Exhibit 2: Deposition of Santiago Gill (Dkt. 568-2, S.D. Fla.)
Summary
Exhibit 2 (Document 568-2) in Case 1:21-md-02989-CMA, entered on the FLSD docket June 8, 2023, is a 196-page transcript, marked confidential, of the videotape deposition via Zoom of Santiago Gill Bohorquez, taken on Friday, April 28, 2023 before Silvia P. Wage of Veritext Legal Solutions. Phillip Kim of The Rosen Law Firm appears for Plaintiffs and Megan Vincent of Cravath Swaine & Moore LLP for Defendants, and Mr. Cohen conducts the examination. The exhibits include Mr. Gill's curriculum vitae, account statements from Grupo Bancolumbia Capital and TD Ameritrade, certifications dated 11/29/21 and 4/17/23, Twitter threads and an Ameritrade announcement entitled Security Impacts Related to Market Conditions.
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Cite this document
“Exhibit 2: Deposition of Santiago Gill (Dkt. 568-2).”
Original at archive.org. Archived at Pandemic Darlings, https://pandemicdarlings.com/source-documents/2023-06-08-covid-era-misc-154f7b27-1/
, SHA-256 154f7b27c6812dd803db766cd46992946cdad4ce94d0022cb2d4aa01059cfe98.Full text
Case 1:21-md-02989-CMA Document 568-2 Entered on FLSD Docket 06/08/2023 Page 1 of
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Exhibit 2
Case 1:21-md-02989-CMA Document 568-2 Entered on FLSD Docket 06/08/2023 Page 2 of
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1
2 IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
FOR THE SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA
3 CASE NO. 1:21-MD-2989-CMA
4 IN RE: :
:
5 JANUARY 2021 SHORT :
SQUEEZE TRADING :
6 LITIGATION :
:
7 ------------------------ :
8
9 ** CONFIDENTIAL **
10 VIDEOTAPE DEPOSITION VIA ZOOM OF:
11 SANTIAGO GILL BOHORQUEZ
12 FRIDAY, APRIL 28, 2023
13
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24 REPORTED BY:
25 SILVIA P. WAGE, CCR, CRR, RPR
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Page 2
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2 April 28, 2023
3 3:08 p.m. Serbian
4
5 Videotape deposition via Zoom of
6 SANTIAGO GILL BOHORQUEZ, pursuant to agreement
7 before SILVIA P. WAGE, a Certified Shorthand
8 Reporter, Certified Realtime Reporter, Registered
9 Professional Reporter, and Notary Public for the
10 States of New Jersey, New York and Pennsylvania.
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2 A P P E A R A N C E S:
3
THE ROSEN LAW FIRM
4 Attorneys for Plaintiffs
275 Madison Avenue, 40th Floor
5 New York, New York 10016
(212) 686-1060
6 PKim@rosenlegal.com
BY: PHILLIP KIM, ESQ.
7
8 CRAVATH SWAINE & MOORE LLP
Attorneys for Defendants
9 825 Eighth Avenue
New York, New York 10019
10 (212) 474-1000
SCohen@cravath.com
11 MVincent@cravath.com
BY: SCOTT COHEN, ESQ.
12 BY: MEGAN VINCENT, ESQ.
13
14 A L S O P R E S E N T:
15
MARK FRIEDMAN
16 VIDEOGRAPHER
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2 I N D E X
3 WITNESS: SANTIAGO GILL BOHOROQUEZ PAGE
4 EXAMINATION BY MR. COHEN 9
5
E X H I B I T S
6
NO. DESCRIPTION PAGE
7 Exhibit 268 copy of Mr. Gill's curriculum 19
vitae
8 Exhibit 269 copy of Mr. Gill's December 45
2020 account statement for
9 CredicorpCapital P00002761 to
P00002763 marked Confidential
10 Exhibit 270 copy of Mr. Gill's December 50
2020 account statement for
11 Grupo Bancolumbia Capital
P00002776 to P00002780 marked
12 Confidential
Exhibit 271 copy of Mr. Gill's December 84
13 2020 account statement for TD
Ameritrade P00002114 to
14 P00002119 marked Confidential
Exhibit 272 Exhibit A Mr. Gill's 95
15 Certification dated 11/29/21
and attachment
16 Exhibit 273 Exhibit A Mr. Gill's 97
Certification dated 4/17/23
17 and attachment
Exhibit 274 copy of Mr. Gill's January 104
18 2021 account statement for TD
Ameritrade P00002120 to
19 P00002127 marked Confidential
Exhibit 275 Twitter thread P00001326 & 117
20 P00001327 marked Confidential
Exhibit 276 different Twitter threads 136
21 with no Bates
Exhibit 277 Ameritrade announcement 144
22 entitled, "Security Impacts
Related to Market
23 Conditions,"
Exhibit 278 copy of Mr. Gill's February 160
24 2021 account statement for
Ameritrade P00002128 to
25 P00002135 marked Confidential
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2 E X H I B I T S
3 NO. DESCRIPTION PAGE
4 Exhibit 279 copy of Mr. Gill's March 2021 167
account statement for
5 Ameritrade P00002136 to
P00002142 marked Confidential
6 Exhibit 280 history of playlist of 193
YouTube videos produced by
7 Mr. Gill
8
PREVIOUSLY MARKED EXHIBITS
9
NO. DESCRIPTION PAGE
10
Exhibit 2 2/27/23 letter from The Rosen 27
11 Law Firm to the Cravath Law
Firm and attachment
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2 - - -
3 DEPOSITION SUPPORT INDEX
4 - - -
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6 Direction to Witness Not to Answer
Page Line
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99 23
8 103 11
122 18
9
10 Request for Production of Documents
Page Line
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13 Stipulations
Page Line
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16 Question Marked
Page Line
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19 Reservation
Page Line
20
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22 Motion to Strike
Page Line
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1 CONFIDENTIAL - SANTIAGO GILL BOHORQUEZ
2 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Good morning. We
3 are going on the record at 3:08 p.m. local Serbia
4 time on Friday, April 28, 2023.
5 Please note that this deposition
6 success conducted virtually. Quality of the
7 camera -- quality of the recording depends on the
8 quality of the camera and Internet connections of
9 all participants.
10 What is heard from the witness and
11 seen on the screen is what will be recorded.
12 Audio and video recording will
13 continue to take place, unless all parties agree
14 to go off the record.
15 This is Media Unit 1 of the video
16 recorded deposition of Santiago Gill in the
17 matter of January 2021 Short Squeeze Trading
18 Litigation.
19 This case is filed in the United
20 States District Court, Southern District of
21 Florida, Case No. 1:21-MD-2989-CMA.
22 My name is Marc Friedman. I'm the
23 your Certified Video Legal Specialist. Your
24 Court Reporter is Silvia Wage. And we are both
25 from the firm of Veritext Legal Solutions.
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2 I am not related to any parties in
3 this action, nor financially interested in the
4 outcome. If there are any objections to these
5 proceedings, please state them at the time of
6 your appearance.
7 Counsel will now state their
8 appearances and affiliations for the record
9 beginning with the noticing attorney.
10 MR. COHEN: Scott Cohen from Cravath
11 Swaine & Moore on behalf of the Defendants. And
12 I'm joined here by Megan Vincent also of Cravath.
13 MR. KIM: This is Phillip Kim, Rosen
14 Law Firm, Counsel for Mr. Gill and other
15 Plaintiffs.
16 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Would the Court
17 Reporter please swear in our witness and we can
18 proceed.
19 THE STENOGRAPHER: Mr. Gill, if you
20 can please raise your right hand.
21 SANTIAGO GILL BOHOROQUEZ,
22 after having
23 been duly sworn, was examined and testified
24 as follows:
25 THE STENOGRAPHER: Thank you.
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1 CONFIDENTIAL - SANTIAGO GILL BOHORQUEZ
2 You may proceed.
3 EXAMINATION BY MR. COHEN:
4 Q. Good morning, sir.
5 A. Good morning.
6 Q. My name is Scott Cohen. I'm an
7 attorney from Cravath Swaine & Moore and we
8 represent the Defendants in this case.
9 Could you please state your full name
10 for the record?
11 A. Santiago Gill Bohorquez.
12 Q. Okay. And just a few minutes before
13 you said that you preferred to be called Mr. Gill
14 or Gill is your preferred last name?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. And what is your current address, Mr.
17 Gill?
18 A.
19
20
21 Q. And you speak English fluently?
22 A. Yes, I do.
23 Q. Have you ever been deposed before?
24 A. No, I haven't.
25 Q. Okay. In that case, I'm just going
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2 to go over a few preliminary matters before we
3 get to things.
4 A. Correct.
5 Q. Do you understand you've been sworn
6 in and the testimony that you are giving today is
7 given under oath?
8 A. Yes, for sure.
9 Q. Is there any reason you cannot give
10 complete truthful testimony today?
11 A. No, not at all.
12 Q. Do you have any condition that would
13 prevent you from having an accurate recollection
14 or from giving true and complete testimony today?
15 A. No, not at all.
16 I have a thing in my lung, so I might
17 cough during the deposition, but it's like
18 normal; just in case.
19 Q. Okay. Do you have any memory
20 problems?
21 A. No.
22 Q. The Court Reporter is taking down
23 everything we say. So it's important that you
24 provide verbal responses to any questions you're
25 asked.
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2 Do you understand?
3 A. Yeah, for sure.
4 Q. So say yes or no rather than nodding
5 or shaking your head.
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. Also, during the course of the
8 deposition, your Counsel might object to the form
9 of a question that I ask. That objection is just
10 for the record and you should proceed to answer
11 the question, if you can. Unless your Counsel
12 instructs you, specifically, not to answer the
13 question on the basis of privilege.
14 Do you understand?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. And if you don't understand the
17 question I ask, please just let me know and I'll
18 rephrase or clarify so that you can understand
19 it.
20 Does that make sense?
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. And if you don't hear a question
23 fully, same thing, ask me to repeat myself and I
24 will be happy to do so.
25 A. Perfect.
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2 Q. Also, if you would please allow me to
3 finish the questions I ask before you start
4 answering. I'll be sure to let you finish your
5 answer before I ask the next question and that's
6 just so that the record remains clear.
7 Does that make sense?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. And if you need to take a break at
10 anytime, just let me know and we'll try to make
11 that happen. And I only ask that you don't ask
12 to take a break while there is a question still
13 pending.
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. So you said you're in Serbia right
16 now?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. But you're from Columbia, right?
19 A. I am from Columbia, yes.
20 Q. Have you ever been to the United
21 States?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. When?
24 A. I've been many times. I've been --
25 since I was a little kid, I've been going, at
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2 least, twice a year.
3 Q. Where do you usually come?
4 A. To Miami, actually, most of the time.
5 Q. To visit family?
6 A. Just to sometimes to see family,
7 sometimes to see friends, sometimes just visiting
8 around, sometimes business.
9 Q. When you made your stock trades, are
10 you usually in Columbia?
11 A. Yes, most of the time.
12 Q. Is there anybody else in the room
13 with you, by the way?
14 A. No.
15 Q. And are you in a hotel room?
16 A. I'm in an apartment I rented.
17 Q. And are you communicating with
18 Counsel electronically in any way right now?
19 A. No.
20 Q. Did you take any steps to prepare for
21 your deposition today?
22 A. Can you repeat that question?
23 Q. Did you take any steps to prepare for
24 your deposition?
25 A. Yes, sure.
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2 Q. What did you do?
3 A. I had a meeting with my lawyers two
4 times in the week. I saw some documents, yeah,
5 the ones in the case and, basically, that's it.
6 Q. So who did you meet with?
7 A. I was meeting with Phil and another
8 two guys from the firm.
9 Q. And you said you met twice earlier
10 this week?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. Do you remember which days?
13 A. Yesterday and the day before.
14 Q. So Wednesday and Thursday?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. And about how long were those
17 meetings?
18 A. Like two hours, an hour, two hours,
19 more or less.
20 Q. So was anybody else in the meeting
21 with you besides yourself and Counsel?
22 A. No, you know, just us.
23 Q. And you said that you reviewed
24 documents, right?
25 A. Uh-huh.
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2 Q. And that was to just make sure that
3 your memory was correct about the events relevant
4 to this case?
5 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
6 A. Yeah, I saw the documents on the
7 case, yeah, just to see the general things about
8 the case.
9 Q. And did that jog your memory about
10 the events of this case?
11 A. Yeah, it helped.
12 Q. Okay. Do you know which specific
13 documents those were?
14 A. Mostly the complaint. Yeah, we saw
15 the other documents but mostly the complaint.
16 The Certification we saw as well.
17 Q. Okay. And that's the Certification
18 that was served that shows the trades you made
19 during the stock period?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. Did you speak with anybody else at
22 anytime in preparing for this deposition?
23 A. No, not at all.
24 Q. Did you take any other preparatory
25 steps for this deposition?
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2 A. The other matters are attorney
3 privilege with The Rosen Law Firm.
4 Q. Yeah, to be clear, I'm not asking you
5 what you discussed with your attorneys.
6 I'm asking, for instance, did you
7 read any deposition transcripts from previous
8 depositions?
9 A. No.
10 Q. Did you speak with other named
11 Plaintiffs about their depositions?
12 A. No.
13 Q. Have you discussed this lawsuit at
14 all with anybody else other than your lawyers?
15 A. No.
16 Q. You said you've never been deposed
17 before; is that in any proceeding or just in an
18 American proceeding?
19 A. No, not at all. Not in Columbia, not
20 in the US.
21 Q. Have you ever been involved in a
22 legal proceeding in any way?
23 A. Not that I recall.
24 Q. So, for example, were you ever a
25 plaintiff suing somebody else?
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2 A. No, not that I recall.
3 Q. Have you ever been sued?
4 A. Not that I recall.
5 Q. Have you ever acted as a witness in a
6 case that you weren't either suing someone or
7 being sued?
8 A. No, not that I recall.
9 Q. So it stands to reason that you've
10 never been a class representative before,
11 correct?
12 A. That's correct.
13 Q. And could you please just tell me
14 about your background and education please?
15 A. Sure. I work with IT. I have
16 studies in IT in Columbia. I did a Bachelor's
17 and the Master's for IT. And I did Master's as
18 well in innovation, yeah. And I have around
19 17 years of experience in IT.
20 Q. Okay. And where did you receive
21 those degrees?
22 A. The three main ones in Columbia and
23 the second Master in Spain, in Barcelona.
24 Q. Okay. So, in Columbia, it was at Los
25 Andes University?
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2 A. Yes.
3 Q. And your main educational background
4 is in something called a systems engineer?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. And is that the same thing as IT?
7 A. Yes. Yes, that's how it is called in
8 Columbia, in that university, specifically.
9 Q. So what is it that a systems engineer
10 does?
11 A. Basically, we design IT systems,
12 yeah, in all the phases that it has and all the
13 kind of different systems that there exists.
14 Q. And so you first received your
15 Bachelor's in 2005?
16 A. Uh-huh, yes.
17 Q. And then you received your Master's
18 in systems engineering in 2009?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. And your Master's in innovation
21 strategy and entrepreneurship in Barcelona, as
22 you were saying, in 2014?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. And what was that Master's?
25 A. Hum? What was the question?
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2 Q. I'm sorry, yes.
3 What was that Master's degree?
4 A. It is about techniques for innovation
5 and entrepreneurship. It included a project on
6 entrepreneurship.
7 MR. COHEN: Okay. Let's mark Tab 4.
8 Q. Are you set up with Exhibit Share?
9 A. Can you repeat the question? What is
10 that?
11 MR. KIM: Yeah, he's -- Santiago,
12 you've got that Exhibit Share link, right, where
13 they're going to show you documents?
14 THE WITNESS: Yes, I have it.
15 MR. KIM: They just put something in
16 the -- in your folder, an exhibit called 268.
17 Is that right, Scott?
18 THE WITNESS: Yes, I'm seeing it.
19 (Deposition Exhibit 268, copy of Mr.
20 Gill's curriculum vitae, was marked for
21 identification.)
22 Q. Okay. And what is this document?
23 A. I'll take a look.
24 That is my CV. Well, a version of my
25 CV, of course.
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2 Q. Is this the most updated version of
3 your CV?
4 A. Let me take a look.
5 It's very close to that. I have made
6 some minor adjustments but, yes.
7 Q. Okay. Could you tell me what has
8 changed from your previous --
9 A. I think things with the details of
10 the deduction and the way it's written.
11 THE STENOGRAPHER: Can you say that
12 again I'm sorry.
13 A. Details some changes regarding how it
14 is written, some things that are in the CV.
15 Q. So they're non-substantive?
16 A. Non-substantive, yeah.
17 Q. And other than those few minor
18 changes, this fairly and accurately represents
19 your education and work experience?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. Okay. Do you have any education in
22 finance or economics?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. And what is that?
25 A. I -- I started finance, everything
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2 related to finance in 2020 and I have made three
3 courses on finances and I operate the markets
4 since 2020, around three years, two years and a
5 half.
6 Q. And when in 2020 was that that you
7 started this company [sic]?
8 A. In April.
9 Q. April 2020.
10 And what do you do when you say you
11 "operate the markets"?
12 A. Okay. I invest in the markets. I
13 invest in both the Columbian market, the
14 Columbian Stock Exchange and the US Stock
15 Exchange.
16 Q. Okay. Do you know what "market
17 efficiency" means?
18 A. I have an idea, yes, of the term.
19 Q. What is your understanding of that
20 term?
21 A. It's that the market, like, it puts
22 on the price what is happening on the reality.
23 That's like a rough idea I have.
24 Q. And by "reality," do you mean
25 information --
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2 A. Yes.
3 Q. -- about a company?
4 A. Information regarding the macro
5 economics, the companies and et cetera.
6 Q. And what do you mean by "et cetera"?
7 A. Well, there are many things, like,
8 that impact the market, like all the --
9 macroeconomics drops in the market, all the
10 indicators, other indicators, yeah, other
11 equities that are being negotiated and the things
12 happening in the reality, yes.
13 Q. And you said since April 2020, when
14 you started this company [sic], you educate
15 people on --
16 A. No, I don't educate. I just took
17 some courses. But I'm not a trainer.
18 Q. Where did you take those courses?
19 A. One of them, the first one was in a
20 school -- yeah, a firm in Columbia called Arena
21 Alpha, which is an education institution in
22 Columbia. I took another course in the Columbian
23 Stock Exchange. They offered courses, yeah. I
24 took other course in Udemy, yeah, about the US
25 stock market. And that's, basically, it.
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2 Q. And this document also notes that
3 from July 2020 to the present you have been
4 employed by SuperNat Retail in Bogota.
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. Is that still correct?
7 THE STENOGRAPHER: I think he froze.
8 A. Can you repeat the question please?
9 Q. Do you still work for SuperNat
10 retail?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. And your job title is Analytics
13 Architect and Financial Operations?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. And what do you do for that?
16 A. So, basically -- well, it's a company
17 retailer. We sell natural products and I -- my
18 responsibility is to design the information
19 system so that we have accurate information about
20 the financials of the company. And then I
21 operate and standardize the process to operate
22 everything related to the financials of the
23 company.
24 Q. If you look at the second page of
25 your résumé, would you say that the description
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2 of your role at SuperNat Retail is correct?
3 A. It is correct, yeah. I will note
4 that this is CV oriented for IT position. So all
5 the description there, under the descriptions
6 there, are focused on the things related to IT
7 mostly.
8 Q. And so you do things unrelated to IT,
9 but that's not on this résumé?
10 A. Let me see again the résumé.
11 I do some other things for them
12 besides what it is written. It is focused -- the
13 résumé is focused on the IT things.
14 Q. Do you do anything financed based for
15 them?
16 A. Yes. We -- it's -- I go, like,
17 supervise the financial operations of the
18 company, yeah, like the day-to-day activities.
19 Q. Such as the accounting activity?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. And what does that entail?
22 A. So we have a group of people, yeah,
23 that run the company. And, specifically, my team
24 is -- includes the accounting team, yeah. So,
25 basically, we -- I with the team supervise the
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2 activities are done accordingly to standards.
3 Q. Do you do any investing on behalf of
4 this company?
5 A. No.
6 Q. Okay. And before you were at
7 SuperNat Retail, you were a digital architecture
8 manager at T&AS?
9 A. Yes, that was the name of the unit.
10 It was in -- you can see it up, the name of the
11 company is Everis, which it was -- it is part of
12 Entity Data.
13 Q. And is the description below that an
14 accurate description of your role there?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. And prior to that in 2016 through
17 2019, you were employed as a CTO Architect and
18 co-founder of Wide Sports?
19 A. Yes, that is correct.
20 Q. What did you do at Wide Sports?
21 A. I was, basically, leading the company
22 technically from the IT point of view and I was
23 the co-founder for that. So I with the team, we
24 designed the architecture for that platform and
25 developed and put it to operation.
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2 Q. And why did you start this business?
3 A. Well, basically, because I saw an
4 opportunity on that. That business is now
5 stopped. I actually -- I stopped it because of
6 the pandemics; so no events.
7 Q. You stopped this in 2019?
8 A. No, in 2020, when the pandemic start.
9 Q. Okay. Who are your other
10 co-founders?
11 A. A friend in Columbia.
12 Q. And your résumé says that your hobby
13 include being an independent investor?
14 A. Yes, I am.
15 Q. What do you mean by that?
16 A. That I invest in the markets, yeah,
17 and follow the markets, yes.
18 Q. And it's a hobby, so you enjoy doing
19 that?
20 A. I enjoy doing that, yes.
21 Q. How did you first learn about
22 investing?
23 A. I first learned from some courses I
24 took in Columbia and the courses I told you
25 before.
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2 Q. With the Arena Alpha?
3 A. Arena Alpha, yes, and the Stock
4 Market Exchange in Columbia and another course in
5 Udemy.
6 Q. I want to show you what's been
7 previously marked in this case as Exhibit 2.
8 (Deposition Exhibit 2, 2/27/23 letter
9 from The Rosen Law Firm to the Cravath Law Firm
10 and attachment, was previously marked for
11 identification.)
12 MR. KIM: Is it in there yet? I
13 don't see it.
14 THE WITNESS: I don't see it either.
15 MR. KIM: Oh, there we go.
16 Q. Do you have that up, sir?
17 A. Let me review it please.
18 I don't have that document, but it
19 has some information that I send to the -- to my
20 lawyers, yeah, about my, yeah, social media
21 accounts.
22 Q. But you've never seen this document
23 before?
24 A. I don't recall.
25 Q. Did your Counsel ever reach out to
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2 you to ask you which social media platforms you
3 were on?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. And so, if you would turn to your
6 name, do you see on Page 2?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. Are these the only social media
9 accounts you have now?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. And it looks like it also goes on to
12 Page 3.
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. Are these the only social media
15 accounts you've ever had?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. So your YouTube account is
18 ?
19 A. Yeah, the thing is that ID is
20 automatically generated. So I don't know it by
21 hard. The YouTube account is associated with the
22 -- with my e-mail, the e-mail you have been using
23 to reaching me out.
24 Q. And what e-mail is that?
25 A. It's
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2 Q. Okay. So is your YouTube account
3 private, as far as you know?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. And how frequently do you use it?
6 A. Everyday.
7 Q. And have you been using it everyday
8 since, at least, December 2020?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. And what do you use it for?
11 A. I use it to watch videos -- videos.
12 Q. About in particular?
13 A. Well, about everything, basically,
14 about sports, about hobbies, about investments.
15 Yeah, that's it.
16 Q. Do you ever delete anything off of
17 YouTube?
18 A. Not that I recall. I usually don't
19 do it.
20 Q. And going to the next one, is this
21 your Twitter handle?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q.
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. And is that your only Twitter
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2 account?
3 A. Yes.
4 Q. About how frequently do you use it?
5 A. I basically -- I would say everyday
6 or every two days, I watch Twitter.
7 Q. And for about how long?
8 A. It's difficult to say; about an hour.
9 I see, basically, news on that.
10 Q. And had you been engaging on Twitter
11 everyday or twice a day since around
12 December 2020?
13 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
14 A. I mainly watch Twitter. I don't post
15 that much, yeah. So but, yeah, I use it for
16 reading.
17 Q. And you used it for reading going
18 back to, at least, December 2020?
19 A. Mostly for reading. I post from time
20 to time but not much.
21 Q. When you post, would you say it's for
22 something more important?
23 A. No. I don't post because I don't
24 have the time and I don't use it for any specific
25 purpose. But sometimes I like to comment.
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2 That's it. But not views in particular, no
3 objective in particular.
4 Q. Alright. The next one down is your
5 Facebook account, right?
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. And this is the accurate --
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. -- address?
10 How often do you use Facebook?
11 A. I would say, yeah, everyday, every
12 two days depending on the things I need.
13 Q. And that account is private too,
14 correct?
15 A. Yes, it's private.
16 Q. Do you ever delete posts off your
17 Facebook account?
18 A. Not that I recall, no.
19 Q. Did you ever delete any -- sorry.
20 A. Maybe, but not that I recall.
21 Nothing that I recall, to be honest.
22 Q. Do you ever delete anything off your
23 Twitter?
24 A. Not that I recall. I don't post much
25 and I don't -- well, I don't delete as well
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2 either.
3 Q. Do you ever post on Twitter or
4 Facebook about investing?
5 A. Not much. Sometimes I comment. Some
6 people post things about investing, but, yeah,
7 not much, yeah. I don't have the time to do it.
8 Q. When you do your reading on Twitter,
9 do you look at investment information ever?
10 A. Yeah, sometimes I look for investment
11 like a status of the market, mostly information
12 and news. But that's, like, the main idea of it,
13 besides news on the -- mostly in Columbia.
14 Q. And this last account is your
15 Instagram, right?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. And that's your handle is
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. How often do you use that?
20 A. More or less the same frequency as
21 the other; everyday or every two days.
22 Q. And that was the same in
23 December 2020 as it is now?
24 A. I think, yes, as I recall.
25 Q. Do you ever delete posts off of that?
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2 A. No. And I don't post much at all,
3 maybe a couple but nothing, nothing much.
4 Q. And you said you never had any social
5 media accounts other than these, correct?
6 A. Not that are active, as I recall.
7 Q. What about accounts that are no
8 longer active but that you had before?
9 A. Hmm. I have to -- I don't recall.
10 For example, I had something like on Messenger,
11 but that's inactive; long time ago. But I don't
12 recall.
13 Q. That's Facebook Messenger?
14 A. No, that's the Microsoft Messenger.
15 Q. Did you ever have a Reddit account?
16 A. No.
17 Q. No TikTok account?
18 A. No.
19 Q. Or Twitch?
20 A. (No response.)
21 Q. Okay.
22 THE STENOGRAPHER: I'm sorry, your
23 answer? I didn't hear an answer.
24 A. Sorry; no.
25 Q. We noted before that your résumé said
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2 that one of your hobbies was as an independent
3 investor, correct?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. And, generally speaking, how would
6 you describe your level of experience in
7 investing?
8 A. From one to ten, I would say six.
9 Q. When did you first start investing in
10 the stock market?
11 A. In April 2020.
12 Q. And how did you first start
13 investing?
14 A. I started and I took some courses,
15 some institutions in Columbia with the Arena
16 Alpha. That's one of the courses I took. The
17 stock market exchange, I took another course
18 there and another one in Udemy.
19 Q. And did you sign up with a brokerage
20 at that time?
21 A. Yes. The first brokers I started
22 using were in Columbia, in Columbia in the stock
23 market in Columbia, which were Valores
24 Bancolumbia and CredicorpCapital. Later I
25 started with TD Ameritrade.
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2 Q. Why did you open up three different
3 accounts?
4 A. Well, basically, the accounts in
5 Columbia just trade the stock market in Columbia.
6 But there are some products that work in the US
7 market, but I don't like to use them. But mostly
8 they operate in the stock market in Columbia.
9 And TD Ameritrade I use it for, yeah, operating
10 the US market.
11 Q. Do you invest in a company called
12 Avianca?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. Is that one of your larger holdings?
15 A. It's a -- it was, yeah, at that time.
16 Q. At what time?
17 A. Around the 2020, as I recall.
18 Q. Do you remember how big your position
19 in Avianca was?
20 A. It was big, as I recall. But I don't
21 remember the specifics.
22 Q. Okay. Were -- is that a publically
23 traded company?
24 A. It was at that time, yes. Right now
25 I don't know, because they were sold to another
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2 company. I haven't followed much Avianca since
3 then.
4 Q. Okay. About how much time today do
5 you spend investing?
6 A. It depends on the day. But I would
7 say one hour daily, something around that. But
8 it depends on the day.
9 Q. And what about in December 2020 and
10 January 2021?
11 A. Around that, maybe a bit more. I
12 would say two hours, three hours. It all depends
13 on the market.
14 Q. What made you interested in starting
15 to invest in 2020?
16 A. Well, basically, I started because of
17 the pandemic. My thinking was that even before
18 going -- starting in investing, my feeling was
19 that there was a lot of opportunities brought by
20 the pandemic, in terms of the stock market. So
21 that was my feeling before starting. So I
22 started with that. That made me start with the
23 courses and all the things I have told you
24 before.
25 Q. And what were the opportunities you
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2 saw in the stock market during the pandemic?
3 A. Well, basically, that was my -- my
4 feeling before starting. When I started
5 investing, I started investing in the Columbian
6 market and many companies were very undervalued.
7 So that's why -- well, I got into investing.
8 The companies that were interesting
9 were Avianca, as you mentioned, and other in
10 Columbia.
11 Q. What do you mean by, "they were
12 undervalued"?
13 A. The price that was in the stock
14 market was lower than the real value of the
15 companies I was seeing.
16 Q. What did you base the "real value of
17 the companies" on?
18 A. I, basically, do all my investing
19 based on value investing, yeah. I see the
20 financials and I see as well the real operation
21 of the company. I mean, where they are located
22 and all the things happening in the real world
23 besides the statements and the indicators.
24 Q. So, when you think that a company is
25 "undervalued," you're thinking that the stock
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2 market price does not correctly reflect the
3 information that's publically available about the
4 company's financials and its operations?
5 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
6 A. Yeah, I do an analysis to see the --
7 how it is the price compared to its valuation.
8 And if I see an opportunity that the price will
9 go up, I invest in it. I do a plan for that
10 investment and I invest on it.
11 Q. And do you base your perception of
12 the value of a company on anything except
13 publically available information?
14 A. Yeah, about the information I see
15 about the news and about the -- all the
16 information regarding the company, yes.
17 Q. And it's only publically available
18 information that you base your idea of the value
19 of the company on?
20 A. Yes.
21 MR. KIM: Objection.
22 Q. You said, "yes"?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. Is that how you would describe your
25 investment philosophy for all stocks you
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2 purchase?
3 A. It's difficult to say that it's "for
4 all," also. But that's like my general view of
5 the stock market.
6 Q. Is there any particular industry you
7 invest in?
8 A. No, not any particular.
9 Q. You invest in Columbian stocks and
10 American stocks you said, correct?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. And what type of Columbian traded
13 companies do you invest in?
14 A. I don't recall the specifics. But,
15 as you mentioned, Avianca, that's one of them.
16 Another one is like Cementos Argos, Grupo Argos,
17 which are companies related to construction, you
18 know, Ecopetrol, a petrol company and, yeah, some
19 others, but I don't recall the specifics.
20 Q. How would you describe your risk
21 tolerance?
22 A. I would say medium.
23 Q. Are there times when you're mostly
24 trusting your intuition when investing in a
25 stock?
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2 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
3 A. I would say I do my analysis and I
4 trust my analysis, yeah, and that's how I try to
5 operate.
6 Q. And what do you mean when you say
7 that your risk tolerance is "medium" when you're
8 investing?
9 A. Yeah, sometimes the positions go low
10 and I tolerate some level of going down, yeah.
11 And if it's going down -- even though I did the
12 valuation and did the technicals, yeah, sometimes
13 I tolerate that it's going down. But I -- like,
14 sometimes I prefer to trigger a stop loss, yeah,
15 for that. But I don't do it on extremes. If
16 it's going too much, I don't go to extremes.
17 Q. What factors do you consider when
18 evaluating the riskiness of a certain stock?
19 A. Well, I see mainly fundamentals. I
20 see the company, what the company is doing, yeah.
21 And I see news about the company. And I do
22 technical analysis as well. I do all these
23 analysis and I analyze the market conditions as
24 well. Based on this mix I make the decisions.
25 Q. Do you only invest in stocks?
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2 A. No.
3 Q. Do you also invest in options?
4 A. No, I don't invest in options.
5 Q. What else?
6 A. I invest in real estate. I have an
7 investment in Columbian real estate and I invest
8 in another company that is outside of the stock
9 market in Columbia.
10 Q. What kind of real estate do you
11 invest in?
12 A. Oh, apartments.
13 Q. So residential?
14 A. Residential, yes. Actually, at the
15 moment I only have one apartment.
16 Q. Have you ever invested on someone
17 else's behalf?
18 A. No.
19 Q. For example --
20 THE STENOGRAPHER: I didn't catch the
21 answer.
22 MR. KIM: He said, "no."
23 A. No.
24 THE STENOGRAPHER: I thought he said
25 something along with that.
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2 A. Yeah, not that I recall.
3 Q. Has anybody ever invested on your
4 behalf?
5 A. No.
6 Q. Have you ever hired an investment or
7 a financial adviser?
8 A. No.
9 Q. Do you talk about investing with
10 friends?
11 A. Actually, no. My friends don't
12 invest in the stock market. I speak about
13 investments that are outside the stock market
14 with friends.
15 Q. Like --
16 A. Like real estate -- like real estate,
17 for example.
18 Q. And now you use multiple brokerages
19 to invest?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. And you use one of them more for the
22 Columbian-listed companies?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. And the other one you use for
25 American-listed companies?
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2 A. Yes, exactly that.
3 Q. Which brokerages do you use again?
4 A. One is called Valores Bancolumbia,
5 CredicorpCapital and TD Ameritrade.
6 Q. How do you fund these accounts?
7 A. With my personal savings.
8 Q. Just what you made from your
9 occupation?
10 A. Exactly.
11 Q. And you became an American -- an
12 Ameritrade customer in April 2020?
13 A. I think it was after, but I don't
14 recall the detail.
15 Q. So you first became -- you first
16 opened up a brokerage account with the brokerages
17 in which you traded Columbian stocks?
18 A. Yes, that's correct.
19 Q. And about how long after that did you
20 open up your Ameritrade account in which you
21 trade American stocks?
22 A. I don't remember specifics. I would
23 say around a year, but I don't remember
24 specifics.
25 Q. And you opened up your Columbian
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2 brokerages in April 2020 you said?
3 A. Yes.
4 Q. So would you agree that you opened up
5 your Ameritrade account at the end of 2020?
6 A. Yeah, around those dates, yes.
7 Q. So December 2020?
8 A. Around those dates. I -- I don't
9 remember the specifics.
10 Q. And why did you start using
11 Ameritrade?
12 A. Well, basically, I did an evaluation
13 of different brokers in the US. And after the
14 evaluation, I decided that TD Ameritrade was the
15 best for my interests.
16 Q. Do you still use that account?
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. How frequently?
19 A. It depends on the market and it
20 depends on my investments that I have active but
21 daily, twice -- every two days.
22 Q. And you said you became associated
23 with CredicorpCapital around April 2020?
24 A. That's correct.
25 Q. Why did you --
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2 A. I don't remember the exact date I
3 opened the account with them but around those
4 dates.
5 Q. And you decided to open that when you
6 first became interested in investing during the
7 pandemic?
8 A. Yes, that's correct.
9 Q. How frequently do you use that
10 account?
11 A. Right now I don't -- I don't use it.
12 Q. And the late 2020 did you use it?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. About how frequently?
15 A. Around more or less the same. It
16 depends on the investments I had; sometimes
17 everyday, sometimes every two days.
18 MR. COHEN: Let's mark Tab 3.
19 (Deposition Exhibit 269, copy of Mr.
20 Gill's December 2020 account statement for
21 CredicorpCapital P00002761 to P00002763 marked
22 Confidential, was marked for identification.)
23 Q. Mr. Gill, in your folder you should
24 be seeing Exhibit 269.
25 MR. COHEN: And, for the record, the
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2 beginning Bates Number of this document is
3 P00002761.
4 MR. KIM: Is there a question?
5 MR. COHEN: I'm waiting for Mr. Gill
6 to tell me that he's opened up the document.
7 A. Yes, I opened, okay, the document.
8 Q. Do you recognize this document?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. This is a copy of your
11 CredicorpCapital account statement from
12 December 1st, 2020 through December 31st, 2020?
13 A. Yes, that is correct.
14 Q. And, according to this page, you had
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22 A. Yes, that is correct.
23 Q. Let's look at the second page?
24 A. Uh-huh.
25 Q. Am I correct on December 14th, 2020,
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2 you sold 1200 shares of AO Grupo Argos for 13,400
3 pesos?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. This is a company in the construction
6 industry?
7 A. Yes. It's a holding --
8 Q. Why did you --
9 A. (INAUDIBLE DUE TO CROSS-TALK.)
10 THE STENOGRAPHER: I didn't catch the
11 answer. I'm sorry.
12 A. It's a holding company.
13 Q. And why did you invest in this
14 company?
15 A. Because -- well, I don't remember the
16 specifics. It's around two years ago. But,
17 basically, I used the same thesis, which is I
18 thought it was undervalued based on the
19 fundamentals and the operations of the company.
20 But I don't remember the specifics.
21 Q. And on December 22nd, 2020, you sold
22 4,756 shares of Ecopetrol?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. And that was for 2,259 pesos per
25 share?
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2 A. Yes, that is correct.
3 Q. This is a petroleum company, correct?
4 A. It's correct.
5 Q. And why did you invest in this?
6 A. Well, I don't remember the specifics,
7 but it is the same thesis for investment. I
8 thought it was undervalued at that time and --
9 yes, so I saw an opportunity on that.
10 Q. And why did you sell at this time?
11 A. I don't remember the specifics.
12 Q. Do you usually sell when you perceive
13 that a company is now being valued at what you
14 think it should be valued at?
15 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
16 A. I don't remember the specifics, but I
17 take into consideration a lot of things from the
18 market. But the specifics are I don't know. I
19 don't remember.
20 Q. In general, what are the
21 considerations from the market that you take into
22 account when selling a stock?
23 MR. KIM: Objection, asked and
24 answered.
25 A. I see the market, the direction of
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2 the market and the news related to the market and
3 to the company and based in that, I do an
4 analysis and I decide the strategy on that.
5 Q. And on each trade, it looks like you
6 pay a commission, right?
7 A. Yes, that is correct.
8 Q. You also have a Bancolumbia account?
9 A. It is called Valores Bancolumbia but,
10 yes.
11 Q. And you said "Valores"?
12 A. Valores Bancolumbia, that's the name
13 of the broker.
14 Q. Thank you.
15 When did you first open your Valores
16 Bancolumbia account?
17 A. Around those days, around
18 April/May 2020.
19 Q. And why did you start using Valores
20 Bancolumbia?
21 A. Basically, I did an analysis of the
22 brokers in Columbia and it was -- the
23 characteristics of both CredicorpCapital and
24 Valores Bancolumbia were the best for my needs.
25 Q. Do you also only invest in Columbian
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2 stocks on Valores Bancolumbia?
3 A. Yes, as I recall.
4 Q. And about how frequently do you use
5 that now?
6 A. Right now I don't use it much. I see
7 through it every once a month. That is because
8 the characteristics of the market in Columbia
9 right now.
10 Q. What's going on in Columbia?
11 A. Basically, we have a President that
12 it goes in another line different to mine. So
13 he's impacting the stock market. So I prefer not
14 to invest because -- because of that.
15 Q. Is that one of the reasons why you
16 said before that you don't trade Columbian-traded
17 stocks as much now?
18 A. Yes, that is the reason. Yeah, it is
19 because politics and the impact of the stock
20 market more than the price, because, actually,
21 there are plenty of opportunities in Columbia.
22 But the risk is too high.
23 MR. COHEN: Let's mark Tab 4.
24 (Deposition Exhibit 270, copy of Mr.
25 Gill's December 2020 account statement for Grupo
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2 Bancolumbia Capital P00002776 to P00002780 marked
3 Confidential, was marked for identification.)
4 MR. KIM: Scott, we've been going
5 about an hour. I mean, if you got just a couple
6 more minutes on this document, maybe after we
7 could take a break or we can take a break now.
8 Whatever you want to do, five minutes.
9 THE WITNESS: I agree.
10 MR. COHEN: Yeah, let's take a break
11 now.
12 MR. KIM: Alright, sounds good; five
13 minutes, 10:10?
14 MR. COHEN: Perfect.
15 THE WITNESS: Perfect, sounds good.
16 MR. COHEN: Alright.
17 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Stand by please.
18 The time is 4:05 p.m. We are going
19 off the record. This will end Media Unit 1.
20 One second please. And we are off
21 the record.
22 (Recess taken 4:05 to 4:16 p.m.
23 Serbian time.)
24 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
25 4:16 p.m. We are back on the record. This will
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2 be start of Media Unit No. 2.
3 Counsel.
4 Q. Mr. Gill, in your folder, you should
5 be seeing Exhibit 270.
6 A. Yes, I see it.
7 Q. Do you recognize this document?
8 A. Yes. This is -- yes, sorry. Sorry
9 about that.
10 Q. No, no. Go on, please.
11 A. It is a statement of Valores
12 Bancolumbia, that broker.
13 Q. And this statement shows your account
14 activity from December 1st, 2020 through
15 December 31st, 2020?
16 A. Yes, that is correct.
17 MR. COHEN: And for the record the
18 beginning Bates Number is P00002776.
19 Q. Did you use your Bancolumbia account
20 from January through March 2021?
21 A. Yes. But I don't remember the
22 specifics.
23 Q. Did you make further trades from this
24 account after that time?
25 A. Yes.
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2 MR. KIM: Which time, January or
3 December?
4 MR. COHEN: The time period from
5 January 2021 through March 2021.
6 A. I don't remember the specifics.
7 Q. In which stocks do you generally
8 invest using this account?
9 A. I invest in the Columbian market. So
10 stocks that are listed in the Columbian market
11 mainly but not one in particular.
12 Q. And what's your portfolio value in
13 this account today?
14 A. Today, I don't remember the
15 specifics.
16
17 Q. Let's look at the summary of your
18 portfolio listed on this first page. In the
19 column that says -- I'm sorry, the row that says,
20 "acciones."
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. Do you see that?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. It notes that your balance as of
25
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2
3 A. Yes.
4 Q. And your balance a month later as of
5 December 31st, 2020 was 20,224,000 Columbia
6 pesos, correct?
7 A. That's correct.
8 Q. So, according to the next block over,
9 that was a drop of 46.284 percent in value?
10 A. That's -- that's correct. That's
11 what the statement is saying.
12 Q. Was that a significant loss for you?
13 A. I don't remember the specifics. But
14 I don't think that is a loss. That is just
15 mostly stocks that were sold and are not there
16 anymore. So I don't think it's a loss. But I
17 don't remember the specifics at that time.
18 Q. So, when you sell a stock, do you
19 take the money out of your account?
20 A. No.
21 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
22 A. I, typically, don't do it.
23 Q. Do you, typically, leave the money
24 you get for selling your stocks in the brokerage
25 account, correct?
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2 A. Yes, that's correct, typically. But
3 I don't remember the specifics at that time.
4 Q.
5
6
7
8 MR. KIM: Objection to form, vague.
9 A. Actually, not really, yeah. I would
10 see the total, yeah. That's the last column of
11 that table, yeah. That's the total, yeah, in the
12 account, yeah. And I would see the totals that
13 were taken out from the account. So I wouldn't
14 say those were losses. But I have -- I don't
15 remember the specifics and I would have to see,
16 specifically, this document.
17 Q. Let's go to the page ending 2777 at
18 the bottom.
19 Do you see that?
20 A. I'm going there.
21 Which page again in the document?
22 Q. It's the second page of the document
23 and on the bottom right-hand corner it -- the
24 last four numbers will be 2777.
25 A. Yes. I'm seeing that.
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2 Q. So it looks like you primarily bought
3 and sold petroleum-related securities in
4 December 2020; is that right?
5 A. Yeah, that's what the document says,
6 yes.
7 Q. Is this your usual trading strategy
8 in this brokerage account?
9 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
10 I mean, what -- are you saying his
11 usual trading strategy in buying oil stocks or
12 buying and selling stocks or something else?
13 Q. Is purchasing petroleum stocks, your
14 general target industry in this Bancolumbia
15 account?
16 MR. KIM: Objection. It's vague,
17 compound question but...
18 A. I don't -- I don't trade in
19 particular industry, yeah. Even in this
20 statement, you can see different types of
21 companies. You see petrol companies. That is
22 Terpel. Actually, Terpel is not a petrol
23 company, as it is it commercializes petrol. But
24 it is like a gas station company, but it's not a
25 petrol company.
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2 You see Ecopetrol, which is a petrol
3 company. You see Suramericana, which is a
4 holding; Grupo Argos, which is a holdings. So
5 you see many different titles of companies. So I
6 don't trade in a particular industry, no.
7 Q. And, Mr. Gill, I want to make sure
8 that the video captures your face the whole time.
9 Could you pull your screen down or adjust your
10 screen?
11 A. I'm sorry. I was watching the
12 document.
13 Q. No problem.
14 So, according to this page, most of
15 your purchases in December 2020 were made on
16 December 3rd, correct?
17 MR. KIM: Objection. The document
18 speaks for itself.
19 A. Yes, they were -- if that's what the
20 document says, it is. It is like that.
21 Q. And that same day you also made two
22 purchases in AO Grupo Argos?
23 MR. KIM: What day? What day are you
24 talking about?
25 MR. COHEN: That same day. The
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2 previous question was about December 3rd, Phil.
3 A. Yes. That is what is stated on the
4 document.
5 Q. Is there any reason you made most of
6 your purchases on December 3rd, 2020?
7 A. Yes, that is what is stated in the
8 document.
9 Q. Was there a reason that you made all
10 of your purchases on a single day?
11 A. I don't remember the specifics now.
12 Q. And you also made purchases on
13 December 22nd, correct?
14 A. That's correct, according to this
15 document, yes.
16 Q. And these are all Columbian
17 companies?
18 A. Yes, they are. Basically --
19 actually, there is one -- the last one is a Cemex
20 LatAm Holding. It's a holding company. It's
21 foreign company, but is -- it's being traded in
22 the Columbian stock market. Cemex is a
23 multinational.
24 MR. KIM: It's a cement company;
25 isn't it?
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2 THE WITNESS: Yeah, it's a holding
3 company, yeah, that has presence in Columbian.
4 MR. KIM: I see.
5 Q. So it looks like you purchased these
6 same -- the stock in the same company multiple
7 times in the same day.
8 Do you see that?
9 A. Yes, that is what is stated in the
10 company -- in the document, sorry.
11 Q. On December 3rd, 2020, for example,
12 you purchased AO Ecopetrol stock at four
13 different points in that day, correct?
14 A. Yeah, that's correct. That's what
15 the -- it's stated in the document.
16 Q. Is that common for you to do?
17 MR. KIM: Well, I mean, look, we all
18 know that these document show when the trades
19 were made, you know, when the purchases were
20 made. It doesn't necessarily show that there
21 were multiple trades, right. You could make one
22 trade that could be filled with multiple
23 purchases.
24 And, you know, I don't read Spanish.
25 So I don't know what this document shows. So I
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2 don't think you can assume that, you know, these
3 Ecopetrol transactions was each a trade rather
4 than one trade or two trades, you know, filled
5 with multiple transactions.
6 MR. COHEN: Phil, this is not your
7 deposition. I'm sorry. But could you please let
8 Mr. Gill answer the questions that are asked of
9 him?
10 MR. KIM: I am. I'm just trying to
11 clear the record so that we get to the facts, not
12 speculation and, you know, testimony based on
13 assumptions. That's all.
14 MR. COHEN: Well, testimony from a
15 lawyer --
16 MR. KIM: It's not testimony from a
17 lawyer. I'm just clarifying the record.
18 So let's, you know, let's see what
19 Mr. Gill has to say about this.
20 A. The statement is showing purchases,
21 yeah, of one company, yeah, on the same day. And
22 the purchases -- it doesn't mean that it's a
23 trade or not or -- it's a purchase. That's what
24 is in the document.
25 And, basically, what it shows is that
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2 the purchases were done in different -- in
3 independent orders. But that doesn't mean it's
4 like different strategies, different trades.
5 That just means that I first bought as a portion
6 of the company, some stocks of the company and
7 then I added some stocks of the company.
8 Sometimes how the system puts the same order, it
9 breaks it in different prices.
10 Actually, when you see the specific
11 price for each of the -- of the part of the
12 stock, you can see it in the -- where it says
13 that's our price column, you see a very very
14 similar price, yeah, as you can see there. So
15 it's like the same purchase. It's just broke
16 down in different prices, yeah. That's like
17 typical from the stock market.
18 Q. Okay. Would that have been your
19 response before Mr. Kim chimed in?
20 A. Yes. I'm just reading the document.
21 Q. Okay. I appreciate that, Mr. Gill.
22 I'm just trying to signal to Mr. Kim that you're
23 capable of answering questions on your own.
24 A. Okay, thank you.
25 Q. Do you ever make multiple purchases
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2 of stock in the same company on the same day?
3 A. It's difficult to generalize. But
4 sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. Sometimes I
5 -- when I do, which could be -- I think it's a
6 natural process. It's because I needed -- I want
7 to have a bigger position for that company. So
8 sometimes I do. Sometimes I don't do it. But I
9 would say it's part of the natural process of the
10 stock market, of operating the stock market.
11 Q. So, if you see information about the
12 company in between your first purchase of the
13 stock, that could potentially cause you to buy or
14 sell that same stock later on in the day?
15 MR. KIM: Objection, incomplete
16 hypothetical, calls for speculation.
17 A. I -- I agree it's "speculation."
18 It's, like, you can do that for a lot of reasons,
19 yeah. You can -- you can do it because you are
20 waiting for a price and it's met. You can do it
21 because you change your portfolio and want to
22 have a bigger position, yeah. It can change as
23 well because you sold the position and then you
24 have the available money to increase your
25 position. It can be many ways. It calls for
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2 "speculation."
3 Q. Other than your Ameritrade,
4 CredicorpCapital and Bancolumbia accounts, do you
5 have any other brokerage accounts?
6 A. No, no. I now have another
7 Ameritrade account that is very recent.
8 Q. Within the last year?
9 A. I don't remember the specifics but,
10 yes.
11 Q. Okay. What type of stocks do you
12 trade on that newest account?
13 A. I -- it's a TD Ameritrade account and
14 I trade the US market.
15 Q. Do you do anything differently
16 between your two TD Ameritrade accounts?
17 A. One account, the newest is longer
18 term, like, yeah, very long term, like years,
19 yeah, and the other one is a bit shorter term,
20 three or six months.
21 Q. Did you open up your newest
22 Ameritrade account in order to pursue longer term
23 strategy just for that account?
24 A. I just open it to have a separation.
25 That's all. It's management of the capital, just
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2 that.
3 Q. About how frequently do you use that
4 account?
5 A. It's difficult to say. But I would
6 say, yeah, every two days, every day, depending
7 on the market.
8 Q. And what's your portfolio value?
9 A.
10
11 Q. Do you keep up to date on news of
12 stocks and companies?
13 A. Yes, I do.
14 Q. And is there any particular manner of
15 education for how you keep up to date with these
16 stocks and companies?
17 A. I -- what I do now, I basically see
18 sites for news related to the market like
19 Investing.com. I see YouTube videos for market
20 recaps, yeah. And I see news in different media,
21 in Twitter as well.
22 Q. Is that also how you kept up to date
23 on stock and industry news in December 2020 and
24 January 2021?
25 A. Yeah, I don't remember exactly how I
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2 was following the market during those days, but I
3 would guess it's similar, maybe with different
4 YouTube channels and sites. In my opinion, my
5 investing strategies have evolved everything
6 else.
7 Q. How have they "evolved" since 2020?
8 A. As I recall, I follow now different
9 channels, which are following indicators, macro
10 indicators, which is -- have been very good.
11 Q. So back in 2020 you didn't follow
12 these channels that showed macro indicators?
13 A. They showed the indicators but in a
14 different way.
15 Q. What types of videos do you watch?
16 A. I -- right now I watch market recap,
17 yeah, for the -- a weekly recap or daily recaps
18 and are mostly on technical and fundamentals
19 analysis.
20 Q. Did you watch those videos back in
21 December 2020, January 2021 as well?
22 A. I would say different channels.
23 Q. What channels -- go on.
24 A. But they -- but the idea was more or
25 the less the same, to see the recap, the summary
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2 of the market.
3 Q. Do you describe to any newsletter
4 about investing?
5 A. I mostly watch the media that we have
6 discussed, which is YouTube and Twitter, and --
7 yeah, more or less that but no newsletters, no.
8 Q. What about podcasts?
9 A. Podcasts, no, I don't use podcasts.
10 Q. What about regular broadcast
11 television shows?
12 A. I -- mostly YouTube and different
13 channels and stuff but mostly YouTube.
14 Q. Okay. And all of these videos and
15 social media and other ways in which you followed
16 these stock market in December 2020 and
17 January 2021, did you hear about a possible short
18 squeeze of certain companies?
19 A. I was following the market at that
20 time, yes.
21 Q. Can you explain what a "short
22 squeeze" is?
23 A. A "short squeeze" is like -- is part
24 of the market, of the market dynamics. It's when
25 a lot of people is short on a stock, yeah, and as
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2 you know, the -- when someone is short is
3 borrowing a stock, right, from the broker. And
4 then when a "short squeeze" is when the price is
5 going up for those stocks and then taking the
6 stock back to the broker will mean a lot of
7 losses for a lot of people. So that causes the
8 short squeeze that is the price to go up based on
9 those dynamics, but that's part of the dynamics
10 of the market.
11 Q. So a short squeeze, according to your
12 understanding, affects the price of a stock?
13 A. Yes, it does.
14 Q. And, according to your understanding,
15 does a short squeeze affect the price of a stock
16 even in situations where there is no new
17 information about the company's financials?
18 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
19 A. It is vague. A short squeeze can
20 happen for many reasons, very different reasons,
21 the same reasons that for a stock price to go
22 down or up but many reasons can affect the price.
23 Q. Reasons other than information about
24 the company itself?
25 A. The reasons --
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2 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
3 A. Yeah, the reasons are -- anything can
4 happen in the market and at the end is the market
5 is just supply and demand.
6 Q. And what did you hear about the short
7 squeeze in late 2020/early 2021?
8 A. Well, basically, I saw the news,
9 yeah, and I was following the markets. So I saw
10 the happenings in the market.
11 Q. What did you see happening in the
12 market?
13 A. Well, basically, I -- as you already
14 know, I do value investing. I was investing in
15 companies that were affected by the pandemic.
16 For example, cinema chains, yeah, and other
17 similar stocks like airlines and et cetera. So I
18 was -- I saw what was happening with AMC, yeah,
19 and -- well, all the news and everything that I
20 saw that was related to my investments because of
21 that.
22 Q. So you invested in companies that you
23 saw had stocks that were being affected by the
24 short squeeze, correct?
25 MR. KIM: Objection. That's not what
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2 he said.
3 A. Yeah, exactly, it's not what I said.
4 It's -- I -- my investment strategy
5 is based on the fundamentals and I was -- I -- my
6 hypothesis was that the stocks -- the companies
7 that were affected were -- for the pandemic -- by
8 the pandemic were going to recover. I mean, in
9 this sense, the stock price of those companies
10 would be higher.
11 Q. In December 2020 and January 2021,
12 according to the news that you were consuming at
13 that time, which companies were being affected by
14 the short squeeze?
15 A. Well, the companies I know, yeah,
16 were AMC, which I was investing on that company
17 even much much before, I saw about the GameStop,
18 yeah and others that I don't recall.
19 Q. Okay. And you invested in GameStop
20 as well?
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. And you invested in that at what
23 time?
24 A. I don't remember the specifics.
25 Q. What was your opinion about the short
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2 squeeze?
3 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
4 Are you talking about now, then,
5 yesterday? What are we talking about?
6 Q. While it was going on in
7 December 2020 and January 2021, what was your
8 opinion about the short squeeze?
9 MR. KIM: Well, I object. It hasn't
10 been established that it was actually going on,
11 right. So I'm objecting to the question because
12 it's vague, assumes facts and it's not clear to
13 me.
14 Q. During 2020 and 2021 -- during
15 December 2020 and 2021, you saw news and other
16 media that expressed the belief that there was a
17 short squeeze occurring in GameStop and AMC,
18 correct?
19 A. Correct.
20 Q. And at that time, what was your
21 opinion of what was happening regarding that
22 supposed short squeeze?
23 A. I think it's all aligned to my
24 strategy initial. So I was investing in
25 companies that were, like, undervalued because of
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2 -- they were affected by the pandemic, yeah, and
3 many people was short of that -- on that, on
4 them. And then, typically, what the market does
5 when it -- when everybody is thinking one way,
6 the market does the other way around. That's how
7 the market goes in many many cases in most of the
8 case. So that's my opinion. That plus the fact
9 that there is a value in those companies.
10 So I think, yeah, as an opportunity
11 they were undervalued companies to my
12 understanding, my analysis at that time. So that
13 was my analysis.
14 Q. Have you heard the term "meme stock"
15 before?
16 A. Yes, I do.
17 Q. And what does that mean to you?
18 A. "Meme" is a cartoon. But the term
19 mean -- what the term says is that it's -- those
20 are cartoon stocks, yeah. I don't agree with the
21 term, because, for example, saying that AMC,
22 which is one of the biggest cinema chains in the
23 world, to be a cartoon, that is -- it's not fair
24 to me. It's like a bureaucratic term. It's like
25 a bad term, in my opinion. But that's how people
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2 call several stocks.
3 Q. And by "cartoon," do you mean that it
4 was a joke?
5 A. That's what the term is, yeah. I
6 didn't invent the term.
7 Q. Where did you hear the term?
8 A. I heard the term in the news.
9 Q. And on social media?
10 A. Yeah, I -- I saw a lot -- news mostly
11 on YouTube and the platform I use for trading,
12 which is TD Ameritrade. And in TD Ameritrade,
13 there is the component for news. So I saw -- I
14 saw the term over there.
15 Q. Which stocks did the term "meme
16 stock" apply to?
17 MR. KIM: When?
18 Q. When you first learned about this
19 term "meme stock," Mr. Gill, to what stocks did
20 you see that it was being applied?
21 A. (INAUDIBLE DUE TO CROSS-TALK.)
22 MR. KIM: The we -- the we -- I'm
23 trying to get the timing clear. I don't think
24 it's been established when he first learned of
25 the term. Has it?
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2 Q. When did you first learn of the term
3 "meme stock"?
4 A. Around that time. I don't remember
5 the specifics; around that time.
6 Q. And by "around that time," you're
7 referring to December 2020?
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. Okay. According to what you saw in
10 December 2020, which stocks were being referred
11 to as "meme stocks"?
12 A. As I recall, GME and AMC. But, as I
13 told you before, I don't agree with the term.
14 Q. Have you ever heard of Reddit?
15 A. Yes, I've heard.
16 Q. And you said that you never had a
17 Reddit account, right?
18 A. That's correct.
19 Q. Have you ever visited Reddit?
20 A. I have, yes.
21 Q. On what occasions?
22 A. Oh, sometimes I look things on Google
23 for anything and sometimes Google takes me to
24 Reddit. Sometimes there are threads there that
25 are, like, good but nothing in particular -- in
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2 particular.
3 Q. When you say you're Googling things,
4 do you mean you're researching things?
5 A. Yeah, I research not only in the
6 stock market, but, actually, I research a lot on
7 technology. As you know, I work with IT.
8 Q. But sometimes when you would research
9 the stock market, it would -- Google would take
10 you to Reddit, correct?
11 A. Yeah, that's correct.
12 Q. And then have you ever from there
13 gone to Wall Street Bets?
14 A. No. I saw the term but, no, not
15 really.
16 Q. And Wall Street Bets is a sub-Reddit;
17 is that correct?
18 A. Without seeing it that it is part of
19 Reddit, it's an account there but nothing else.
20 Q. And have you ever interacted with
21 Wall Street Bets in any way?
22 A. Not that I recall.
23 Q. You never posted on a different
24 social media platform a message that was also
25 posted on Wall Street Bets?
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2 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
3 A. I basically use -- the social media I
4 use is mainly Twitter, as you know. And in
5 Twitter, you find a lot of things, yeah, not a
6 lot of news. I use it for information. So
7 that's information I consume. It's good to be
8 informed on what is going on in the market and in
9 life. So that's how I use the social media. And
10 that's how I use Twitter, yeah. And I reply
11 sometimes but really not that much.
12 Q. And sometimes on Twitter you reply to
13 Wall Street Bets' posts, correct?
14 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
15 A. I don't recall the specifics, to be
16 honest. Maybe I did, but I don't recall the
17 specifics.
18 Q. Are you familiar with a company
19 called GameStop?
20 A. Yes, I am.
21 Q. We were just talking about it before,
22 correct?
23 A. Uh-huh.
24 Q. What kind of company is it?
25 A. It is a company selling --
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2 distributing games, physical games.
3 Q. Have you done any research into
4 GameStop?
5 A. I did the research during that time.
6 But I don't recall much, to be honest. I did my
7 studies for those investments over that time, but
8 I don't recall the specifics.
9 Q. Did you start looking into GameStop
10 around December 2020 and January 2021?
11 A. I think before that as well, but I
12 don't recall the specifics.
13 Q. Have you ever looked into the SEC
14 filings associated with GameStop?
15 A. Sometimes when I do the research, I
16 go through the filings. But I don't remember,
17 specifically, if I saw the filings for GameStop.
18 I cannot recall. But I -- it's the type of
19 information I use for evaluation.
20 Q. And do you recall looking at press
21 releases put out by GameStop at that time?
22 A. I don't recall the specifics.
23 Q. In January 2021, do you recall any
24 company announcements that GameStop made?
25 A. I don't remember specifics. I was
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2 following the news on the market and I was
3 following the news with the channels and media I
4 have told you, on YouTube, on Twitter, on the TD
5 Ameritrade platform in the news component. But I
6 don't remember specifics what were the news.
7 Q. Have you ever been to a GameStop?
8 A. Yes, I have.
9 Q. Are you familiar with a company
10 called AMC?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. And that's the AMC movie theater
13 chain that you referenced before, correct?
14 A. That is correct.
15 Q. And what type of research had you
16 done into AMC when you first started purchasing
17 AMC stock?
18 A. Well, I did the research. The
19 research I do for the investments I do and,
20 basically, I do -- I check what the company is
21 doing, the fundamentals, the ratios. I mainly
22 use the information in the Thinkorswim platform,
23 the value that is there. And based on that and
24 the technical analysis, I make my decisions and
25 invest.
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2 Q. Did you hear any news about AMC in
3 December 2020 and January 2021?
4 A. Yes, I was following the news on that
5 time. But I don't remember a specific news for
6 AMC.
7 Q. Can you -- do you recall generally
8 the type of news coverage that AMC was getting
9 around that time?
10 A. Generally speaking, about the -- all
11 these happenings regarding the short squeeze that
12 you mentioned and I -- I remember all these, all
13 these happenings, yes, and the situation that was
14 not easy for the movie chains during that period.
15 Yeah, I remember. But I don't remember
16 specifics.
17 Q. And you saw other people posting on
18 social media about AMC at that time?
19 A. I saw -- I was following the news and
20 the market and the media that we have been
21 discussing on Twitter and on YouTube. And, yeah,
22 I saw postings. I saw news. I saw all kind of
23 information, which is part of the investment
24 process.
25 Q. That news included people discussing
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2 the price spike in AMC due to a purported short
3 squeeze, correct?
4 A. Well, they were describing the
5 situation, the general news on that. Yeah, those
6 were the news I was following. Nothing as
7 specific I recall. I cannot recall.
8 Q. Are you familiar with a company
9 called BlackBerry?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. What kind of company is that?
12 A. It does devices, mobile devices.
13 Actually, I like a lot of the devices they do --
14 they do.
15 Q. Do you own any BlackBerry devices?
16 A. Right now, no. But I used to own. I
17 had, at least, three or four.
18 Q. When was that?
19 A. I cannot recall.
20 Q. Was it before 2020?
21 A. It was before 2020, yes.
22 Q. Had you ever done any research into
23 BlackBerry as a company?
24 A. Well, I -- I was -- I invested once
25 in BlackBerry and I did more or less the same
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2 research I do for the companies. I check news on
3 the company. I check the fundamentals. I check
4 the price, the technicals. And based on that, I
5 do my decisions. I make my decisions.
6 Q. And in December 2020 and
7 January 2021, do you recall that BlackBerry was
8 discussed as among the meme stocks such as
9 GameStop and AMC?
10 MR. KIM: Objection to form.
11 A. I was following the markets and I saw
12 in general what was going on there with this part
13 of the investment process to follow the markets
14 and to see what is going on but, yes -- but I
15 don't remember, specifically, something.
16 Q. Do you recall generally that
17 BlackBerry was being referred to as a meme stock?
18 A. I don't remember specifics. But I
19 think I saw on that group of stocks.
20 Q. Okay. And are you familiar with a
21 company called Express Inc.?
22 A. I am familiar, yes.
23 Q. What kind of company is that?
24 A. It's a retailer for fashion.
25 Q. Do you own any Express items?
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2 A. No, but I've seen friends, yeah.
3 Q. Have you ever done any research into
4 Express as a company?
5 A. Well, basically, the same research
6 that I have been doing when I did investing. I
7 follow news. I go through the fundamentals. I
8 see the technicals and based on that, I do the --
9 I make my decisions.
10 Q. Okay. And, in January 2021, do you
11 recall any company announcements from Express?
12 A. No, I don't recall the specifics.
13 Q. Do you recall encountering any news
14 about Express that caused you to want to invest
15 in it in January 2021?
16 A. My basic analysis, yeah, for all the
17 stocks are more or less the same. If I see that
18 the companies are undervalued, that they are like
19 below the value, I think, the stock should have
20 and I see the things going on in the market, what
21 is maybe the participants and what the people is
22 stating and I see -- and if I see an opportunity
23 in technicals as well, I make me decision to buy.
24 That's more or less the analysis that I saw for
25 Express as well.
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2 Q. Is this analysis similar to what is
3 called "beating the market"?
4 MR. KIM: Objection to form, vague.
5 A. Yeah, I don't know what exactly is
6 "beating the market."
7 What I know about "beating the
8 market" is to simply be more -- that your income,
9 your profitability in the market is better than
10 the S&P 500. That is "beating the market," to my
11 understanding. But it's very vague, the concept,
12 and be very different in many context.
13 Q. And are you familiar with a company
14 called Nokia?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. And what kind of company is that?
17 A. For devices as well. I have owned
18 many Nokia devices, of course. I like them a
19 lot.
20 Q. Have you ever looked into Nokia as a
21 company?
22 A. Yes. Basically, I did an analysis
23 for the company, as I did with the others. So,
24 basically, I see the news on the company. I see
25 the fundamentals, yeah, for the company. And
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2 with this and the technicals, I make my decisions
3 to invest in the company. That's more or less
4 the analysis that I was doing.
5 Q. Do you recall encountering any news
6 in January 2021 about Nokia?
7 A. It's more or less what we have been
8 discussing, yeah. I was following the market. I
9 was following the news and, yeah, it was a
10 mention as well at that time.
11 Q. And it was mentioned in the same
12 conversation as GameStop and AMC and BlackBerry,
13 correct?
14 A. They were all in the same group,
15 yeah.
16 Q. Okay. And did you hear any news that
17 would -- that did affect your desire to purchase
18 shares of Nokia at that time in 2021?
19 A. Well, basically, for my decision,
20 yeah, I was doing the same analysis. So I saw
21 the fundamentals of Nokia, saw the news around
22 Nokia, yeah, and I was thinking it was
23 undervalued. It was under demand. So, based on
24 all the factors, I saw an opportunity to invest
25 in the company.
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2 MR. COHEN: Okay. Let's mark Tab 2.
3 (Deposition Exhibit 271, copy of Mr.
4 Gill's December 2020 account statement for TD
5 Ameritrade P00002114 to P00002119 marked
6 Confidential, was marked for identification.)
7 Q. Mr. Gill, in your folder in a few
8 seconds, you'll see Exhibit 271.
9 MR. COHEN: And, for the record, the
10 beginning Bates Number is P00002114.
11 A. Uh-huh.
12 Q. Is this your TD Ameritrade statement
13 from December 1st, 2020 through December 31st,
14 2020?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. And this catalogs all the trades made
17 through your TD Ameritrade account in
18 December 2020, correct?
19 A. Yes, it does.
20 Q. Okay. Let's go to the page with the
21 Bates Number ending 2116.
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. In the lower left-hand corner, do you
24 see where it says, "cash activity summary"?
25 A. I'm looking. I'm looking.
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2 Q. And it notes there that you purchased
3
4 on this brokerage account, correct?
5 A. Yeah, can you repeat exactly where on
6 the page? I'm looking for the specific place
7 that you were mentioning.
8 Q. It's at the bottom. Depending on
9 your orientation of the page, it should be --
10 MR. KIM: It's the third page. It's
11 the third page of the PDF. And it's on the
12 bottom left-hand corner.
13 "Cash activity summary," do you see
14 that?
15 THE WITNESS: Yes.
16 Q. So it notes in that box beneath the
17 words, "opening balance," that in D
18
19
20 A. Yes, that is correct. That is what
21 is in the document.
22 Q. Is that a typical amount for you to
23 trade in a month?
24 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
25 A. It's vague and it's typical -- it's
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2 difficult to remember specifics. Yeah, I don't
3 keep track of that number. Sometimes it's
4 higher. Sometimes it's lower. It can vary from
5 month to month.
6 Q. If you look to the next column over
7 to the right, do you see where it says
8
9
10 A. Yes, I see it. It's in the document.
11 Q. So, in December of 2020, you
12 purchased about a third of all securities
13 purchased that year on your TD Ameritrade
14 account, correct?
15 A. Well, that's what the document says,
16 yes.
17 Q. Do you have a reason to doubt that
18 the document is correct here?
19 A. No, not at all.
20 Q. So why did you purchase an outsize
21 share of your stock on TD Ameritrade in December?
22 MR. KIM: Objection to form.
23 A. I don't -- I don't remember the
24 specifics. And I don't know if that analysis
25 that you're doing is correct is because probably
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2 I was not using this account from the whole year,
3 yeah. So -- but I don't remember the specifics
4 of that, of that year. I don't remember it being
5 more than usual, to be honest.
6 Q. Okay.
7
8 MR. KIM: Objection to form, asked
9 and answered.
10 A. It's -- it's subjective, but I don't
11 see like a very big difference. Actually, I
12 think I am trading more now.
13 Q. Okay. Let's go to the next page.
14 A. Uh-huh, yes.
15 Q. And do you see that the document
16 notes that on December 2nd, 2020 you decided to
17 purchase 1,325 AMC shares for a price of $4.14
18 per share?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. And you -- had you previously
21 purchased AMC?
22 A. I don't remember when was my first
23 purchase of AMC. I think it was before this
24 time. But I don't recall the specifics, yeah.
25 My general strategy for investing
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2 this type of stocks was the recovery from the
3 pandemic. As you can see in the document, there
4 is an AMC and you can see as well there is
5 American Airlines, Norwegian Cruise Line,
6 Cinemark Holdings, yeah, which are all companies
7 that are affected by the pandemic. So I think it
8 was -- by my strategy in that sense is that they
9 were recovering and then the price of the stock
10 was going up because they were recovering. That
11 was my investment thesis, as I recall, yeah.
12 And it doesn't apply only to AMC but
13 for the other companies as well. So that's what
14 is -- that's -- those general aspects of the
15 investment strategy I recall.
16 Q. While you were making these trades,
17 did you see other people on social media and the
18 news discussing the AMC stock?
19 A. Well, I see the news and I see
20 general comments on the stock market as well as
21 specific comments on different stocks. But it's
22 part of the investment strategy. At the end the
23 decision to make an investment or not, it's
24 completely mine.
25 Q. So what I asked you, Mr. Gill, is if
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2 at that time you saw people posting about the AMC
3 stock on social media and talking about the AMC
4 stock on TV.
5 A. I was following the news on those
6 dates. So, yes, I saw the AMC stock in the news,
7 yes.
8 Q. And you saw that other people were
9 purchasing AMC stock for reasons other than the
10 fundamental value analysis that you were engaging
11 in, correct?
12 MR. KIM: Objection, calls for
13 speculation.
14 A. I don't know what are the other --
15 the reasons for other people to buy the stock.
16 My reasons are the ones I am stating to you, that
17 the fundamentals and there is a recovery that
18 they will go on for the company and that was my
19 investment strategy at that time.
20 Q. Did you observe --
21 A. I didn't know --
22 Q. Go ahead.
23 A. Sorry?
24 Q. No, go ahead please.
25 A. So I don't know the thesis for other
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2 investors. I don't know. And my strategy is to
3 follow my thesis. That's how I do the
4 investment.
5 Q. Did you observe that other people
6 were talking about investing in AMC stock for
7 reasons other than the fundamental analysis that
8 you engaged in?
9 A. I saw --
10 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
11 A. I saw the news during those dates and
12 what was going on with the AMC stock. But, yeah,
13 I don't -- I didn't base my investment strategy
14 on that. I based my strategy on the fundamentals
15 and their recovery of the stock.
16 Q. And two days later, if you look back
17 at the chart, you purchased 664 shares of AMC for
18 $3.71 per share, correct?
19 A. That's the last row of this page,
20 right?
21 Q. Correct.
22 A. Yes, I saw it -- see it in the
23 document.
24 Q. And what was your reason for
25 purchasing more of the stock four days later?
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2 A. I don't remember the specific of
3 those specific orders, yeah, but it was aligned
4 to my main thesis. That's what I can recall,
5 like, there is an opportunity for the company
6 because it's -- it has a value. It's
7 undervalued, yeah, and the price will go up
8 because -- well, the general -- what was going on
9 in the market and about the company. It is
10 aligned to that. But I don't recall specifics
11 for that order, in particular.
12 Q. If you turn to the next page of the
13 document, do you see on December 15th, 2020 you
14 purchased 800 more AMC shares for $2.87 a share?
15 A. Yes, I see it.
16 Q. And the price had fallen for AMC
17 stock since the last time you purchased it,
18 correct?
19 A. I don't remember, specifically, the
20 -- how the market was going and if I sold any in
21 between. I -- I can't recall the specifics.
22 Q. Well, you can see on the chart here
23 all of the stock purchases and sales that you
24 made during January and during -- I'm sorry,
25 during December --
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2 MR. KIM: December.
3 Q. -- 2020 in chronological order.
4 A. Yeah.
5 Q. So would you agree that after your
6 purchase of AMC stock on December 4, 2020, the
7 next time you purchased AMC stock was
8 December 15, 2020?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. And would you agree that the purchase
11 price in December 15, 2020 was lower than the
12 purchase price of AMC stock in December 4, 2020?
13 A. Yes, I agree.
14 Q. Okay. But you purchased it anyway
15 because you assumed the price would go up?
16 A. Yes. Well, basically, if something
17 is cheaper, yeah, it's better to buy, right? It
18 applies to stocks and it applies to a house or
19 electronics or whatever, I mean.
20 Q. And based on what you saw on the news
21 and social media, were other people saying that
22 they believed the stock price of AMC would go up?
23 A. Well, my process was exactly the
24 same. Basically, I was seeing the news, what was
25 going on in the market. And I did my analysis
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2 for the company. I thought it was undervalued so
3 I saw an opportunity. That's more or less the
4 reasoning behind it.
5 Q. Okay. So, at that time, you believed
6 the company was "undervalued" and that the stock
7 price would eventually go up, correct?
8 A. That was my hypothesis, yes.
9 Q. Then why on December 17, 2020 did you
10 sell so many shares of AMC?
11 A. I don't remember the specifics, yeah.
12 But if there is a sale, I -- it was aligned to my
13 risk tolerance that we spoke about at the
14 beginning of the deposition. So, basically it's
15 that. But that's like a normal process in
16 investing.
17 Q. And you sold all of the AMC shares
18 you bought earlier in December on December 17,
19 2020, correct?
20 A. I don't know if they are "all," but
21 it's -- but they are more or less they add. But
22 I don't remember the specifics on why I did that
23 sale or the specifics of the strategy there,
24 yeah, if I wanted to come in the trade have a
25 better position afterwards or -- I cannot recall
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2 the specifics, honestly.
3 MR. KIM: So, Scott, we've been going
4 about an hour. I don't know if you're done with
5 the document. But maybe when you're done, it
6 might be a good point to take another, you know,
7 five or ten-minute break.
8 MR. COHEN: It's good for me.
9 MR. KIM: Are you done with this
10 or...
11 MR. COHEN: Yes. Yeah, we can set
12 this aside.
13 MR. KIM: Alright.
14 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Stand by please.
15 The time is 5:20 p.m. We are going
16 off the record. And this will end media unit
17 No. 2.
18 And we are off the record.
19 (Recess taken 5:20 to 5:34 p.m.
20 Serbian time.)
21 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
22 5:34 p.m. We are back on the record. This is
23 the start of Media Unit No. 3.
24 Q. Mr. Gill, in your folder, you'll see
25 Exhibit 272; if you could pull that up please.
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2 (Deposition Exhibit 272, Exhibit A
3 Mr. Gill's Certification dated 11/29/21 and
4 attachment, was marked for identification.)
5 A. Sure.
6 Q. And this is the certification you
7 signed authorizing The Rosen Law Firm to file
8 this action on your behalf?
9 A. Yes, it is.
10 Q. And if you look at Paragraph 4, the
11 Certification lists, "All of the purchases and
12 sales Plaintiff has made in the affected
13 securities for which Plaintiff seeks redress
14 pursuant to the claims set forth in the
15 consolidated complaint."
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. And you're the "Plaintiff" that this
18 refers to?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. You signed this declaration on
21 November 29th, 2021, correct?
22 A. Yes, that is correct.
23 Q. Alright. Let's look at the next
24 page.
25 A. Yes.
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2 Q. Does this accurately display your
3 trading information at issue in this action?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Does this exhaustively display your
6 trading information at issue in this action?
7 A. This is -- this certification was
8 made by my lawyer, of course, and I reviewed the
9 document and signed it. So, yes, it includes the
10 transactions I made on this stock under the scope
11 of this certification.
12 Q. And, according to Paragraph 4 that I
13 just read, you are seeking redress for Express,
14 Nokia and BlackBerry stock purchases, correct?
15 A. That is correct.
16 Q. And you're not seeking redress for
17 other stocks, according to this certification,
18 correct?
19 MR. KIM: Well, I mean, I think, you
20 know, we're getting into the realm of, you know,
21 attorney-client privilege.
22 But, you know, as you know, we
23 amended the Certification and -- to include
24 additional trades that were accidentally not
25 included. So I think, to that extent, you know,
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2 maybe you should ask him about the amended
3 certification.
4 MR. COHEN: I'm glad that's --
5 A. Yeah, I -- there is -- there are
6 details discussed with the attorney-client
7 privilege. But the technical work, it's done by
8 my attorneys. And I trust what all the technical
9 work and the legal knowledge of my attorneys.
10 So I was advised to make a new
11 version of this Certification that was having
12 another scope, yeah. And, as you mentioned, it
13 includes additional trades. That is correct.
14 Q. Okay. And let's take a look at that
15 later Certification.
16 MR. COHEN: It's Tab 23.
17 Q. And you should see that come up as
18 Exhibit 273.
19 (Deposition Exhibit 273, Exhibit A
20 Mr. Gill's Certification dated 4/17/23 and
21 attachment, was marked for identification.)
22 A. I'm not watching it. I'm not
23 (INAUDIBLE).
24 Q. So this was the later Certification
25 to which you were referring, correct?
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2 A. Let me see.
3 Yes, that is correct.
4 Q. And this was produced to us signed by
5 you on April 17, 2023?
6 A. Yes, that is correct.
7 Q. And like the previous certification
8 we looked at this, this Certification lists,
9 quote, "all of the transactions Plaintiff has
10 made in the affected stocks during the class
11 period set forth in the consolidated complaint."
12 A. Yes, that is correct.
13 Q. And you're the Plaintiff to which
14 this document refers?
15 A. Yes. Yes, I am.
16 Q. If we take a look at the next page,
17 we see that additional detail that you were
18 mentioning, correct?
19 A. That is correct.
20 Q. And what was your explanation for why
21 this additional detail was added?
22 MR. KIM: Well, I'm going to -- I
23 think we're sort of treading into attorney-client
24 communications.
25 So I think, you know, Mr. Gill, can
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2 you answer the question, if you can without
3 revealing the substance of our communications
4 relating to this corrected Certification. So, to
5 the extent that you can answer the question
6 without revealing the substance and content of
7 our communications relating to it, you can. But
8 if you can't, then say you can't and then I would
9 direct you not to answer the question.
10 A. Basically, the two Certifications are
11 having a different scope. So both certifications
12 are correct having a different scope. That's
13 what I can say about the certifications. And the
14 reasons are technical and legal and are under
15 attorney-client privilege, as stated before.
16 Q. And, to be clear, I would not ask you
17 to divulge the contents of your communications
18 with your attorney. So I thank you for your
19 answer.
20 Can you tell me what the different
21 "scope" is of this second document than the first
22 Certification we saw?
23 MR. KIM: [INSTRUCTION] Well I'm
24 going to direct Mr. Gill not to answer that
25 question, as it will reveal attorney-client
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2 communications.
3 What I will say, though, this is the
4 corrected and operative Certification in the
5 case.
6 A. Yeah, basically, the two
7 certifications are different in the way that the
8 scope of the document is different. And the
9 differences are because of technicalities and
10 legal terms. So I prefer not to disclose any
11 other information because of client attorney
12 privilege.
13 Q. Okay. So, just the pure drafting of
14 this was done by your attorney?
15 A. That is correct.
16 Q. Could you look at the left-hand box
17 under "Purchases"?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. What is -- what are -- what's the
20 information beneath "date" before you get to AMC
21 in the fourth last row?
22 A. I'm reviewing the document.
23 Q. Take your time.
24 MR. KIM: It's the fourth last row?
25 You mean AMC 128282021; is that what you're
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2 referring to.
3 MR. COHEN: The information above
4 that is what I'm asking about.
5 MR. KIM: Ah.
6 A. My view of the document is that it's
7 related to the NOK shares, yeah, and that's
8 referring to the Nokia shares.
9 Q. So my question is all of the
10 information from where it says, "date," down to
11 the fourth last row, what is that?
12 A. The table shows a summary of the
13 transactions during those times.
14 Q. Okay. So what dies "AMC minimum
15 opening position 400 shares" mean?
16 A. So, basically, it's -- what it states
17 is that before that there was a position on AMC
18 with that number of shares.
19 Q. When you say, "before," do you mean
20 --
21 A. Before the period of the class.
22 Q. Okay. And so, for the next one down,
23 the "BB opening position 200 shares" is referring
24 to a position you held in BlackBerry before the
25 beginning of the class period?
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2 A. That's what I understand on the -- on
3 the document.
4 Q. And "Express minimum opening position
5 788 shares" refers to the position you held in
6 Express prior to the beginning of the class
7 period?
8 A. That is what is in the file, yeah.
9 Q. And then finally Nokia or "NOK
10 minimum opening position 200-ADSS" that refers to
11 the position you held in Nokia stock prior to the
12 beginning of the stock price -- the class period?
13 A. That's what's in the document.
14 Q. What is "ADSS" mean?
15 A. As I understand it, the Nokia as it
16 is a company that is based outside the United
17 States, it is being listed in the US as ADR,
18 yeah, so that is what it is referring to.
19 Q. That makes sense.
20 This Certification also lists
21 purchases of AMC stock, correct?
22 A. Yes, that is correct.
23 Q. And do you know why it lists --
24 A. So, basically -- sorry to interrupt.
25 Q. No, no. Please go ahead.
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2 A. Basically, the Certification states
3 about the transactions held during those periods,
4 during that period.
5 Q. And the previous certification did
6 not include AMC; is that correct?
7 A. Well, the two certifications are
8 having a different scope, yeah, and, basically,
9 the reasons to having a different scope I prefer
10 not to reveal because of client-attorney
11 privilege [INSTRUCTION]. That was worked out
12 with the my lawyers, yes.
13 Q. Is one of these Certifications the
14 current and correct certification for this
15 lawsuit?
16 A. This is --
17 MR. KIM: Well, Scott, I think as I
18 noted before, this is -- you know, when we served
19 it, this is the operative Certification. So, you
20 know, I don't want to reveal communications. But
21 this is the corrected one. This is the operative
22 one.
23 The prior one, obviously, didn't have
24 AMC in it, right. The document speaks for
25 themselves.
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2 So, I think, it's just getting hard
3 to, you know -- we're approaching on
4 attorney-client sort of communications. And I'm
5 very, you know, cautious about that. That's why
6 I'm interposing myself. But I think, you know,
7 we'll just leave it at that. And if you have
8 different questions, you know, unrelated to the
9 reasons or like that, I think, we should, you
10 know, move along.
11 MR. COHEN: No. Thank you, Phil. I
12 was just trying to ask, as you said, if this was
13 the "operative" one. So you did answer that
14 question.
15 MR. KIM: Okay.
16 MR. COHEN: Let's mark Tab 10.
17 (Deposition Exhibit 274, copy of Mr.
18 Gill's January 2021 account statement for TD
19 Ameritrade P00002120 to P00002127 marked
20 Confidential, was marked for identification.)
21 Q. So you'll see in your folder
22 Exhibit 274.
23 A. Yes, I'm seeing.
24 Q. Is this your Ameritrade account
25 statement for the month of January 1st, 2021
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2 through January 31st, 2021?
3 A. Yes, it is.
4 Q. And do you recognize this document?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. Let's go to the page with the Bates
7 Number ending 2124.
8 A. I'm on that page.
9 Q. It looks like from January 4th to
10 January 26th you continued to purchase stocks
11 related to ships and airlines; is that correct?
12 A. That is correct.
13 Q. And you didn't purchase any of the
14 stocks listed in your operative certification
15 until January 25th, 2021 in January, correct?
16 MR. KIM: Well, it's kind of vague,
17 right, cause -- I mean, GameStop isn't listed.
18 Like, what -- you mean not -- it's
19 not listed as Schedule A, but, you know, you're
20 talking about one of the relevant securities,
21 right?
22 MR. COHEN: Yeah, I mean, any of --
23 any of the affected stocks but, specifically,
24 those listed in his certification in Schedule A.
25 MR. KIM: Well...
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2 MR. COHEN: I don't see why that
3 matters.
4 MR. KIM: Well, I just want it to be
5 clear. Let me just -- sorry, I just -- let me
6 just look at the document again.
7 A. Can you repeat the question please?
8 MR. KIM: Well, GameStop isn't listed
9 in Schedule A. That's why and the first tray
10 that you're talking about is GameStop, right. So
11 I just wanted to...
12 MR. COHEN: Right. So there is going
13 to be another question about the affected stocks,
14 in particular.
15 MR. KIM: Oh, okay. Alright,
16 alright. So maybe I jumped ahead.
17 Can you just re-read the question so
18 we -- sorry about that.
19 MR. COHEN: Sure. And I'll -- I
20 guess if it makes it clearer, I'll just skip to
21 that.
22 Q. Do you understand, Mr. Gill, what I
23 refer to when I say, "the affected stocks"?
24 A. Yes, the ones that are inside of this
25 case, are part of this case.
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2 Q. So would you agree that from the
3 beginning of January 2021 through January 24th,
4 2021, you did not buy or sell any of the affected
5 stocks in this case?
6 A. Well, that is what is in the
7 statement so, yes.
8 Q. Then on January 25th, 2021 you
9 purchased 81 shares of GameStop stock, correct?
10 A. That is correct.
11 Q. And that was for $69.38 per share?
12 A. Yes, that is correct.
13 Q. Can you walk us through why on that
14 day you chose to purchase GameStop stock?
15 A. Basically, my process for investing
16 is more or the less as the ones that have been
17 discussed. Basically, I analyzed the company
18 news. I analyzed the company valuation, yeah. I
19 went through a technical analysis as well. And
20 based on that, I did -- I bought and did the
21 investment, yeah.
22 That's really the process I,
23 typically, do. And that's the process I did in
24 this case. But I don't remember any other
25 specifics for that case.
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2 Q. Would you agree that this is the
3 first time you ever purchased GameStop stock?
4 A. I don't remember if I bought it
5 before.
6 Q. But you didn't buy it before in
7 January 2021, correct?
8 A. Before in January, no. That isn't
9 what is in the statement, yes.
10 Q. And you don't recall seeing it in
11 your December 2020 statement correct?
12 A. That is correct. But before that, I
13 don't recall, to be honest.
14 Q. And the only brokerage at this time
15 in which you traded American stocks was this
16 Ameritrade account?
17 A. Yes, that is correct.
18 Q. So it stands to reason that you
19 likely did not purchase GameStop stock prior to
20 January 25th, 2021, correct?
21 A. Well, there is a possibility. But I
22 would have to check the details.
23 Q. Okay. On January 25th, 2021 or
24 thereabouts, did you see the concentration of
25 attention on GameStop in the news and in other
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2 media?
3 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
4 A. I was following the news on those
5 dates, yeah, following the news on the
6 Thinkorswim platform, and the media we have
7 discussed before. And, yes, I saw about the --
8 what was happening around this group of stocks.
9 Q. And what brought -- strike that.
10 Isn't it true that it was that media
11 and social media attention that brought GameStop
12 stock to your attention on January 25th, 2021?
13 A. I see the news daily to follow the
14 markets and I see what is going on and all
15 around. But, in general, the conclusions and the
16 decisions to make an investment is completely
17 mine.
18 Q. So did you read anything on the Wall
19 Street Bets sub-Reddit about GameStop around this
20 time?
21 A. I cannot recall, yeah.
22 Q. But it's possible?
23 MR. KIM: Objection to form.
24 A. I don't recall. I, typically, use it
25 in the media that we have discussed, which is the
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2 Thinkorswim platform, YouTube videos and Twitter
3 and that's like my normal -- it's the normal
4 information that I use for investing. And it's
5 difficult because I don't remember all the
6 details exactly what I read during those times.
7 Q. Looking at the next page, we can see
8 that you sold all of your GameStop stock the next
9 day on January 26th, 2021, correct?
10 A. That is correct.
11 Q. And you sold it at $115.4575 per
12 share?
13 A. That is what it is stated in the
14 document, yes.
15 Q. So you made a profit from that sale,
16 correct?
17 A. That is what is stated in the
18 document, yes.
19 Q. Why did you chose to sell GameStop
20 after one day?
21 A. It's difficult to remember the
22 specifics on why and which indicators were there.
23 It's difficult to know the specifics. But I was
24 following the market. I was following the news.
25 And I was following, you know, what was going on
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2 in that period. And the decision is what is in
3 the statement. So I decided to sell.
4 Q. Is it fair to say that you sold
5 because you weren't certain that the price would
6 continue to go up?
7 MR. KIM: Objection to form.
8 A. I, honestly, don't know, don't know
9 if it was going be up or down. I just yeah,
10 decided to sell based on what the market was
11 telling me, what was going on in the market and
12 in the news.
13 Q. As a general matter, if you believe
14 that a stock price is going to go up and you hold
15 that security, would you continue to hold onto
16 it?
17 MR. KIM: Objection.
18 A. Well, it's difficult to say because,
19 you know, all the strategy and all the things
20 depend on a lot of information. So generalizing
21 is complicated. I wouldn't go to any conclusion
22 or based conclusion. It depends on the case, you
23 know, from case to case.
24 Q. At this time do you recall seeing any
25 news attention about a stock squeeze with respect
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2 to GameStop stock?
3 A. I was watching the news, as you
4 probably heard, and I was -- I was aware of what
5 was going on in the market.
6 Q. Okay. Going back to the previous
7 page, you see that on January 26, 2021 you
8 deposited $2800 into this Ameritrade account?
9 A. Yes. That is what is in the
10 statement, yes.
11 Q. Do you recall why you deposited that
12 money in your account at that time?
13 A. Sorry. I was closing a window that
14 was like -- I'll get back to it.
15 Basically, no, I wanted to -- I had a
16 payment from something, what I recall, or maybe I
17 was like doing rebalancing from the accounts from
18 -- that I was having in Columbian and I put some
19 money into TD Ameritrade. The specific reasons I
20 don't know. I think I was -- I wanted to invest
21 in the market, which, of course, is the objective
22 of TD Ameritrade.
23 Q. Do you recall on January 26, 2021
24 when you made that deposit that you anticipated
25 to make a significant investment in certain
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2 stocks in the near future?
3 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
4 A. Yeah, I don't -- I don't remember the
5 specifics of why I did that decision and what was
6 I was going to do with that money. Of course,
7 the decision was to put it into the TD Ameritrade
8 account to invest, but I don't know exactly the
9 strategy or what I was going to do afterwards.
10 Q. We briefly touched on the social
11 media sources that you were engaging in before.
12 And do you recall what you said the
13 social media sources you were viewing in
14 January 2021 are?
15 MR. KIM: Objection --
16 A. I wasn't --
17 MR. KIM: -- asked and answered.
18 A. I was -- I was given the same
19 information I was -- I had been telling you,
20 which is the news on TD Ameritrade in the
21 Thinkorswim platform, YouTube videos. I do -- I
22 see information on the recaps for the market and
23 I see Twitter. I follow Twitter for news.
24 That's what I do, typically.
25 Q. And you mention something called
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2 Arena Alpha?
3 A. I, typically, follow, yeah, this
4 account, yes.
5 Q. And what is Arena Alpha again?
6 A. Arena Alpha is an institution. They
7 do education on investments. It's very good.
8 Q. And they have a presence on social
9 media?
10 A. They have a presence in social media,
11 yes.
12 Q. Do you know what platforms?
13 A. They, typically, use YouTube and,
14 typically, use Twitter as well mainly.
15 Q. Is there a person associated with
16 Arena Alpha who is posting that you're aware of?
17 A. Yes, basically, it is an institution
18 and the person that knows more about the
19 advancement in this institution is -- it was a
20 professor I was with when I did the course with
21 them years before.
22 Q. Oh, it's your professor.
23 A. It was my professor at that time,
24 which is it was like a year before or something
25 like that.
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2 Q. So did you first learn about Arena
3 Alpha's social media engagement when you were
4 being educated at Arena Alpha?
5 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
6 A. I started in the investment world
7 with both Arena Alpha and courses from the stock
8 market exchange in Columbian. Those were my
9 first learnings, yeah. And Arena Alpha, it's a
10 good source of information for investment. They
11 do -- their base is value investing.
12 Q. Do you trust that source of
13 information?
14 A. Well, it's like --
15 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
16 A. It's like any other type of
17 information. It's like you listen what they say.
18 They provide some information regarding that.
19 But all the decisions are personal, yeah.
20 Q. Are you a paid subscriber to any
21 Arena Alpha accounts?
22 A. I been a -- I been a -- I used
23 courses in the past, as I was -- had told you and
24 I was a paid subscriber as well for some time.
25 Q. And --
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2 A. Not anymore.
3 Q. What weighs the name of this
4 professor?
5 A. Let me recall. It's called Sebastian
6 Toro.
7 Q. Could you spell that? I'm sorry.
8 A. Sebastian Toro, S-E-B-E-S-T-I-N-I --
9 I'll put it in the...
10 He works for Arena Alpha.
11 (The witness typed out the name in
12 Zoom chat as S-E-B-A-S-T-I-A-N T-O-R-O.)
13 Q. And do you watch most of the content
14 that Professor Toro puts out on Arena Alpha's
15 platforms?
16 MR. KIM: Objection, vague.
17 A. I watch some content from them. All
18 it's all like very difficult to know. They
19 operate both the Columbian market and the US
20 stock market as well; mostly Columbian market.
21 But they have good content, but that's not the
22 only source of information.
23 Q. Do you listen Arena Alpha's podcasts?
24 A. They -- I don't know if they do
25 podcasts. I don't hear much podcasts. But I see
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2 the videos on YouTube. They -- they post videos
3 on YouTube.
4 Q. Do you ever ask Professor Toro's
5 advice on investment matters?
6 A. Sometimes I ask things, but it's not
7 that common.
8 MR. COHEN: Okay. Let's mark Tab 5
9 please.
10 (Deposition Exhibit 275, Twitter
11 thread P00001326 & P00001327 marked Confidential,
12 was marked for identification.)
13 Q. Mr. Gill, in your folder, you'll soon
14 see, I believe, Exhibit 275.
15 Do you recognize this document?
16 A. I have -- I have seen, yes, some of
17 the tweets. Yes, some things I remember posting,
18 yeah. I don't post much.
19 Q. Okay. And, for the record, you
20 produced this to us with the beginning Bates No.
21 P00001326.
22 A. Okay.
23 Q. Now, these are your tweets, correct?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. And did you create this document that
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2 you see in front of you?
3 A. I don't recall "creating" it, but
4 these are the tweets, yes.
5 Q. Do you recall finding these tweets so
6 that this document could be created?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. And how did you find these tweets?
9 A. I go -- I went, basically, to my
10 account and looked for in the history in Twitter.
11 Q. And what were you looking for in your
12 history?
13 A. I don't recall the specific key
14 words. But I was looking for -- by different
15 searches and this is what I found.
16 Q. Okay. Let's look at the first page
17 of this document.
18 And this top tweet has a comment on
19 it, correct?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. That you made?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. And that was on January 26, 2021?
24 A. The date I see in the first comment,
25 it's January 27th.
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2 Q. If you look below that, sir, do you
3 see on January 26, 2021 --
4 A. On the second one?
5 MR. KIM: Are you talking about at
6 the Arena Facol one; is that the one?
7 MR. COHEN: Yes.
8 MR. KIM: Okay.
9 A. Okay, I see it.
10 Q. So that is -- you're tweeting at
11 Arena Alpha, correct?
12 A. Yeah, that is correct.
13 Q. And I'm going to read what it says
14 here in English. And you'll let me know if I've
15 translated this correctly.
16 "Doc, what do you think about the
17 GameStop issue about the legality of what is
18 happening? What do you think? As a retailer,
19 can you get into trouble excluding, of course,
20 the risks of trading?"
21 A. The translation is correct.
22 Q. So when you say, "Doc, are you
23 referring to your professor Professor Toro?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. So this tweet is to ask Professor
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2 Toro advice about investing, correct?
3 MR. KIM: Objection to form. I think
4 it's more like a question.
5 A. I don't see the advice on investing.
6 I see his opinion. I am seeking his opinion on
7 the topic, which I think by seeing on the tweet
8 -- I don't recall any answer or anything.
9 Actually, the account that is listed, which is
10 Arena Alpha Facol, is the one that is for the
11 paid service, specifically, in Columbia. The
12 call is for Columbia. So my guess is I didn't
13 have any answer, but I don't recall the
14 specifics.
15 Q. What did you mean by "tema del
16 GameStop?"
17 That means GameStop issue, correct?
18 A. The topic. "Tema" is topic as well.
19 Q. Okay. And what did you mean by
20 "GameStop topic"?
21 A. I cared what was going around.
22 Q. What was going around about the
23 GameStop price spike?
24 A. The GameStop topic, all the news
25 surrounding GameStop.
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2 Q. Could you be more specific about what
3 you meant about "GameStop topic"?
4 A. It's difficult to recall specifics on
5 that matter. Because I don't know the -- exactly
6 what were, specifically, the happenings on that
7 date and everything. It's January 26th. So it's
8 before -- even it's before the period of this
9 class. So I don't -- I don't know exactly what
10 is the context of that tweet, of that message.
11 But it's around the topic of GameStop, which is
12 literally what is stated there in the tweet.
13 Q. You said the GameStop topic involves
14 several different attributes of what was going on
15 with GameStop at that time?
16 A. Yeah, it's like the literal question
17 states, "what do you think about the topic around
18 GameStop," which is very vague.
19 Q. Did the "topic around GameStop" at
20 that time include the GameStop stock price spike
21 at that time?
22 A. It's -- I'm assuming -- it's
23 difficult to assume and I don't remember the
24 specifics or what was going on January 26th or
25 before, which was before all the matters of this
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2 class. But it's difficult to recall specifics.
3 Q. In general, did the GameStop topic
4 have to do with trading GameStop stock?
5 A. There was -- it's like it's very
6 vague, yeah, I mean, that topic. And that topic
7 involves many things, yeah. And -- but it was
8 referring -- that tweet was referring in general
9 to that topic, not to something in particular.
10 And I can only judge -- I can only
11 answer for what it's in the tweet. More from
12 that it's more like speculation.
13 Q. Well, please speculate. Tell me --
14 MR. KIM: No, he's not going to
15 speculate. We're not here to -- you know, come
16 on. You're not asking a witness to speculate
17 about something that happened a couple of years
18 ago. [INSTRUCTION] He's not going to answer that
19 question.
20 Q. Mr. Gill, is it your testimony under
21 oath that you don't recall anything about what
22 the "GameStop topic" was when you asked your
23 professor?
24 A. Well, the "GameStop topic," yeah,
25 what I recall is that there was a demand for a
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2 group of stocks. The stocks that the -- called
3 the meme stock, there was demand for that. There
4 was many people short on those stocks and there
5 was a lot of news about this topic, yeah, about
6 these stocks. That's what I recall.
7 And -- but, specifically, what was
8 going on on that day and what was like taking me
9 to ask this person about it, I don't -- I don't
10 remember the specifics. The generalities it's
11 like -- it's what we know about the case.
12 Q. And, in general, this also refers to
13 the purported coordinated trading of GameStop
14 stock, right?
15 MR. KIM: Objection, assumes facts.
16 A. I don't -- I don't know about any
17 coordinated attack or -- I don't know anything
18 about if people were getting involved with each
19 other. I don't know, yeah. I just saw the news
20 and I saw the news on the media that we have been
21 discussing, which is the Thinkorswim platform,
22 the YouTube videos I watch for the market recap
23 videos and the Twitter. That's what I can see.
24 And I cannot state anything about any coordinated
25 attack. I have --
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2 Q. And what did you -- what did you
3 think might be illegal then if you look at your
4 tweet?
5 A. I don't -- I don't know and I don't
6 remember. That's speculation.
7 Q. But you don't deny that you are
8 asking about the legality of what was happening
9 with regard to GameStop, correct?
10 A. Well, that's the question. Of
11 course, I cannot deny that. That's for sure.
12 But exactly what I was referring to
13 is -- honestly, I don't recall it, specifically.
14 Q. Were you worried that your investment
15 in GameStop the day before this could potentially
16 be a legal problem?
17 A. That's speculation as well. But it
18 was related to that, of course.
19 Q. And is that because you -- no, go
20 ahead.
21 A. So -- but the details are
22 speculation.
23 Q. Were you worried that you believed
24 what was going on with GameStop stock was market
25 manipulation?
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2 MR. KIM: Objection to form.
3 A. I don't know. I was not worried for
4 that. That's -- that's -- that's what I
5 remember, not for that specific reason for sure,
6 but as you can see in the tweet, I was worried.
7 But I cannot recall exactly the reason.
8 Q. You refer to retail traders, correct?
9 A. Yeah, saying that there are, like,
10 big groups of traders or investors, yeah,
11 institution and retail. So we are all the
12 retail. If we are in the market, we are all the
13 retail.
14 Q. And you're asking can retailers like
15 you get into trouble regarding the GameStop stock
16 topic, correct?
17 A. That's what the tweet says, yes.
18 Q. Are you normally worried about the
19 legality of your stock trades?
20 MR. KIM: Objection, form.
21 A. I am like -- of course, when you do
22 an investment, you do the research and you do it
23 in order, of course, to make the best of the
24 investment. That's what we all do when we
25 invest, not only in the stock market but in
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2 general. So that's part of the process.
3 Q. Have you ever asked Professor Toro
4 before about the legality of your stock trades?
5 A. I have asked several things to this
6 guy, to Sebastian, definitely.
7 Q. About whether your stock trades could
8 be illegal?
9 A. No. It's like -- I have asked
10 generalities, yeah. It's like -- I would say
11 when we are students of somebody and then you
12 trusted somebody, it's good to ask his view on
13 these things. But at the end all the decisions,
14 the final decisions are completely mine. That is
15 just one opinion, as watching one news or
16 watching one video. They have their views. They
17 have their saying on any topic and then you say
18 -- you see many opinions, yeah, many news and
19 then you make your own decision. But decisions
20 are personal.
21 By the way, he's not a financial
22 advisor in any case.
23 Q. You mean he's --
24 A. He's just in education.
25 Q. Right, I understand that.
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2 So, just as a general matter, based
3 on your trades in GameStop stock the day before,
4 you are asking your professor about the possible
5 illegality surrounding the GameStop topic?
6 MR. KIM: Objection. I think you're
7 mischaracterizing the document. The document
8 speaks for itself so...
9 A. Yeah, it's what the tweet was about
10 and nothing else, yeah. It's like nothing as
11 specific on that topic, yeah. And I don't recall
12 if there was an answer or not or what was the
13 answer. It's like -- it's like that. It's
14 what's in the document.
15 Q. And it's your testimony here today
16 that you have no idea what you were talking about
17 when you said the, legality of the GameStop
18 topic?
19 MR. KIM: I mean, you don't need to
20 raise your voice at the client. So I'd ask you
21 to refrain from raising your voice to the client.
22 But I think to the extent that you
23 can answer the question, you can, Mr. Gill.
24 A. Well, I remember what I am telling
25 you, yeah, that I was seeing the news, yeah, and
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2 what was going on in the market surrounding these
3 stocks and the other part of the market, which
4 is, of course, very big and what's going on with
5 the whole market. And I had -- I had questions
6 and so I reached out to the professor. But the
7 specifics why, I cannot recall, to be honest.
8 Q. And this was the same time that you
9 purchased GameStop stock, correct?
10 A. I don't remember if it was before or
11 after. But it was around that date, as we saw on
12 the statement.
13 Q. Okay. When we looked at your trades
14 before, we noted that you made a profit in
15 selling the GameStop that day, correct?
16 A. Yeah, that is correct.
17 Q. And you made the profit after only
18 holding GameStop for one day, correct?
19 A. Yes, that is correct. That is what
20 is in the document.
21 Q. Do you remember tweeting this before
22 or after you sold that stock?
23 A. I don't remember if it was --
24 THE STENOGRAPHER: He froze.
25 A. -- before or after or there was this
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2 tweet.
3 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: He's frozen.
4 A. I don't remember -- am I back again?
5 I don't remember if I tweeted this
6 before or after, but I tweeted it and it was
7 around that date.
8 Q. Let's go back to your Ameritrade
9 January 2021 account statement. I believe it is
10 Exhibit 274?
11 MR. KIM: Hey, Scott, I just want to
12 flag we've been going an hour. So, I mean, if
13 you got a few more minutes, you know, that would
14 be good. But, you know, whenever you want to
15 take a break.
16 MR. COHEN: Okay. Let's go a few
17 more minutes.
18 MR. KIM: Okay.
19 A. Okay.
20 Q. Alright. We noted before that, you
21 deposited more funds into your account on
22 January 26th, correct?
23 A. Let me go back to that page. Yes,
24 correct.
25 Q. And we can also see that on
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2 January 27th you decided to deposit more funds
3 into your account, correct?
4 A. Yes, that is correct.
5 Q. And that was for $1400?
6 A. Yes, that is correct.
7 Q. And that was the day after the tweet
8 we were just looking at regarding the legality of
9 the GameStop topic, correct?
10 MR. KIM: I'd just object to the form
11 insofar that it assumes that's when the deposits
12 were made. I don't know -- you know, it just
13 says, funds deposited, wire received. I mean, I
14 don't know how long to do a wire to be reflected
15 in a brokerage account. I mean, I guess, it's
16 possible that it might have been a day other than
17 those days. So, to that extent, I object.
18 But you can answer the questions if
19 you can.
20 A. It was around those dates.
21 Q. Okay. And, just to be clear, you see
22 that on January 27, 2021 you made -- you took the
23 action to deposit -- to make your wire transfer
24 and on that same day, that transaction settled,
25 correct?
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2 A. I don't remember the duration of the
3 -- of those transfer and those dates. Right now
4 it's like in the same day. But in two years ago,
5 I'm not pretty sure. I think it takes one day
6 or, at least, half a day depending on the time.
7 But it was around those dates.
8 Q. Why did you deposit more funds around
9 that date?
10 MR. KIM: Objection, asked and
11 answered. I mean, didn't we go over this when we
12 were looking at this document earlier?
13 MR. COHEN: No. Actually, we went
14 over the deposit of the January 26th funds. This
15 is a new deposit.
16 MR. KIM: Oh, okay. Alright. Well,
17 my attention is not as good as yours.
18 A. Basically, yeah, I put some money in
19 the account, yeah, because I wanted to invest.
20 But the specifics of how to invest it and stuff
21 is -- it's difficult to know. I don't recall the
22 details.
23 Q. Okay. And you put this money in the
24 account on that day because you wanted to invest
25 more in GameStop, specifically, correct?
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2 A. That is speculation. I don't know.
3 Q. Alright. Well, let's --
4 A. I don't know. And as I -- I don't
5 recall it, specifically, what -- why -- what did
6 I buy with those funds. I don't recall. But,
7 yeah, it's the information that is in the
8 statements where we can see the details.
9 Q. Let's turn to the next page, sir,
10 ending 2125.
11 A. I am in this page.
12 Q. On January 27, 2021, do you see that
13 you purchased AMC, BlackBerry, Nokia and Express
14 stock?
15 A. Yes, it's in there.
16 Q. And these were all stocks that you
17 had heard at the time were being affected by the
18 short squeeze, correct?
19 MR. KIM: Objection to form.
20 A. If those were stocks that were in the
21 news, yeah, I agree completely. They were in the
22 news during those days and that's why I did the
23 process for investing in this company and the
24 process was to the same one that I typically use,
25 yeah.
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2 So I see the news around them. I see
3 the fundamentals. I see the technicals and based
4 on all the information, I make a decision, yeah.
5 And that's the process I have done with all the
6 stocks I, typically, trade.
7 Q. You had previously purchased AMC
8 stock in December 2020, correct?
9 A. Yes, that is correct.
10 Q. And why did you decide to buy more
11 AMC stock on this specific day?
12 A. Well, basically -- I don't know the
13 specifics of the trading strategy. But what I
14 can see is that, basically, I was right on the
15 initial strategy, yeah, and the initial strategy
16 is exactly aligned to what I'm telling you. It's
17 company that is undervalued, yeah, based on the
18 analysis I did and now the price is going higher.
19 So that's like the analysis that was done before.
20 You can see it in the price action. So it's part
21 of the process.
22 Q. Did you believe at that time that the
23 increase in share price in AMC at the time was
24 solely due to the market realizing the
25 fundamental value of the company?
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2 MR. KIM: Objection to form, vague.
3 A. It's always difficult to know why a
4 stock is going up in value or why it's going down
5 in value. It's very difficult to know from the
6 market and from the news it's like that's the day
7 to day of every person that is on the market.
8 And that's what happens with these stocks as
9 well, yeah.
10 And, basically, what my personal
11 process is the one that I have been speaking
12 about is I see the company. I see the
13 fundamentals. I see the news. Based on that, I
14 do the decisions to buy the stocks, yeah. That's
15 more or less the process.
16 And when you see the price is going
17 down -- going up, you validate your analysis that
18 -- the analysis that you have done. So it
19 actually don't make sense, yeah. And that's more
20 or less the process that I was going through
21 those days.
22 Q. This was the first time you had ever
23 purchased BlackBerry stock, right?
24 A. I cannot -- I cannot recall. But I
25 think so...
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2 Q. And this was the first time you had
3 ever purchased Nokia stock, right?
4 A. I don't recall, but I think so...
5 Q. And this was the first time you had
6 ever purchased Express stock, right?
7 A. I don't recall the specifics, but I
8 would say so...
9 MR. COHEN: Alright. You want to
10 take a break now?
11 MR. KIM: Sure, sure.
12 A. Sure.
13 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Stand by. One
14 second please. Stand by.
15 The time is 6:35 p.m. We're going
16 off the record. This will end Media Unit No. 3.
17 We're off the record.
18 (Recess taken 6:35 to 6:52 p.m.
19 Serbian time.)
20 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
21 6:52 p.m. We are back on the record. This will
22 be the start of Media Unit No. 4.
23 Q. Mr. Gill, when you were making those
24 trades on January 27th, 2021, you were also
25 viewing news and social media about the market in
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2 general, correct?
3 A. Yeah, that is correct.
4 Q. And in viewing that news, you saw
5 items regarding the so-called meme stocks?
6 A. I saw news in the market including
7 those stocks, yes.
8 Q. And were you reading anything
9 specific?
10 A. I don't remember the specific. But,
11 yes, I was watching the news, including that
12 group of stocks.
13 Q. Were you watching YouTube at all?
14 A. Yes, for sure.
15 Q. And you were on Twitter?
16 A. On Twitter, yes.
17 Q. I want to show you Exhibit 276, if
18 you can pull that up.
19 (Deposition Exhibit 276, different
20 Twitter threads with no Bates, was marked for
21 identification.)
22 A. Sure.
23 Q. And these are more of your tweets,
24 correct?
25 A. I'm taking -- yes.
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2 Q. Let's go to the last page of this
3 document.
4 A. Last page?
5 Q. The last page, right.
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. Oh, I'm sorry, the second to last
8 page. So you'll see a picture of a shark it
9 looks like in one of the tweets.
10 A. Uh-huh.
11 Q. It looks like on January 27, 2021,
12 you responded to a tweet from Arena Alpha; is
13 that correct?
14 A. Well, that is what is in the
15 document, yes.
16 Q. And you commented -- the tweet that
17 you commented on says, "FUBO AMC, NOK and GME
18 were el nuevo FANG," correct?
19 A. Yes, that is in the tweet.
20 Q. And in English that means the new
21 F.A.N.G.?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. Can you explain what that means?
24 A. Well, basically, there is a group of
25 stocks, yeah, that are well-known which are the
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2 FANG, yeah. It's a Facebook -- I don't remember
3 the -- it's Facebook in there. It's Google in
4 there. It's Netflix in there for the end. I
5 don't remember the "A." Maybe it's Alphabet;
6 Facebook Alphabet and Nokia -- well, big stocks,
7 yeah, big technological stocks, yeah. And I was
8 saying the "new FANG," which are the stocks
9 below, which is FUBO, AMC, Nokia and GME.
10 Q. And this tweet has as a laughing face
11 next to it, right?
12 A. Yes, it's there.
13 Q. So did you perceive this tweet to be
14 making a joke of some kind?
15 A. Well, it was a tweet I saw and I
16 reacted to it, of course.
17 Q. Did you think it was funny?
18 A. It's what was happening in the
19 market. I mean, Facebook, Google, Netflix are
20 huge companies, yeah, and the others are smaller
21 companies. That's -- there is no question about
22 it. And it was what was going on in the market
23 and I was reacting to that.
24 Q. So you were reacting to how FUBO,
25 AMC, Nokia and GameStop were being compared to
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2 these enormous companies?
3 A. Yeah. Well, they were going up in
4 valuation, yeah, actually, aligned to what was my
5 analysis. So, yeah, I reacted to that, which is
6 I would say normal.
7 Q. You've heard of Robinhood, correct?
8 A. Yes, I've heard, of course.
9 Q. And you understand this is an action
10 against Robinhood?
11 A. Yes, that is correct.
12 Q. You don't have a Robinhood account,
13 though, right?
14 A. No, I don't. I am TD Ameritrade
15 client, but I don't have a Robinhood account.
16 Q. Why not?
17 A. Basically, when I started operating
18 the US market, I evaluated different options.
19 And based on my needs, TD Ameritrade was the one
20 that fit my needs.
21 Q. And if you don't have a Robinhood
22 account and you don't trade on Robinhood, then
23 why are you suing Robinhood?
24 A. Well, basically, this class is for --
25 we are suing Robinhood for market manipulation
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2 and when it turned off the buy button, it, like,
3 affected the demand for these stocks. So there
4 is a market manipulation. It's for the market,
5 not only for their clients. It's for the market.
6 So that's why.
7 Q. Is it your opinion that by turning
8 off the buy button, Robinhood affected the stock
9 prices?
10 MR. KIM: Objection to form.
11 A. Well, basically, there is a market
12 manipulation, yeah, and there are technical
13 proofs on that and technical proofs that
14 disabling the buy button it makes the demand
15 lower for these stocks thus making the price of
16 the stock go down. If you only have one side
17 equation for defining the price, yeah, only --
18 you can only sell, not buy, then you are
19 manipulating the price of the stock market. And
20 that's why -- that's what's in the class.
21 Q. Was that analysis something you
22 believed back when Robinhood put the stock
23 purchase restrictions in place?
24 A. That was an analysis of mine, yes,
25 and that's why I contacted The Rosen Law Firm.
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2 But technicals and the details and the evidence,
3 everything was prepared by them, by The Rosen Law
4 Firm.
5 Q. But as soon as you saw these
6 restrictions were in place, was that your fear?
7 MR. KIM: Objection, form.
8 A. I don't remember exactly how it
9 happened. It's like in the day to day. But, of
10 course, it affected me because, of course, if you
11 cannot buy, yeah, you affect the stock price, the
12 demand, and then that is, like, affects directly
13 the price. So, yes, of course, it affected my
14 decisions on the day to day.
15 But I don't remember exactly how it
16 happened. But it affected, of course, the
17 overall performance in the market and, of course,
18 I lost money on that and that's why we are here.
19 Q. So, as we were discussing, you're
20 aware that Robinhood implemented certain
21 purchasing restrictions on its platform on
22 January 28th, right?
23 A. Yeah, I don't remember exactly the
24 specifics. But, yeah, those restrictions were
25 implemented. And that was all over the news.
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2 Q. Was it -- it was all over the news
3 the day it happened?
4 A. Yes, I remember I was on the
5 Thinkorswim platform and I saw the news there.
6 It was like very public. And -- but, yes, I
7 don't remember exactly the date or the time.
8 Q. Can you describe for me the
9 restrictions that Robinhood put in place?
10 A. Yeah, all the evidence, all the
11 technical analysis was done by The Rosen Law
12 Firm, yeah. But their restrictions I remember
13 was the first one, the main one was that the buy
14 button was disabled. Thus affecting the stock
15 prices, as we discussed, that made the prices go
16 down directly. And besides that there were some
17 restrictions to buy, like, you can just buy one
18 share or five shares of something, but it was
19 like more or less the same as having the button
20 disabled. And I don't remember the specifics on
21 those restrictions. But those restrictions were
22 in place and there was public documentation in
23 place, even Robinhood documentation stating those
24 restrictions.
25 Q. And Robinhood never forced you to
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2 trade securities, correct?
3 A. Yeah, that is correct.
4 Q. Do you recall which stocks
5 Robinhood's restrictions affected?
6 A. I don't remember the specifics. But
7 they are in the group of the ones discussed in
8 this class.
9 Q. Do you know how long the restrictions
10 lasted?
11 A. No. Those details I don't know them,
12 but they are part of the complaint.
13 Q. Do you have an understanding about
14 why Robinhood imposed the restrictions?
15 A. I have a general understanding, yeah.
16 But I don't agree. It's market manipulation,
17 yeah. And that's why I don't agree, yeah, and
18 that's why I contacted The Rosen Law Firm in the
19 first place. But all the technical details and
20 what was going on in the market, yeah, it's part
21 of the work being done by The Rosen Law Firm.
22 Q. When the restrictions were put in
23 place and you first learned about it, did you
24 speak with anyone about them?
25 A. Not that I recall. In Columbia, not
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2 many of my friends -- actually, no one of my
3 friends trades on the market. So, no, that I
4 recall.
5 Q. Do you recall any restrictions by
6 other brokers?
7 A. I remember there were some, yes.
8 Q. Okay. I want to show you another
9 exhibit. This will be Exhibit 277 in your
10 folder.
11 (Deposition Exhibit 277, Ameritrade
12 announcement entitled, "Security Impacts Related
13 to Market Conditions," was marked for
14 identification.)
15 Q. Let me know when you have it up.
16 A. I have it open.
17 Q. Do you recognize this announcement?
18 A. I recognize that it is from TD
19 Ameritrade.
20 Q. Have you seen it before?
21 A. Maybe I have. I could have, of
22 course, because I was very on the market during
23 those times. But exactly if I saw it, I cannot
24 recall, but I might have seen it.
25 Q. And this is an announcement by TD
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2 Ameritrade alerting its customers that, "In the
3 interest of mitigating risks for our company and
4 clients, we have put in place several
5 restrictions on some transactions in GME, AMC and
6 other securities," right?
7 A. Yes, that's what is in the
8 communication.
9 Q. Did there come a time when you became
10 aware that TD Ameritrade imposed certain
11 restrictions on these same stocks that we've been
12 talking about?
13 MR. KIM: Which ones? Are you
14 talking about this announcement, GME, AMC, or are
15 you talking about other stocks?
16 MR. COHEN: The group of stocks that
17 we've been talking about in this case but
18 including GME and AMC.
19 A. Sorry, can you repeat that question
20 again? Sorry about that.
21 Q. No problem.
22 Did there come a time when you became
23 aware that TD Ameritrade also imposed certain
24 restrictions on the trading of these stocks
25 including GameStop and AMC?
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2 A. I was aware there were restrictions
3 in the market, yes. I don't know to what extent
4 was the market and the prices, like, impacted by
5 this. I believe you have to do a much deeper
6 analysis to that and that analysis has been done
7 by my lawyers, by The Rosen Law Firm. And
8 basically, what I understand is that the impact
9 is way more less than their restrictions done by
10 Robinhood.
11 But all the technicals, yeah, and all
12 the specific analysis are -- have been done by
13 The Rosen Law Firm and, of course, I support all
14 this analysis.
15 Q. So the restrictions that TD
16 Ameritrade put on these stocks, did those affect
17 your ability to purchase stocks like GameStop and
18 AMC?
19 MR. KIM: Objection to form.
20 A. It's difficult to say specifics.
21 Even in this communication, there is no detail on
22 what restrictions were. And I don't remember,
23 specifically, what was going in the specific
24 time, yeah.
25 But I believe these things, this
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2 detail, this technical detail is to be seen with
3 all the detail analysis done by The Rosen Law
4 Firm.
5 Q. Are you also suing TD Ameritrade?
6 A. No, it's not part of this class.
7 Q. Are you seeking to sue them in
8 addition?
9 A. That's another matter, another
10 discussion. But what we have done for this class
11 is that only Robinhood is being sued because
12 that's what the evidence suggests and that the
13 technical analysis suggests. So that's why it's
14 only part -- that -- they are the only ones in
15 this class. That's why.
16 Q. And you believe that Robinhood has
17 been wrong for doing this for a long time,
18 correct?
19 A. Yeah, that is correct. I personally
20 -- I am in the stock market and we are investors.
21 So I think that the conditions of the market
22 should be transparent. And these kind of things,
23 this market manipulation, I think they are wrong
24 and they are wrong for the market and the market
25 it's important that it is transparent and it's
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2 transparent to all the investors. So that's why
3 I don't like this market manipulations.
4 Q. Let's go --
5 A. Any of them.
6 Q. Let's go back to 275, the exhibit.
7 A. I am in the exhibit.
8 Q. If you can turn to the last page
9 please.
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. This shows two tweets of yours, one
12 on January 29, 2021 and one on January 30, 2021?
13 A. Yeah that's what's in the document,
14 yes.
15 Q. So, on January 29, 2021, you were
16 responding to another tweet saying, "looks like
17 Robinhood is limiting most of chamath's SPAC
18 stocks," and then it lists other stocks too,
19 correct?
20 A. That's what it says in the tweet,
21 yes.
22 Q. And the article that was posted along
23 with that tweet is -- at least, the first part of
24 the title says, "Robinhood is still severely
25 limiting trading"?
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2 A. Yes, that's what's in the tweet, yes.
3 Q. And then you say, "that's illegal.
4 Cowards and robbers. At least 20 years. We need
5 transparency in the markets," correct?
6 A. That's correct. That's what's in the
7 tweet.
8 Q. Can you explain what that means?
9 A. Yeah, I don't recall exactly the
10 contents of the article, yeah. But I was
11 basically having a reaction, you know, to what
12 was going on in the market.
13 As I was telling you before, I don't
14 like market manipulations at all. And I think
15 the market should be transparent and good for
16 investors. In the long-term and in the
17 short-term, that has to happen. That's my
18 reaction. And that was their reaction then.
19 That's what I can see in the tweet. So,
20 basically, I am against market manipulation. But
21 I don't know what is in that article. So it's
22 difficult to draw up further conclusions to that.
23 Q. Okay. But it's fair to say that as
24 of the time you posted that, you believed that
25 Robinhood had done something wrong, correct?
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2 A. Yeah, that is correct.
3 Q. You believe that they were engaging
4 in market manipulation, right?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. Who were the "cowards and robbers"
7 that you're talking about here?
8 A. I don't know the contents of the
9 article. But I was against market manipulation
10 so the people doing the market manipulation,
11 yeah.
12 I am not, specifically, talking about
13 anyone, in particular, but the people doing
14 market manipulation I don't approve.
15 Q. And you say here, "at least
16 20 years"?
17 A. That was very reactive, of course.
18 Q. But you're talking about jail time,
19 right?
20 A. Yeah, I'm not a lawyer, as you know.
21 I am someone in IT and I was doing -- having a
22 reaction on Twitter for something that I don't
23 approve.
24 I don't remember, specifically, the
25 happenings, the specific happenings on those
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2 dates. But I was having a reaction. And that's
3 what's in the tweet. And this is from a
4 non-lawyer.
5 Q. SPAC insider is a known lawyer?
6 A. Where are you reading? I'm sorry.
7 Q. I'm sorry. Who are you saying that's
8 from a known [sic] lawyer?
9 THE STENOGRAPHER: He said
10 non-lawyer. I'm so sorry.
11 Q. Oh, a non-lawyer. I'm sorry.
12 A. Oh, a non-lawyer. That's me.
13 Q. No, it was my mishearing.
14 You also tweeted beneath that, "go to
15 Webull."
16 Do you see that?
17 A. Yeah, I see it.
18 Q. What is "Webull"?
19 A. It's another broker.
20 Q. Oh. Do you use Webull?
21 A. No, not at all. I know that it
22 exists and it's in the market, but I don't use
23 it. I have evaluated Webull when I did the
24 evaluation. Webull was one of the alternatives.
25 But I haven't used Webull before. But it is part
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2 of the tweet and it's part of their reaction.
3 That's it.
4 Q. Do you recall why you wanted people
5 to go to Webull?
6 MR. KIM: Objection to form.
7 A. Yeah, we are in a case against market
8 manipulation. So it was a reaction, yeah. I
9 know it's bad to react, but it was a reaction to
10 something I don't agree with. So that's why the
11 comment. But, yeah, nothing else.
12 Q. So it was your reaction that Webull
13 was also involved in restricting stock purchases?
14 A. Well, that is speculation and that is
15 not what it says on the tweet. The tweet says,
16 "go to Webull." But that doesn't suggest
17 anything else.
18 Q. Right. So I'm just trying to figure
19 out what it means, because I also don't know.
20 MR. KIM: Well, I think he answered
21 the question the first time but...
22 Q. I'm sorry, then one more time.
23 What are you suggesting with respect
24 to "Webull"?
25 A. Well, Webull is another broker, yeah.
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2 I haven't used Webull. Actually, I don't follow
3 much about what is happening to Webull, yeah. On
4 that period of time, I don't know if they put
5 restrictions or not. I'm not aware of that.
6 Maybe they did, maybe they don't. I don't know.
7 I was just -- that tweet is regarding a reaction
8 I had to an article, yeah, and it doesn't mean
9 anything else. It's like the article -- the
10 title says, Robinhood is limiting trading,
11 "severely limiting trading," et cetera, et
12 cetera. And I'm reacting to that, yeah, saying
13 that there is market manipulation.
14 And the next comment says, "go to
15 Webull." That's like, I think, it's
16 self-explanatory. So, that if someone reads the
17 tweet, yeah, tell -- it's like telling the people
18 to go to other broker that doesn't do this kind
19 of market manipulation.
20 Q. So let's go back to your January 2021
21 Ameritrade statement, which is Exhibit 274, I
22 think.
23 A. I'm in it. Which page?
24 Q. Let's go to the page ending 2126?
25 A. I'm in it.
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2 Q. It looks like that on January 28th,
3 2021 you purchased 81 more AMC shares on your
4 Ameritrade account, correct?
5 A. Yes, that is correct.
6 Q. Okay. Why did you buy these shares
7 at that time?
8 A. Well, I don't remember the specifics,
9 yeah. The general investment thesis was the
10 same, yeah, in which I did based on the
11 fundamentals I went to the news, I went to
12 technicals. And based on that, I went to do
13 these buy, all those -- actually, all those
14 transactions there.
15 But the specifics of why I did this
16 order or the other one, it's difficult to recall
17 and I don't recall.
18 Q. Do you recall if you made this
19 purchase before or after you found out that
20 Robinhood had implemented its purchasing
21 restrictions?
22 A. I don't recall the specifics. Yeah,
23 I don't recall it, specifically, on which date
24 the restrictions started and where they were
25 changed and then when they were like up. Yeah, I
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2 don't recall exactly that. And I don't recall
3 how it goes with this transactions. Honestly,
4 that's a lot of detail to remember, to recall.
5 Q. You also purchased 14 Express shares
6 on this day, correct?
7 A. Yeah, that is correct.
8 Q. And you purchased Express shares for
9 the same reason as you purchased your AMC shares?
10 A. It's like -- it's -- the analysis --
11 the base analysis is the same, yeah, and it's the
12 same done with AMC but for Express, yeah. And
13 based on the analysis -- well, the operation was
14 made and it was made as it is on this statement.
15 But I don't remember exactly what was
16 happening on that time and I don't remember
17 exactly what the price action was. So it's
18 difficult to say exactly the strategy for those
19 trades for those buys.
20 Q. After you purchased Express shares on
21 January 28, 2021, it looks like you in that same
22 day quickly sold off shares for several companies
23 that same day, correct?
24 A. Yeah, that is what is in the
25 statement.
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2 Q. So you sold AMC, Nokia, BlackBerry
3 and Express shares on January 28th, 2021?
4 A. That's what's in the statement, yes.
5 Q. Okay. Is it a fair inference that
6 that you sold these shares after you learned of
7 Robinhood's restrictions?
8 A. Yeah. Honestly, exactly, I don't
9 know exactly why I sold seeing at the statement
10 right now, because, yeah, it's difficult to
11 remember the exact things that were happening in
12 and which times the things were happening and
13 which specific news were going on at that time.
14 So, the specifics I, honestly, don't recall.
15 Q. These are the stocks that were being
16 affected by the Robinhood trade restrictions,
17 correct?
18 A. As I recall, yes.
19 Q. Did you see something on social media
20 at this time indicating that there were stock
21 purchase restrictions on these companies' stocks?
22 A. Yeah, I don't remember, specifically,
23 the news on those dates, yeah, and what was
24 happening in that specific date. I, honestly,
25 don't remember, yeah.
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2 What I can tell you is that I
3 operated the market based on the Thinkorswim
4 platform, the news on Thinkorswim platform and
5 the Twitter that I have been telling you and the
6 YouTube I have been telling you all along.
7 Q. And then if you look at the next day,
8 on January 29th, you continued to sell AMC,
9 Express and BlackBerry shares, correct?
10 A. Yeah, that is what is in the
11 statement, yes.
12 Q. And, as we saw in the tweet we looked
13 at just a few minutes ago, you were certainly
14 aware that Robinhood had instituted its
15 restrictions by January 29th, correct?
16 A. Yeah, as I was telling you, I don't
17 remember the specifics, yeah, and exactly when
18 the restrictions were imposed.
19 What was the scope of their
20 restrictions each day, what was the price action,
21 yeah, that was happening on the markets during
22 those times, yeah, I don't recall that -- those
23 specifics. But the transactions are there in the
24 statement. So, of course, yeah, they happen as
25 they are reflected on the statement.
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2 Q. And on January 29th, you made the
3 comment on Twitter to go to "Webull," correct?
4 A. It is what is in the document.
5 Q. Okay. Let's go back to that
6 document.
7 A. What's the exhibit?
8 (There is a discussion off the
9 record.)
10 Q. It's 275.
11 A. 275?
12 Q. Yes.
13 A. I'm back in, in the exhibit. I'm on
14 that page.
15 Q. So you see that the January 29th,
16 2021 tweet was about Robinhood "severely limiting
17 trading," correct?
18 A. Yeah, that's what's in the tweet,
19 yes, in the article from that tweet, yes.
20 Q. And then on January 29, 2021, you
21 also commented on that tweet, correct?
22 A. Yes, that's correct. That is what is
23 in that tweet, yes.
24 Q. So, on January 29th, you were aware
25 that there were trading restrictions that
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2 Robinhood implemented, right?
3 A. That is what is in the tweet, yes.
4 Q. Let's go back to the exhibit we were
5 just in, which is Exhibit 274.
6 A. In what page?
7 Q. Page 2127.
8 A. Alright. I'm here.
9 Q. So, also, on January 29th, after you
10 made those -- you sold those shares, you also
11 purchased more AMC stock.
12 Do you see that?
13 A. I see it's in the statement, yes.
14 Q. Do you know why you had purchased the
15 AMC stock on January 29th after selling it that
16 same day?
17 A. Yeah, it's difficult to see -- to
18 recall the detail, yeah. And without knowing
19 what was going on, specifically, on those day in
20 the news and, specifically, in those days on the
21 price action. So it's difficult to say, yeah.
22 It's -- honestly, I don't recall.
23 Q. Is it fair to say that there was a
24 lot of confusion going on from your perspective?
25 MR. KIM: Objection to form.
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2 A. That is difficult to say, yeah. I
3 don't recall exactly what was -- why I did all
4 these -- all these purchase and sells, yeah. And
5 they were -- and the processes on that.
6 But to say it's "confusion," it's
7 like -- it's difficult to say. I wouldn't agree
8 to that.
9 Q. And do you recall what was going
10 through your head at all at this time?
11 A. No, those specifics, no.
12 Q. Let's go to a new exhibit.
13 MR. COHEN: Tab 12.
14 Q. And it will be 278.
15 (Deposition Exhibit 278, copy of Mr.
16 Gill's February 2021 account statement for
17 Ameritrade P00002128 to P00002135 marked
18 Confidential, was marked for identification.)
19 A. I can see it.
20 Q. We're having some technical
21 difficulties.
22 A. There it is.
23 MR. COHEN: And, for the record, the
24 beginning Bates Number is P00002128.
25 Q. So, Mr. Gill, this is your Ameritrade
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2 account statement for the month of February 1st,
3 2021 through February 28, 2021?
4 A. Yes, that is correct.
5 Q. Let's go to the page ending 2133.
6 A. I'm in the page.
7 Q. If you look at the fourth row down --
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. -- you made -- you made several stock
10 trades on February 3rd, 2021.
11 Do you see that?
12 MR. KIM: You mean February 1 or is
13 it the 3rd?
14 Q. I'm sorry. They were --
15 February 1st, 2021 and settled on February 3rd,
16 2021.
17 A. Yes, I see them.
18 Q. Okay. So we can see that you bought
19 a 150 more shares of AMC stock for $15.20 per
20 share, correct?
21 A. That's correct.
22 Q. And this was after you saw that
23 Robinhood had imposed its purchasing
24 restrictions, correct?
25 A. Yeah, that is correct.
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2 Q. Could you tell me why you continued
3 to buy the AMC stock at this time?
4 A. Yeah, it's -- it's difficult to say
5 because it's all -- it is tied to the news and to
6 the market what is pricing there in the details.
7 I don't remember if there were like some
8 restrictions that were not there anymore, yeah,
9 or any other things happening in the market,
10 yeah. So it's like -- basically, I don't know.
11 I don't recall.
12 Q. And then you sold 100 shares of AMC
13 on that same day, right?
14 A. I think it's the day after. It's the
15 2nd of February.
16 Q. This is the 1st of February; the row
17 up from where you're looking.
18 A. Ah, okay.
19 Q. Do you see that you sold 100 shares
20 of AMC stock at $12.37 per share?
21 A. Yeah. Yeah, I see it.
22 Q. Do you recall the reason why you sold
23 the AMC shares shortly after purchasing them?
24 A. I don't -- I don't remember the
25 specifics, yeah. But they are tied to specific
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2 news in the market and the price action. So it's
3 difficult to comment, yeah, after two years. I
4 don't recall.
5 Q. Did you at the time believe that
6 AMC's stock was trading in a volatile way?
7 A. It was volatile, yes.
8 Q. Did that affect your analysis of when
9 to buy and sell stock?
10 A. Well, the pricing -- the market --
11 what the pricing -- what the market was pricing,
12 of course, was affecting the -- my decisions, of
13 course. And some were good decisions, some not
14 so much, but they were affected as well by their
15 restrictions, yeah. And the -- but that was what
16 was going on in the market at that time.
17 But the specifics on why each of the
18 transactions is difficult to know, difficult to
19 say. I don't recall the specifics.
20 Q. And then you sold 150 shares of AMC
21 on February 2nd, right?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. And then you went on to buy 210
24 shares of AMC on February 5th, right?
25 A. Yeah, that's what's in this
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2 statement.
3 Q. Is this type of alternating of buying
4 and selling the same shares a common way that you
5 invest?
6 A. No, it is not but were not common
7 days in the market.
8 Q. Okay. If you go to the next page, on
9 February 10th, 2021, you bought Express, GameStop
10 and Koss?
11 MR. KIM: You mean it's on the same
12 page, no? You said, "the next page."
13 What page are we talking about?
14 MR. COHEN: Oh, sorry. Yeah, it's
15 the bottom of the same page. You're correct,
16 Phil.
17 Q. So I can ask that again.
18 Do you see that on February 10th,
19 2021 you bought Express, GameStop and Koss
20 shares?
21 A. Yes, I see it's in the statement,
22 yes.
23 Q. And do you recall why at that time
24 you purchased those shares?
25 A. Well, the hypothesis, the initial
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2 hypothesis was still there, yeah, and the
3 analysis was still there, yeah. So what I did
4 was, like, reviewing the fundamentals, the price
5 action and the news and that's -- it reflects of
6 what I was doing, yeah. But the specifics on why
7 the specific transaction is difficult to say.
8 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: I think the
9 Videographer has got some audio -- there you go.
10 MR. COHEN: Thank you.
11 Q. Isn't it true that this is the first
12 time you had ever purchased Koss shares?
13 A. I cannot recall when was the first
14 time, but maybe it was, maybe not. I cannot
15 recall.
16 Q. Do you know what Koss does?
17 A. It's a consumer electronics, yes. I
18 did the analysis at those times, yeah,
19 headphones. And I did the analysis and -- well,
20 it was worked at that time, yeah, and that's why
21 that is reflected on the transactions.
22 Q. Looking at the next page, on
23 February 24th, 2021, you purchased more Nokia,
24 Express and GameStop stock, correct?
25 A. That is correct.
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2 Q. Could you talk me through your
3 thinking in purchasing those three stocks on that
4 day?
5 A. Yeah, the strategy and the way of
6 doing the process, it's more or less the same,
7 yeah. And reviewing the fundamentals, the news
8 and the price action and based on that good to
9 buy, that was after, you know, with all the
10 happenings. And so -- well, the overall strategy
11 was more or less the same. So it's a
12 continuation of the same. But the specifics of
13 each trade, it's difficult to know.
14 Q. So, because --
15 A. I don't recall.
16 Q. Because this was after the events
17 that we were just talking about with regard to
18 Robinhood, would you characterize these purchases
19 as being long on the stock?
20 MR. KIM: Objection to form.
21 A. It's -- I don't remember exactly what
22 was the strategy for these trades. So I cannot
23 comment on the details. About the overall
24 strategy is more or less the same.
25 Q. Okay. Let's look at -- it will be
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2 Exhibit 279.
3 (Deposition Exhibit 279, copy of Mr.
4 Gill's March 2021 account statement for
5 Ameritrade P00002136 to P00002142 marked
6 Confidential, was marked for identification.)
7 A. I'm not seeing the exhibit yet.
8 Q. It will be coming up soon.
9 MR. COHEN: And, for the record, the
10 beginning Bates Number is P0002136.
11 A. There it is.
12 Q. And I'll point you to the page --
13 well, first of all, this is your March 2021
14 Ameritrade statement, correct?
15 A. Yes, that is correct.
16 Q. And if you go to Page 2140.
17 A. Yes.
18 Q. On February 25th, you bought AMC and
19 GameStop stocks, correct?
20 A. Yes, that is correct.
21 Q. And then you went on to sell those
22 same stocks on February 26, 2021?
23 A. Well, that's what is in the
24 statement, yes.
25 Q. And you sold the same number of
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2 shares that you purchased, correct?
3 A. Yes, that is correct.
4 Q. Do you have any recollection about
5 why you bought and sold these same shares within
6 a day of each other?
7 A. I don't recall the specifics. And I
8 don't recall what was going on in the news or in
9 the market or in the price action. It's
10 difficult to say, yeah. But what could happen,
11 which is normal, are stop losses, right, that
12 happens, typically, in the market.
13 Q. What are "stop losses"?
14 A. "Stop losses" is when you automate,
15 yeah, to sell a stock when it reaches a certain
16 limit, yeah, that's part of the operation of the
17 stock market in every trading strategy, yeah.
18 But I'm guessing because I don't -- I don't know,
19 specifically, the -- their reasons in that time.
20 But I, typically, use the stop losses.
21 Q. Understood.
22 A. Yeah. And that happens when you
23 analyze the things like this without all the
24 context, yeah. So, for example, a stop loss,
25 yeah, looks like trading a lot. But what happens
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2 is that you simply put -- define some limits and
3 if the limit is surpassed, it's automatic. It's
4 like -- it will prevent damages. But that's the
5 normal investing either long-term or short-term.
6 Using a stop loss is very very valuable.
7 Q. And before we talked briefly about
8 your familiarity with Reddit, correct?
9 A. Can you repeat? The communication
10 cut a bit.
11 Q. We spoke briefly before about your
12 familiarity with Reddit?
13 A. Yeah, I more or less know what it is.
14 Q. And I also asked you about Wall
15 Street Bets, the sub-Reddit, correct?
16 A. Yes, that is correct.
17 Q. But you couldn't recall whether you
18 interacted with Wall Street Bets at all; is that
19 right?
20 A. Yeah, that is right.
21 Q. When if at all did you first hear
22 about Wall Street Bets?
23 A. I don't recall the specifics, yeah.
24 But it was on the news during those days, yeah.
25 I -- like, the most up-to-date news I get are
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2 typically, from the Thinkorswim platform. And in
3 the Thinkorswim platform, they say the news and
4 they were on the news, yes.
5 Q. And do you recall re-tweeting any
6 Wall Street Bets comments?
7 A. Maybe I did.
8 MR. KIM: Objection to form, asked
9 and answered.
10 A. I don't recall specifics, but maybe I
11 did.
12 Q. Do you recall up voting or down
13 voting any Wall Street Bets content?
14 A. I don't remember specifics of the
15 content I saw during those days or they -- if I
16 had re-tweeted or commented or something. Maybe
17 I did.
18 Q. And by "those days," you're talking
19 about December 2020 and January 2021, correct?
20 A. Yeah, that's correct. But I don't
21 remember specifics what I did, but maybe I did,
22 yes.
23 Q. Do you remember at all your general
24 view of Wall Street Bets around that time?
25 A. Basically, what was in the news,
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2 yeah. And the news were saying, yeah, that they
3 were manipulating the market. That what was in
4 the news, yeah. But that's the general view. I
5 don't know, specifically.
6 Q. And what was your view of Wall Street
7 Bets around December 2020 and January 2021?
8 A. Well, they are a community, yeah,
9 and, yeah, they discuss things in the community.
10 I don't know the details, yeah. And, yeah and
11 they were a community and they were investing in
12 these stocks, yeah. But I don't know more
13 details. I don't recall.
14 Q. Did you at that time have a positive
15 view of Wall Street Bets?
16 A. They were -- it was a view, but if
17 it's possible good or bad, it's like they are a
18 community. They're in the market, yeah, and as
19 we have been speaking, I was in the market, yeah.
20 But how do I see them? Well, I don't
21 know. Maybe I commented something or -- yeah, I
22 don't know.
23 Q. Let's look at Exhibit 276.
24 A. Yes. Which page?
25 Q. These are your tweets, right?
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2 A. Yes.
3 Q. I'll point you to Page 1, actually.
4 A. Uh-huh.
5 Q. You see at the bottom of this page a
6 Wall Street Bets moderator tweet that you
7 re-tweeted on March 12th, 2021?
8 A. Yeah, it's there.
9 Q. And the tweet says, "CNBC uses the
10 term Wall Street Bets like we're El Qaeda."
11 A. Yes. Yes, that's in the document.
12 Q. What did you understand this tweet to
13 mean?
14 A. Well it is what it says. I cannot
15 say further. "CNBC uses the term Wall Street
16 Bets like we are El Qaeda." That's like, yeah,
17 like -- that's what CNBC is saying, comparing
18 this community to El Qaeda, and I reacted to that
19 tweet.
20 Q. When you re-tweeted this, was it
21 because you disagreed with that assessment?
22 A. I found it amusing, but, yeah,
23 because it's amusing, that comparison. But still
24 -- you know, but that's the reason. That is what
25 is in the tweet.
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2 Q. Let's go two pages in.
3 MR. KIM: What do you mean? You mean
4 two more pages down or the second page?
5 MR. COHEN: Two more pages down. So
6 it will be the third page.
7 A. Okay.
8 Q. You see a Wall Street Bets moderator
9 tweet that you replied to?
10 A. I think I am in the same page. But,
11 yes, there is one.
12 Q. And the tweet says, "Casual reminder
13 that this actually happened," with a picture of a
14 screen displaying common Wall Street Bets lingo,
15 correct?
16 A. Yeah, that's what's in the picture.
17 Q. Were you familiar with this lingo?
18 A. It was on the news, yeah, all over
19 the news. So I saw it, of course. It was
20 everywhere in the news.
21 Actually, they are showing a picture
22 of a guy on TV, showing it. So, yes, it was all
23 over the news.
24 Q. Have you ever used these terms?
25 A. Like, some but, like, nothing
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2 serious.
3 Q. So, for example, in the tweet itself
4 it says, To the moon means a "belief that a stock
5 will gain significantly."
6 A. Yeah, that's what's in the tweet.
7 But that's what they were saying in the news, all
8 over the news. It's a kind of amusing way of
9 referring. It's, like, amusing. That's why I
10 tweeted that. But that's it.
11 Q. So it was in the news, all over the
12 news that "to the moon" meant that a stock was
13 going to gain significantly?
14 A. Yes. Actually, the picture shows a
15 guy, yeah, a reporter in Bloomberg, yeah, saying
16 that. So it was all over the news.
17 Q. And then your response to that was,
18 "the best. I am into the moon."
19 A. It's amusing, yeah, but nothing else.
20 Q. What were you saying?
21 A. Yeah, I was just reacting to the
22 message. That's all.
23 Q. And did you go on to repeat this
24 language in other context?
25 A. No, not at all. In Twitter, like,
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2 but it's like sporadic. I don't comment too
3 much. So it's -- it's a way to referring to
4 which was, like, everywhere in the news.
5 Q. Could you go to the next page please.
6 And this is a comment to a different
7 tweet that you make, correct?
8 A. Correct.
9 Q. And in that comment you say, "to the
10 moon!", right?
11 A. Yes, it's there.
12 Q. Do you recall what the deleted tweet
13 was about?
14 A. Well, it was more or less the same.
15 It was actually -- it was on September the 2nd,
16 which was more -- much -- way after all the
17 events, yeah. But I don't remember exactly what
18 was I reacting to. But it was a reaction.
19 Q. Do you recall if in January 2021 you
20 bought shares of Tootsie Roll?
21 A. Tootsie Roll? It doesn't -- I don't
22 remember. But I don't think so.
23 Q. And what about Trivago?
24 A. It don't remember, but I don't think
25 so.
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2 Q. Koss Corporation?
3 THE STENOGRAPHER: What was it?
4 MR. COHEN: Koss, K-O-S-S.
5 MR. KIM: Didn't we just go over Koss
6 on the account statements?
7 MR. COHEN: In January 2021, I
8 believe --
9 A. I don't remember the specifics, but I
10 have bought Koss, yes.
11 Q. And you bought that in February 2021?
12 A. I don't remember the specific date,
13 but I did bought Koss, yes.
14 Q. And Bed Bath & Beyond, do you
15 remember if you purchased that stock in
16 January 2021?
17 A. I don't recall, but I don't think so.
18 Q. Did you consider buying any of these
19 stocks on January 2021?
20 A. Maybe I analyzed some of them, maybe,
21 maybe not, I don't remember. But if I didn't buy
22 them, then that was -- there was a reason for
23 that. But I think I didn't buy them. But that's
24 what I can recall.
25 Q. Do you hold any of these stocks
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2 today?
3 A. That I recall, no, I don't think so,
4 no.
5 Q. What are the stocks that make up the
6 largest portion of your portfolio today --
7 A. Today?
8 Q. -- in TD Ameritrade, specifically?
9 MR. KIM: You cut out. Can you
10 repeat the question? My signal cut out. I
11 didn't hear the question.
12 MR. COHEN: No problem.
13 Q. What are the stocks that make up the
14 biggest portion of your portfolio today in your
15 Ameritrade account in which you trade more
16 short-term?
17 A. "Short-term"?
18 Q. So let me go back.
19 Before you testified that you now
20 have two Ameritrade accounts, correct?
21 A. That is correct.
22 Q. And the newest account, which you
23 created just within the last several months, is
24 more for long-term holdings, correct?
25 A. That is correct.
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2 Q. So what are the stocks that make up
3 the biggest portion of your Ameritrade portfolio
4 in the other Ameritrade account, the short-term
5 account?
6 A. The short-term or the long-term?
7 Q. The short-term.
8 A. The short-term. Let me remember.
9 I have Digital Ocean, the SAS
10 platform, yeah. Actually, now technology has
11 good prices in general. So I'm aiming
12 technology. So right now it's a bit too up.
13 It's up above the market. So I'm bit out at the
14 moment, yeah.
15 But the ones that I am -- I have
16 right now in the portfolio -- let me remember. I
17 have a position in KRE in K -- K-R-E, which is
18 ETF for banks, I believe, in the banks that they
19 am recover. That's one part of the portfolio --
20 the portfolio.
21 The other one? There is one in AI.
22 That's in the short-term portfolio. I would call
23 the things going around AI, I think, it will --
24 that helps a lot for the stock market on that.
25 So I'm long on AI.
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2 What else? I don't recall others
3 but...
4 Q. Do you recall the stocks that make up
5 the largest portion of your long-term Ameritrade
6 portfolio?
7 A. Yeah, basically, I am waiting a bit.
8 I am partially long, partially out and partially
9 long. Actually, I am waiting for the market to
10 rest a little bit to go into the market. But
11 right now I have a portion of Digital Ocean I
12 mentioned. I have a portion -- I am waiting to
13 go down. I want to buy the Qs, yeah, the ETF --
14 THE STENOGRAPHER: I'm sorry. What
15 is that?
16 A. QQQ, which is the ATF -- ETF for
17 technology, yeah. Depending on what goes down, I
18 will go for one of the big technology companies,
19 which are good, which have good value now; either
20 Google, Microsoft, CRM, which is sales for --
21 sales first to go down. Depending on which one
22 will go down, I would go long on any of this.
23 I like another stock which is outside
24 the US market, which is ADR. It is called ASML,
25 which is on semi-conductors. It's from the
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2 Netherlands. I'm waiting that one to go down a
3 bit more.
4 So more or less that's what I'm doing
5 in the market for the long-term. But I'm waiting
6 for a rest. I think it needs to rest a bit.
7 Q. Do you know the approximate value of
8 your long-term Ameritrade portfolio?
9 A. The account for the long-term is
10
11 Q. And for the other Ameritrade account?
12 A. It's like
13 MR. KIM: So, Scott, I think we've
14 been going an hour and ten minutes. I don't know
15 if you have more questions on this topic. Maybe
16 we can take another ten-minute break.
17 MR. COHEN: Be back at 2:10.
18 MR. KIM: Alright. Oh, you're done
19 on this topic?
20 MR. COHEN: Yeah, yeah.
21 MR. KIM: Alright, 2:10 it is.
22 A. 2:10?
23 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Stand by please.
24 The time is 8:01 p.m. We are going
25 off the record. This will end media unit No. 4.
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2 (Recess taken 8:01 to 8:12 p.m.
3 Serbian time.)
4 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: The time is
5 8:12 p.m. We're back on the record. This will
6 be the start of Media Unit No. 5.
7 Q. You're a named Plaintiff in this
8 case, Mr. Gill, correct?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. And what does that mean?
11 A. Well, basically, we are in a class
12 action. So that is a lawsuit in which many
13 people are involved, yeah, hundreds even
14 thousands of people. And, basically, I am -- we
15 are in the class certification process, which is
16 -- we are asking the Court to approve this class
17 action and then I would be their representative
18 of these class members, which are many people as
19 I was stating.
20 Q. What does it mean to be the
21 representative of the class?
22 A. Basically, yeah, I will represent all
23 the class members in this class action and
24 oversee the case and see that the case goes
25 through well.
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2 Q. When did you first hear about this
3 case?
4 A. When I was -- during those period --
5 during that period of time, actually, of course,
6 after, yeah, I saw on the news. They were
7 commenting everywhere that there were people --
8 like firms that were, like, opening cases against
9 Robinhood. I don't agree the acting on
10 Robinhood, as we have stated before. So I got in
11 contact with The Rosen Law Firm and signed up for
12 being in this case.
13 Q. How did you know to contact The Rosen
14 Law Firm?
15 A. I Googled and I searched different
16 entities and evaluated them and then I went to
17 contact The Rosen Law Firm.
18 Q. Had The Rosen Law Firm reached out to
19 you before in any way?
20 A. No. I reached them and then I signed
21 in in the process.
22 Q. Was it always your intent in reaching
23 out to be a named plaintiff?
24 A. Not actually. But after going
25 through all the process with them, the
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2 possibility came and, yeah, and I'm here.
3 Q. And excluding your deposition today,
4 how much time have you spent on matters related
5 to this case?
6 A. We have been in touch with The Rosen
7 Law Firm since, approximately, November 2021, if
8 I recall correctly. And we have been, yeah,
9 preparing the -- reviewing the documents and
10 going through meetings, et cetera.
11 All the preparation and the
12 technicalities of the case, of course, has been
13 worked out by The Rosen Law Firm. I've been
14 reviewing the documents, yeah, and participating
15 in the meetings.
16 Q. Have you ever attended these meetings
17 in person?
18 A. No, remotely. They have been all
19 remotely.
20 Q. You said before that you read the
21 complaint in this case, right?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. Have you read any other court
24 filings?
25 A. Yeah, I read the court filings, yeah.
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2 Q. Like what?
3 A. Yeah, of course, I read the
4 documents. I was involved in the Certification,
5 obviously, the two of them that we saw. There
6 was another Court dismissing any -- some -- the
7 Defendants were like asking to dismiss this case
8 and that was dismissed by the Court, yeah. And I
9 read that document as well. And, yeah, I don't
10 recall any other.
11 Q. Could you give me an estimate of the
12 number of hours you've spent working on this case
13 so far?
14 A. It's difficult to recall, but I would
15 say around 30 hours, around that.
16 Q. How much time do you expect to spend
17 on this lawsuit going forward?
18 A. I don't know. Honestly, I don't
19 know. It's the first time I have been
20 participating in this type of lawsuit. So I
21 don't know. But I am open to the idea of
22 continuing working together.
23 Q. Have you been compensated for your
24 role in this case in any way?
25 A. No, not at all, of course.
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2 Q. Have you been told whether you'll
3 receive compensation?
4 A. No. Basically, we have an agreement
5 with The Rosen Law Firm and this is with a
6 success fee. So, basically, if there is a
7 recovery and The Rosen Law Firm take a
8 percentage, a percentage that is approved by the
9 Court, and then we get something that is like a
10 -- based on the amount of stocks and the amount
11 of the damages that were cost, yeah. But it's
12 like those specific numbers and everything is for
13 the Court to decide.
14 Q. Do you understand what the class is
15 in this lawsuit?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. Could you describe the definition of
18 the class?
19 A. Well, basically, the class is -- we
20 are suing Robinhood and subsidiaries for market
21 manipulation. Basically, what the Robinhood was
22 doing is -- applying those restrictions we have
23 been speaking about, specifically, turning off
24 the buy button and the other restrictions on the
25 buying of the stocks and thus making the price go
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2 down and making -- and that was a bit difficult
3 for Robinhood in those days. So we are -- the
4 complaint is going through all the specifics in
5 that matter.
6 Q. Who are the members of the class?
7 A. The members is -- are everyone that
8 is affected by these market manipulation. There
9 are -- there is an estimate of around a
10 thousand -- thousands of people, but there is not
11 a number, a specific number. But that's more or
12 less the number of people that there is and,
13 basically, the people that were affected by this
14 market manipulation.
15 Q. "Affected" in any way?
16 A. Yeah, the level of being affected,
17 it's, of course, to be decided by the Court,
18 yeah. And the calculation of damages is decided
19 by the Court, the specifics, yeah. But there
20 were people that were having that stock during
21 that period and were affected and got damages, in
22 that sense, for the market manipulation.
23 But all the specifics and how to
24 calculate who is -- and the damages and all that
25 is, like, decided by the Court.
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2 Q. How much money are you contending
3 that you lost as a result of Robinhood's
4 purchasing restrictions?
5 A. I don't remember the specifics. Of
6 course I lost money, yeah; otherwise, I wouldn't
7 have, like, sign up for the case. But I don't
8 remember the specifics and the way to calculate
9 the damages changes and there are specifics on
10 that. And that's for the Court to decide.
11 Q. Are you aware that a request for
12 production was served on you through your
13 Counsel?
14 MR. KIM: You mean production of
15 documents?
16 MR. COHEN: Yeah.
17 Q. Are you aware that a request for
18 production of documents in your possession or
19 control was served on you through your Counsel?
20 A. Yeah, that The Rosen Law Firm
21 contacted me to provide some document and I did.
22 And I did based on the -- what was going on with
23 the case.
24 Q. Have you ever seen a document from
25 the Robinhood Defendants asking for specific
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2 items to produce?
3 A. I haven't. I just been asked by The
4 Rosen Law Firm.
5 Q. Do you recall when that was?
6 A. I don't know. I don't remember. I
7 don't recall.
8 Q. Was it closer to when you first came
9 on as a named Plaintiff?
10 A. I don't recall, exactly. I think it
11 was last year in 2022, but I don't recall,
12 specifically.
13 Q. Do you recall the types of documents
14 that you were asked to produce?
15 A. Yes. They were asking me, for
16 example, the social media account, which we saw
17 already, documents regarding the trading
18 strategies, investment methodologies, things
19 related to that.
20 Q. And you were asked to go through your
21 different social media accounts and produce the
22 responsive tweets and messages and comments and
23 so forth, correct?
24 A. Yes, that is correct.
25 Q. So, for example, we looked before
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2 today at a tweet that you produced when you were
3 discussing -- when you were asking the opinion of
4 the Professor Toro, right?
5 A. Uh-huh.
6 Q. And then we looked at other tweets
7 that you didn't produce.
8 Do you recall that?
9 A. Yeah, I recall -- I recall that I
10 looked through my social media account. I went
11 through some terms, yeah, and -- but, yes, there
12 were more terms there. I didn't look through all
13 the terms possible. I don't remember exactly
14 which ones I saw and which ones you find
15 additional to the ones I found.
16 Q. Did you preserve the documents that
17 you were ultimately asked to produce in any way?
18 A. I keep track of the records for the
19 case, yeah, so I have a folder for that.
20 Q. Okay. And from February 2021 through
21 the present, are you aware of any documents that
22 would have been responsive to our requests that
23 you discarded?
24 A. When I was asked to produce the
25 documents, I went through all the things I got
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2 and I gave everything I was asked for. Maybe I
3 didn't find something as you found in the social
4 media, yeah. But I made -- I went through the
5 search and I gave everything.
6 Q. Was there anything that you may have
7 thrown out before you received the request for
8 production?
9 A. Well, I -- I wouldn't call it like I
10 throw, yeah. I was asked for the specific
11 trading strategies, you know, if I had it. And
12 my reply to The Rosen Law Firm is that I usually
13 do the trading strategies in an Excel, yeah, but
14 that Excel file it's a living document. So I
15 only have the trades that are going now. So
16 closed positions and stocks or securities that I
17 don't plan to use in the future, I simply discard
18 and go and define new ones.
19 So I had the specifics, yeah, for
20 that but they are not there in the living
21 document.
22 Q. Okay. Did you delete any documents
23 or social media content?
24 THE STENOGRAPHER: I'm sorry. He
25 froze. And I didn't hear what he said.
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2 Can you repeat that, sir? You froze.
3 MR. KIM: I think they were talking
4 over each other. Maybe, Scott, you can repeat
5 that question and then Mr. Gill can respond.
6 MR. COHEN: Sure.
7 Q. Did you delete any documents or
8 social media content that would be relevant to
9 this case?
10 A. Not that I recall.
11 Q. And where did you look for responsive
12 documents?
13 A. So, basically, I use OneNote, yeah.
14 I searched through that. I went through my
15 laptop. I searched the contents of the laptop.
16 I went through the social media accounts and I
17 did some searches, yeah.
18 Q. Do you ever -- you searched through
19 your personal computer?
20 A. Yes, the laptop.
21 Q. And do you have a work computer, a
22 separate work computer?
23 A. Not at the moment.
24 Q. Did you go through your text
25 messages?
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2 A. Yes, I did.
3 Q. Did you go through your e-mails?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. Did you communicate in any -- with
6 anybody in writing regarding your purchase or
7 sale of GameStop or Nokia or AMC shares?
8 A. Not that I recall.
9 Q. You produced something to us or
10 rather your Counsel produced something to us two
11 days ago.
12 Are you aware of that?
13 A. Yes, for sure. Basically, we were on
14 the operation --
15 MR. KIM: Yeah, Mr. Gill, I don't
16 think -- you're starting to get into details
17 about attorney-client privilege. But, you know,
18 you don't want to disclose anything about any
19 advice you received.
20 But as to how you discovered those
21 YouTube links, you can talk about that, but not
22 anything specific as to any advice or
23 communications we had with you.
24 THE WITNESS: Agreed.
25 Q. Yeah, that's fine.
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2 So, just explain the process of how
3 you discovered you needed to turn this new
4 information over and when that happened please.
5 A. It happened this week. Basically, it
6 was related to YouTube, my YouTube account. And
7 I didn't know the history was saved for two years
8 before, three years ago.
9 So I checked. I went through the
10 history and I found some videos I saw and that's
11 exactly what I delivered to The Rosen Law Firm.
12 Q. And so these were videos that you
13 watched in the relevant time period?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. In January 2021 and December 2020?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. I'll ask you to take a look at
18 Exhibit 280.
19 (Deposition Exhibit 280, history of
20 playlist of YouTube videos produced by Mr. Gill,
21 was marked for identification.)
22 Q. Let me know when you're there.
23 A. Yes, I'm looking at it.
24 Q. Is this the document that you gave to
25 your Counsel to produce?
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2 A. I produced a playlist on YouTube and
3 this is the document produced by that playlist.
4 Q. So these are the videos that you
5 watched in December 2020 and January 2021?
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. Mr. Gill, I don't have any more
8 questions for you. I really appreciate you
9 taking time to do this, especially when you're so
10 far away and in a different time zone.
11 A. Thank to you.
12 MR. KIM: I don't have any questions.
13 Thank you very much. And, hopefully,
14 you can sit back and relax.
15 THE WITNESS: Okay. Thank you.
16 MR. KIM: Thank you.
17 THE WITNESS: Bye-bye.
18 Can I disconnect?
19 MR. KIM: Yeah, you can disconnect.
20 THE WITNESS: Okay bye-bye.
21 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Please stand by
22 while I close the record.
23 You can disconnect, if you like, Mr.
24 Gill.
25 This concludes today's deposition of
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2 Santiago Gill. The number of media units used is
3 five, but they will be retained by Veritext Legal
4 Solutions.
5 We are going off the record at 8:32
6 local Serbia time.
7 Thank you everybody. Appreciate your
8 assistance today.
9 (Time noted: 2:33 p.m.)
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