to the authentic labs, real-world
                                                                  equipment, and coursework that lead to tangible credentials and
                                                                  career opportunities.
                                                                    Texas provides weighted funding for CTE courses, which is crit-
                                                                  ical. However, in fast-growth communities like ours, increases in
                                                                  the State homestead exemption limit local revenue growth. This di-
                                                                  rectly affects our ability to expand facilities and meet the demand
                                                                  students have for high-quality workforce programs.




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                                                                     The Small Business Committee can play a pivotal role in
                                                                  strengthening CTE. Some key actions from you might include
                                                                  things like: creating tax incentives or direct funding for small busi-
                                                                  nesses that hire high school interns or apprentices, helping to off-
                                                                  set training and supervision costs; providing incentives for local
                                                                  and regional workforce development organizations to formally part-
                                                                  ner with public schools in building workforce-ready talent pipe-
                                                                  lines; supplementing local salary schedules to create competitive
                                                                  CTE teacher pay, enabling schools to recruit professionals with
                                                                  real-world experience; prohibiting unfunded state and federal man-
                                                                  dates and ensuring that K-12 funding grows at at least the rate of
                                                                  inflation; and restricting State actions that reduce or undermine
                                                                  local funding mechanisms, particularly those that limit bonding ca-
                                                                  pacity for fast-growth districts like Godley, such as excessive in-
                                                                  creases to homestead exemptions that erode districts’ ability to fi-
                                                                  nance facilities and CTE infrastructure.
                                                                     Career and technical education is no longer an alternative path-
                                                                  way; it is an essential strategy for economic growth and small-busi-
                                                                  ness sustainability. When students graduate with certifications and
                                                                  real-world experience, they strengthen small business, they fill
                                                                  workforce gaps, and they often become entrepreneurs themselves.
                                                                     At Godley ISD, we believe education should launch students into
                                                                  opportunity, supporting small businesses and the future of main
                                                                  street.
                                                                     Thank you for your time today, and I look forward to your ques-
                                                                  tions.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Boren for his 5-minute opening remarks.

                                                                                               STATEMENT OF ZACH BOREN
                                                                    Mr. BOREN. Chairman Williams, Ranking Member Tran, and
                                                                  distinguished Members of this Committee, thank you for convening
                                                                  this hearing on how we can strengthen America’s main streets by
                                                                  investing in career and technical education, including apprentice-
                                                                  ships.
                                                                    I am Zach Boren. I am senior vice president of Apprenticeships
                                                                  for America. We are a national industry association advancing ap-
                                                                  prenticeships as America’s first choice talent strategy. Our North
                                                                  Star is to reach at least 4 million active apprentices over the next
                                                                  decade, putting us on par with Germany, Switzerland, England,
                                                                  competitors that invest heavily in the trades and apprenticeships.
                                                                    I am grateful to be here at a hearing about career and technical
                                                                  education because that is what apprenticeships are. Apprentice-
                                                                  ships are the oldest form of work-based learning. And CTE is
                                                                  where that journey begins, building real, hands-on skills. And ap-
                                                                  prenticeships are where those skills turn into paid jobs, credentials,
                                                                  and careers. Together, they form this seamless pathway from
                                                                  school to work.
                                                                    I am also the proud son of an apprenticeship graduate myself.
                                                                  My dad completed a meter technician apprenticeship in Indiana.
                                                                  His apprenticeship didn’t just land him a job; it built a trade that
                                                                  sustained our family and built our American Dream for more than
                                                                  50 years and still does today.




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                                                                     My career includes a decade of civil service at the U.S. Depart-
                                                                  ment of Labor, working across multiple administrations to expand
                                                                  registered apprenticeships. During that time, we reached a 20-year
                                                                  high in apprentices and participating employers, we cut red tape
                                                                  by 70 percent, and we expanded the GI Bill for veterans who need-
                                                                  ed access to those education dollars.
                                                                     I have worked with Fortune 500s like Google and GM to build
                                                                  apprenticeship programs, but, just as importantly, I have worked
                                                                  with small employers with similar talent needs. One example is
                                                                  Technically IT. It is a small, minority-owned business in South
                                                                  Carolina. Its founder, Ashley, turned to apprenticeships to grow in
                                                                  a tight labor market. With support for training and start-up costs,
                                                                  she launched quickly and saved nearly $100,000 in education ex-
                                                                  penses, and her company grew.
                                                                     Her story matters because small businesses employ nearly half
                                                                  of America’s private-sector workforce, yet they consistently say that
                                                                  the biggest challenge is finding skilled workers. Registered appren-
                                                                  ticeships allow employers to train workers to industry specifica-
                                                                  tions with local flexibility while workers earn a paycheck from day
                                                                  one.
                                                                     The average apprentice, as Congressman Tran pointed out, earns
                                                                  about $80,000 when they complete that apprenticeship program,
                                                                  and their earnings increase 50 percent. Employers see a good re-
                                                                  turn too: a 144-percent return on investment while significantly
                                                                  lowering worker turnover.
                                                                     Yet, today, just three-tenths of 1 percent of American workers
                                                                  are apprentices.
                                                                     With nearly 680,000 Americans learning through apprenticeships
                                                                  each year, that is more learners than the nine largest public uni-
                                                                  versities combined, but apprenticeships receive only a fraction of
                                                                  the federal investment for education. For every dollar we invest in
                                                                  apprenticeships, $1,000 is spent on higher education.
                                                                     Small businesses face their own set of barriers to adopting ap-
                                                                  prenticeships. Those include upfront costs, administrative com-
                                                                  plexity, and slow State approval processes that can hamper their
                                                                  success.
                                                                     I have experienced this kind of apprenticeship bureaucracy my-
                                                                  self. In Pennsylvania, a small business I supported waited more
                                                                  than 10 months and three council hearings for approval, even
                                                                  though they had a solid training plan that met the State’s require-
                                                                  ments and they were ready to hire. Delays like that mean lost con-
                                                                  tracts and lost workers.
                                                                     If Congress wants to unlock apprenticeship growth, then we
                                                                  must make it easier to start and financially workable for small em-
                                                                  ployers. The most effective model is a group employer sponsor ap-
                                                                  proach. That is where multiple small businesses share infrastruc-
                                                                  ture and coordinate training and compliance.
                                                                     North Carolina really shows the way, where more than 25 groups
                                                                  help employers collaborate with community colleges to scale their
                                                                  own apprenticeship programs in a variety of industries.
                                                                     When small businesses work together, they don’t have to build
                                                                  everything on their own. They train together, and they grow.
                                                                     This Committee can incentivize groups of employers to start ap-
                                                                  prenticeships through a pay-for-performance model that rewards




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                                                                  hiring and completion, not paperwork and process that protects
                                                                  taxpayers and lowers risk for employers.
                                                                     This Committee gets it: What drives main street is risk, cash
                                                                  flow, and workforce. Building and incentivizing apprenticeship ad-
                                                                  dresses all three. It is the most effective talent and anti-poverty
                                                                  strategy we have, where Americans can advance through their
                                                                  sweat, not student debt, strengthening families and hometowns.
                                                                     We do not need a new idea for small-business talent; we need an
                                                                  old one. Registered apprenticeship works. Let’s scale what works.
                                                                     Thank you for your time. I look forward to your questions.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     Let me also bring up something. If you see Members walking in,
                                                                  walking out, it is nothing you said; nobody is mad. There are a lot
                                                                  of other hearings going on, and so they will come and go. So I just
                                                                  want to make sure we understand that.
                                                                     And now we will move to the Member questions under the 5-
                                                                  minute rule we talked about, and I will recognize myself for 5 min-
                                                                  utes.
                                                                     Dr. Nix, based on your experience teaching CTE programs, these
                                                                  programs provide a pivotal solution to the skilled workforce short-
                                                                  age and offer students a robust pathway to acquire hands-on expe-
                                                                  rience, industry-recognized certifications, and valuable partner-
                                                                  ships with local businesses.
                                                                     My question is, what more can be done to increase awareness of
                                                                  skilled trades so students can utilize them as pathways to high-
                                                                  paying, in-demand careers?
                                                                     Ms. NIX. I think it starts with really recognizing the fact that
                                                                  you can graduate and enter the workforce with a skilled trade that
                                                                  costs you pretty much nothing if you are coming from public school.
                                                                  There is not a college tuition that you have to pay to get that. A
                                                                  lot of times, high schools can provide that full certification in your
                                                                  high school experience, and you can graduate with little to no debt.
                                                                     I think incentivizing that and helping parents understand that
                                                                  is a huge part of promoting and recruiting students into skilled
                                                                  trades, for sure.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Perfect.
                                                                     So, additionally, how would an increase in CTE students and
                                                                  graduates benefit rural communities like Godley, like the one that
                                                                  you serve in my district, and those others around it?
                                                                     Ms. NIX. The more students we can get certified and ready to
                                                                  enter the workforce, the faster our community is going to grow.
                                                                     As I mentioned earlier, we are a rural community, and our
                                                                  growth has largely come from rooftops and not an industry or even
                                                                  a lot of small businesses.
                                                                     If we can graduate students who understand the culture of
                                                                  Godley and in keeping our small-town feel that our community
                                                                  loves, those students want to come back and live and work in our
                                                                  community and start new businesses there to provide construction
                                                                  trades and welding and masonry jobs right here locally to our own
                                                                  community, and that helps our own town in a tremendous way.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Mr. Gibson, by 2030, data suggests that
                                                                  if the workforce shortage is not addressed, it will cost the U.S.
                                                                  economy $1.75 trillion in lost revenue.




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                                                                     So can you explain how your member businesses have strength-
                                                                  ened their partnerships with CTE programs?
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Well, thank you, Mr. Chair.
                                                                     One thing I will build on with my company—we did a presen-
                                                                  tation last fall amongst western Kansas economic developers. And
                                                                  after the presentation, a mayor of a little town of 500 came up to
                                                                  me and said, ‘‘Mike, y’all keep focusing on technical trades.’’ He
                                                                  said, ‘‘We had a water main break in our city 6 months ago. It took
                                                                  3 weeks to find a backhoe operator, and we had to have our resi-
                                                                  dents use bottled water.’’ That is one example. How did that impact
                                                                  quality of life and economic development?
                                                                     But I would suggest to you, going back to the original question
                                                                  that Panasonic asked: building and maintain a facility. We are,
                                                                  right now—you are—working to try to attract all those companies
                                                                  that left this country over the years to come back here. And I know
                                                                  they are asking the same question: Are we capable of building and
                                                                  maintaining our facilities?
                                                                     And the key to that is technical trades. I will promise you, the
                                                                  return on the investment is multifold—in terms of what the em-
                                                                  ployer needs, the employee has a professional career.
                                                                     In our State, we need 58,000 new construction workers. I told the
                                                                  Speaker of the House—I made this comment 2 years ago. I said,
                                                                  ‘‘You have a partner with AGC of Kansas that cannot fail.’’ He
                                                                  said, ‘‘You are making a bold statement in front of my colleagues.’’
                                                                  I said, ‘‘No, sir.’’ I said, ‘‘If we don’t get 58,000 new construction
                                                                  workers over the next 3 to 5 years, I may have a lot of construction
                                                                  firms going out of business, because the first thing a contractor
                                                                  needs is people in order to bid a project.’’
                                                                     So this has a ripple effect throughout the economy.
                                                                     And with the infrastructure, the—we all know that our highways
                                                                  and bridges and overall infrastructure is aging. It is going to re-
                                                                  quire a big amount of professional career folks coming out of high
                                                                  school and community college and vo-tech, more so than ever be-
                                                                  fore.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you.
                                                                     Dr. Gunuskey, the Wayne Pike Career and Technical Center is
                                                                  a joint effort among multiple school districts in Pennsylvania to
                                                                  house 13 career and technical education programs.
                                                                     My question is, can you discuss the importance of a dedicated
                                                                  CTE center for engaging students in CTE programs at a very
                                                                  young age?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Absolutely.
                                                                     I think, you know, one of the things—going back to a previous
                                                                  question of what else we can do, I think it is important to begin
                                                                  early exploration of the trades in career and tech education, start-
                                                                  ing at kindergarten on up. It not only really allows the students
                                                                  to home in on an interest that they may particularly have, it also
                                                                  focuses on non-traditional students, students that may not have
                                                                  seen their pathway going through the world of career and tech edu-
                                                                  cation.
                                                                     And so I do believe having that CTC—having a CTC is critical,
                                                                  because it puts the message out that this is important.
                                                                     It also creates half-day programs. Right now, our students, if
                                                                  they want to attend a career and tech ed program in our school




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                                                                  from a neighboring school district, they must actually withdraw
                                                                  from their current school and enroll in our school, leaving their
                                                                  friends and families behind. So we are forcing kids to choose be-
                                                                  tween their families and friends——
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. My time is up.
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY.—and their career.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. My time is up.
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yep.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you for that.
                                                                     I now recognize the Ranking Member for 5 minutes of questions.
                                                                     Mr. TRAN. Thank you, Chairman.
                                                                     Mr. Boren, I am proud to co-lead H.R. 1642, the Connecting
                                                                  Small Businesses with Career and Technical Education Graduates
                                                                  Act, with my colleagues Chairman Williams, Congressman
                                                                  Olszewski, and Congressman Bresnahan. Our bill aims to help
                                                                  small-business owners fill gaps in their workforce by connecting
                                                                  them with graduates of vocational programs through SBA’s Small
                                                                  Business Development Center program.
                                                                     I think one of the largest missed opportunities in our economy
                                                                  is between connecting CTE graduates and the small businesses
                                                                  that desperately need their skills. Right now, small businesses are
                                                                  often the last to know that a pipeline of trained, job-ready workers
                                                                  exists in their own backyard.
                                                                     From your work with apprenticeships nationwide, how important
                                                                  is it to formally connect small businesses with CTE graduates? And
                                                                  what best practices have you seen that ensure these partnerships
                                                                  translate into jobs?
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. That is a great question.
                                                                     And, you know, it really begins with CTE. CTE builds those
                                                                  foundational skills at the high school and community college level.
                                                                  But we have not yet built this pathway from career and technical
                                                                  education into registered apprenticeships, which are those paid on-
                                                                  the-job learning opportunities. We have this real disconnect be-
                                                                  tween what happens at the Department of Education under CTE
                                                                  and registered apprenticeship, which has a large—fairly large foot-
                                                                  print of 680,000 apprentices nationwide.
                                                                     We can also look at pre-apprenticeship as a real bridge in be-
                                                                  tween CTE and apprenticeships. And, you know, a really great ex-
                                                                  ample of that is what is happening in Iowa.
                                                                     So I worked with Central Campus in Des Moines, Iowa, led by
                                                                  a terrific director. They partnered with John Deere and a bunch of
                                                                  their suppliers to build apprenticeship programs at the high school
                                                                  that leverages the CTE training that is happening in the high
                                                                  school with what is happening at the factory.
                                                                     So this is really the idea of, like, how do we connect, you know,
                                                                  CTE leaders at the high school level with businesses that actually
                                                                  have those jobs in demand.
                                                                     Mr. TRAN. You know, on that, in your written testimony, you
                                                                  wrote about a secret sauce that helps small businesses’ apprentice-
                                                                  ship programs succeed. Can you further discuss those factors?
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. Yeah. I think the secret sauce is really coming out
                                                                  of North Carolina, and it is not just their barbecue. It is really how
                                                                  they have built 25 different consortia across the State—you know,
                                                                  these consortium that bring employers together to design appren-




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                                                                  ticeship programs, to organize them with other employers who
                                                                  have like needs, and then also to bring them to scale.
                                                                     So a great example of that is Apprenticeship 2000. It is a 30-year
                                                                  youth apprenticeship program just outside of Charlotte. It began
                                                                  with about eight or nine companies, both German, Swiss, Austrian,
                                                                  and American. And, you know, a really amazing aspect of that is
                                                                  that they had this need in 1994 for something called mechatronics.
                                                                  And mechatronics is probably pretty familiar to everyone today,
                                                                  but it is really this combination of mechanics and engineering at
                                                                  the factory-floor level. But the community college had no idea how
                                                                  to teach it.
                                                                     So they came together as a consortium to build the apprentice-
                                                                  ship program together as, you know, kind of, not necessarily com-
                                                                  petitors but people working in the same industry. And they have
                                                                  been able to sustain that program for over 30 years.
                                                                     One of the young men I met there was at Ameritech Die & Mold,
                                                                  named Sean. He was 21 years old, just finished his apprenticeship
                                                                  program. He was buying his second house, getting married. We
                                                                  asked him what his friends were doing. Most of them were on their
                                                                  couch, you know, vaping and playing video games. Meanwhile, he
                                                                  is living the American Dream.
                                                                     Mr. TRAN. A question for the entire panel if I can get a chance:
                                                                  How do we change the narrative nationally so that career and tech-
                                                                  nical education is seen as an equal value to traditional college
                                                                  pathways?
                                                                     Why don’t I start with you, Dr. Gunuskey?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yes. Just to re-echo what I said before, I think
                                                                  it is the early education. It is going to our—you know, going to the
                                                                  elementary schools and the middle schools and giving them the op-
                                                                  portunities to see what their pathway can include.
                                                                     I also think it is important to ensure that all of the equipment
                                                                  that we have is reflective of the equipment that is in industry so
                                                                  that we are not working on two different levels, teaching kids one
                                                                  pathway and then they enter the field in an industry and they are
                                                                  working on different equipment. So I think mirroring that equip-
                                                                  ment is critical.
                                                                     Mr. TRAN. Thank you. I am out of time, but—Chairman, I yield
                                                                  back—look forward to talking with you all a little more.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     And I now recognize Mr. Stauber from the great State of Min-
                                                                  nesota, the hockey magnate in this group, and champion, for 5 min-
                                                                  utes.
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. Well, first off, Mr. Chair, I appreciate you hold-
                                                                  ing this meeting.
                                                                     And I want to be real crystal-clear: I actually tried out for the
                                                                  1992 Olympic team, and I wasn’t good enough. So that was the way
                                                                  it is.
                                                                     But my younger brother coached the women’s team to the 2018
                                                                  Olympic gold medal in Pyeongchang. And I can tell you that these,
                                                                  the women’s Olympic gold medal and the men’s gold medal—some-
                                                                  thing special for our country. And I think we have to congratulate
                                                                  the athletes.
                                                                     And I don’t know about you, but you get chills and a tear in your
                                                                  eye when they have that flag wrapped around them, you know,




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                                                                  skating around the rink. Both the men’s and the women’s team, we
                                                                  are so proud of them and all the athletes that made the United
                                                                  States proud.
                                                                     Thank you, Mr. Chair.
                                                                     Mr. Gibson, at the end of last year, there were roughly 6.5 mil-
                                                                  lion job openings nationwide. In northern Minnesota and across the
                                                                  Eighth District, contractors tell me they have work lined up but it
                                                                  can be difficult to find enough skilled workers to get it done.
                                                                     From your vantage point, how is the skilled labor shortage im-
                                                                  pacting the construction companies you represent, especially small
                                                                  and midsize firms?
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Thank you.
                                                                     Build Up Kansas took this on several years ago, because, again,
                                                                  we need 58,000 new construction workers to keep up with market
                                                                  demand. But the bottom line is, the small to medium-size firms are
                                                                  now having to be very selective on what they bid, which keeps
                                                                  them from being able to grow their company, grow their expertise,
                                                                  and other related growth opportunities——
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. And that is what we want to do in small busi-
                                                                  ness, Mr. Gibson——
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Absolutely.
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER.—have the small-business man or woman be part
                                                                  of that.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Absolutely.
                                                                     The other thing and the thing I saw when I moved to Kansas 15
                                                                  years ago was, Kansas has ranked over the last 40 years 40 to 45th
                                                                  in the country for out-migration of population. We are actually
                                                                  slowing that down, to where employers are starting to see, because
                                                                  of CTE programs, those young women and men taking technical
                                                                  trade programs, and they are getting their credentials, to where
                                                                  they can get jobs close to home where they grew up versus moving
                                                                  somewhere else and their parents following where they go. And
                                                                  when their parents retire, guess what? They follow and sell their
                                                                  homes and take their wealth with them to wherever their kids and
                                                                  grandkids are.
                                                                     So our employers are really excited about what CTE has brought
                                                                  to the table, because it has actually increased the number of a
                                                                  working pool of technical trade folks with credentials that they can
                                                                  immediately put to work on the job site.
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. Right.
                                                                     You know, one of the things when I talk to high schools, I say
                                                                  the—at the graduation, you know, instead of when we recognize
                                                                  the highest GPA in the class, why don’t we recognize the best me-
                                                                  chanic? Why don’t we recognize the best carpenter? Why don’t we
                                                                  recognize the sheet-metal worker that made something to put on
                                                                  display? We have to—we have to really push for that.
                                                                     And I want to thank you all, you know, for doing—go ahead, Mr.
                                                                  Gibson.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. We actually—with our community college and vo-
                                                                  tech, we actually have a graduation ceremony where, just as a
                                                                  graduation for our college students, we are doing the same thing.
                                                                     But the bottom line being is, you have to look at how you provide
                                                                  those resources for that younger generation. They look for struc-
                                                                  ture.




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                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. Yes.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. And technical trade programs, apprenticeship pro-
                                                                  grams—in fact, my good friend Mr. Boren talked about the dif-
                                                                  ferent programs out there. Kansas is now one of the leading ap-
                                                                  prenticeship programs, pre-apprenticeship programs. And the rea-
                                                                  son for that is, it brings structure to the younger generation, who
                                                                  is seeking that structure.
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. I have 1 minute left. And this is for anybody
                                                                  here——
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. You can have another minute if you
                                                                  want.
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. I can have another—oh, thank you, Mr. Chair.
                                                                     What would you say the impact will be from the new policy in
                                                                  the One Big Beautiful Bill where Congress created the Workforce
                                                                  Pell Grant, which will allow Pell funds to be used for components
                                                                  of registered apprenticeship programs starting this July?
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. I am happy to take that one.
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. Go ahead, Mr. Boren.
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. Yeah. We are excited about Workforce Pell. I think,
                                                                  you know, Pell has long incentivized, you know, college students to
                                                                  do well in college to be able to save some of those dollars that—
                                                                  that gets really expensive. You know, the average student loan
                                                                  debt is $38,000 across the United States—a whopping $1.7 trillion
                                                                  in student loans.
                                                                     And today we are really looking at Workforce Pell being able to
                                                                  bring new talent into the trades and to a number of occupations
                                                                  that don’t necessarily require a 4-year degree and offset both the
                                                                  costs of the student as well as the small employer that wants to
                                                                  hire that talent.
                                                                     We are going to see how this rolls out. We are really excited
                                                                  about what the Department of Education has done here. But it is
                                                                  going to take a lot of innovation at the State level to get it off the
                                                                  ground.
                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. And I think that—you bring it up—at the State
                                                                  level, I want the States to compete. I want the States to compete,
                                                                  you know, for the workforce. And I hope that all 50 States agree
                                                                  with that. Because at the State level, I think this would be great—
                                                                  things coming out of, you know, the discussions at the State level.
                                                                     Does anybody else want to talk about the Workforce Pell Grants?
                                                                  Because Pell Grants have never been used for registered appren-
                                                                  ticeships. Anybody?
                                                                     Mr. Gibson, go ahead.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. I think you are going to see that the States that
                                                                  are focused on CTE are going to step up and take advantage of
                                                                  these opportunities like no tomorrow. Because, again, what we are
                                                                  seeing is, our policymakers, our education deliverables—we use
                                                                  community college and vo-tech to deliver a lot of our training pro-
                                                                  grams.
                                                                     And then the other thing that we told Congressman Schmidt—
                                                                  what a great story legislators have to tell to their constituents on
                                                                  how articulation agreements are being used by high schools and
                                                                  community colleges to use resources, like resources, and not having
                                                                  to duplicate it. But these Pell Grants will only reinforce that mo-
                                                                  mentum that is being shown on CTE.




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                                                                     Mr. STAUBER. Thank you very much.
                                                                     Thank you for indulging me for an extra minute, Mr. Chair, and
                                                                  I yield back.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Cisneros from the great State of California
                                                                  for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. CISNEROS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     And thanks to all our witnesses for being here today on this im-
                                                                  portant topic.
                                                                     I am going to start this first question with our two educators
                                                                  here on the panel, Dr. Gunuskey and Dr. Nix.
                                                                     You know, back when I was in high school, which was not that
                                                                  many—a few years ago, you know, we had electives where you
                                                                  could take, whether it be wood shop, metal shop, auto mechanics,
                                                                  home economics. And a lot of that went away.
                                                                     And I know, now, we have created these pathways that students
                                                                  can get on. But the thing I kind of worry about, right, it is—you
                                                                  know, these used to be electives, things that could kind of go—you
                                                                  could go from this or that and kind of see what you liked, rather
                                                                  than having to choose a pathway and then that becomes your direc-
                                                                  tion that now you are—for a lot of students, if they do it for a little
                                                                  while and then decide they don’t like it, they are still kind of stuck
                                                                  on that pathway on their way to graduation.
                                                                     How do we get back to a system where we can expose students
                                                                  to different things, let them choose these electives, so they don’t
                                                                  have to kind of make this decision and they can kind of work—
                                                                  ‘‘You know what? I think I like this.’’ You know, ‘‘Maybe I didn’t
                                                                  like that, but let me try this.’’ How do we get back to that?
                                                                     Ms. NIX. Well, if you use myself as an example, I changed my
                                                                  major five times in college and got a degree and then still went
                                                                  back and got an alternative certification to become an educator. So,
                                                                  most times, even after you enter the workforce, you change your
                                                                  job multiple times before you actually find where you land.
                                                                     I think that is an important distinction to make for our students
                                                                  as well. And it is something that people have touched on in dif-
                                                                  ferent arenas already. Pell Grants are great for you when you are
                                                                  graduating high school. Apprenticeships are great for you as you
                                                                  are in high school and leaving high school and going into college.
                                                                  These are all things that address the problem when you are ready
                                                                  to enter the workforce. But I think a bigger part of the core prob-
                                                                  lem is addressing this from pre-K to professionals.
                                                                     There is an initiative we have in our district where we start with
                                                                  students as young as pre-K, start having conversations with stu-
                                                                  dents about what their innate abilities and strengths are. If you
                                                                  aren’t good at conflict resolution as a kindergartener and you can’t
                                                                  keep your hands to yourself, you probably won’t be a really good
                                                                  police officer, if you are not innately good at that. It doesn’t mean
                                                                  that you can’t be, but it is going to be a lot harder path for you
                                                                  to achieve that and be successful in it.
                                                                     So we have a lot of conversations about students learning about
                                                                  what their abilities are, where their strengths lie, and then helping
                                                                  them understand what careers align with that outside of just their
                                                                  sphere of influence. Because if you grew up in a household where




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                                                                  your dad was a police officer and your grandpa was a police officer
                                                                  and your uncle was a police officer, that is what is familiar to you.
                                                                     So we have to be very intentional about exposing students to ca-
                                                                  reers outside of what they are immediately in contact with, helping
                                                                  them learn about who they are as individuals, and then helping
                                                                  connect them to careers that align with those so that they can
                                                                  make informed decisions as they move through life.
                                                                     Mr. CISNEROS. Well, thank you for that answer. I think it is
                                                                  important to kind of work with kids young to find what they are
                                                                  good at and kind of help facilitate that process.
                                                                     But, Dr. Gunuskey, what would you—how would you do this?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yeah, absolutely. I think that is a great ques-
                                                                  tion.
                                                                     And what we do at our school is, as ninth graders, all students
                                                                  pick a wide variety of introductory classes that they can take—
                                                                  short, little bursts which are basically a microcosm of the pathways
                                                                  that they can explore.
                                                                     And then the students, once they pick that pathway, they are
                                                                  able to change if that is something they realize they don’t like. Be-
                                                                  cause it is not only important to find out what you want to do for
                                                                  the rest of your life, it is also equally critical to find out what you
                                                                  don’t want to do for the rest of your life as early as possible.
                                                                     But I think it is important—and I will use this analogy—when
                                                                  you talk about taking a variety of classes, I think that, you know,
                                                                  if you were to look at each class as a brick and if you just take a
                                                                  smattering of classes throughout your entire career, at the end of
                                                                  your high school career, you might have a pile of bricks. If you take
                                                                  those within a given pathway, you have taken those bricks and
                                                                  built a foundation of which you can now build your career on.
                                                                     So that is kind of the idea that we are focusing on, is ensuring
                                                                  that kids are leaving with a firm foundation, not a pile of bricks.
                                                                     Mr. CISNEROS. All right. Thank you for that.
                                                                     And, you know, Mr. Boren, let me ask you this, right? I have
                                                                  been told—but I have heard it—and, actually, the Chairman kind
                                                                  of said the same thing here, right? But I have been told by many
                                                                  CEOs, ‘‘I don’t need more MBAs. I need more welders.’’
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. Uh-huh.
                                                                     Mr. CISNEROS. So how can this Committee help facilitate that
                                                                  process?
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. Yeah, I think this Committee plays an important
                                                                  role on really helping small employers work together. As I men-
                                                                  tioned in my testimony, North Carolina is a great example of how
                                                                  we build consortia of small employers and medium-sized employers
                                                                  with all the similar talent challenges.
                                                                     You know, I talked about how these employers can come together
                                                                  through group sponsorship programs offered by the U.S. Depart-
                                                                  ment of Labor—and certainly in California, it is possible—to bring
                                                                  together the same training under the same roof with the same abil-
                                                                  ity to recruit, build a brand name, just the way we see colleges
                                                                  build a brand name today, and go out and build really first-class
                                                                  training programs.
                                                                     Mr. CISNEROS. All right.
                                                                     Well, thank you for those answers.
                                                                     And I am out of time, so I yield back.




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                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Mr. Chair, could I just expand on his question?
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Ten seconds.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Ten seconds.
                                                                     It is how you deliver to the younger generation. They get all
                                                                  their information here. We spend almost 40 percent of our total
                                                                  budget, workforce CTE budget, on social media, pushing out the ca-
                                                                  reers and the pathways——
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman’s time is up.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. And so, keep that in mind.
                                                                     Mr. CISNEROS. Thank you.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Meuser from the great State of Pennsylvania
                                                                  for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Thank you, Chairman.
                                                                     Thank you to our witnesses very much.
                                                                     Dr. Gunuskey, nice to see you.
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Good to see you.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. I know that ride very well that you took on the
                                                                  way down here. And I am also not surprised at all to hear how
                                                                  Congressman Bresnahan was very supportive, as he works real
                                                                  hard for the district, of course, for the long term and the short
                                                                  term. So that is outstanding work. Good to hear.
                                                                     You know, career and technical schools, we all get it, as far as
                                                                  their importance. All you have to do is walk in one and see a young
                                                                  man, a young lady, who might have their head on the desk in tra-
                                                                  ditional schooling and now has a bounce in their step, they are tak-
                                                                  ing care of business, they love what they are doing. It is fantastic.
                                                                  I love seeing it in the high schools, in the public schools, and then,
                                                                  you know, in the CTEs themselves.
                                                                     We, fortunately, in my district, right outside of Congressman
                                                                  Bresnahan’s district, have some great CTE schools—Penn Tech, for
                                                                  instance, Schuylkill County Technical Center, Northumberland
                                                                  County, Lebanon County Technical Center. We have some great
                                                                  ones—Columbia-Montour, Berks County. Luzerne County Commu-
                                                                  nity College has an outstanding program.
                                                                     Yet they are jammed. And they—they could be more expansive,
                                                                  and the funding is not there, necessarily, for the capacity. And let’s
                                                                  face it, as well, the apparatuses and machines that they use are
                                                                  not always available, because they need the latest things in order
                                                                  to develop the skills at the right level.
                                                                     So it is great how you integrate with—you know, it is really a
                                                                  training ground for a lot of businesses. So I know that is a big piece
                                                                  of it.
                                                                     Another big piece of it, of course, is, in 2019, our friend from
                                                                  Pennsylvania, actually, GT Thompson, had a lot to do with the Per-
                                                                  kins Grants being expanded. So that is very, very important and
                                                                  very meaningful. Last year, Pennsylvania got $50 million. I would
                                                                  like to see that be a lot more than that—double, if not triple.
                                                                     And, as well, the Pell Grants. Under the BBB, as I think you
                                                                  know, the Pell Grants were expanded from not just a long-term but
                                                                  short-term.
                                                                     So, really—I mean, I have a list of questions here, but I would
                                                                  really just like to hear from you all, what else do we need to do




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                                                                  to help improve, expand, provide the right equipment to the schools
                                                                  that you are all doing such a great job and dedicated to developing?
                                                                     I will start with you, Dr. Gunuskey.
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yeah, I would just say, I think a targeted in-
                                                                  frastructure funding model of some kind, where—when you look
                                                                  around the country and you assess the CTCs that are successful,
                                                                  that have 600 kids on a waiting list—which, as I mentioned in my
                                                                  opening, at Monroe County, is sad. I mean, that is something that
                                                                  certainly needs to be addressed. So I think a targeted funding
                                                                  structure would be great.
                                                                     I also think—and you had mentioned Perkins, and I can’t agree
                                                                  more. That is something that certainly supports our funding for ca-
                                                                  reer and tech education but in an indirect way. So do the other
                                                                  funding models that we have, including title funding, special-ed
                                                                  funding under IDEA. We have a number of special-needs students
                                                                  who participate in our career and tech ed programs and are able
                                                                  to work and live independently because of those programs.
                                                                     And so I think identifying all of those sources and just taking a
                                                                  look and seeing if there is anything else where they could be sup-
                                                                  ported would be helpful to our programs.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. That is good that you mixed a little bit of busi-
                                                                  ness administration into that——
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yeah.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER.—towards the end of——
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. My business administrator will be happy, yes.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Yeah, good. Good.
                                                                     Mr. Gibson?
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Congressman, I will tell you, obviously, increasing
                                                                  Perkins funds is one thing, but reaching out and working with
                                                                  trade associations. The reason for that is, we can then reach out
                                                                  to our manufacturer reps and suppliers to donate materials.
                                                                     We have programs in the high schools and community colleges
                                                                  where we will get a sheet-metal subcontractor to donate a sheet-
                                                                  metal brake, which costs about $150,000 to $200,000 apiece——
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Right.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON.—but if they see that that school is committed to
                                                                  CTE programming——
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Yeah.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON.—AGC can reach out to our contractors or our sub-
                                                                  contractors and suppliers and their manufacturer reps and say,
                                                                  ‘‘We want you to get involved.’’
                                                                     Why are they going to get involved? Why would Black & Decker
                                                                  donate materials to that? Because they know that those kids are
                                                                  going to be trained on those tools, and they are going to be on the
                                                                  job site and they are going to ask that company to buy those tools
                                                                  that they were trained on.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Huh.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. So that public-private partnership really pays huge
                                                                  dividends not just with the federal dollars and State dollars but the
                                                                  private dollars that are contributed.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Maybe some sort of tax deduction for such dona-
                                                                  tions is something we could work on.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. I will tell you, all industries would welcome that.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Yeah. Okay, great.




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                                                                     Dr. Nix?
                                                                     Ms. NIX. Perkins funding is amazing, and it does support pro-
                                                                  grams in our district. And when you hear the dollar value at the
                                                                  national level, it sounds really big, but when you look at the dollar
                                                                  value at a local level, our Perkins allocation was just around
                                                                  $20,000.
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. Thank you.
                                                                     Ms. NIX. We have a history——
                                                                     Mr. MEUSER. I am out of time.
                                                                     I am very glad you folks are in the positions you are in. Thanks
                                                                  for the great work you do.
                                                                     I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay.
                                                                     The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Ms. Goodlander from the great State of New
                                                                  Hampshire for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Ms. GOODLANDER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     And thank you to our witnesses for being here today for this
                                                                  really important and exciting hearing.
                                                                     In New Hampshire, our small businesses are the beating heart
                                                                  of our economy. And I hear the same story everywhere I go, and
                                                                  the data bears this out: A third of our small businesses can’t fill
                                                                  basic positions.
                                                                     It is about recruiting and retaining talent. And the energy and
                                                                  excitement around starting that pipeline as early as possible in our
                                                                  schools is really overwhelming.
                                                                     You know, as I have talked to and visited our schools and our
                                                                  tech centers—we have more than two dozen across New Hamp-
                                                                  shire—you know, I hear the same thing from students, who have
                                                                  really lost faith in a traditional 4-year-college path, and for very
                                                                  good reasons. You know, the national student debt balance right
                                                                  now has ballooned to over $1.8 trillion. It is all very understand-
                                                                  able. And this is where I really believe the power of career and
                                                                  technical education comes in.
                                                                     As I have traveled around New Hampshire and seen at Alvirne
                                                                  High School in Hudson the next generation of nurses, I have seen
                                                                  in Claremont at Sugar River Valley Regional Tech Center—mul-
                                                                  tiple generations of people whose lives and livelihoods started right
                                                                  in these tech centers. And it is an inspiration to see.
                                                                     We have talked about a lot of the barriers that I have heard
                                                                  about again and again. I want to start with funding.
                                                                     You know, as I look at the federal budget—and, you know, I
                                                                  serve on the Armed Services Committee. It is a trillion-dollar budg-
                                                                  et for our Pentagon. And when I think about what you are doing
                                                                  with $20,000 in your district, what my State has done in
                                                                  leveraging, you know, $7 million in Perkins Grants, it should be
                                                                  humbling to anyone administering a trillion-dollar budget any-
                                                                  where in this government.
                                                                     But, as I understand it, federal funding for career and technical
                                                                  education has fallen since 1980 from around $3.5 billion to just
                                                                  $1.5 billion in 2024.
                                                                     Mr. Gunuskey, you mentioned that there are several sources of
                                                                  federal funding, including IDEA funding, that is essential to the
                                                                  programs.




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                                                                     And, by the way, I just want to thank—anyone who does the job
                                                                  of superintendent deserves a massive round of applause for what
                                                                  you do, because it is one of the hardest jobs, I think, in our country.
                                                                     But can you say a little bit more—I mean, I have been very
                                                                  seized by the fact that Congress now has chronically failed to live
                                                                  up to our obligations under IDEA and funding it at the level that
                                                                  we said we would. Can you just speak more to the other sources
                                                                  of funding beyond Perkins that are essential to your programs?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yeah, absolutely. And there are three that I
                                                                  will highlight.
                                                                     First is the title funding that we receive, Title I for low-income
                                                                  students. That is imperative in our area, with 60 percent of our
                                                                  students defined as economically disadvantaged. That funding is
                                                                  critical to move our programs forward. As I had mentioned, being
                                                                  over 325 square miles, access to our programs, transportation, is
                                                                  also a very big challenge that we face.
                                                                     So the Perkins funding is there. One of the items——
                                                                     Ms. GOODLANDER. So do you use Perkins for transportation?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. We do not use Perkins for transportation. We
                                                                  use the Title I funding for——
                                                                     Ms. GOODLANDER. [Inaudible.]
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yes. And we can use it for, really, classroom
                                                                  supports, aides that we may have, teachers in our classrooms to
                                                                  support reading and math work as well.
                                                                     Special education with IDEA is huge, as many of our students
                                                                  require teacher assistants to be with them to help with their in-
                                                                  struction, special-education teachers to help process and modify
                                                                  curriculum so that it is understandable for the students. And so
                                                                  that is very important.
                                                                     And then there is something called a WIOA that I wanted to
                                                                  mention, which is the Workforce Innovation and Opportunity Act.
                                                                  And, really, that is super-important in helping us network with our
                                                                  workforce boards. And it is a real collaborative approach that we
                                                                  have been able to work with in our community in just trying to le-
                                                                  verage as much funding as we can and collaboration and to having
                                                                  our students have as much experience as possible.
                                                                     Ms. GOODLANDER. Thank you.
                                                                     Mr. Boren, you mentioned in your written testimony that the Na-
                                                                  tional Apprenticeship Act hasn’t been meaningfully modernized in
                                                                  more than 80 years. I really look forward to working with you on
                                                                  that project.
                                                                     You mentioned that sometimes just the red tape, excessive pa-
                                                                  perwork, and registration requirements, which can exceed 35
                                                                  pages, have been a real barrier to getting small businesses involved
                                                                  with apprenticeship programs. And you chronicled some pretty out-
                                                                  rageous stories of red tape.
                                                                     Show us the red tape; let’s cut it together. I am out of time, but
                                                                  I appreciate your testimony on this point and look forward to work-
                                                                  ing with you.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Bresnahan from the great State of Pennsyl-
                                                                  vania for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. BRESNAHAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.




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                                                                     And thank you to Congressman Meuser for those kind remarks
                                                                  earlier.
                                                                     And thank you to the witnesses. I know it is quite time-con-
                                                                  suming to take time out of your days and your lives to come here
                                                                  and advocate for your causes in front of Congress, but it really does
                                                                  mean a lot.
                                                                     And, Dr. Gunuskey, thank you for making the trek through the
                                                                  blizzard from northeastern Pennsylvania. And we will be spending
                                                                  some time on Thursday, so should you need a ride home, we will
                                                                  make some room to accommodate.
                                                                     But one of the first places that I got to visit after becoming a new
                                                                  Member of Congress was your CTE. And something that really
                                                                  stuck with me was the excitement and the passion that we saw
                                                                  from your students, whether that was in the culinary program, the
                                                                  aviation program, the small automotive repair industry.
                                                                     And something that I also experienced in my last life as being
                                                                  a contractor—I am sure Mr. Gibson would agree—is just the pipe-
                                                                  line and availability of the future workforce. And the careers and
                                                                  the education that you are providing for your students are indus-
                                                                  tries and jobs that will never be replaced by artificial intelligence.
                                                                     And the availability of work and jobs and family-sustaining ca-
                                                                  reers the day after they graduate from your program was some-
                                                                  thing that was certainly inspiring, which led us to support the $3
                                                                  million community project funding for the enhancement and the
                                                                  new facility that I am really excited for that I assume will be state-
                                                                  of-the-art based off of all of the other programs that you have to
                                                                  offer.
                                                                     And I think it is an investment that is just one step to ensure
                                                                  that hundreds of students that are eager to pursue a career in
                                                                  skilled trades and technical fields can do so in just an incredibly
                                                                  new facility.
                                                                     But something else that you do incredibly well was—and I hope
                                                                  that you can provide some insight back to the Committee here on—
                                                                  how you partner with small businesses inside of the community
                                                                  and the curriculum that you are creating matches what the current
                                                                  workforce actually needs.
                                                                     So are there any examples of successful partnerships with small
                                                                  businesses somewhere within your over-300-mile radius that you
                                                                  can point to that we can have some better insight on?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yes, absolutely. I would be happy to share
                                                                  that.
                                                                     So one of the reasons that I think our programs are so successful
                                                                  is because they are celebrated and embraced by our community.
                                                                  Our community loves that we have these programs. They see the
                                                                  value in them. They just understand that we need more of them
                                                                  and we need them to grow, we need more participation.
                                                                     What has, I think, greatly benefited our program—and it is
                                                                  something that I think Pennsylvania does very well—is the re-
                                                                  quirement for every CTE program to have occupational advisory
                                                                  committees, OAC committees, that meet twice a year. And those
                                                                  committees are required for small businesses, industry profes-
                                                                  sionals, post-secondary institutions to come in and meet with us
                                                                  twice a year, each program, and really dissect what we are doing—
                                                                  looking at our task list, looking at what students are learning,




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                                                                  looking at the equipment that we are utilizing—and giving us feed-
                                                                  back as to, are we hitting the mark or are we not? What do we
                                                                  need to change? What do we need to update?
                                                                     And so I would strongly suggest the OAC to any school who is
                                                                  not doing that. I think that is a strong complement to any program.
                                                                     Mr. BRESNAHAN. How frequently will you adjust curriculum
                                                                  based off of that feedback?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. After every meeting. So, after every meeting,
                                                                  our teachers will take the feedback and they will begin adjusting
                                                                  task lists for the future.
                                                                     And, again, that keeps us in sync with the small businesses, who
                                                                  are—again, our small businesses are terrific partners. We would
                                                                  like to have more small-business participation, because we believe
                                                                  that the more numbers that we have, the greater value that we
                                                                  have in our programs and the better feedback that we can receive
                                                                  and make those changes.
                                                                     Mr. BRESNAHAN. How has the local community and sur-
                                                                  rounding area been receiving the idea of such a large investment
                                                                  and the idea that, out of—two counties in the Commonwealth of
                                                                  Pennsylvania are the only two that don’t have a dedicated CTE
                                                                  CTC? How has that surrounding community been in response to
                                                                  this initiative?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yes. They have been very supportive, because,
                                                                  once again, they see the need.
                                                                     As I had mentioned before, the difficulties that we now face with
                                                                  students sharing districts. Having to dis-enroll in one district and
                                                                  re-enroll in another district naturally puts up barriers for students
                                                                  and families that are really—is really inequitable when you look
                                                                  across the entire State, where no other county has to do this except
                                                                  our two counties.
                                                                     So it has been very well-received and very well-supported.
                                                                     Mr. BRESNAHAN. Well, I appreciate you making the trek out
                                                                  here.
                                                                     Thank you for all that you all do for your communities, and I
                                                                  look forward to our continued working relationship.
                                                                     And, with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield the balance of my time.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mrs. McIver from the great State of New Jersey
                                                                  for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mrs. MCIVER. Thank you so much, Chairman, and thank you to
                                                                  our Ranking Member for convening today’s hearing.
                                                                     I want to thank each of our witnesses for joining us here today,
                                                                  especially with all of the weather and everything going on. Happy
                                                                  that you can be here with us.
                                                                     Across the country, small businesses are struggling to find work-
                                                                  ers with the skills they need, while too many young people are
                                                                  questioning whether a traditional, 4-year degree is the only path
                                                                  to economic prosperity. Last December, one-third of small-business
                                                                  owners reported job openings they could not fill.
                                                                     At the same time, student loan debt is rising, and recent college
                                                                  graduates are experiencing higher unemployment rates than the
                                                                  broader workforce. We must build better bridges between education
                                                                  and the workforce, which we have heard today on this panel.




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                                                                     In my district, we see this both as a challenge and an oppor-
                                                                  tunity. Institutions like Essex County College and Newark Voca-
                                                                  tional High School are working to empower students. They are
                                                                  helping young people earn industry certifications and hands-on
                                                                  technical skills that align with businesses’ needs.
                                                                     At the same time, initiatives like the Urban League of Essex
                                                                  County’s Microenterprise and Skilled Trades Training Center show
                                                                  how partnerships between industry and educators can create pipe-
                                                                  lines into high-demand careers. This strengthens vocational oppor-
                                                                  tunities in our community. These programs show that, when we in-
                                                                  vest in practical pathways, we prepare students for well-paying
                                                                  jobs and we ensure that small businesses have the talent they need
                                                                  to compete.
                                                                     With that, I have one question for Mr. Boren.
                                                                     Participation in career and technical education programs has re-
                                                                  mained largely flat for years, and instructor shortages continue to
                                                                  limit expansion in high-demand fields.
                                                                     From your perspective, what federal policy changes would most
                                                                  effectively expand high-quality CTE pathways and better connect
                                                                  people to apprenticeships and employment opportunities?
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. That is a great question, Congresswoman.
                                                                     Mrs. MCIVER. It is a mouthful. It is a mouthful.
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. And I appreciate the question, because we just have
                                                                  underinvested in CTE and apprenticeships. It was laid out earlier
                                                                  that, you know, we have had 50-percent cuts in CTE since 1980.
                                                                  And, you know, when we look at registered apprenticeship, for
                                                                  every dollar we invest in higher education, we are spending
                                                                  $1,000—or, for every dollar we invest in apprenticeships, we are
                                                                  spending $1,000 on higher education. So there is a huge disparity.
                                                                     You know, since 2016, we want to thank the Congress for invest-
                                                                  ing in registered apprenticeship. Prior to 2016, the Office of Ap-
                                                                  prenticeship had absolutely zero dollars, when I started there, to
                                                                  invest in companies and intermediaries and in the trades. Today,
                                                                  we are at $285 million—still kind of a fraction in comparison to the
                                                                  $27 billion or more that we spend on higher education.
                                                                     So, critically important that we continue to think about modern-
                                                                  izing apprenticeships, making them easier for small businesses to
                                                                  start, cutting red tape and some of the paperwork as well as speed-
                                                                  ing the amount of time that it can take for these programs to get
                                                                  approved.
                                                                     Mrs. MCIVER. Thank you so much for that.
                                                                     And just in the small amount of time that I have left, I would
                                                                  love for each witness if they can—I know many of you have talked
                                                                  about this a little bit. What strategies should Congress support to
                                                                  improve early awareness for these types of non-4-year-college path-
                                                                  ways?
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. One, setting the tone. Again, I hear—and I have
                                                                  outlawed in my office—‘‘local control,’’ but—local control from the
                                                                  State down to the school districts.
                                                                     Most of the school districts we talk to—and we have 150 part-
                                                                  ners, and we have got 300 school districts, so we are on our way
                                                                  to getting 100 percent saturation in terms of participation in CTE.
                                                                  But most of those school districts are looking for direction. They




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                                                                  are looking for direction from the Department of Ed. They are look-
                                                                  ing for direction out of Washington, D.C.
                                                                     So I would suggest to you, don’t be afraid to set the tone. Be-
                                                                  cause I can promise you, especially in rural America, they are look-
                                                                  ing for direction, they are looking for help. And you, as the policy-
                                                                  makers here in Washington, D.C., can set that tone.
                                                                     Mrs. MCIVER. Thank you.
                                                                     With that, I am running out of time, but I will say, thank you
                                                                  each for all of your, you know, expertise that you shared up here
                                                                  today.
                                                                     Me, I am a true supporter of skilled trades. I used to work in a
                                                                  school district as a personnel director, and I know how important
                                                                  skilled trades is. And I wish we could have more dollars, more
                                                                  funding to be able to support such. And if I could do it all over
                                                                  again, I would have been an electrician, for sure, okay?
                                                                     Thank you.
                                                                     With that, I yield back, Chairman.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. That is your new nickname, ‘‘The Elec-
                                                                  trician.’’
                                                                     With that, the gentlelady yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Downing from the great State of Montana
                                                                  for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     And thank you to the witnesses for being here.
                                                                     You know, it is interesting, I was thinking the other day, it
                                                                  wasn’t that long ago when I saw political slogans always talking
                                                                  about creating jobs.
                                                                     And I travel around my district, and, you know, there are two
                                                                  big limiting factors in small businesses and industry across my dis-
                                                                  trict—you know, access to capital and the ability to recruit and re-
                                                                  tain employees. And that seems to be one of the biggest limiting
                                                                  factors, is finding employees.
                                                                     And there are so many, you know, issues there, from housing to,
                                                                  you know, trades education to make sure that you have, you know,
                                                                  folks coming in that have the skills necessary. And it really under-
                                                                  scores the need for more workforce development, more of this type
                                                                  of training.
                                                                     And one of the things that I noticed—I am going to start with
                                                                  you, Mr. Gibson. According to a survey conducted by your own as-
                                                                  sociation, by the Associated General Contractors of America, 92
                                                                  percent of construction firms nationally reported having difficulty
                                                                  finding workers to hire.
                                                                     Can you elaborate on how this shortage of construction workers
                                                                  is impacting the companies that you represent?
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Well, this didn’t happen overnight. And one of the
                                                                  components of Build Up Kansas is to change the perception of our
                                                                  industry. Construction has always been an afterthought. Now it is
                                                                  becoming back what it was in the 1950s and 1960s, and that is,
                                                                  a noble profession. And investment, of which Kansas is doing, lead-
                                                                  ing the way on CTE in the Midwest, is providing that pipeline.
                                                                     But I said earlier, setting a tone. We are setting that pace and
                                                                  that tone to send a message to our membership across the State
                                                                  of Kansas and even across the country that it is a noble profession,




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                                                                  it has got good pay, it has got a good career. And I said ‘‘career,’’
                                                                  not ‘‘a job.’’
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. Yeah.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. And you have to also deliver this type education
                                                                  materials the way the younger generation wants to receive it, and
                                                                  that is through social media.
                                                                     But the bottom line is, it is costing companies in re-work——
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. So can I—I want to elaborate on that. And I
                                                                  think that is a really good message, and I appreciate that. But—
                                                                  so to what degree do you believe that this shortage is contributing
                                                                  to the rising costs of both, you know, housing and commercial real
                                                                  estate in this country?
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. There is no question about it. Again, if a contractor
                                                                  only has X number of employees and they need Y-plus, they are
                                                                  limited on how many projects they can bid, which limits the com-
                                                                  petition on commercial, industrial, whatever project it is. The more
                                                                  competition, the better pricing you are going to get and the better
                                                                  quality that you are going to get all the way across the board.
                                                                     But it has an across-the-board impact on our industry——
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. Right.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON.—starting with development of workforce.
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. And, briefly, what role do you think CTE pro-
                                                                  grams can play in bridging this current skills gap?
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. CTE is the number-one issue, the number-one
                                                                  issue, bar none. And that goes for all industries across, but espe-
                                                                  cially construction.
                                                                     What was the first thing everybody did this morning in getting
                                                                  up? You turned on a light switch, right? Somebody had to install
                                                                  that light switch.
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. Right.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Okay? So point——
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. Thank you for those answers. I really like that
                                                                  message.
                                                                     I am going to turn now to Dr. Gunuskey.
                                                                     I want to discuss your experience as a superintendent in rural
                                                                  Pennsylvania. So my district, central and eastern Montana, is one
                                                                  of the most rural congressional districts in the country. And rural
                                                                  high school students, notably, participate in CTE programs at sig-
                                                                  nificantly higher rates than their suburban and urban counter-
                                                                  parts.
                                                                     So, Dr. Gunuskey, can you elaborate on the benefits of CTE pro-
                                                                  gramming and rural education and why these programs are par-
                                                                  ticularly effective in sparsely populated school districts?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yeah. As I said in my opening statement, I
                                                                  think that, you know, with having the high economically disadvan-
                                                                  taged populations that we have, for many of our kids, they get into
                                                                  it as a way of life.
                                                                     And many of our students, when they graduate, they want to live
                                                                  in our community. And so, fortunately, what we are trying to do
                                                                  is continually match the needs of our community with what we are
                                                                  offering in schools——
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. Right.




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                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY.—so that the kids can learn, they can con-
                                                                  tribute to the local economy, they can stay, they don’t have to
                                                                  leave, they don’t have to leave with college debt.
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. So I appreciate that.
                                                                     And as emerging technologies like AI play an increasingly impor-
                                                                  tant role in our society, in what ways do you think CTE programs
                                                                  can be leveraged to best prepare rural students for employment in
                                                                  this future economy?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. That is a great question. And I think what we
                                                                  are seeing is a shift in the interest level of the CTE programs being
                                                                  demanded by students.
                                                                     Years ago, computers, computer programming, graphic arts—
                                                                  those were the most requested programs.
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. Right.
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. But, now, AI can create those for you in 2 sec-
                                                                  onds and create all types of coding.
                                                                     So, again, everything that we are trying to do is that AI-resistant
                                                                  program that allows—that AI is not going to take over.
                                                                     Mr. DOWNING. All right. Thank you, Doctor.
                                                                     It looks like I have run out of time, so, Mr. Chair, I yield.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     And I now recognize Ranking Member Olszewski from the great
                                                                  State of Maryland for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. OLSZEWSKI. Thank you very much, Chairman Williams. I
                                                                  want to thank you and Ranking Member Velázquez for holding this
                                                                  hearing.
                                                                     Thank you to all of our witnesses for your presence here today.
                                                                     Mr. Boren, I appreciate that you ground a lot of your work in the
                                                                  teachings of Jesus. And I know that our faith calls us to look at
                                                                  policy as if we are our brother’s keeper. And I just want to say first
                                                                  that I respect that you are doing that, and hope that we can con-
                                                                  tinue to see more of that perspective here on Capitol Hill.
                                                                     I know that you and many others in my State worked hard to
                                                                  pass Maryland’s RAISE Act to create more tools and expand reg-
                                                                  istered apprenticeships to new industries, employers, and commu-
                                                                  nities.
                                                                     During my time as a State delegate, long before I came to Con-
                                                                  gress, I was proud to be the primary sponsor of the now-nationally-
                                                                  recognized Employment Advancement Right Now Act, or EARN
                                                                  program. For the past decade, EARN has strengthened the State’s
                                                                  workforce pipeline to supply local and small businesses with a well-
                                                                  trained workforce and has placed residents into good-paying jobs.
                                                                  Over 11,000 Marylanders have obtained full-time employment be-
                                                                  cause of EARN, and more than 15,000 incumbent workers have
                                                                  benefited from the program’s upscaling opportunities.
                                                                     I would commend to my Chairman and my colleagues on the
                                                                  Committee this successful statewide initiative be explored and per-
                                                                  haps replicated at the federal level.
                                                                     Back home in my district, Reisterstown’s main street is home to
                                                                  the nonprofit Cavanagh House, which hosts a partnering appren-
                                                                  ticeship program for upholstery and sewing that matches students
                                                                  with workrooms and experienced tradespeople at industry-leading
                                                                  businesses. These partnerships allow students to refine their skills,




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                                                                  gain invaluable hands-on experience, and build confidence in pro-
                                                                  fessional settings.
                                                                     Unfortunately, as we know, not every small business can provide
                                                                  this type of paid service to train and retain its students as workers,
                                                                  and that is where CTE bridges the gap.
                                                                     That is why I was proud to partner with Chairman Williams to
                                                                  pass the Connecting Small Business with Career and Technical
                                                                  Education Graduates out of the House last year, a bill that will
                                                                  help match students and graduates of CTE with actual job opportu-
                                                                  nities through Small Business Development Centers and Women’s
                                                                  Business Development Centers.
                                                                     We will have to get it done in the Senate soon, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     We need more of this commonsense type of legislation. Doing so
                                                                  will help ensure that America continues to be a place where small
                                                                  businesses, especially those on main streets, can thrive.
                                                                     Mr. Boren, I will start with you. We know that small businesses
                                                                  make up 99 percent of employers but just a small fraction of ap-
                                                                  prenticeship sponsors. Is the main issue the administrative capac-
                                                                  ity, or are there other barriers we should be tracking?
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. Yeah, I think the—and thanks for your opening re-
                                                                  marks. I do appreciate you being from my home State. And Mary-
                                                                  land really being the second-fastest-growing apprenticeship State
                                                                  in the country has a lot to do with the leadership of the Governor
                                                                  and folks like yourself.
                                                                     And one of the things that we are seeing, where Maryland is
                                                                  leading, is really in pay-for-performance for apprenticeships. So
                                                                  that really came about in the RAISE Act, as you know, and is
                                                                  being undertaken by the State, to pay for what works.
                                                                     You know, oftentimes we are using federal dollars where we put
                                                                  grants out, bespoke programs, and we hope that they work. This
                                                                  idea around pay-for-performance pays for success when apprentices
                                                                  are gainfully hired, retained, and, ultimately, what we hope to get
                                                                  to in one of our new pilot programs is to where they complete. So,
                                                                  if you are going to start an apprenticeship program, there is no
                                                                  reason why we ought not pay that employer or that apprenticeship
                                                                  sponsor for that completion as well.
                                                                     One area I just wanted to highlight, too, that I think is really
                                                                  critical for this Committee is helping our veterans. Veterans are a
                                                                  critical component of how small businesses can grow, yet the Post-
                                                                  9/11 GI Bill focuses only on higher education.
                                                                     If we are to really help expand apprenticeships with small busi-
                                                                  nesses, we need to level the playing field, giving them their full
                                                                  housing benefits and tuition. My calculation looks at, if you choose
                                                                  apprenticeship, you are getting $200,000 less than you would if you
                                                                  decided to go pursue that French lit degree at Brown University.
                                                                     Mr. OLSZEWSKI. That is a really important perspective. Thank
                                                                  you for that.
                                                                     With my remaining time, 30 seconds, Dr. Nix, what percentage
                                                                  of your CTE graduates are going on to apprenticeships? And do you
                                                                  have any formal partnerships with employers to help create those
                                                                  pathways?
                                                                     Ms. NIX. In Texas, we have an indicator on accountability called
                                                                  CCMR: College, Career, and Military Readiness. Eighty-six percent
                                                                  of our students graduate with an indicator in one way or another.




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                                                                  Seventy-seven percent of students indicate that through career or
                                                                  military readiness. So a large portion of our students do graduate
                                                                  with that indicator.
                                                                    Just to add, one barrier that we have in fulfilling apprenticeships
                                                                  are age restrictions and liability that apprentice providers face as
                                                                  far as housing students underage in their facilities.
                                                                    Mr. OLSZEWSKI. Hm.
                                                                    I appreciate all that feedback, and thank you all for the work.
                                                                  Sorry I didn’t have time for questions for everybody, but thanks
                                                                  again for being here.
                                                                    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                    I now recognize Congressman Schmidt from the great State of
                                                                  Kansas for 5 minutes.
                                                                    Mr. SCHMIDT. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for convening this
                                                                  hearing.
                                                                    And thanks again to our witnesses for being here. I think it has
                                                                  been a great discussion.
                                                                    I want to look a little more down the road toward the horizon
                                                                  here and talk about maybe some spin-offs and some entrepreneur-
                                                                  ship issues. And I am going to start with Mr. Gibson and then go
                                                                  down the line to the extent that my time allows here.
                                                                    I am from a fairly little town. We have about 10,000 people now.
                                                                  My wife is from the Kansas City metro area. When we were first
                                                                  contemplating getting married—she is from a town of 2.5 million
                                                                  people if you count the metro, and I told her, ‘‘Well, I am from the
                                                                  biggest town in my area too,’’ and I didn’t disclose all the details.
                                                                  Sometimes our local dynamics were a little different.
                                                                    And, you know, one thing that strikes me—and I hear it every-
                                                                  where I go. We hear the same dynamics, that we don’t have enough
                                                                  plumbers, we don’t have enough electricians, we don’t have enough
                                                                  carpenters. But, in our world, that is not just having more folks at
                                                                  our regional construction companies, whether it is a Key or a
                                                                  Crossland or a Hutton—you know, we all have those. It is also hav-
                                                                  ing folks in our local communities who do that.
                                                                    And they are often mom-and-pop shops. They are somebody who
                                                                  hung out, you know, at Bob’s Carpentry and Joe’s Plumbing, and
                                                                  they either don’t have employees or they have one or two or they
                                                                  have them ad hoc, and they live in a community. And, at least
                                                                  anecdotally, it sure looks to me like in big parts of the area I rep-
                                                                  resent we have fewer of those folks than we did a generation ago.
                                                                    So here is what I am wondering. Let’s assume—you know, Mr.
                                                                  Gibson, your literature talks about needing 58,000 more workers in
                                                                  the CTE space over the next 5 years in Kansas. That is great. Let’s
                                                                  assume we succeed in that through a combination of all these great
                                                                  things we are talking about.
                                                                    Here is what I am guessing. Tell me if I am right or not. I am
                                                                  guessing that, out of the several thousand young folks that we en-
                                                                  courage and support and they get into this field and they become
                                                                  carpenters, plumbers, electricians, whatever—metal workers—with
                                                                  these midsize companies, larger companies, some portion of them
                                                                  are going to have life events that make them decide they want to
                                                                  go back home, or they don’t want to work for somebody else, they
                                                                  want to hang out their own shingle, and they want to raise their




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                                                                  kids where they were raised or near grandparents or whatever, and
                                                                  those may be in smaller communities.
                                                                     What do we need to be thinking about—this is the Small Busi-
                                                                  ness Committee. What do we need to be thinking about now, as
                                                                  you are growing workers, to also be identifying and be prepared to
                                                                  help grow the entrepreneurs who spin off 5 years from now, 10
                                                                  years from now, and become that next generation?
                                                                     Mr. Gibson?
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. The lion’s share of the contractors that I represent
                                                                  are small to medium-size firms. A lot of them started in entry-level
                                                                  positions and worked their way up. In fact, one of the contractors
                                                                  I wanted to bring with me today—and I don’t think he will mind
                                                                  if I say who it is—Jeromy Bartz, Bartz Construction.
                                                                     He came out of a construction management program at Kansas
                                                                  State, went to work for McCownGordon, which is a large firm, got
                                                                  7, 8 years of experience. But his hometown is Great Bend, Kansas,
                                                                  a very rural community, but he saw a niche. There wasn’t a gen-
                                                                  eral contractor in that area. And he and another McCownGordon
                                                                  employee decided to break off and start their own company. And
                                                                  they started that company 3 years ago, and they are serving that
                                                                  area very well.
                                                                     But I go back to my story about the mayor that was looking for
                                                                  a backhoe operator. If you don’t have craftspeople in your commu-
                                                                  nity—and a lot of these folks that are coming out of CTE programs
                                                                  want to stay close to home. And we are giving them that life skill
                                                                  early on, because they are not interested in going to college or they
                                                                  can’t afford to go to college, and they are finding their way to stay
                                                                  close to home and meet their future spouse. We are starting to see
                                                                  population growth versus out-migration of population, all because
                                                                  of CTE programming.
                                                                     Mr. SCHMIDT. Thank you, Mr. Gibson.
                                                                     Dr. Gunuskey, you mentioned entrepreneurship in your opening.
                                                                  That caught my attention. And, you know, just because you are a
                                                                  great plumber and electrician doesn’t mean you know how to han-
                                                                  dle HR issues or tax prep issues or advertising issues. What do we
                                                                  need to be doing with the SBA or otherwise?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yeah, I think—and that is a great question.
                                                                     What we do is, we bake entrepreneurship into all of our pro-
                                                                  grams. So, regardless of the career pathway that the students are
                                                                  in, kids have a rich exposure in entrepreneurship.
                                                                     Through that, students also participate in something called our
                                                                  seminar programs, where they have a rich understanding of finan-
                                                                  cial literacy, what it takes to start a business, to own a business,
                                                                  public relations, answering a phone call, all of the little things that
                                                                  mean so much today.
                                                                     So I think, as we are doing this as a country, I think entrepre-
                                                                  neurship has to be baked in across the board.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Congressman, I would just say, the Small Business
                                                                  Administration is a great connector to CTE programs because of
                                                                  the resources that they provide, just as the doctor talked about, not
                                                                  only technical resources but financial resources. And small busi-
                                                                  ness coming out of CTE programs could definitely be that great
                                                                  connector to the Small Business Administration.
                                                                     Mr. SCHMIDT. Thank you.




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                                                                     My time has expired.
                                                                     Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields.
                                                                     And I now recognize Dr. Morrison from the great State of Min-
                                                                  nesota for 5 minutes.
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. Thank you, Mr. Chair and Ranking Member,
                                                                  for holding this hearing.
                                                                     And thanks to our witnesses for being here today. This has been
                                                                  a really great conversation.
                                                                     Workforce training and development is critical, of course, to both
                                                                  helping our small businesses grow and ensuring the next genera-
                                                                  tion of the skills they need to succeed and advance.
                                                                     Minnesota’s Third District is proud to be the home of Anoka
                                                                  Technical College, Hennepin Technical College, and Normandale
                                                                  Community College, which provide higher education and training
                                                                  through career and technical programs to ensure their students are
                                                                  equipped with the skills they need to succeed in today’s and tomor-
                                                                  row’s workforce.
                                                                     I had the honor of visiting Normandale Community College, ac-
                                                                  tually, just last week and hearing about how they are shaping and
                                                                  preparing Minnesota’s workforce.
                                                                     AI is increasingly impacting the way we work and changing the
                                                                  skills that employers are looking for in their employees. A common
                                                                  concern I hear from recent graduates entering the workforce is that
                                                                  AI is replacing many entry-level jobs. During my visit to
                                                                  Normandale, I learned about how they are training students to do
                                                                  jobs that AI can never replace.
                                                                     Mr. Boren, how can apprenticeships, technical education pro-
                                                                  grams, and community colleges help ensure that students have the
                                                                  skills they need to succeed in an increasingly AI-driven job market
                                                                  and they are able to find a job now and in the future?
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. I think you are exactly right, Congresswoman. We
                                                                  are seeing a hollowing out of the entry-level labor market due to
                                                                  AI replacing that early-level, entry-level jobs.
                                                                     The challenge is, you know, we are going to need these folks
                                                                  later on too, and we need to get them in the workforce today. No-
                                                                  body can wait 5 or 6 years to get into the workforce.
                                                                     And that is where apprenticeship, especially registered appren-
                                                                  ticeship, is a flexible, industry-driven training program, where em-
                                                                  ployers drive the learning. It is not a train-and-pray model. It is
                                                                  where we invest today in apprenticeships, as we have since 2016,
                                                                  and we see an 80-percent increase in the number of employers and
                                                                  the number of apprentices being engaged in a variety of fields.
                                                                     One of the exciting things is that, since we have invested, we see
                                                                  more than 50 percent of apprenticeships now being outside of the
                                                                  trades. So they can be in insurance, in healthcare, in IT. A number
                                                                  of different industries are now investing.
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. Thank you. I appreciate that.
                                                                     Perfect segue to my next question for you. I am a doctor by train-
                                                                  ing, and I am really worried about the growing shortage of
                                                                  healthcare workers and how this impacts access to care, especially
                                                                  in our rural communities.
                                                                     So, Mr. Boren, during your testimony, you mentioned that you
                                                                  have worked directly with small businesses as an apprenticeship




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                                                                  intermediary, recruiting employers, designing programs, and help-
                                                                  ing companies across sectors, including healthcare, launch appren-
                                                                  ticeship programs that meet workforce needs.
                                                                     Can you elaborate on how registered apprenticeships can help
                                                                  address workforce challenges, such as staffing shortages, in the
                                                                  healthcare industry?
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. Well, that is right. I am actually really excited to
                                                                  be here with my wife today, who is a registered nurse. But she
                                                                  ended up going the route of getting a master’s degree. But we are
                                                                  seeing more States like Texas, Michigan, and a number of States
                                                                  create registered apprenticeship programs for nursing, where you
                                                                  don’t need to go into debt. You can start that registered apprentice-
                                                                  ship, where you are learning at the hospital with a preceptor, and
                                                                  that continuum goes on, up to receiving your license as an RN.
                                                                     But we see those shortages in a number of occupations just like
                                                                  that, whether that is surgical technicians or physical therapists, ra-
                                                                  diologists—a number of occupations that are now being created for
                                                                  apprenticeships. But we still have a lot of licensing barriers at the
                                                                  State levels that don’t allow those apprentices to have that hands-
                                                                  on learning that we really need some relief from that regulatory
                                                                  burden at the State.
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. And you kind of touched on this, but what
                                                                  skills do apprenticeships teach that can’t be taught in conventional
                                                                  classrooms?
                                                                     Mr. BOREN. Well, they teach the hands-on. So, I mean, when
                                                                  you are in a classroom, you are learning it by theory. When you
                                                                  are on the job, you are learning directly from a mentor who—and
                                                                  a journeyperson who has done that work as a full professional.
                                                                     And, in fact, we are seeing what is interesting about apprentice-
                                                                  ships is, 85 percent of apprentices today are men, and a lot of the
                                                                  last few administrations have treated that as a flaw, not a feature.
                                                                  We are seeing a number of men drop out of college, not being able
                                                                  to return, and apprenticeships are this great way where men—and
                                                                  research is showing that men really do well when they have that
                                                                  hands-on learning. And it is a great way to get them into a great
                                                                  career that pays really well as well.
                                                                     Ms. MORRISON. Thank you so much. And a quick thank you to
                                                                  your wife for taking care of patients.
                                                                     Thank you. I yield back, Mr. Chair.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
                                                                     I now recognize Mr. Wied from the great State of Wisconsin for
                                                                  5 minutes.
                                                                     Mr. WIED. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                     And thank you to all the witnesses that are testifying here today.
                                                                     For far too long, our education system has prioritized 4-year col-
                                                                  leges and has treated CTE education as an afterthought. Despite
                                                                  our nation’s clear need for skilled tradesmen and a high demand
                                                                  from students, we have continued to see a lack of resources allo-
                                                                  cated to these programs.
                                                                     CTE programs offer a less expensive alternative to a 4-year de-
                                                                  gree, and students often graduate in as little as 18 months, pre-
                                                                  pared for good-paying, in-demand careers.
                                                                     In northeastern Wisconsin, many high schools and technical col-
                                                                  leges partner with local small businesses to ensure students can




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                                                                  begin an apprenticeship immediately after graduation. This not
                                                                  only provides students with paid hands-on experience but also
                                                                  helps small businesses connect with eager, hardworking students.
                                                                    I am encouraged by the work of our witnesses here and all that
                                                                  you have done to bring technical education back into the high
                                                                  school curriculum. The demand from schools in my district for CTE
                                                                  education underscores the pressing need for these programs.
                                                                    Like all of you, I feel very strongly about this issue, and I remain
                                                                  committed to supporting CTE in schools in northeastern Wisconsin
                                                                  and, of course, across our nation.
                                                                    Dr. Gunuskey, from the great school district of Wallenpaupack,
                                                                  obviously you are doing a great job. And what I am impressed with
                                                                  is—and you had mentioned—the community support. And that is
                                                                  key to building, you know, the vocational education, of course, in
                                                                  your district. And you also have great small-business support in
                                                                  your area.
                                                                    What advice would you give to other school districts, maybe some
                                                                  best practices of things that have gone very well, in order to build
                                                                  the culture that you have? We have questions. A lot of districts in
                                                                  our area want to improve. And so what would you offer to them?
                                                                    Mr. GUNUSKEY. First and foremost, seeing is believing. Invite
                                                                  them in. Invite them in to see the programs, to meet with the stu-
                                                                  dents, to participate in OACs, to contribute.
                                                                    Many times, we will have organizations and industry partners
                                                                  come in, and they didn’t necessarily see how they fit into the over-
                                                                  all picture of the curriculum, how they can support the CTE. And
                                                                  so, by bringing them in, it does not take them very long to realize
                                                                  that they are very integral in part. So I would say, seeing is believ-
                                                                  ing is absolutely critical.
                                                                    In our school, we don’t have—we have a pre-apprenticeship pro-
                                                                  gram but not a full apprenticeship program, because, again, we are
                                                                  not a CTC. But we do have students in the healthcare field that
                                                                  are actually working in the hospital for half a day, going out to—
                                                                  rehabilitation aide, PT, OT, PTAs—for half a day, getting that
                                                                  hands-on experience.
                                                                    Mr. WIED. We have a lot of great districts that do very well in
                                                                  vocation. Luxemburg-Casco, for one, has built, over a long time,
                                                                  great community support, great support with local businesses.
                                                                    Mr. Gibson, what would you say, maybe some of the things
                                                                  that—some big wins that you have seen in partnering with local
                                                                  school districts? What would you say to contractors and businesses?
                                                                  What can we do better?
                                                                    Mr. GIBSON. Well, Build Up Kansas has—its success has come
                                                                  down—and the doctor talked about advisory councils, industry ad-
                                                                  visory councils. I would go one step farther. One of the things that
                                                                  has been successful is not only bringing industry in to share what
                                                                  type of professions they are looking for, but we bring in recent
                                                                  graduates of that high school CTE program, because they can re-
                                                                  late to that younger generation better than the contractor. And
                                                                  that has really turned a lot of heads.
                                                                    In fact, I mentioned about social media. If you go to Build Up
                                                                  Kansas—BuildUpKS.com, you will see testimonies of a lot of stu-
                                                                  dents that have graduated out of the high school CTE programs.




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                                                                    Matter of fact, I mentioned Panasonic. One of our community col-
                                                                  leges up in Topeka, Washburn Technology, graduated 300 electrical
                                                                  technicians. All of them received contracts to go to work for
                                                                  Panasonic.
                                                                    So get the industry and recent students that have graduated
                                                                  from their local schools to tell the story, and I can tell you, you will
                                                                  get a lot of heads turning to CTE programming.
                                                                    Mr. WIED. That is fantastic.
                                                                    Clearly, technical colleges we are talking about. But apprentice-
                                                                  ships—Mr. Boren, what are—that you have seen—what are some
                                                                  best practices in building this community engagement and, you
                                                                  know, the relationships with school districts that you have done,
                                                                  that others could use around the country?
                                                                    Mr. BOREN. Yeah. And I just congratulate Wisconsin on being
                                                                  the oldest and one of the most robust apprenticeship States——
                                                                    Mr. WIED. Uh-huh.
                                                                    Mr. BOREN.—who has done a great job with youth apprentice-
                                                                  ship.
                                                                    But I also look to Iowa, who has created high schools as spon-
                                                                  sors, working as sponsors of apprenticeship programs, working
                                                                  across different industries, from being a butcher to being a cyberse-
                                                                  curity analyst. You can do it, if you create the program at the high
                                                                  school level.
                                                                    Mr. WIED. Great.
                                                                    Thank you all.
                                                                    I yield back.
                                                                    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                    I now recognize Mr. Jack from the great State of Georgia for 5
                                                                  minutes.
                                                                    Mr. JACK. Well, thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
                                                                    And I want to thank our witnesses for testifying today.
                                                                    I would be remiss if I didn’t open my remarks walking you all
                                                                  through something that was very special to my district.
                                                                    Just last month, I brought our Secretary of Education, Linda
                                                                  McMahon, to my district. And, just for reference, I represent a part
                                                                  of Georgia that is just southwest of Atlanta, includes Coweta Coun-
                                                                  ty. And, very specifically, within it, we have got a Central Edu-
                                                                  cational Center. And this is—this provided, frankly, for the State
                                                                  a blueprint for success for how high schools can better prepare our
                                                                  students to be well-equipped for the ever-evolving workforce in to-
                                                                  day’s technological age.
                                                                    And I say that because—we brought the Secretary of Education.
                                                                  We have had, you know, a lot of important people come but never
                                                                  a Cabinet Member. I was proud to bring her. And what they did
                                                                  is—effectively, this community, Newnan, Georgia, about 30, 40
                                                                  years ago, they said, we have high school students that are grad-
                                                                  uating that are not prepared for the workforce that we have now
                                                                  recruited to come into our communities, so we have to partner with
                                                                  our school and provide an opportunity for students to leave the
                                                                  school place during the day for a small period of time, go learn
                                                                  some technical skills, and then come back and participate just as
                                                                  they normally would.
                                                                    This blueprint was so successful—Central Educational Center, I
                                                                  encourage anybody to look at it—that the State of Georgia has now




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                                                                  replicated it in over 60 counties. They literally copy-paste-replace
                                                                  in different cities and counties around the State. So I am very
                                                                  proud of that.
                                                                     And, in that vein, if I could, I just want to start with Mr.
                                                                  Gunuskey.
                                                                     So, as you think—and we have talked about this today. As we
                                                                  think about this global economy that we have today, new tech-
                                                                  nologies constantly evolving, how can schools better integrate these
                                                                  kinds of tools and training into career and technical education?
                                                                  How does that help support small businesses that rely on a skilled,
                                                                  adaptable workforce?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Effective communication—communication with
                                                                  the small businesses, communication with your county and commu-
                                                                  nity.
                                                                     And I applaud what you have done in Georgia. And the work
                                                                  that they have done certainly is a great example of that commu-
                                                                  nication—groups coming together, having effective communication,
                                                                  finding out what needs to be done, what workforce needs to be met,
                                                                  and how the schools can implement those strategies to supplement
                                                                  the workforce locally.
                                                                     Mr. JACK. And what would you say the biggest barriers are for
                                                                  schools that want to adopt and maintain these types of projects?
                                                                  How can federal policy help break down some of those barriers to
                                                                  help more students get to enjoy this?
                                                                     Mr. GUNUSKEY. Yeah. I know we talked about funding, be-
                                                                  cause funding is the—is probably the biggest hurdle.
                                                                     I think in rural Pennsylvania another issue that we are facing—
                                                                  and I know my colleague mentioned this before—is also the staff-
                                                                  ing, the CTE teacher shortage that we are experiencing. It is very
                                                                  difficult.
                                                                     A starting teacher at Wallenpaupack is right around $60,000. So,
                                                                  when you take somebody out of industry who is making signifi-
                                                                  cantly more than that, invite them in and say, ‘‘Here, now you can
                                                                  teach 12 to 15 kids, and you have to go back to college to get cer-
                                                                  tification,’’ it is not very enticing.
                                                                     And so it is something that we are continually trying to work on.
                                                                  And so, if there was any type of, you know, work that we could do
                                                                  with potential industry teachers to come back and help, you know,
                                                                  be teachers in the classroom, it would be significant.
                                                                     Mr. JACK. Well, thank you very much.
                                                                     If I can next move to Mr. Gibson.
                                                                     I would also be remiss if I didn’t note my colleague to my right,
                                                                  Congressman Schmidt. We were just talking about you. I was with
                                                                  Marty Jackley, the attorney general for South Dakota, who said
                                                                  you were one of the best attorneys general he’s served with. So you
                                                                  are well-represented in Kansas, and I want to——
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Absolutely.
                                                                     Mr. JACK.—make that clear for the record.
                                                                     But, as I mentioned, in my district, the Central Educational Cen-
                                                                  ter, of which I am very proud, was created because the community
                                                                  recognized that students needed to access training to compete in
                                                                  this changing economy.
                                                                     And I am curious, from your perspective, how, too, do you see—
                                                                  especially within the workforce that you have to recruit, you know,




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                                                                  what type of educational opportunities would you like to see better
                                                                  provided for students coming out of some of these technical schools?
                                                                     And, frankly, I also have to ask—you know, we are seeing a more
                                                                  autonomous workforce. I see it across factories I visit all the time.
                                                                  And, obviously, you are more focused on general contracting. But
                                                                  I am curious, how do we prepare ourselves for this autonomous
                                                                  workforce that is coming?
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON. Well, first, I want to build on the question. In-
                                                                  structors are critical. We are losing instructors as fast as we are
                                                                  losing the older generation.
                                                                     And, through our HR platform, we are giving the schools the
                                                                  ability to post their jobs. We have actually had experience of bring-
                                                                  ing back recently retired tradesmen to come back and teach at a
                                                                  local school. We actually got the State to change the legislation to
                                                                  where they didn’t have to have a Ph.D. or a master’s to teach——
                                                                     Mr. JACK. Huh.
                                                                     Mr. GIBSON.—if it was regarding technical training.
                                                                     But the key in getting everything to a point where CTE becomes
                                                                  important is training.
                                                                     We use the NCCER curriculum because it was developed by the
                                                                  construction industry with education in mind. It has a credential
                                                                  that goes along with it. The contractors—and I represent general
                                                                  contractors, subs, and suppliers—they are migrating to it because
                                                                  there is a proven curriculum that the schools are embracing.
                                                                     And that credential that comes along with it is like a high school
                                                                  diploma, to where they can demonstrate—like, for example, the
                                                                  core has blueprint reading, OSHA 10-hour safety, hand tools,
                                                                  power tools. All of that accumulates like a high school degree, to
                                                                  where that applicant can show that contractor what skills they
                                                                  have to go to work immediately in the industry.
                                                                     Mr. JACK. Thank you, Mr. Gibson.
                                                                     Mr. Chairman, I yield.
                                                                     Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
                                                                     And I want to thank our witnesses today for your testimony.
                                                                     And I want you to go home and—I always get asked, can’t you
                                                                  reach across the aisle with these guys and gals? I think you have
                                                                  seen we can do that. A pretty good hearing today. We were just re-
                                                                  marking, there wasn’t—I mean, we all agree on everything. So this
                                                                  is great. We will get something done. And that is not true every-
                                                                  where, but here, we all agree on everything right now.
                                                                     But, anyway, without objection, Members have 5 legislative days
                                                                  to submit additional materials and written questions for the wit-
                                                                  nesses to the Chair, which will be forwarded to the witnesses.
                                                                     I ask the witnesses to please respond promptly if that happens.
                                                                     If there is no further business, without objection, the Committee
                                                                  is adjourned.
                                                                     [Whereupon, at 11:52 a.m., the Committee was adjourned.]




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                                                                                                           APPENDIX




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                                                                                                                      79




                                                                                                                      Æ




SBR125-LTP with DISTILLER                                                                                                                                       Insert offset folio 79 here 63057.040


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